jobs.codeproject.com [modified]
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bigdenny200 wrote:
goes far beyond earning the costs of running several CP severs.
I'm thinking you are SERIOUSLY underestimating the costs involved in creating, operating and maintaining this site.
Can be true, since I have no idea how much the 'lifecycle' of running CP web-site costs, I just assumed, that such a massive job-site (targetting 5 million programmers), receiving reasonably high amount of money for a single job advertsiement, could still go far beyond the costs required for just running CP.
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bigdenny200 wrote:
Well, I think by charging around 300$ for one job listing, on the community of 5 million programmers, goes far beyond earning the costs of running several CP severs. Correct me if I am wrong again.
I'm not sure, but I think you have this a bit backwards. The cost is charged to an employer who wants to post a job on the job board. It isn't charged to a CP member who wants to view the job board, apply to the job, etc.
Scott Dorman
Microsoft® MVP - Visual C# | MCPD President - Tampa Bay IASA Hey, hey, hey. Don't be mean. We don't have to be mean because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are. - Buckaroo Banzai
No, I did not get it backwards, just the way I wrote was confusing. What I meant, is explained in my reply to Mike.
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bigdenny200 wrote:
Well, I think by charging around 300$ for one job listing, on the community of 5 million programmers, goes far beyond earning the costs of running several CP severs. Correct me if I am wrong again.
I'm not sure, but I think you have this a bit backwards. The cost is charged to an employer who wants to post a job on the job board. It isn't charged to a CP member who wants to view the job board, apply to the job, etc.
Scott Dorman
Microsoft® MVP - Visual C# | MCPD President - Tampa Bay IASA Hey, hey, hey. Don't be mean. We don't have to be mean because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are. - Buckaroo Banzai
Scott Dorman wrote:
The cost is charged to an employer who wants to post a job on the job board. It isn't charged to a CP member who wants to view the job board, apply to the job, etc.
Correct.
Sincerely, Elina Life is great!!! Enjoy every moment of it! :-O
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Well, I think by charging around 300$ for one job listing, on the community of 5 million programmers, goes far beyond earning the costs of running several CP severs. Correct me if I am wrong again.
A lot of those accounts belong to little Joshua and Kyle because they get banned every so often. :) Then there are the people who create an account when they find out they have to register for downloading ZIP files, forgetting they did the same thing yesterday.... All in all, I think the number of active users (few posts a month, an article a year) is in the low thousands.
Cheers, Vikram.
The hands that help are holier than the lips that pray.
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Hey All, I wonder, how "ethically" correct it is to create a web-site like, jobs.codeproject.com, within (please correct me if I am wrong) the codeproject.com site. The community at CP, is mostly doing what they do for free, and I don't think it is a good idea, to "use" this fact, in order to run a business like jobs.codeproject.com. In a way, it turns CP to a web-site which is masked under the name of a free software developer's community, while at the same time, its owners get highly paid by employers for running the job.codeproject.com service. In the very least case, I think these web-sites should be hosted on two different domains. Else, one will end up with a web-site offering jobs, and no more developers :). Please don't get furious :). Just putting my opinion, I am sure many have thought about this beforehand, and also I think, the reality might be a bit different then I described. So, simple clarifications (without swearings) and discussions would be welcome. PS. Another implication can be that, when one sees a "great" article by some programmer at CP, one does not know it anymore, whether it was done on a purely enthusiastic basis, or with the purpose to attract job seekers. Of course, this is always the case, since someone can link to his article on CP, but with this new approach it makes it even more obvious and noticable. PS2. I think that if the web-site goes on running, it should limit itself in terms of received vacancies, and not become very massive. Else, CP will turn into an employment agency, instead of a software developer community, after a while. Cheers.
I don't see any conflict of interest. While the site is free, there are cost involved in creating, running and maintaining it. Of course one could argue the writers get compensated, since I have not contributed any article I have no comments.
bigdenny200 wrote:
PS. Another implication can be that, when one sees a "great" article by some programmer at CP, one does not know it anymore, whether it was done on a purely enthusiastic basis, or with the purpose to attract job seekers. Of course, this is always the case, since someone can link to his article on CP, but with this new approach it makes it even more obvious and noticable.
In my last job hunt, I have used as reference some recommendations on LinkedIn to support my resume. I don't see any harm if someone writes an excellent article with the intention of showcasing it to potential employer down the road. It is a win-win situation. what do I know, my thinking could be skewed off a bit or more.
