Microsoft certification
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Scott Dorman wrote:
Your scores are also not public knowledge either, only if you passed or failed an exam
Not always. I took various exams at various testing centres. Some had scores, others didn't. Where a score was shown the pass was mark was 700 and the maximum score was 1000. For example, the SQL Server 2000 and ASP.NET exams were simple pass/fail and I took them in London. The WinForms exam had a score and I took that in Edinburgh.
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Colin Angus Mackay wrote:
Not always. I took various exams at various testing centres. Some had scores, others didn't. Where a score was shown the pass was mark was 700 and the maximum score was 1000.
Sorry...guess I wasn't clear. All of the exams had an actual score, with a 700 being the lowest to pass. What I was saying was that on the public transcript it only shows a pass/fail and not the actual score.
----------------------------- In just two days, tomorrow will be yesterday.
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I seriously wouldn't bother with these certifications they're not worth the paper there written on.
.net is a box of never ending treasures, every day I get find another gem.
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Not at any place most programmers would want to work at though. Anyone who has ever had to hire a programmer or computer tech knows just how much certification blows. I *always* found the best candidates were the ones that were *not* certified.
"110%" - it's the new 70%
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I seriously wouldn't bother with these certifications they're not worth the paper there written on.
.net is a box of never ending treasures, every day I get find another gem.
Generally we rather draw up a test regarding specific problem that the candidate will be employed for. We don't even care if the person finished school. If he can do the job he is qualified enough. On the other hand, experience plays a large part in the decision. The more the experience, the shorter the learning curve.
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Colin Angus Mackay wrote:
Not always. I took various exams at various testing centres. Some had scores, others didn't. Where a score was shown the pass was mark was 700 and the maximum score was 1000.
Sorry...guess I wasn't clear. All of the exams had an actual score, with a 700 being the lowest to pass. What I was saying was that on the public transcript it only shows a pass/fail and not the actual score.
----------------------------- In just two days, tomorrow will be yesterday.
What certification shows is a breadth of understanding - a good interviewer will be able to determine depth. More importantly, they show a commitment to your profession. Whilst an inexperienced developer can pass the exams, and not make a good programmer, they will most likely know more than an uncertified bluffer. As someone who has done a lot of recruitment, it certainly won't get you the job, but it will tell me you are serious about development as your profession (and thus make you more likely to get an interview). Plus, I think as a personal development exercise, studying for and passing MCP exams is highly beneficial, as it exposes you to areas where your work my not require you to go. My knowledge of encryption is almost totally based on my MCP study. So not mandatory, but highly recommended. Sparkie
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Generally we rather draw up a test regarding specific problem that the candidate will be employed for. We don't even care if the person finished school. If he can do the job he is qualified enough. On the other hand, experience plays a large part in the decision. The more the experience, the shorter the learning curve.
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I started my MCSD course recently in c# .net 2.0 here in Brisneyland As you sit the exams you do pick up a cert or two :) Bryce
--- To paraphrase Fred Dagg - the views expressed in this post are bloody good ones. --
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Hi guys, I was going to do MCAD, but since net2.0 and now nearly 3.0 is out now its better to do them. But the scheme changed a little bit now, i used to know it as first you do MCAD and then advance to MCSD. Now there's MCPD for web development, Mcpd for application development, is there one for both? MCTS in .net framework 2.0 MCTS in sql server 2005 I am a little confused, can any one help me? Thanks Luke
Microsoft has divided the certification exams in to more sections than earlier. Now in the new track they don't have MCAD and MCSD which covers all the areas like windows dev, web dev and database etc. Instead of that they have divided the exams in more specific way. MCTS is basic lavel in the new track and you can get MCTS in any area you like.For that you have to do one or more exams depends on the area Eg. MCTS in web development,MCTS in Winwods development. after that, if you want to be a professional in your area you can do next step exams and earn MCPD in relevent area. Same as you can earn MCTS,MCPD in several areas (eg. Web dev+Win dev+Ent dev) see more details on http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mcp/mcts/default.mspx hope i make my self clear to you rgds Thushara
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Microsoft has divided the certification exams in to more sections than earlier. Now in the new track they don't have MCAD and MCSD which covers all the areas like windows dev, web dev and database etc. Instead of that they have divided the exams in more specific way. MCTS is basic lavel in the new track and you can get MCTS in any area you like.For that you have to do one or more exams depends on the area Eg. MCTS in web development,MCTS in Winwods development. after that, if you want to be a professional in your area you can do next step exams and earn MCPD in relevent area. Same as you can earn MCTS,MCPD in several areas (eg. Web dev+Win dev+Ent dev) see more details on http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mcp/mcts/default.mspx hope i make my self clear to you rgds Thushara
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:) you are welcome....!!!!. I believe its worth of doing the certification exams. At least you will get a good knowledge on fundamentals. Wish you luck for the exams ...! rgds Thushara
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There is MCPD for windows, web and distributed applications
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Perhaps it is because I have seen so many methodologies that hurt rather than help the process, I can't help but to think that in his early years, Albert Einstein was ridiculed and mocked. It is likely, that his relativistic views would not have been certified by the physicists of the day.
