ok ... call me stupid but...
-
why do we need .NET? i don't mean this as a flame against it in particular but more in the sense that we have technologies (mfc, atl, com, wtl, vb, asp, etc, etc) that lets us build useful apps for the world at large and the world at large seems happy that they run these apps and get work done (well, thats how it happens in my universe) what do we get from .NET? different looking windows that are better windows than the current windows? better buttons? better listboxes? etc etc ... i think .NOT is this really that ms want to change their method of generating revenues for their systems but can't unless we (the great unwashed developers of this world) go with them and thereby force our customers to follow suit i can just see the conversation with one of my clients now: me: "ummm ... you have to upgrade your software now" client: "why? it works just fine" me: "well yes but we rewrote it in .NET so you must change to that version" client: "dot what?" me: "don't worry ... just do as i say ... and buy a new machine and os while you're at it" client to co-worker: "george ... what's that other software company's name we used to do busines with?" uh huh ... like it .... DOT.NOT --- "every year we invent better idiot proof systems and every year they invent better idiots"
-
why do we need .NET? i don't mean this as a flame against it in particular but more in the sense that we have technologies (mfc, atl, com, wtl, vb, asp, etc, etc) that lets us build useful apps for the world at large and the world at large seems happy that they run these apps and get work done (well, thats how it happens in my universe) what do we get from .NET? different looking windows that are better windows than the current windows? better buttons? better listboxes? etc etc ... i think .NOT is this really that ms want to change their method of generating revenues for their systems but can't unless we (the great unwashed developers of this world) go with them and thereby force our customers to follow suit i can just see the conversation with one of my clients now: me: "ummm ... you have to upgrade your software now" client: "why? it works just fine" me: "well yes but we rewrote it in .NET so you must change to that version" client: "dot what?" me: "don't worry ... just do as i say ... and buy a new machine and os while you're at it" client to co-worker: "george ... what's that other software company's name we used to do busines with?" uh huh ... like it .... DOT.NOT --- "every year we invent better idiot proof systems and every year they invent better idiots"
-
why do we need .NET? i don't mean this as a flame against it in particular but more in the sense that we have technologies (mfc, atl, com, wtl, vb, asp, etc, etc) that lets us build useful apps for the world at large and the world at large seems happy that they run these apps and get work done (well, thats how it happens in my universe) what do we get from .NET? different looking windows that are better windows than the current windows? better buttons? better listboxes? etc etc ... i think .NOT is this really that ms want to change their method of generating revenues for their systems but can't unless we (the great unwashed developers of this world) go with them and thereby force our customers to follow suit i can just see the conversation with one of my clients now: me: "ummm ... you have to upgrade your software now" client: "why? it works just fine" me: "well yes but we rewrote it in .NET so you must change to that version" client: "dot what?" me: "don't worry ... just do as i say ... and buy a new machine and os while you're at it" client to co-worker: "george ... what's that other software company's name we used to do busines with?" uh huh ... like it .... DOT.NOT --- "every year we invent better idiot proof systems and every year they invent better idiots"
ROTFL !!! Too much truth and humour for me to take this early in the morning !!! Christian I've learned that you cannot make someone love you. All you can do is stalk them and hope they panic and give in. The early bird may get the worm, but it's the second mouse that gets the cheese.
