The World has gone mad...
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State Pattern, Strategy pattern,Visitor pattern, BizConnector, NTier, Adapter and fly weight The world has gone buzzword mad, with all this stuff floating around, isnt there any substitute for good old fashioned analysis and design?? I am over 30 so this might be a case of me being an old Fart.. but all the systems I have designed and written function quite well using the "Old" methods without any of this pattern junk.. Or are all of these buzzwords around so programmers have some buzzwords to baffle the managers with on their CV's?? Its all a waste of time imo, if you can design and code competantly, whats the point in all this pattern rubbish? Prehaps its time for me to retire from coding and move up to the levels of senior management... *stomps off and growls in the corner*
They're just terms for what you're already doing, but were unable to communicate succinctly. Would you rather have to explain what the State Pattern means to a dim junior programmer, or just say "go look up State Pattern" and get on with real work (or whatever)?
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State Pattern, Strategy pattern,Visitor pattern, BizConnector, NTier, Adapter and fly weight The world has gone buzzword mad, with all this stuff floating around, isnt there any substitute for good old fashioned analysis and design?? I am over 30 so this might be a case of me being an old Fart.. but all the systems I have designed and written function quite well using the "Old" methods without any of this pattern junk.. Or are all of these buzzwords around so programmers have some buzzwords to baffle the managers with on their CV's?? Its all a waste of time imo, if you can design and code competantly, whats the point in all this pattern rubbish? Prehaps its time for me to retire from coding and move up to the levels of senior management... *stomps off and growls in the corner*
Errm - I'm well over 30, and I use patterns daily. Once you realise that they are names for common sense ideas, it makes it a lot easier.
Deja View - the feeling that you've seen this post before.
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State Pattern, Strategy pattern,Visitor pattern, BizConnector, NTier, Adapter and fly weight The world has gone buzzword mad, with all this stuff floating around, isnt there any substitute for good old fashioned analysis and design?? I am over 30 so this might be a case of me being an old Fart.. but all the systems I have designed and written function quite well using the "Old" methods without any of this pattern junk.. Or are all of these buzzwords around so programmers have some buzzwords to baffle the managers with on their CV's?? Its all a waste of time imo, if you can design and code competantly, whats the point in all this pattern rubbish? Prehaps its time for me to retire from coding and move up to the levels of senior management... *stomps off and growls in the corner*
Male Pattern Baldness. You forgot that one. ;P
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State Pattern, Strategy pattern,Visitor pattern, BizConnector, NTier, Adapter and fly weight The world has gone buzzword mad, with all this stuff floating around, isnt there any substitute for good old fashioned analysis and design?? I am over 30 so this might be a case of me being an old Fart.. but all the systems I have designed and written function quite well using the "Old" methods without any of this pattern junk.. Or are all of these buzzwords around so programmers have some buzzwords to baffle the managers with on their CV's?? Its all a waste of time imo, if you can design and code competantly, whats the point in all this pattern rubbish? Prehaps its time for me to retire from coding and move up to the levels of senior management... *stomps off and growls in the corner*
GriffinPeter wrote:
isnt there any substitute for good old fashioned analysis and design?? I am over 30 so this might be a case of me being an old Fart.. but all the systems I have designed and written function quite well using the "Old" methods without any of this pattern junk..
Design Patterns are nothing new. I'm well over 30 and I've been using patterns where appropriate for over a decade now.
GriffinPeter wrote:
whats the point in all this pattern rubbish?
It's merely a descriptive language that is intended to help you communicate and document the choices you took to build a system. Think of it as a way of naming your tools....Everyone knows what a wrench is, but just calling it a wrench doesn't describe all of the details.
GriffinPeter wrote:
Prehaps its time for me to retire from coding and move up to the levels of senior management...
Or, catch up with the past. The first book on programming patterns was released in 1995. The real problem that I see with pattern use it that it's use is often bragged about by people who I wouldn't hire to do data entry work.
Sovereign ingredient for a happy marriage: Pay cash or do without. Interest charges not only eat up a household budget; awareness of debt eats up domestic felicity. --Lazarus Long
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State Pattern, Strategy pattern,Visitor pattern, BizConnector, NTier, Adapter and fly weight The world has gone buzzword mad, with all this stuff floating around, isnt there any substitute for good old fashioned analysis and design?? I am over 30 so this might be a case of me being an old Fart.. but all the systems I have designed and written function quite well using the "Old" methods without any of this pattern junk.. Or are all of these buzzwords around so programmers have some buzzwords to baffle the managers with on their CV's?? Its all a waste of time imo, if you can design and code competantly, whats the point in all this pattern rubbish? Prehaps its time for me to retire from coding and move up to the levels of senior management... *stomps off and growls in the corner*
GriffinPeter wrote:
analysis and design
Analysis and Design? Well I'll mention it to the troops, but I don't think they'll be happy.