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norm .net wrote:
they're not worth the paper there written on
they are only worth it to the company, if the company believes they are worth it. For instance, although a degree or an MS certification would not assist me in my job since most of it is R&D (how do get instruction on inventing things that have not been invented?). Still, if I had either, or both, the company would increase my salary appropriate to the level of "worth" they associate with the degree or certification. It is all a bit subjective and it could be a little or a lot, but you don't know until you do it and they decide subjectively what it means to them. Mostly it is PR worth. The lead programmer for yyy project has zzz certifications/degrees. It just looks good on paper. Sometimes they will even partner with me someone who's certifications or degrees looks better on paper to improve the comfort level of the contract granting office who hasn't a clue what any of it means.
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
A good degree from a reputable University will show that you have been taught how to learn and if a research based degree (MSC/PHd) how to research (and stand a better chance of being creative/inventive). MS cert says you are only good for a narrow band of technology. As a company we would give very little weight to MS cert, more on interview, general education (degree), tech evaluation, and previous work. Anyway who want's to be certified by Microsoft :)
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I know of people who claim the done MCSD MCAD and actaully haven't :rolleyes:
.net is a box of never ending treasures, every day I get find another gem.
well to be honest i havn't completed it, but NH Australia will attest me to starting it ;) bryce
--- To paraphrase Fred Dagg - the views expressed in this post are bloody good ones. --
Publitor, making Pubmed easy. http://www.sohocode.com/publitorOur kids books :The Snot Goblin, and Book 2 - the Snotgoblin and Fluff
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It's sometimes the case that experience + certification is worth more than experience alone. In other words, some employers (typically consultancies) insist on it. I don't have certification but I did have an interview in which I was asked why I wasn't certified. I didn't get the job. I suspect they would have been happier had I been certified.
Kevin
For the areas I work in (native application development and Visual Studio Extensibility) there are no certifications available anyway, so that's a moot point. Everything is .NET, and that's a very small subset of what I do, and therefore not an area it would be worth me studying for an exam in. :rolleyes:
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I don't see why people would need to get these certificate's to get interviews... surely a university degree and a little experience should be enough to say you are interview-worthy at the very least. Then you cull the useless candidates in practical assessments! Any company requiring a useless certification isn't really worth working for... just my opinion. :)
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Hi guys, I was going to do MCAD, but since net2.0 and now nearly 3.0 is out now its better to do them. But the scheme changed a little bit now, i used to know it as first you do MCAD and then advance to MCSD. Now there's MCPD for web development, Mcpd for application development, is there one for both? MCTS in .net framework 2.0 MCTS in sql server 2005 I am a little confused, can any one help me? Thanks Luke
Luke, I am a MCAD. My certification cost me almost $5k (paid for it myself through New Horizons). I got my cert in April 2005. By the end of 2005, MS was already working on the new certifications. The ink wasn't hardly dry on my cert and they were putting out the new MCPD certifications. Honestly, the only thing my certification has been good for is getting past HR interviewers. I was pushed to the top of the interview pile when up against non-certified applicants. Some companies have accepted my certification and we completely bypassed the interview process! However, once you get on site, they expect you to be GOOD at what they hired you for! Other companies couldn't have cared less about the cert and I have even had other companies tell me that "we can't afford you!" and not give me the chance to hear their offer!! I was going to go for my MCPD Web and MCPD Win, but with VS2008 coming out, you just KNOW that there's going to me another round of certifications coming with that. I don't know about you, but even being a Sr. Programmer Analyst, I don't make the kind of money that it would take me to keep up with Microsoft's Certification program. I miss the days when a certification was good more than 18 months! Just my opinion!
JamminJimE Microsoft Certified Application Developer
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Where? cut the code and show them an app, jobs yours.
.net is a box of never ending treasures, every day I get find another gem.
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I don't see why people would need to get these certificate's to get interviews... surely a university degree and a little experience should be enough to say you are interview-worthy at the very least. Then you cull the useless candidates in practical assessments! Any company requiring a useless certification isn't really worth working for... just my opinion. :)
atilaw wrote:
Any company requiring a useless certification isn't really worth working for...
Funny, I feel the same way about any company that requires a "university degree" to apply for a job.
Grim
(aka Toby)
MCDBA, MCSD, MCP+SB
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I seriously wouldn't bother with these certifications they're not worth the paper there written on.
.net is a box of never ending treasures, every day I get find another gem.
The only reason to get a certification is because HR managers don't get it... Most of the time a technical manager puts a job requisition together for a software developer and only gets resume's that the HR people think are a fit. HR people think (incorrectly) that the certification actually has meaning and therfor give preferance to certified people. The HR people giving preferance, because of ignorance, is the only value that any certification has. As ignorance is the cause of the value it doesn't matter what kind of certification you have, because the HR people don't know the difference any way. Some of the training for the certification can be a good primer if you are unfamiliar with the technology at hand. I took a week long VB.net course and got a lot of good info on web services, that I have never used. It was an interesting and fun week but as an embedded guy I havent touched VB in years except for the ocational test program. The certification process is enough to give you a basic familiarity, and a foot in the door but don't expect it to get you the job. Sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never... Ouch... Nevermind