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This got me thinking

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  • F Offline
    F Offline
    fly904
    wrote on last edited by
    #1

    Should people who know absolutely nothing about technology be allowed to make laws on it? I'm talking about laws regarding the Internet in particular. The people in question are the politicians in the Houses' of Commons and Lords, Lords in particular, or any other governing body, who don't know what the technology even does or is. There are even some politicians who have never even used a computer and have secretaries to email and read emails for them on their behalf etc. Personally, I don't believe they should even be allowed an opinion on the matter unless they are informed and familiar enough with the technology in question, which they certainly aren't. This also relates to another question which is: Should there be laws regulating the Internet if they cannot be enforced?

    If at first you don't succeed, you're not Chuck Norris.

    H N 0 P L 10 Replies Last reply
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    • F fly904

      Should people who know absolutely nothing about technology be allowed to make laws on it? I'm talking about laws regarding the Internet in particular. The people in question are the politicians in the Houses' of Commons and Lords, Lords in particular, or any other governing body, who don't know what the technology even does or is. There are even some politicians who have never even used a computer and have secretaries to email and read emails for them on their behalf etc. Personally, I don't believe they should even be allowed an opinion on the matter unless they are informed and familiar enough with the technology in question, which they certainly aren't. This also relates to another question which is: Should there be laws regulating the Internet if they cannot be enforced?

      If at first you don't succeed, you're not Chuck Norris.

      H Offline
      H Offline
      Henry Minute
      wrote on last edited by
      #2

      Many, if not the majority (you can never be sure with MPs :) ), have no experience of rape. Are you saying that they should not be allowed to pass laws on rape?

      Henry Minute Do not read medical books! You could die of a misprint. - Mark Twain Girl: (staring) "Why do you need an icy cucumber?" “I want to report a fraud. The government is lying to us all.”

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      • H Henry Minute

        Many, if not the majority (you can never be sure with MPs :) ), have no experience of rape. Are you saying that they should not be allowed to pass laws on rape?

        Henry Minute Do not read medical books! You could die of a misprint. - Mark Twain Girl: (staring) "Why do you need an icy cucumber?" “I want to report a fraud. The government is lying to us all.”

        L Offline
        L Offline
        Lost User
        wrote on last edited by
        #3

        I think that's simplifying the issue a little to much. Rape is an age old crime, dating back to the times of...well... an erection. Technology is new, politicians know less and less about it especially as it gets more complex. It's not something handed down, it evolves day to day.

        Check out the CodeProject forum Guidelines[^] The original soapbox 1.0 is back![^]

        H B 2 Replies Last reply
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        • F fly904

          Should people who know absolutely nothing about technology be allowed to make laws on it? I'm talking about laws regarding the Internet in particular. The people in question are the politicians in the Houses' of Commons and Lords, Lords in particular, or any other governing body, who don't know what the technology even does or is. There are even some politicians who have never even used a computer and have secretaries to email and read emails for them on their behalf etc. Personally, I don't believe they should even be allowed an opinion on the matter unless they are informed and familiar enough with the technology in question, which they certainly aren't. This also relates to another question which is: Should there be laws regulating the Internet if they cannot be enforced?

          If at first you don't succeed, you're not Chuck Norris.

          N Offline
          N Offline
          Nemanja Trifunovic
          wrote on last edited by
          #4

          fly904 wrote:

          Should people who know absolutely nothing about technology be allowed to make laws on it?

          They don't "make" laws - there are experts that do that for them. They just vote. Besides, this is not specific to technology. Do you think they are experts in health, traffic, economy,... anything?

          utf8-cpp

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          • F fly904

            Should people who know absolutely nothing about technology be allowed to make laws on it? I'm talking about laws regarding the Internet in particular. The people in question are the politicians in the Houses' of Commons and Lords, Lords in particular, or any other governing body, who don't know what the technology even does or is. There are even some politicians who have never even used a computer and have secretaries to email and read emails for them on their behalf etc. Personally, I don't believe they should even be allowed an opinion on the matter unless they are informed and familiar enough with the technology in question, which they certainly aren't. This also relates to another question which is: Should there be laws regulating the Internet if they cannot be enforced?

            If at first you don't succeed, you're not Chuck Norris.

            0 Offline
            0 Offline
            0x3c0
            wrote on last edited by
            #5

            No. I don't like an person having an opinion on something they don't know anything about, and I apply the same principles to MPs; if anything, I apply it more-so, in that the people who pass the laws should know precisely what they're signing. Going after torrent sites really gets my goat up, since it exposes their complete lack of knowledge about the way parts of the Internet work.

            fly904 wrote:

            Should there be laws regulating the Internet if they cannot be enforced?

