Who's the Greater? The Developer, The SysAdmin, The NetAdmin or some other I.T. Guy?

El Corazon

dan neely wrote:

Someone's having a conniption over the fact that you can't write protect a USB stick.

nope, strictly form a bring software/data in/out. I asked about the CD issue, they honestly hadn't even thought about that, especially based the expressions. I am sure CDs and floppies will follow, we'll all have thin-station machines with no read-write capability shortly there-after. Silly me. Then they can replace my network computer with a internet appliance picture frame and I'd probably gain some processing power. ;)

_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)

Albert Dadze

El Corazon wrote:

you really do NOT want my resume. Honest.

Alright Man, to be honest, I hope you don't consider my statement as an insult, just trying to express some points.

AlbertDadze

lost in transition

What about the truck drivers, driving down the road or the steel worker in Detroit or the coal miner in the holes.:laugh: I feel an old Alabama song coming on.;)

God Bless, Jason

DavidCrow wrote:

It would not affect me or my family one iota. My wife and I are in charge of when the tv is on, and what it displays. I do not need any external input for that.

El Corazon

Albert Dadze wrote:

just trying to express some points

As I was. I have a great deal of respect for the one-man shop, he's got to sell, develop and maintain everything. And make a living at it! (hopefully) I specialize nowadays, but I have a very strong respect for those individuals who go independant contractors and survive doing it. :)

_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)

Ed Poore

I agree, cos I'm one of them ;P

El Corazon

Ed.Poore wrote:

I'm one of them

Your wish M'Lord? :laugh: seriously though, I may join you folks soon. Just not wanting to make the jump blind. I am officially registered and ready though. :)

_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)

Chris Maunder

For they have the power to change reality. There is no spoon.

cheers, Chris Maunder

CodeProject.com : C++ MVP

The 9 things Microsoft should be announcing at MIX07 (but won't)

charlieg

Chris - I would concur, to a point. When I ran a development group, all I had to do to make the admins go away was to utter the 4 letter magical word: "unix". Poof, no where in site. :) There are three issues at play here: 1) arrogant developers. Since I'm one, I know what I'm talking about. 2) arrogant admins. Since I've suffered with them, I know they are out there. I had one admin tell me that my group did not need to log off every night. If they needed to get onto our machines, they knew how to "hack" in. This air of confidence made me curious, so I asked him how we did it. "Oh, we just toggle the power on the system. Then we can get to the login screen." I sat and stared at him for a while. :wtf: Did not illicit any response from him, so I inquired as to if he realized he might be crashing programs that might be running. Blank look again. 3) Managers that don't want to be bothered or are unable to understand the symbiotic relationship between the two groups. I spent some time educating the IT Manager as to how development groups operated. He was blown away... stunned by his own ignorance (not negative, just an observation). He also had the opportunity to educate me on some corporate directives he had to put in place. We came to an understanding relationship :)

Charlie Gilley Will program for food... Whoever said children were cheaper by the dozen... lied. Overheard in a cubicle: "A project is just a bug under development." Seeking to rise above the intelligence of a one eared rabbit...

charlieg

Or defy/dismiss it. :eek:

Charlie Gilley Will program for food... Whoever said children were cheaper by the dozen... lied. Overheard in a cubicle: "A project is just a bug under development." Seeking to rise above the intelligence of a one eared rabbit...

Raj Lal

Chris Maunder wrote:

For they have the power to change reality.

Totally agree, They do :cool:

Omit Needless Words - Strunk, William, Jr.

Vista? Cryptography Next Generation (CNG) here

Dan Neely

"...It will all be rendered in later by a farm of SGI boxes" I wonder if anyone else remembers where that line's from?

-- You have to explain to them [VB coders] what you mean by "typed". their first response is likely to be something like, "Of course my code is typed. Do you think i magically project it onto the screen with the power of my mind?" --- John Simmons / outlaw programmer

brianwelsch

jason_lakewhitney wrote:

I feel an old Alabama song coming on

:laugh: I was thinking Bruce Springsteen.

BW

Quick to judge, quick to anger, slow to understand.
Ignorance and prejudice and fear walk hand in hand.
-- Neil Peart

Albert Dadze

Great El, in that respect you are right. the one-man shop is, but that kind of do-it-all-myself person will not last to his 40s if he is in 30s:laugh::laugh::laugh:

AlbertDadze

David Crow

Agreed.

"A good athlete is the result of a good and worthy opponent." - David Crow

"To have a respect for ourselves guides our morals; to have deference for others governs our manners." - Laurence Sterne

Shog9 0

Joe Woodbury wrote:

Why are developers so arrogant as a group that they believe they understand the full complexity of the network they are dealing with (and understand ALL the other projects going on as well)?

Tongue-in-cheek replies aside, i think all of the groups tend to forget that their job is, in essence, to serve the other groups. Ultimately, they should be working together to serve the customer, whether that's internal or external. I want a build server. Scratch that, i need a build server. And a crash logging server. And a source control server. And a server to generate reports on all this and more. Some handy feeds wouldn't go amiss either. Assuming i can come up with a reasonably good justification for this, it's ITs duty to make it happen and keep it running smoothly. They're holding the keys so that they can unlock stuff, not key-ring-whip anyone trying to get some work done. I've worked in places where everything was locked down. Places like this, people would get bored and shove cheeseburgers into their computers. Why? Who knows? To keep them warm...? Point is, no-one was trusted with any real control over the machines, and so no-one felt that they had any responsibility as far as keeping them working. Place i'm working now is going through a long overhaul, aiming towards SOX compliance. Suddenly, almost no-one has a login for the production database. Problem is, most of us need a login to accomplish parts of our jobs. Guess what, we're still doing our jobs... ;) Treat your workers like children, and that's what they'll act like. And i think we all remember the sorts of deviltry we were up to as kids...

----

It appears that everybody is under the impression that I approve of the documentation. You probably also blame Ken Burns for supporting slavery.

--Raymond Chen on MSDN

El Corazon

dan neely wrote:

I wonder if anyone else remembers where that line's from?

It sounds real familiar, but google didn't help any.

_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)

Dan Neely

I'm not surprised. Even assuming my memory didn't mangle it, the site it's from has been down for years.

-- You have to explain to them [VB coders] what you mean by "typed". their first response is likely to be something like, "Of course my code is typed. Do you think i magically project it onto the screen with the power of my mind?" --- John Simmons / outlaw programmer

Andy Brummer

I'd be really nervous if I was the guy that voted that post down. Chuck Norris attacks when you are least expecting it.

Using the GridView is like trying to explain to someone else how to move a third person's hands in order to tie your shoelaces for you. -Chris Maunder

l a u r e n

:laugh:

"there is no spoon" {me}

Dan Neely

posted before I forget. It was from a site called detonate.net which posted 'bastardized' versions of several movies made by taking a number of screen captures and adding sarcastic comments to them. The Matrix, Blade, and IIRC one or two other movies were given this treatment back in 99 before the creator got bored and let the site die a year or three later.

-- You have to explain to them [VB coders] what you mean by "typed". their first response is likely to be something like, "Of course my code is typed. Do you think i magically project it onto the screen with the power of my mind?" --- John Simmons / outlaw programmer