Yusuf
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Hey All, I wonder, how "ethically" correct it is to create a web-site like, jobs.codeproject.com, within (please correct me if I am wrong) the codeproject.com site. The community at CP, is mostly doing what they do for free, and I don't think it is a good idea, to "use" this fact, in order to run a business like jobs.codeproject.com. In a way, it turns CP to a web-site which is masked under the name of a free software developer's community, while at the same time, its owners get highly paid by employers for running the job.codeproject.com service. In the very least case, I think these web-sites should be hosted on two different domains. Else, one will end up with a web-site offering jobs, and no more developers :). Please don't get furious :). Just putting my opinion, I am sure many have thought about this beforehand, and also I think, the reality might be a bit different then I described. So, simple clarifications (without swearings) and discussions would be welcome. PS. Another implication can be that, when one sees a "great" article by some programmer at CP, one does not know it anymore, whether it was done on a purely enthusiastic basis, or with the purpose to attract job seekers. Of course, this is always the case, since someone can link to his article on CP, but with this new approach it makes it even more obvious and noticable. PS2. I think that if the web-site goes on running, it should limit itself in terms of received vacancies, and not become very massive. Else, CP will turn into an employment agency, instead of a software developer community, after a while. Cheers.
bigdenny200 wrote:
its owners get highly paid by employers for running the job.codeproject.com service
I added that little extract emphasis. If you really think that the owners are raking in huge amounts of cash, then why don't you start up your own site as well? The reality will hopefully click in quickly before you realize that it's much different than what you are describing. You are re-hashing the ad arguments that started several years ago when ad's starting appearring on the site. But the reality is that in order for CP to continue to provide all the services it provide's to our community, it has to generate revenue to cover costs. The creation of a job board is just a natural extension to that aim and I have no problem with it. :)
Chris Meech I am Canadian. [heard in a local bar] In theory there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice there is. [Yogi Berra] Donate to help Conquer Cancer[^]
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A lot of those accounts belong to little Joshua and Kyle because they get banned every so often. :) Then there are the people who create an account when they find out they have to register for downloading ZIP files, forgetting they did the same thing yesterday.... All in all, I think the number of active users (few posts a month, an article a year) is in the low thousands.
Cheers, Vikram.
The hands that help are holier than the lips that pray.
That is something I and you know, but that is something, "external" job employers don't :). Also, that is not something said next to the job add at the web-site: http://www.codeproject.com/
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bigdenny200 wrote:
its owners get highly paid by employers for running the job.codeproject.com service
I added that little extract emphasis. If you really think that the owners are raking in huge amounts of cash, then why don't you start up your own site as well? The reality will hopefully click in quickly before you realize that it's much different than what you are describing. You are re-hashing the ad arguments that started several years ago when ad's starting appearring on the site. But the reality is that in order for CP to continue to provide all the services it provide's to our community, it has to generate revenue to cover costs. The creation of a job board is just a natural extension to that aim and I have no problem with it. :)
Chris Meech I am Canadian. [heard in a local bar] In theory there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice there is. [Yogi Berra] Donate to help Conquer Cancer[^]
"I added that little extract emphasis. If you really think that the owners are raking in huge amounts of cash, then why don't you start up your own site as well? The reality will hopefully click in quickly before you realize that it's much different than what you are describing." Well, that's the point, that this web-site seems to be running within CP, and using the community that is here. Clearly, by just running a seperate job-site won't produce same revenues :).
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I don't see any conflict of interest. While the site is free, there are cost involved in creating, running and maintaining it. Of course one could argue the writers get compensated, since I have not contributed any article I have no comments.
bigdenny200 wrote:
PS. Another implication can be that, when one sees a "great" article by some programmer at CP, one does not know it anymore, whether it was done on a purely enthusiastic basis, or with the purpose to attract job seekers. Of course, this is always the case, since someone can link to his article on CP, but with this new approach it makes it even more obvious and noticable.
In my last job hunt, I have used as reference some recommendations on LinkedIn to support my resume. I don't see any harm if someone writes an excellent article with the intention of showcasing it to potential employer down the road. It is a win-win situation. what do I know, my thinking could be skewed off a bit or more.
Yusuf
"In my last job hunt, I have used as reference some recommendations on LinkedIn to support my resume. I don't see any harm if someone writes an excellent article with the intention of showcasing it to potential employer down the road. It is a win-win situation." Well, that is smth. I said as well. and what I said here (in that paragraph), is really a minor, and "ad-hoc" argument. Probably it is better for me to remove it...
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Hey All, I wonder, how "ethically" correct it is to create a web-site like, jobs.codeproject.com, within (please correct me if I am wrong) the codeproject.com site. The community at CP, is mostly doing what they do for free, and I don't think it is a good idea, to "use" this fact, in order to run a business like jobs.codeproject.com. In a way, it turns CP to a web-site which is masked under the name of a free software developer's community, while at the same time, its owners get highly paid by employers for running the job.codeproject.com service. In the very least case, I think these web-sites should be hosted on two different domains. Else, one will end up with a web-site offering jobs, and no more developers :). Please don't get furious :). Just putting my opinion, I am sure many have thought about this beforehand, and also I think, the reality might be a bit different then I described. So, simple clarifications (without swearings) and discussions would be welcome. PS. Another implication can be that, when one sees a "great" article by some programmer at CP, one does not know it anymore, whether it was done on a purely enthusiastic basis, or with the purpose to attract job seekers. Of course, this is always the case, since someone can link to his article on CP, but with this new approach it makes it even more obvious and noticable. PS2. I think that if the web-site goes on running, it should limit itself in terms of received vacancies, and not become very massive. Else, CP will turn into an employment agency, instead of a software developer community, after a while. Cheers.
