How to get a raise
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Have you considered outsourcing?
"Every time Lotus Notes starts up, somewhere a puppy, a kitten, a lamb, and a baby seal are killed. Lotus Notes is a conspiracy by the forces of Satan to drive us over the brink into madness. The CRC-32 for each file in the installation includes the numbers 666." Gary Wheeler "The secret to a long and healthy life is simple. Don't get ill and don't die." Pete O'Hanlon, courtesy of Rama "I realised that all of my best anecdotes started with "So there we were, pissed". Pete O'Hanlon
Don't. The amount of crap I get in my inbox from Indian companies offering to handle all my development needs. Come on FFS - developing is what my company does. We don't need some substandard coding chopshop churning out below par code which we then have to rewrite because somebody doesn't understand the requirements - more importantly, I don't want to see somebody posting a question on a CP forum asking how to do something that we are paying them to do.
Deja View - the feeling that you've seen this post before.
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Don't. The amount of crap I get in my inbox from Indian companies offering to handle all my development needs. Come on FFS - developing is what my company does. We don't need some substandard coding chopshop churning out below par code which we then have to rewrite because somebody doesn't understand the requirements - more importantly, I don't want to see somebody posting a question on a CP forum asking how to do something that we are paying them to do.
Deja View - the feeling that you've seen this post before.
Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
more importantly, I don't want to see somebody posting a question on a CP forum asking how to do something that we are paying them to do.
:laugh::laugh: That's a 5! :D
"Every time Lotus Notes starts up, somewhere a puppy, a kitten, a lamb, and a baby seal are killed. Lotus Notes is a conspiracy by the forces of Satan to drive us over the brink into madness. The CRC-32 for each file in the installation includes the numbers 666." Gary Wheeler "The secret to a long and healthy life is simple. Don't get ill and don't die." Pete O'Hanlon, courtesy of Rama "I realised that all of my best anecdotes started with "So there we were, pissed". Pete O'Hanlon
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Is it just me or does it seem like the only way to get a sizeable raise is to change who you work for? I get the max raise provided by the company, which is usually just under inflation. But, I don't get a merit raise unless I quite and go to work somewhere else. Does anyone else find this to be true? If it is, what is required to change this? I hear people in different careers talk about the same thing so it isn't just my profession.
ramhog wrote:
Is it just me or does it seem like the only way to get a sizeable raise is to change who you work for? I get the max raise provided by the company, which is usually just under inflation. But, I don't get a merit raise unless I quite and go to work somewhere else. Does anyone else find this to be true? If it is, what is required to change this? I hear people in different careers talk about the same thing so it isn't just my profession.
Well, I am not sure I can help since every job is different. But unless it is a REALLY bad year for my work's customer, there is usually a pool of raises that start at just under inflation and go up based on merit. I have usually cleared the top of that pool every year. But I stay late as required, I work weekends as required. When the customer needs something I am willing to go that extra mile (sometimes literally) to get what the customer wants. I talk with the customers and provide direct input into the software to make sure what I write is exactly what the customer wants. There are very few of our customers who dislike my work, so there is a constant flow of letters of appreciation about me. Because I am willing to save the customer's bacon, they tend to be appreciative. That doesn't mean that everyone doesn't work as hard, and I make sure and tell the customer when someone else has helped because I am the only face they see. I don't steal credit, and offer it up readily to the company and others. I support the customer from design through testing to make sure everything is top-notch. My documentation is above required levels. My biggest problem is that I am too honest. When there is a real problem, they keep me away from the customer because I won't lie to cover it up. I am an over-grown boyscout, which is fitting since I was a boy-scout leader about 8 years ago. :laugh: Basically I take everything that you would expect someone to do as "just part of the job" and I go beyond it at every single step.
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
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It is in my experience that a company will NEVER give you more than the least they feel they can get by with. In other words, if they think they can give you 3 or 4% and you'll "be ok with it", then that's exactly what they are going to do. If you feel you've gone above and beyond, then you need to make a case for the salary increase; don't just say "I'm worth it". Why are you worth it? Did the last project you worked on net the company millions? Save the company millions? Does the industry pay someone with your skill level MORE? If so, how much more? Etc... Also, if you're going to do this, be proactive and also point out any flaws; don't leave it up to your boss to go find them ... if you present all the pros/cons and have an honest case, it will be far more difficult for them to turn you down. My two cents.
:..::. Douglas H. Troy ::..
Bad Astronomy |VCF|wxWidgets|WTLDouglas Troy wrote:
It is in my experience that a company will NEVER give you more than the least they feel they can get by with. In other words, if they think they can give you 3 or 4% and you'll "be ok with it", then that's exactly what they are going to do.
this is very true. One reason I casually admit to contacts across the USA and in multiple industries. Then tend to keep the number high because they are afraid to loose me. It doesn't help that a few of the customers have wished to take me away. :-D
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
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MrPlankton wrote:
Get a govi job. Doesn't matter which country, they all get yearly raises.