Ahoy! Martin Hughes
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GriffinPeter wrote:
analysis and design
Analysis and Design? Well I'll mention it to the troops, but I don't think they'll be happy.
Ahoy! Martin Hughes
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State Pattern, Strategy pattern,Visitor pattern, BizConnector, NTier, Adapter and fly weight The world has gone buzzword mad, with all this stuff floating around, isnt there any substitute for good old fashioned analysis and design?? I am over 30 so this might be a case of me being an old Fart.. but all the systems I have designed and written function quite well using the "Old" methods without any of this pattern junk.. Or are all of these buzzwords around so programmers have some buzzwords to baffle the managers with on their CV's?? Its all a waste of time imo, if you can design and code competantly, whats the point in all this pattern rubbish? Prehaps its time for me to retire from coding and move up to the levels of senior management... *stomps off and growls in the corner*
I stopped putting all that crap on my resume, and replaced it all with a single sentence: "I gots da skillz dood."
"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass..." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997
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"...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001 -
I stopped putting all that crap on my resume, and replaced it all with a single sentence: "I gots da skillz dood."
"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass..." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997
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"...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
"I gots da skillz dood."
Think it's "I gots mad skillz dood."
¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire! Real Mentats use only 100% pure, unfooled around with Sapho Juice(tm)! SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0 0 rows returned Save an Orange - Use the VCF! VCF Blog
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Crikey. I haven't heard anyone mention SSADM in years.
Ahoy! Martin Hughes
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State Pattern, Strategy pattern,Visitor pattern, BizConnector, NTier, Adapter and fly weight The world has gone buzzword mad, with all this stuff floating around, isnt there any substitute for good old fashioned analysis and design?? I am over 30 so this might be a case of me being an old Fart.. but all the systems I have designed and written function quite well using the "Old" methods without any of this pattern junk.. Or are all of these buzzwords around so programmers have some buzzwords to baffle the managers with on their CV's?? Its all a waste of time imo, if you can design and code competantly, whats the point in all this pattern rubbish? Prehaps its time for me to retire from coding and move up to the levels of senior management... *stomps off and growls in the corner*
Count me in as one of the old guys who uses patterns. I think the ability to recognize when a pattern can be applied, and the ability to communicate that concept quickly to another programmer is a tremendous improvement in application development.
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Crikey. I haven't heard anyone mention SSADM in years.
Ahoy! Martin Hughes
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Along with ADA?
Ahoy! Martin Hughes
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Along with ADA?
Ahoy! Martin Hughes
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State Pattern, Strategy pattern,Visitor pattern, BizConnector, NTier, Adapter and fly weight The world has gone buzzword mad, with all this stuff floating around, isnt there any substitute for good old fashioned analysis and design?? I am over 30 so this might be a case of me being an old Fart.. but all the systems I have designed and written function quite well using the "Old" methods without any of this pattern junk.. Or are all of these buzzwords around so programmers have some buzzwords to baffle the managers with on their CV's?? Its all a waste of time imo, if you can design and code competantly, whats the point in all this pattern rubbish? Prehaps its time for me to retire from coding and move up to the levels of senior management... *stomps off and growls in the corner*
patterns programming is just another attempt at standardization of methods, this time on algorithms rather than storage. Just as you would recognize the reference to hashes or lists for storage, once you learn the terms you will probably recognize that you have been using them all already, just not in a standard way. So why do patterns? Well, why did we standardize storage? Right now our company has two hash tables. 1) mine 2) someone elses. That someone else is currently debugging his because of multi-threading issues, mine currently is working massively parallel. Duplication of work, and misunderstandings in storage methods, as well as poor implimentations encouraged storage method standardization over the years. Not that everyone is perfect there either (obviously), still the closer everyone comes to standardization with each others work the easier it is to understand someone else's code. patterns are just names to algorithmic pieces of programming code. Not so different than naming nodes interlinked as a doubly linked list. :) most programmers, even the older ones would recognized the names of queues lists arrays and stacks without batting an eye. Patterns are just new names for old methods. :) P.S. I am 43. :-D
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb) John Andrew Holmes "It is well to remember that the entire universe, with one trifling exception, is composed of others."
modified on Tuesday, October 14, 2008 6:31 PM
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John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
"I gots da skillz dood."
