the american-iraq-taliban-thing...
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i had this discussion with a guy recently where he was bleating on at how badly the poor taliban fighters were being treated in cuba by the americans ... having to wear hoods and being handcuffed etc ... like duh! whether its fair or not its a simple fact that everyone should know by now ... if you play soldier boy with the americans you will lose and get f**ked up in the process ... if you cant figure that out by now you really shouldnt be playing with guns and bombs and besides if you do play with guns and bombs you deserve whatever you get in return
"... and so i said to him ... if it don't dance (or code) and you can't eat it either f**k it or throw it away"
biz stuff about me -
i had this discussion with a guy recently where he was bleating on at how badly the poor taliban fighters were being treated in cuba by the americans ... having to wear hoods and being handcuffed etc ... like duh! whether its fair or not its a simple fact that everyone should know by now ... if you play soldier boy with the americans you will lose and get f**ked up in the process ... if you cant figure that out by now you really shouldnt be playing with guns and bombs and besides if you do play with guns and bombs you deserve whatever you get in return
"... and so i said to him ... if it don't dance (or code) and you can't eat it either f**k it or throw it away"
biz stuff about meI guess you just described the typical US-american view of the world. -- Scanned MSDN Mag ad with YOUR name: www.magerquark.de/misc/CodeProject.html See me: www.magerquark.de
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I guess you just described the typical US-american view of the world. -- Scanned MSDN Mag ad with YOUR name: www.magerquark.de/misc/CodeProject.html See me: www.magerquark.de
which I thought that would change witn WTC attacks. Not that I agree with that horrible act, it's far away from that. But this view is the main reason people usually hate americans. I'm talking about the others. I tend not to generalize things, there are good americans, there are bad... people just remember the bad ones.
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I guess you just described the typical US-american view of the world. -- Scanned MSDN Mag ad with YOUR name: www.magerquark.de/misc/CodeProject.html See me: www.magerquark.de
I guess we could have housed them all in nice middle class homes and had them over for tea. Tim Smith "Programmers are always surrounded by complexity; we can not avoid it... If our basic tool, the language in which we design and code our programs, is also complicated, the language itself becomes part of the problem rather that part of the solution." Hoare - 1980 ACM Turing Award Lecture
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I guess we could have housed them all in nice middle class homes and had them over for tea. Tim Smith "Programmers are always surrounded by complexity; we can not avoid it... If our basic tool, the language in which we design and code our programs, is also complicated, the language itself becomes part of the problem rather that part of the solution." Hoare - 1980 ACM Turing Award Lecture
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i had this discussion with a guy recently where he was bleating on at how badly the poor taliban fighters were being treated in cuba by the americans ... having to wear hoods and being handcuffed etc ... like duh! whether its fair or not its a simple fact that everyone should know by now ... if you play soldier boy with the americans you will lose and get f**ked up in the process ... if you cant figure that out by now you really shouldnt be playing with guns and bombs and besides if you do play with guns and bombs you deserve whatever you get in return
"... and so i said to him ... if it don't dance (or code) and you can't eat it either f**k it or throw it away"
biz stuff about meI believe it's the (British) S.A.S. that have a saying, "Big boys' games, big boys' rules". Enough said really..... B.
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I guess we could have housed them all in nice middle class homes and had them over for tea. Tim Smith "Programmers are always surrounded by complexity; we can not avoid it... If our basic tool, the language in which we design and code our programs, is also complicated, the language itself becomes part of the problem rather that part of the solution." Hoare - 1980 ACM Turing Award Lecture
Tim Smith wrote: and had them over for tea. No, no, no. Americans don't have people around for tea, thats the Brits. Americans have people round for a brewsky or some wife swa... I mean a bbq. p.s. I still find you devilishly attractive Timothy... (Hey if you don't stop posting after this at least we know you really are a man and not a female programmer.)
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South Africa -
I believe it's the (British) S.A.S. that have a saying, "Big boys' games, big boys' rules". Enough said really..... B.