Why are you not happy when CP got money? I'm absolutely fine if Chris become a richest man in the world :)
Thanks and Regards, Michael Sync ( Blog: http://michaelsync.net)
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Scott Dorman wrote:
The cost is charged to an employer who wants to post a job on the job board. It isn't charged to a CP member who wants to view the job board, apply to the job, etc.
Correct.
Sincerely, Elina Life is great!!! Enjoy every moment of it! :-O
But his assumption was not correct :).
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Why are you not happy when CP got money? I'm absolutely fine if Chris become a richest man in the world :)
Thanks and Regards, Michael Sync ( Blog: http://michaelsync.net)
Well, not that I am unhappy. I just think in the long-term, it can actually, be even harmful for CP.
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But his assumption was not correct :).
Why do you think so?
Sincerely, Elina Life is great!!! Enjoy every moment of it! :-O
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Can be true, since I have no idea how much the 'lifecycle' of running CP web-site costs, I just assumed, that such a massive job-site (targetting 5 million programmers), receiving reasonably high amount of money for a single job advertsiement, could still go far beyond the costs required for just running CP.
bigdenny200 wrote:
could still go far beyond the costs required for just running CP.
Let's assume it's true... my question is: So?
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Well, I think by charging around 300$ for one job listing, on the community of 5 million programmers, goes far beyond earning the costs of running several CP severs. Correct me if I am wrong again.
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Well, not that I am unhappy. I just think in the long-term, it can actually, be even harmful for CP.
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bigdenny200 wrote:
could still go far beyond the costs required for just running CP.
Let's assume it's true... my question is: So?
So, read my first forum post :).
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Hey All, I wonder, how "ethically" correct it is to create a web-site like, jobs.codeproject.com, within (please correct me if I am wrong) the codeproject.com site. The community at CP, is mostly doing what they do for free, and I don't think it is a good idea, to "use" this fact, in order to run a business like jobs.codeproject.com. In a way, it turns CP to a web-site which is masked under the name of a free software developer's community, while at the same time, its owners get highly paid by employers for running the job.codeproject.com service. In the very least case, I think these web-sites should be hosted on two different domains. Else, one will end up with a web-site offering jobs, and no more developers :). Please don't get furious :). Just putting my opinion, I am sure many have thought about this beforehand, and also I think, the reality might be a bit different then I described. So, simple clarifications (without swearings) and discussions would be welcome. PS. Another implication can be that, when one sees a "great" article by some programmer at CP, one does not know it anymore, whether it was done on a purely enthusiastic basis, or with the purpose to attract job seekers. Of course, this is always the case, since someone can link to his article on CP, but with this new approach it makes it even more obvious and noticable. PS2. I think that if the web-site goes on running, it should limit itself in terms of received vacancies, and not become very massive. Else, CP will turn into an employment agency, instead of a software developer community, after a while. Cheers.
I have no problems at all with it. CodeProject is a great resource for developer's wishing to showcase their talent and knowledge, and a great place for prospective employers looking for the best (so long as they're clued up enough to separate the wheat from the chaff, and the best people here wouldn't want to work for someone who can't). It's win-win as far as I'm concerned.
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Well, not that I am unhappy. I just think in the long-term, it can actually, be even harmful for CP.
Employers are not stupid, man.. sooner or later, they will know 5 millions is the count of accounts or actual users... they will consider the result after posting the job ads here.. if there is so much benefits but pay so high then they won't do next time.. I'm thinking in chris's place.. if I were chris, i might also do the same thing.. as u know, there are a lot of tech article sites but CP is much better than other... CP allows us to disable Inline Text ads which is I hate the most. We don't need to go a lot of pages to read the whole article.. there is no big annoying ads at the middle or top of the article.. so, CP has done a lot of good things for us..
Thanks and Regards, Michael Sync ( Blog: http://michaelsync.net)
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If they didn't charge they would get flooded by timewasters.
Visit http://www.notreadytogiveup.com/[^] and do something special today.
Well, one could filter out (bad) received job vacancies, and at least charge reasonably less amount, for advertisements. Actually, came to think now, maybe by charging this amount, CP tries to maintain high quality of job seekers? -- but what does that change, one could still do the filtering manually. At the very least, the idea should be to make the job web-site, relatively limited in terms of allowed job applications, and not make it too massive, else, it may over shade CP after a while :).