-
why do we need .NET? i don't mean this as a flame against it in particular but more in the sense that we have technologies (mfc, atl, com, wtl, vb, asp, etc, etc) that lets us build useful apps for the world at large and the world at large seems happy that they run these apps and get work done (well, thats how it happens in my universe) what do we get from .NET? different looking windows that are better windows than the current windows? better buttons? better listboxes? etc etc ... i think .NOT is this really that ms want to change their method of generating revenues for their systems but can't unless we (the great unwashed developers of this world) go with them and thereby force our customers to follow suit i can just see the conversation with one of my clients now: me: "ummm ... you have to upgrade your software now" client: "why? it works just fine" me: "well yes but we rewrote it in .NET so you must change to that version" client: "dot what?" me: "don't worry ... just do as i say ... and buy a new machine and os while you're at it" client to co-worker: "george ... what's that other software company's name we used to do busines with?" uh huh ... like it .... DOT.NOT --- "every year we invent better idiot proof systems and every year they invent better idiots"
Hello! So, why do we need .NET? Because .NET helps us build new kind of Internet applications like web services more easily than current technologies. For example, try compare build web service via SOAP toolkit and via VS.NET, and you must see the difference. Also try compare ASP 3.0 and ASP.NET. ASP.NET is IMHO big step forward. If you try build few web applications via ASP.NET you certainly will do not want build it again with ASP. With .NET/C# you can be really more productive than with WinAPI/COM/C++. And there is, at last, ONE COMMON application framework for building all kinds of applications, so if you know how to build win apps and then you want build web apps you do not need learn new application model, new libraries, new language, again. These advantages are real, I think. I more than 2 years build Intranet applications on windows platform (ASP & COM) for living and recently I tried port some of my web apps to .NET/ASP.NET/ADO.NET and my experience with this new framework is really positive. Sure, you must learn new stuff, but, as I say, advantages are real. At least for me. I do not want go back to ASP & COM. Just my $0.02. SlavoF "I hear and I forget. I see and I remember. I do and I understand." --Confucius
-
Hello! So, why do we need .NET? Because .NET helps us build new kind of Internet applications like web services more easily than current technologies. For example, try compare build web service via SOAP toolkit and via VS.NET, and you must see the difference. Also try compare ASP 3.0 and ASP.NET. ASP.NET is IMHO big step forward. If you try build few web applications via ASP.NET you certainly will do not want build it again with ASP. With .NET/C# you can be really more productive than with WinAPI/COM/C++. And there is, at last, ONE COMMON application framework for building all kinds of applications, so if you know how to build win apps and then you want build web apps you do not need learn new application model, new libraries, new language, again. These advantages are real, I think. I more than 2 years build Intranet applications on windows platform (ASP & COM) for living and recently I tried port some of my web apps to .NET/ASP.NET/ADO.NET and my experience with this new framework is really positive. Sure, you must learn new stuff, but, as I say, advantages are real. At least for me. I do not want go back to ASP & COM. Just my $0.02. SlavoF "I hear and I forget. I see and I remember. I do and I understand." --Confucius
//Because .NET helps us build new kind of Internet applications like web services more easily than current technologies. //With .NET/C# you can be really more productive than with WinAPI/COM/C++. You see, here is my problem. IF you're excited by statement one, THEN statement two probably applies. If, on the other hand, your program needs only do a little FTP on the side and mostly is not tied to the Web, then the second statement is a loss. //And there is, at last, ONE COMMON application framework for building all kinds of applications, so if you know how to build win apps and then you want build web apps you do not need learn new application model, new libraries, new language, again. At last ? People have been asking for this ? I've seen people tout the fact that a team can have a C++ guy, a VB guy and someone who only knows C#, but they can work together though the CLR. What CRAP !!! How on earth can I work with someone who cannot read my code, and cannot be trusted to try and learn because they have no idea about memory management ( for starters ) ( yes, I'd be the C++ guy ). How can a team work together if no-one is expert enough to work on the same code as someone else ? Yes, VB looks easy, and C# looks similar enough, but language changes between C++ & C# ( and the ones I know of are plain stupid ) mean there are some real gotchas waiting for you. //These advantages are real, I think. In a web centred world, some of them probably are. The point people like me are making is that we're not all writing web based applications. //I more than 2 years build Intranet applications on windows platform (ASP & COM) for living and recently I tried port some of my web apps to .NET/ASP.NET/ADO.NET and my experience with this new framework is really positive. Sure, you must learn new stuff, but, as I say, advantages are real. At least for me. I do not want go back to ASP & COM. I'm pleased that you seem to be exactly the sort of developer .Net is for. I work on a 3D home design package and am also writing a paint package to compliment it. How does .Net help me ? I heard the new MFC had some long overdue bitmap stuff in it, and it's all in GDI+, which I am using with VC 6 on Windows 98. So what reason should I have to be happy about .Net in my work environment ? Christian I've learned that you cannot make someone love you. All you can do is stalk them and hope they panic and give in. If someone offers a penny for my thoughts, and I give my two cents worth, who gets the change ?