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i had this discussion with a guy recently where he was bleating on at how badly the poor taliban fighters were being treated in cuba by the americans ... having to wear hoods and being handcuffed etc ... like duh! whether its fair or not its a simple fact that everyone should know by now ... if you play soldier boy with the americans you will lose and get f**ked up in the process ... if you cant figure that out by now you really shouldnt be playing with guns and bombs and besides if you do play with guns and bombs you deserve whatever you get in return
"... and so i said to him ... if it don't dance (or code) and you can't eat it either f**k it or throw it away"
biz stuff about melauren wrote: and besides if you do play with guns and bombs you deserve whatever you get in return Yeah but it doesn't matter. You could rape babies, be treated badly and still have nutters bleating that you should be treated better. People just want to appear to be on a moral* high ground. High minded, caring, "we are just bringing ourselves down to their level" blah blah etc. blah. It is the done thing. In our day and age it is not proper to reveal that you really want to hurt the buggers for what they did, that they should be raped back etc. And the problem is that everyone goes along with that, so everyone bleats which just re-enforces the reason to bleat, rather than trying to bring out what people really think. Saying all of that: I am glad they left that one high up Talibanananana critter in Pakistan where the ends justifies the means. * or ethically, whichever the right word is, I can never figure that one out
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South Africa -
I guess you just described the typical US-american view of the world. -- Scanned MSDN Mag ad with YOUR name: www.magerquark.de/misc/CodeProject.html See me: www.magerquark.de
And I guess you just described the typical Germano-European view of americans. Tomaz
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which I thought that would change witn WTC attacks. Not that I agree with that horrible act, it's far away from that. But this view is the main reason people usually hate americans. I'm talking about the others. I tend not to generalize things, there are good americans, there are bad... people just remember the bad ones.
RodLima wrote: people just remember the bad ones. Most arabs in middle-east never saw the [good] americans (i mean, americans who were good to them)! They just see US policies. 1. supporting creation of Israel against Arab wishes. 2. supporting Israel with military equipment. 3. overthrowing a democratic Iranian president and replace him with Shah. 4. support Saddam to fight Khomeini 5. supporting Saudis for oil, even though most 9/11 guys were Saudi (no option, I guess) - other than get a fovaouable govt. in Iraq. etc ..... These are the things that remain in memory, because they change lives. The good deeds most often are not in the same league. I can think of Russians probably loving Gorbachev for freeing them from the communist party autocracy.
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which I thought that would change witn WTC attacks. Not that I agree with that horrible act, it's far away from that. But this view is the main reason people usually hate americans. I'm talking about the others. I tend not to generalize things, there are good americans, there are bad... people just remember the bad ones.
I would not agree. I had (perhaps rare) opportunity to meet and know in person many American haters in Europe. Most of them (now I am sincere) hate Americans, because their life's gone bad and they need distraction. Their heads are usually full of leftist propaganda (this is especially true for my German friends which appear to me close to brainwashed, when we meet) and have no idea what they are talking about. Tomaz
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i had this discussion with a guy recently where he was bleating on at how badly the poor taliban fighters were being treated in cuba by the americans ... having to wear hoods and being handcuffed etc ... like duh! whether its fair or not its a simple fact that everyone should know by now ... if you play soldier boy with the americans you will lose and get f**ked up in the process ... if you cant figure that out by now you really shouldnt be playing with guns and bombs and besides if you do play with guns and bombs you deserve whatever you get in return
"... and so i said to him ... if it don't dance (or code) and you can't eat it either f**k it or throw it away"
biz stuff about melauren wrote: i had this discussion with a guy recently where he was bleating on at how badly the poor taliban fighters were being treated in cuba by the americans ... having to wear hoods and being handcuffed etc ... like duh! I think that your friend is right to some respect... The treatment that Taliban fighters received is far from the standards they are used to. I guess a bullet in the head (preferably at some sports stadium) would have been much closer to the traditional way they might consider much more apropriate.
/* I C++, therefore I am... */
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I would not agree. I had (perhaps rare) opportunity to meet and know in person many American haters in Europe. Most of them (now I am sincere) hate Americans, because their life's gone bad and they need distraction. Their heads are usually full of leftist propaganda (this is especially true for my German friends which appear to me close to brainwashed, when we meet) and have no idea what they are talking about. Tomaz
tstih wrote: Their heads are usually full of leftist propaganda (this is especially true for my German friends which appear to me close to brainwashed, when we meet) and have no idea what they are talking about. The funny thing is they probably think the same of you; swapping appropriate words of course :) [Edit: when will I learn to spell think?]
James Sig code stolen from David Wulff
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And I guess you just described the typical Germano-European view of americans. Tomaz
Of course! -- Scanned MSDN Mag ad with YOUR name: www.magerquark.de/misc/CodeProject.html See me: www.magerquark.de
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RodLima wrote: people just remember the bad ones. Most arabs in middle-east never saw the [good] americans (i mean, americans who were good to them)! They just see US policies. 1. supporting creation of Israel against Arab wishes. 2. supporting Israel with military equipment. 3. overthrowing a democratic Iranian president and replace him with Shah. 4. support Saddam to fight Khomeini 5. supporting Saudis for oil, even though most 9/11 guys were Saudi (no option, I guess) - other than get a fovaouable govt. in Iraq. etc ..... These are the things that remain in memory, because they change lives. The good deeds most often are not in the same league. I can think of Russians probably loving Gorbachev for freeing them from the communist party autocracy.