No amount of money is worth the mind-numbing, skill-atrophying, technologically stagnant, backstabbing Hell that is government employment. I'm just glad I got out with most of my sanity and enough remaining skills to still be employable.
Sunrise Wallpaper Project | The StartPage Randomizer | The Windows Cheerleader
Yes, I have seen newbe govi's report for thier badges at govi badge dispensing facilities. I hear when they pick up thier badge they get the ice pick through the eye sockets and are then issued sun glasses. They are much more maliable after the procedure. I have also noticed when I am in a govi facility with a govi and they have been working there awhile they have this yellow pasty patina, whites, blacks, doesn't matter they still have this patina... strange, and a goofy smile with a vacant look. However they do have a savant intelligense about them in that they can tell you the years, days, hours and minutes to the day they retire... it's amazing! I have heard rumars that some govi programmers can do the most amazing ASCII art on the daisy wheel printer using nothing but a FORTRAN 77 compiler, IBM 360 and a Dec writer. Astounding!
MrPlankton
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Is it just me or does it seem like the only way to get a sizeable raise is to change who you work for? I get the max raise provided by the company, which is usually just under inflation. But, I don't get a merit raise unless I quite and go to work somewhere else. Does anyone else find this to be true? If it is, what is required to change this? I hear people in different careers talk about the same thing so it isn't just my profession.
Good employers recognize valuable employees and find ways around policies to keep them happy and on staff. That said, you may just be in a situation where your employer is no good. This could be the company in general or just your direct superiors; I am not trying to pass judgment. So, if I were still in your shoes I'd do one or more of the following. A) Go Independent B) Find a new Job C) Start Your Own Self Funded company. D) Partner with others for C. E) Tell your boss you need more than they have offered to stay with the company. Many times in the past I have done E and it usually worked out. But, about four years I did B & C at the same time. About two years later I did A and began really focusing on C between contracts. Now, C pays my bills and A lets me play around with technology I like when I want. What I did may not be your 'thing' so don't run out and do anything just because I or somebody else did. But, if you want more cash you must be willing to do something.
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. - -Lazarus Long
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Is it just me or does it seem like the only way to get a sizeable raise is to change who you work for? I get the max raise provided by the company, which is usually just under inflation. But, I don't get a merit raise unless I quite and go to work somewhere else. Does anyone else find this to be true? If it is, what is required to change this? I hear people in different careers talk about the same thing so it isn't just my profession.
Interview with other companies. Make it known. Of course this will not work everywhere.
John
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Mustafa Ismail Mustafa wrote:
Wow! Where do I send you my CV? I'll pay for relocation myself!
You've gone solo now. You don't need me. BTW - this is the reason I have very low staff turnover.
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Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
BTW - this is the reason I have very low staff turnover.
That is very good. Truly happy employees have seem to want to stay and work for people :-D
"I guess it's what separates the professionals from the drag and drop, girly wirly, namby pamby, wishy washy, can't code for crap types." - Pete O'Hanlon
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I must admit that I have given some thought to writing an article on the "softer side". In other words, dealing with clients, winning work, that type of thing.
Deja View - the feeling that you've seen this post before.
Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
I have given some thought to writing an article on the "softer side". In other words, dealing with clients, winning work
That would be a great article. Write it and I'll give positive feedback on it :-D
"I guess it's what separates the professionals from the drag and drop, girly wirly, namby pamby, wishy washy, can't code for crap types." - Pete O'Hanlon
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I must admit that I have given some thought to writing an article on the "softer side". In other words, dealing with clients, winning work, that type of thing.
Deja View - the feeling that you've seen this post before.
Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
In other words, dealing with clients
WOW you must have a lot of spare time ;P
"There are three sides to every story. Yours, mine and the truth" ~ unknown "All things good to know are difficult to learn" ~ Greek Proverb "The only place success comes before work is in the dictionary" ~ Vidal Sassoon
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Is it just me or does it seem like the only way to get a sizeable raise is to change who you work for? I get the max raise provided by the company, which is usually just under inflation. But, I don't get a merit raise unless I quite and go to work somewhere else. Does anyone else find this to be true? If it is, what is required to change this? I hear people in different careers talk about the same thing so it isn't just my profession.
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Is it just me or does it seem like the only way to get a sizeable raise is to change who you work for? I get the max raise provided by the company, which is usually just under inflation. But, I don't get a merit raise unless I quite and go to work somewhere else. Does anyone else find this to be true? If it is, what is required to change this? I hear people in different careers talk about the same thing so it isn't just my profession.