-
Hello! So, why do we need .NET? Because .NET helps us build new kind of Internet applications like web services more easily than current technologies. For example, try compare build web service via SOAP toolkit and via VS.NET, and you must see the difference. Also try compare ASP 3.0 and ASP.NET. ASP.NET is IMHO big step forward. If you try build few web applications via ASP.NET you certainly will do not want build it again with ASP. With .NET/C# you can be really more productive than with WinAPI/COM/C++. And there is, at last, ONE COMMON application framework for building all kinds of applications, so if you know how to build win apps and then you want build web apps you do not need learn new application model, new libraries, new language, again. These advantages are real, I think. I more than 2 years build Intranet applications on windows platform (ASP & COM) for living and recently I tried port some of my web apps to .NET/ASP.NET/ADO.NET and my experience with this new framework is really positive. Sure, you must learn new stuff, but, as I say, advantages are real. At least for me. I do not want go back to ASP & COM. Just my $0.02. SlavoF "I hear and I forget. I see and I remember. I do and I understand." --Confucius
Note that the .NET platform isn't just for web services or ASP.NET pages; it's a general-purpose platform for building many kinds of applications, with the exception of things like low-level device drivers. The advantage of having a managed environment is real, as it having rationally designed, easy to use class libraries.
-
//Because .NET helps us build new kind of Internet applications like web services more easily than current technologies. //With .NET/C# you can be really more productive than with WinAPI/COM/C++. You see, here is my problem. IF you're excited by statement one, THEN statement two probably applies. If, on the other hand, your program needs only do a little FTP on the side and mostly is not tied to the Web, then the second statement is a loss. //And there is, at last, ONE COMMON application framework for building all kinds of applications, so if you know how to build win apps and then you want build web apps you do not need learn new application model, new libraries, new language, again. At last ? People have been asking for this ? I've seen people tout the fact that a team can have a C++ guy, a VB guy and someone who only knows C#, but they can work together though the CLR. What CRAP !!! How on earth can I work with someone who cannot read my code, and cannot be trusted to try and learn because they have no idea about memory management ( for starters ) ( yes, I'd be the C++ guy ). How can a team work together if no-one is expert enough to work on the same code as someone else ? Yes, VB looks easy, and C# looks similar enough, but language changes between C++ & C# ( and the ones I know of are plain stupid ) mean there are some real gotchas waiting for you. //These advantages are real, I think. In a web centred world, some of them probably are. The point people like me are making is that we're not all writing web based applications. //I more than 2 years build Intranet applications on windows platform (ASP & COM) for living and recently I tried port some of my web apps to .NET/ASP.NET/ADO.NET and my experience with this new framework is really positive. Sure, you must learn new stuff, but, as I say, advantages are real. At least for me. I do not want go back to ASP & COM. I'm pleased that you seem to be exactly the sort of developer .Net is for. I work on a 3D home design package and am also writing a paint package to compliment it. How does .Net help me ? I heard the new MFC had some long overdue bitmap stuff in it, and it's all in GDI+, which I am using with VC 6 on Windows 98. So what reason should I have to be happy about .Net in my work environment ? Christian I've learned that you cannot make someone love you. All you can do is stalk them and hope they panic and give in. If someone offers a penny for my thoughts, and I give my two cents worth, who gets the change ?
I work on a 3D home design package and am also writing a paint package to compliment it. How does .Net help me ? I heard the new MFC had some long overdue bitmap stuff in it, and it's all in GDI+, which I am using with VC 6 on Windows 98. So what reason should I have to be happy about .Net in my work environment ? ***** .NET helps you in a number of ways. First, writing C# code is a whole lot more productive than writing C++ code. The model is simpler, the libraries are better, and the compiler is a lot faster. I've done a fair bit of MFC, and using Windows Forms is a lot more straightforward (though it doesn't have a doc/view architecture built in). The other advantage you'd get is being able to use the class libraries. They do things differently from how they would be done in C++, so that takes a little bit of getting used to, but they use the same design patterns globally. It also offers improved versioning, so you can prevent new versions of libraries killing your existing application. The downside right now is that it it hasn't released yet, and even after it is released, you've got to worry about the redist issues to get the runtime on the customer machines.
-
Note that the .NET platform isn't just for web services or ASP.NET pages; it's a general-purpose platform for building many kinds of applications, with the exception of things like low-level device drivers. The advantage of having a managed environment is real, as it having rationally designed, easy to use class libraries.