yep. Good point, George. I would just add that the above is just oh so shallow European leftist. Typically an angry German will use these facts, but only to criticize United States. But he will be left pointless, when asked about alternatives. For example: So what do you think, how we should handle Israel in 48? So are you saying that the world should leave Israelis to their fate? So should Americans let Iranians under Khomeini defeat Iraq? Would you prefer to have unstable Saudi Arabia and pay double for gasoline? Hell, I can be a libertarian primadonna in the same way. And critisize leftist views. I can start with critique of Soviet Union and China. But that would sound ridiculus to the other side. Because they would be on the receiving end. But when they do it they really don't think about how stupid they sound with only critique and no alternatives offered. Tomaz
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lauren wrote: and besides if you do play with guns and bombs you deserve whatever you get in return Yeah but it doesn't matter. You could rape babies, be treated badly and still have nutters bleating that you should be treated better. People just want to appear to be on a moral* high ground. High minded, caring, "we are just bringing ourselves down to their level" blah blah etc. blah. It is the done thing. In our day and age it is not proper to reveal that you really want to hurt the buggers for what they did, that they should be raped back etc. And the problem is that everyone goes along with that, so everyone bleats which just re-enforces the reason to bleat, rather than trying to bring out what people really think. Saying all of that: I am glad they left that one high up Talibanananana critter in Pakistan where the ends justifies the means. * or ethically, whichever the right word is, I can never figure that one out
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaMoral (Encarta's summary definitions): 1. involving right and wrong 2. derived from personal conscience 3. in terms of natural justice 4. encouraging goodness and respectability 5. good by accepted standards 6. telling right from wrong 7. based on conviction Ethical (Encarta's full definitions because I think the expanded text is pertinent): 1. conforming to accepted standards: consistent with agreed principles of correct moral conduct. Example: While such activities are not strictly illegal, they are certainly not ethical. 2. of ethics: relating to or involving ethics 3. (pharmacology) available by prescription only: used to describe a drug that is available only through a doctor’s prescription Ethics (Encarta's summary definitions): 1. study of morality’s effect on conduct 2. code of morality Microsoft® Encarta® Reference Library 2003. © 1993-2002 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.
So as you can see, there is a difference, yet a convoluted one.
-Domenic Denicola- [CPUA 0x1337] MadHamster Creations "I was born human. But this was an accident of fate - a condition merely of time and place. I believe it's something we have the power to change..."
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Of course! -- Scanned MSDN Mag ad with YOUR name: www.magerquark.de/misc/CodeProject.html See me: www.magerquark.de
Just a thought. Did a thought ever crossed your mind, that you have a whole lot of internal problems in Germany, that demand much more attention then saving Saddam Hussei? Such as: 4 mio. unemployed, expensive work force, high taxes, recession. Things that need to be changed. Work force need to be less protected, taxes need to be lowered, egalitarism need to be replaced by healthy competition between German people. Well, if you haven't then that's exactly what Schroeder wanted. He wanted you not to think about these problems. He wanted you to concentrate on external enemy and turn your frustations towards this enemy instead of thinking about these problems when you vote. Tomaz
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tstih wrote: Their heads are usually full of leftist propaganda (this is especially true for my German friends which appear to me close to brainwashed, when we meet) and have no idea what they are talking about. The funny thing is they probably think the same of you; swapping appropriate words of course :) [Edit: when will I learn to spell think?]
James Sig code stolen from David Wulff
So do Iraquis, but that doesn't make them any wiser. Fact is that not only were Germans very much against the first intervention (which shows that their attitude is absolutely no news), but they did have a good chance to prove that the "Deutsche Weg" works - in Bosnia. The result of their wisdom was 200.000 slaughtered Muslims and 100.000 dead Serbs and Croats. And now they want to continue with the same. Geez. Tomaz
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RodLima wrote: people just remember the bad ones. Most arabs in middle-east never saw the [good] americans (i mean, americans who were good to them)! They just see US policies. 1. supporting creation of Israel against Arab wishes. 2. supporting Israel with military equipment. 3. overthrowing a democratic Iranian president and replace him with Shah. 4. support Saddam to fight Khomeini 5. supporting Saudis for oil, even though most 9/11 guys were Saudi (no option, I guess) - other than get a fovaouable govt. in Iraq. etc ..... These are the things that remain in memory, because they change lives. The good deeds most often are not in the same league. I can think of Russians probably loving Gorbachev for freeing them from the communist party autocracy.
Thomas George wrote: 1. supporting creation of Israel against Arab wishes. The beloved UN did that:) Thomas George wrote: 2. supporting Israel with military equipment. Blame USSR for starting this, USA shipped weapons only in response. Thomas George wrote: 3. overthrowing a democratic Iranian president and replace him with Shah. When? Thomas George wrote: 4. support Saddam to fight Khomeini The arabs mostly supported Saddam since he is suna muslim.