I have a friend who changed jobs a few times and eventually joined one of his earlier companies. He said he had a much higher salary than some of his colleagues who had stayed on in the same company.
Regards, Nish
Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
My latest book : C++/CLI in Action / Amazon.com link -
I have a friend who changed jobs a few times and eventually joined one of his earlier companies. He said he had a much higher salary than some of his colleagues who had stayed on in the same company.
Regards, Nish
Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
My latest book : C++/CLI in Action / Amazon.com linkI think this is an effect means to do so. Staying after getting an offer is fraught with politics that will always stay. But returning after a few years discharges the politics and will typically get you a better salary, especially if you were low paid the first time. Of course this only works if the company was sorry to lose you! :)
I'm largely language agnostic
After a while they all bug me :doh:
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Is it just me or does it seem like the only way to get a sizeable raise is to change who you work for? I get the max raise provided by the company, which is usually just under inflation. But, I don't get a merit raise unless I quite and go to work somewhere else. Does anyone else find this to be true? If it is, what is required to change this? I hear people in different careers talk about the same thing so it isn't just my profession.
In India, the dirty politics makes all these shameful things. People who know to shake their dirty a** in the public proudly get all promotional prospects while those who are sincere to the organization are considered scapegoats. When you try to striking a lucrative offer, your manager makes frantic and desparate attempts to give you some 'good offers' for the following reasons: 1) Prevent attrition so that he can add a feather to his cap to his manager. 2) He is losing a scapegoat. :-D
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A pessimist sees only the dark side of the clouds, and mopes; a philosopher sees both sides, and shrugs; an optimist doesn't see the clouds at all - he's walking on them. --Leonard Louis Levinson -
Is it just me or does it seem like the only way to get a sizeable raise is to change who you work for? I get the max raise provided by the company, which is usually just under inflation. But, I don't get a merit raise unless I quite and go to work somewhere else. Does anyone else find this to be true? If it is, what is required to change this? I hear people in different careers talk about the same thing so it isn't just my profession.
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I must admit that I have given some thought to writing an article on the "softer side". In other words, dealing with clients, winning work, that type of thing.
Deja View - the feeling that you've seen this post before.
I second Mustafa. This is an article I would love reading. Especially because it will be written from a software developer's perspective as well (of course also the owner, manager, marketer, etc) but nonetheless a techie.
Cheers, Mircea "Pay people peanuts and you get monkeys" - David Ogilvy
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ramhog wrote:
Is it just me or does it seem like the only way to get a sizeable raise is to change who you work for?
Either that or to get promoted within the same company. Significant salary increases while staying in the same position/title seem to be pretty rare.
In my company almost all promotions are lateral unless you want to become manager (as in, no technical responsibilities.) I've been "promoted" to Sr developer, applications architect, project lead, team lead, tech lead, and others over the years. Not one of those promotions came with a raise. Although I must admit, my last several annual raises were significantly higher than the inflation rate.
Grim (aka Toby) MCDBA, MCSD, MCP+SB SELECT * FROM users WHERE clue IS NOT NULL (0 row(s) affected)
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That should be fine. I'd love to see that one finished.
"Every time Lotus Notes starts up, somewhere a puppy, a kitten, a lamb, and a baby seal are killed. Lotus Notes is a conspiracy by the forces of Satan to drive us over the brink into madness. The CRC-32 for each file in the installation includes the numbers 666." Gary Wheeler "The secret to a long and healthy life is simple. Don't get ill and don't die." Pete O'Hanlon, courtesy of Rama "I realised that all of my best anecdotes started with "So there we were, pissed". Pete O'Hanlon
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Is it just me or does it seem like the only way to get a sizeable raise is to change who you work for? I get the max raise provided by the company, which is usually just under inflation. But, I don't get a merit raise unless I quite and go to work somewhere else. Does anyone else find this to be true? If it is, what is required to change this? I hear people in different careers talk about the same thing so it isn't just my profession.
Well, it's determined by the company that you're working for. I would guess most don't have a huge IT budget to give thier people "sizable" raises just for the pure joy of doing so, though I have been at companies that did (and they no longer exist due to bankruptcy or whatever). They are paying you what they feel you are worth to them for the work that you are providing to them, so expect the inflationary paise raise and live with it...or show them your worth more by being better then your peers...or work hard to get a promotion and the raise that comes with it. Bottom line is you do what you have to do to make yourself happy, and if your worried that you should make more money and the company doesn't feel the same by only providing the infationary raises, then yes, move on. The company probably knows, as most do, that there's always someone to fill the position, so they pay accordingly.
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Nice job answering the OP question. Maybe get a hotel room and you two can start a partnership...
I hope you followed the thread and found that we did answer the question. :-D Perhaps you just need a hug.
Deja View - the feeling that you've seen this post before.