??? --- "every year we invent better idiot proof systems and every year they invent better idiots"
-
when u run your own company you do bits of all of it --- "every year we invent better idiot proof systems and every year they invent better idiots"
-
I work on a 3D home design package and am also writing a paint package to compliment it. How does .Net help me ? I heard the new MFC had some long overdue bitmap stuff in it, and it's all in GDI+, which I am using with VC 6 on Windows 98. So what reason should I have to be happy about .Net in my work environment ? ***** .NET helps you in a number of ways. First, writing C# code is a whole lot more productive than writing C++ code. The model is simpler, the libraries are better, and the compiler is a lot faster. I've done a fair bit of MFC, and using Windows Forms is a lot more straightforward (though it doesn't have a doc/view architecture built in). The other advantage you'd get is being able to use the class libraries. They do things differently from how they would be done in C++, so that takes a little bit of getting used to, but they use the same design patterns globally. It also offers improved versioning, so you can prevent new versions of libraries killing your existing application. The downside right now is that it it hasn't released yet, and even after it is released, you've got to worry about the redist issues to get the runtime on the customer machines.
//.NET helps you in a number of ways. First, writing C# code is a whole lot more productive than writing C++ code. Productive in what way ? Because it has garbage collection ? Because it doesn't have pointers ? That's great for the goombah programmers of the world, but for people who actually understand how to manage memory, it's a monster liability. //The model is simpler, the libraries are better, and the compiler is a lot faster. I don't *want* a simple model, I want a flexible one. I'm interested ( seriously ) to hear how the libraries are better ? You're saying my code compiling faster makes it worthwhile that it runs slower ? Or are we seriously claiming that a graphics intensive application will run as fast in C# ? // I've done a fair bit of MFC, and using Windows Forms is a lot more straightforward (though it doesn't have a doc/view architecture built in). PMI but how does Windows Forms corellate to MFC ? I have no idea what they are. //The other advantage you'd get is being able to use the class libraries. They do things differently from how they would be done in C++, so that takes a little bit of getting used to, but they use the same design patterns globally. It also offers improved versioning, so you can prevent new versions of libraries killing your existing application. Oh, I see - the end of dll hell ? I thought COM did that ? //The downside right now is that it it hasn't released yet, and even after it is released, you've got to worry about the redist issues to get the runtime on the customer machines. This is indeed another down side on top of the ones I mentioned. Christian I've learned that you cannot make someone love you. All you can do is stalk them and hope they panic and give in. Famous Last Words: Why am I standing on a plastic sheet ?
-
why do we need .NET? i don't mean this as a flame against it in particular but more in the sense that we have technologies (mfc, atl, com, wtl, vb, asp, etc, etc) that lets us build useful apps for the world at large and the world at large seems happy that they run these apps and get work done (well, thats how it happens in my universe) what do we get from .NET? different looking windows that are better windows than the current windows? better buttons? better listboxes? etc etc ... i think .NOT is this really that ms want to change their method of generating revenues for their systems but can't unless we (the great unwashed developers of this world) go with them and thereby force our customers to follow suit i can just see the conversation with one of my clients now: me: "ummm ... you have to upgrade your software now" client: "why? it works just fine" me: "well yes but we rewrote it in .NET so you must change to that version" client: "dot what?" me: "don't worry ... just do as i say ... and buy a new machine and os while you're at it" client to co-worker: "george ... what's that other software company's name we used to do busines with?" uh huh ... like it .... DOT.NOT --- "every year we invent better idiot proof systems and every year they invent better idiots"
Lauren far from calling you stupid, I agree with you in the most part. I too am a one person company who is marketing a desktop App, And I can't see the use in dropping C++ and MFC, to Jump on to C# and .Net, With MFC and C++ It's not broken, so WHY fix it? So you are not alone in your thinking! Regardz Colin
-
Note that the .NET platform isn't just for web services or ASP.NET pages; it's a general-purpose platform for building many kinds of applications, with the exception of things like low-level device drivers. The advantage of having a managed environment is real, as it having rationally designed, easy to use class libraries.