Think it's "I gots mad skillz dood."
¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire! Real Mentats use only 100% pure, unfooled around with Sapho Juice(tm)! SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0 0 rows returned Save an Orange - Use the VCF! VCF Blog
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patterns programming is just another attempt at standardization of methods, this time on algorithms rather than storage. Just as you would recognize the reference to hashes or lists for storage, once you learn the terms you will probably recognize that you have been using them all already, just not in a standard way. So why do patterns? Well, why did we standardize storage? Right now our company has two hash tables. 1) mine 2) someone elses. That someone else is currently debugging his because of multi-threading issues, mine currently is working massively parallel. Duplication of work, and misunderstandings in storage methods, as well as poor implimentations encouraged storage method standardization over the years. Not that everyone is perfect there either (obviously), still the closer everyone comes to standardization with each others work the easier it is to understand someone else's code. patterns are just names to algorithmic pieces of programming code. Not so different than naming nodes interlinked as a doubly linked list. :) most programmers, even the older ones would recognized the names of queues lists arrays and stacks without batting an eye. Patterns are just new names for old methods. :) P.S. I am 43. :-D
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb) John Andrew Holmes "It is well to remember that the entire universe, with one trifling exception, is composed of others."
modified on Tuesday, October 14, 2008 6:31 PM
anybody besides me and the OP think that these "common methods" were very poorly named? hash? list? i get that. templateFactorySingleton... Well, back to google again...
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anybody besides me and the OP think that these "common methods" were very poorly named? hash? list? i get that. templateFactorySingleton... Well, back to google again...
Steve Hazel wrote:
hash? list? i get that.
Well.... they are common because they have been around so long they have become common. However. Just as an example. Hash is not so common. :) You have true hashes, and bucket hashes. So when is a hash a hash? when we declare it a hash. With lists you have single, double, and skip lists. How many people know what a skip list is? it never really made the standards.... (pity, I like them) Then you get into multi-threaded implimentations with protected latch lists (protect the attach and detach of a list member) or transactional memory, or optimistic FIFO's, etc. The names mean something to someone, but until they become as old as dirt, we don't recognize them. A template factory singleton is a single unitary existing object (singleton) that produces (factory) a variety of other objects based on some sort of template input. :)
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb) John Andrew Holmes "It is well to remember that the entire universe, with one trifling exception, is composed of others."
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Along with ADA?
Ahoy! Martin Hughes
martin_hughes wrote:
Along with ADA?
Nope Ada became strictly a military thing. Colleges moved on to other languages rapidly. :)
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb) John Andrew Holmes "It is well to remember that the entire universe, with one trifling exception, is composed of others."
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Steve Hazel wrote:
hash? list? i get that.
Well.... they are common because they have been around so long they have become common. However. Just as an example. Hash is not so common. :) You have true hashes, and bucket hashes. So when is a hash a hash? when we declare it a hash. With lists you have single, double, and skip lists. How many people know what a skip list is? it never really made the standards.... (pity, I like them) Then you get into multi-threaded implimentations with protected latch lists (protect the attach and detach of a list member) or transactional memory, or optimistic FIFO's, etc. The names mean something to someone, but until they become as old as dirt, we don't recognize them. A template factory singleton is a single unitary existing object (singleton) that produces (factory) a variety of other objects based on some sort of template input. :)
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb) John Andrew Holmes "It is well to remember that the entire universe, with one trifling exception, is composed of others."
El Corazon wrote:
So when is a hash a hash?
When it's followed by "brown" and served for breakfast :)
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State Pattern, Strategy pattern,Visitor pattern, BizConnector, NTier, Adapter and fly weight The world has gone buzzword mad, with all this stuff floating around, isnt there any substitute for good old fashioned analysis and design?? I am over 30 so this might be a case of me being an old Fart.. but all the systems I have designed and written function quite well using the "Old" methods without any of this pattern junk.. Or are all of these buzzwords around so programmers have some buzzwords to baffle the managers with on their CV's?? Its all a waste of time imo, if you can design and code competantly, whats the point in all this pattern rubbish? Prehaps its time for me to retire from coding and move up to the levels of senior management... *stomps off and growls in the corner*