Hello, the codegurus around the world.;) (Copy Right 2001 Masaaki Onishi) MSFT takes more than 5 years to get C#. Even though COM developer complained that OCX is too slow to run in web site, MSFT doesn't care about it?:confused: Or MSFT dosn't have enough developer:confused: Even though MSFT published ATL DLL, Sun Java has enough power to convince the customer to use it.:eek: Even though MSFT made C# (COOL in those days) about two years ago, MSFT have kept the secret of COOL.:cool: :confused: Now, this is the time when MSFT publishes C#, and MSFT must convince the user to use it. As a result, what will MSFT do for us?:mad: 1) Throw away Microsoft J++. (What shall the company with J++ do?):mad: Even though MSFT provides the wizard to convert J++ to C#, the J++ developer have a time to learn C#. 2) VC7.0 will not be compatabile with the standard C++ compiler.:mad: Blah, blah :mad: (Take a break to calm me down. :cool: ) If some company only develops the stand alone application with MFC, we dont' need to use C# ASAP. MFC developer have to learn C# even though C# is easy to learn. Maybe, the developer need one year, and during half year, the developer makes both MFC and C# application. On the business point of view, it is dangerous to move the development enviornment to C# ASAP. Even though Sun Java is a powerful tool, Sun Java also takes a couple of years for the developer to accept it. Have a nice day! -Masaaki Onishi-
-
??? --- "every year we invent better idiot proof systems and every year they invent better idiots"
Hello, the codegurus around the world.:cool: (Copy Right 2001, Masaaki Onishi) MSFT = Microsoft.:cool: or X| Have a nice day! -Masaaki Onishi-
-
Hello, the codegurus around the world.;) (Copy Right 2001 Masaaki Onishi) MSFT takes more than 5 years to get C#. Even though COM developer complained that OCX is too slow to run in web site, MSFT doesn't care about it?:confused: Or MSFT dosn't have enough developer:confused: Even though MSFT published ATL DLL, Sun Java has enough power to convince the customer to use it.:eek: Even though MSFT made C# (COOL in those days) about two years ago, MSFT have kept the secret of COOL.:cool: :confused: Now, this is the time when MSFT publishes C#, and MSFT must convince the user to use it. As a result, what will MSFT do for us?:mad: 1) Throw away Microsoft J++. (What shall the company with J++ do?):mad: Even though MSFT provides the wizard to convert J++ to C#, the J++ developer have a time to learn C#. 2) VC7.0 will not be compatabile with the standard C++ compiler.:mad: Blah, blah :mad: (Take a break to calm me down. :cool: ) If some company only develops the stand alone application with MFC, we dont' need to use C# ASAP. MFC developer have to learn C# even though C# is easy to learn. Maybe, the developer need one year, and during half year, the developer makes both MFC and C# application. On the business point of view, it is dangerous to move the development enviornment to C# ASAP. Even though Sun Java is a powerful tool, Sun Java also takes a couple of years for the developer to accept it. Have a nice day! -Masaaki Onishi-
Two questions. 1/ People still use Java ? I have a good friend working in Sun and they are obviously mostly Java zealots ( he prefers C++ ), but who else uses it ? 2/ There's a J++ -> C# wizard ? Can't be too hard as I am sure one is built on the dying embers of the other. But who used J++ anyhow ? It was always a poor choice because of the M$ specific stuff. Christian I've learned that you cannot make someone love you. All you can do is stalk them and hope they panic and give in. The early bird may get the worm, but it's the second mouse that gets the cheese.
-
Two questions. 1/ People still use Java ? I have a good friend working in Sun and they are obviously mostly Java zealots ( he prefers C++ ), but who else uses it ? 2/ There's a J++ -> C# wizard ? Can't be too hard as I am sure one is built on the dying embers of the other. But who used J++ anyhow ? It was always a poor choice because of the M$ specific stuff. Christian I've learned that you cannot make someone love you. All you can do is stalk them and hope they panic and give in. The early bird may get the worm, but it's the second mouse that gets the cheese.
//People still use Java ? Yes. Lots and lots and lots of them. I've noticed that the Windows groups and Java groups are almost completely isolated from one another. I speak with Java guys often that no nothing about what Microsoft is up to, and an equal number of Windows programmers that have absolutely no idea what the value proposition is for Java and J2EE. I certainly don't feel qualified to stand up and defend Microsoft's larger business objectives with .Net, mainly because I doubt they've made them all public yet. But from my limited perspective on this I would say that without question .Net is at the very least a toe-to-toe competitor for Java in the Enterprise. And that is where Java's appeal is the greatest. I don't know anyone writing shrink wrapped apps, or small vertical applications in Java, but I know a bunch of people writing larger vertical applications and Enterprise level apps in Java. There's a J++ -> C# wizard ? I believe there's both a Wizard, and with Microsoft's announced JUMP (Java Users Migration Path) technology, you can run native, current version (read J++) apps on .Net without modification, or at least that's the goal as Tony Goodhew has explained it to me. D
-
Hello, the codegurus around the world.;) (Copy Right 2001 Masaaki Onishi) MSFT takes more than 5 years to get C#. Even though COM developer complained that OCX is too slow to run in web site, MSFT doesn't care about it?:confused: Or MSFT dosn't have enough developer:confused: Even though MSFT published ATL DLL, Sun Java has enough power to convince the customer to use it.:eek: Even though MSFT made C# (COOL in those days) about two years ago, MSFT have kept the secret of COOL.:cool: :confused: Now, this is the time when MSFT publishes C#, and MSFT must convince the user to use it. As a result, what will MSFT do for us?:mad: 1) Throw away Microsoft J++. (What shall the company with J++ do?):mad: Even though MSFT provides the wizard to convert J++ to C#, the J++ developer have a time to learn C#. 2) VC7.0 will not be compatabile with the standard C++ compiler.:mad: Blah, blah :mad: (Take a break to calm me down. :cool: ) If some company only develops the stand alone application with MFC, we dont' need to use C# ASAP. MFC developer have to learn C# even though C# is easy to learn. Maybe, the developer need one year, and during half year, the developer makes both MFC and C# application. On the business point of view, it is dangerous to move the development enviornment to C# ASAP. Even though Sun Java is a powerful tool, Sun Java also takes a couple of years for the developer to accept it. Have a nice day! -Masaaki Onishi-
Masaaki - take a deeeep breath...that's right...now exhale slowly... :) C# and the CLR are intertwined so MS couldn't release C# till they had a runtime that could support managed code. For information on J++ etc check out the JUMP initiative at MS (haven't looked closely myself so maybe you can get back to us on what you find) >>VC7.0 will not be compatabile with the standard C++ compiler How do you mean? Also: you have to remember that .NET hasn't even been released yet (officially, that is). I think once .NET and VS7 go gold you will see a steady uptake of C#. No one has to write Java - developers can stick to straight C++ or program Win32 or X-Window or whatever. Some choose Java because they like the language and enjoy working within a JVM. C# developers will be the same - they will be people who love the language and don't have an issue with targeting a specific platform (the .NET runtime). There are going to be those who jump on C# immediately, and those who keep an eye on C# while they continue working in C++, and then eventually move to C#, and there will be those who ignore C# altogether. No idea what the percentages of each will be. cheers, Chris Maunder
-
Hello, the codegurus around the world.:cool: (Copy Right 2001, Masaaki Onishi) MSFT = Microsoft.:cool: or X| Have a nice day! -Masaaki Onishi-
thanks masaaki but i kinda knew it was the share code for ms what i meant *in a roundabout kinda way) was does eric *work* for ms sounds a bit like a religious argument he put forward to me that came from the marketing mouthpieces rather than a reasoned technical debate --- "every year we invent better idiot proof systems and every year they invent better idiots"
-
//.NET helps you in a number of ways. First, writing C# code is a whole lot more productive than writing C++ code. Productive in what way ? Because it has garbage collection ? Because it doesn't have pointers ? That's great for the goombah programmers of the world, but for people who actually understand how to manage memory, it's a monster liability. //The model is simpler, the libraries are better, and the compiler is a lot faster. I don't *want* a simple model, I want a flexible one. I'm interested ( seriously ) to hear how the libraries are better ? You're saying my code compiling faster makes it worthwhile that it runs slower ? Or are we seriously claiming that a graphics intensive application will run as fast in C# ? // I've done a fair bit of MFC, and using Windows Forms is a lot more straightforward (though it doesn't have a doc/view architecture built in). PMI but how does Windows Forms corellate to MFC ? I have no idea what they are. //The other advantage you'd get is being able to use the class libraries. They do things differently from how they would be done in C++, so that takes a little bit of getting used to, but they use the same design patterns globally. It also offers improved versioning, so you can prevent new versions of libraries killing your existing application. Oh, I see - the end of dll hell ? I thought COM did that ? //The downside right now is that it it hasn't released yet, and even after it is released, you've got to worry about the redist issues to get the runtime on the customer machines. This is indeed another down side on top of the ones I mentioned. Christian I've learned that you cannot make someone love you. All you can do is stalk them and hope they panic and give in. Famous Last Words: Why am I standing on a plastic sheet ?
Christian, Obviously you don't feel .NET is for you. So don't use it. No one is forcing you to use it. Good ole' C++ will always be around, it's not going anywhere. >>I'm pleased that you seem to be exactly the sort of developer .Net is for. I work on a 3D home design package and am also writing a paint package to compliment it. How does .Net help me ? I heard the new MFC had some long overdue bitmap stuff in it, and it's all in GDI+, which I am using with VC 6 on Windows 98. So what reason should I have to be happy about .Net in my work environment ?<< MFC is not part of .NET, and if you're going to continue to use it, .NET probably won't help you. You could use Managed C++ or C# if you wanted and port it to Windows Forms but there really isn't a point. So don't buy the upgrade to VS.NET, that simple. Continue to use VC6 with SP5, there is no problem with that and I know that many people are going to continue to do the same. Or buy the uprade to VS.NET and reap the benefits of MFC 7, ATL 7 (have they synched the version numbers?) and the new C++ compilier which supposedly has better standards support and still not have to touch .NET. .NET is here because Microsoft needed a new way to make money and beat out Java. However, it's providing many benefits to developers. I love the new Windows Forms framework, very easy and powerful. But I'm primarily an ASP and COM developer and I'm very excited about ASP.NET. I've done quit a bit of work with .NET and I can't wait until Beta2. .NET is going to make Web apps much easier to create and maintain and much more stable. Jason Gerard MCSD, MCSE Technology Point International, Inc.
-
Note that the .NET platform isn't just for web services or ASP.NET pages; it's a general-purpose platform for building many kinds of applications, with the exception of things like low-level device drivers. The advantage of having a managed environment is real, as it having rationally designed, easy to use class libraries.
The advantage of having a managed environment is real Well, if you really think slower app's is an advantage then yes. I guess .NET is really great for web, and for ppl doing GUI app's that don't need more power/speed that an calculator. But some ppl like Graus that does 3D stuff, and me doing server stuff, I just think .NET is going to be too slow. Ppl get faster machines, someone might add here. Yes but when ppl get faster machines they also expect their programs to run faster... - Anders Money talks, but all mine ever says is "Goodbye!"
-
Masaaki - take a deeeep breath...that's right...now exhale slowly... :) C# and the CLR are intertwined so MS couldn't release C# till they had a runtime that could support managed code. For information on J++ etc check out the JUMP initiative at MS (haven't looked closely myself so maybe you can get back to us on what you find) >>VC7.0 will not be compatabile with the standard C++ compiler How do you mean? Also: you have to remember that .NET hasn't even been released yet (officially, that is). I think once .NET and VS7 go gold you will see a steady uptake of C#. No one has to write Java - developers can stick to straight C++ or program Win32 or X-Window or whatever. Some choose Java because they like the language and enjoy working within a JVM. C# developers will be the same - they will be people who love the language and don't have an issue with targeting a specific platform (the .NET runtime). There are going to be those who jump on C# immediately, and those who keep an eye on C# while they continue working in C++, and then eventually move to C#, and there will be those who ignore C# altogether. No idea what the percentages of each will be. cheers, Chris Maunder
Hello, the codegurus around the world.;) Basically, since I use MFC of MSFT, I don't want to complain about Microsoft so much.:rolleyes: However, the customer should have the option that he or she wants or don't want to use C#. Window 2000 is a good example since some company doesn't like to use Window 2000 until Micorosft publishes SP1. Company with web based application must be benefit from C#, but the company with the stand alone application on Windows may not be benefit from C# partly because this kind of application deal with the complicated stuffs.:cool: This is a same situation as Sun Java. I guess that many Sun Java developers don't want to make the complicated GUI application. Maybe C# is better Java on GUI application since Microsoft dominates the unpublished code. Have a nice day! -Masaaki Onishi-