            Never. They only serve to provide a stupid micro-manager with a six-figure salary.

            OSDev :)

            F 1 Reply Last reply
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            • N Nemanja Trifunovic

              fly904 wrote:

              Should people who know absolutely nothing about technology be allowed to make laws on it?

              They don't "make" laws - there are experts that do that for them. They just vote. Besides, this is not specific to technology. Do you think they are experts in health, traffic, economy,... anything?

              utf8-cpp

              F Offline
              F Offline
              fly904
              wrote on last edited by
              #6

              That's a good point, although what you're saying is that we vote for people to vote for what non-elected people think is best. But that is a bit off topic.

              Nemanja Trifunovic wrote:

              Do you think they are experts in health, traffic, economy,... anything?

              They are experts in bullsh*t, that's about it. I focused on technology in particular as it is something applicable to all of us here, rather than being a niche subject for The Back Room or Soapbox 1.0.

              If at first you don't succeed, you're not Chuck Norris.

              L 1 Reply Last reply
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              • N Nemanja Trifunovic

                fly904 wrote:

                Should people who know absolutely nothing about technology be allowed to make laws on it?

                They don't "make" laws - there are experts that do that for them. They just vote. Besides, this is not specific to technology. Do you think they are experts in health, traffic, economy,... anything?

                utf8-cpp

                L Offline
                L Offline
                Lost User
                wrote on last edited by
                #7

                Nemanja Trifunovic wrote:

                They don't "make" laws - there are experts that do that for them. They just vote.

                Primarily, the Lords is a reforming chamber. Yes there are private office staff. Yes, many are experts in their field of specialty. Yes there are debates. And yes they do vote. And until very recently when new chambers were made operative, it was the highest court of law in this land.

                Nemanja Trifunovic wrote:

                Do you think they are experts in health, traffic, economy,... anything?

                Yes, many are. For example, Lord the Professor Robert Winston, he and many others are superbly and eminently qualified.

                1 Reply Last reply
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                • F fly904

                  Should people who know absolutely nothing about technology be allowed to make laws on it? I'm talking about laws regarding the Internet in particular. The people in question are the politicians in the Houses' of Commons and Lords, Lords in particular, or any other governing body, who don't know what the technology even does or is. There are even some politicians who have never even used a computer and have secretaries to email and read emails for them on their behalf etc. Personally, I don't believe they should even be allowed an opinion on the matter unless they are informed and familiar enough with the technology in question, which they certainly aren't. This also relates to another question which is: Should there be laws regulating the Internet if they cannot be enforced?

                  If at first you don't succeed, you're not Chuck Norris.

                  P Online
                  P Online
                  PIEBALDconsult
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #8

                  fly904 wrote:

                  I don't believe they should even be allowed an opinion on the matter unless they are informed and familiar enough with the technology in question

                  Right, but they only get information from the lobby that's in favor of the legislation (and stand to make money by it and can then "donate" some of it back to the politician).

                  fly904 wrote:

                  Should there be laws regulating the Internet if they cannot be enforced?

                  I don't like any unenforceable law.

                  F 1 Reply Last reply
                  0
                  • H Henry Minute

                    Many, if not the majority (you can never be sure with MPs :) ), have no experience of rape. Are you saying that they should not be allowed to pass laws on rape?

                    Henry Minute Do not read medical books! You could die of a misprint. - Mark Twain Girl: (staring) "Why do you need an icy cucumber?" “I want to report a fraud. The government is lying to us all.”

                    R Offline
                    R Offline
                    Rajesh R Subramanian
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #9

                    It is if or not they know anything that they're making a law about (whether or not through experience is insignificant). That way, they know about rape. But sadly on the other hand, they don't know sh*t about a computer or the internet. OK, this topic is a better candidate for the SB so I can milk the political bastards to what they're worth. :)

                    It is a crappy thing, but it's life -^ Carlo Pallini

                    1 Reply Last reply
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                    • F fly904

                      Should people who know absolutely nothing about technology be allowed to make laws on it? I'm talking about laws regarding the Internet in particular. The people in question are the politicians in the Houses' of Commons and Lords, Lords in particular, or any other governing body, who don't know what the technology even does or is. There are even some politicians who have never even used a computer and have secretaries to email and read emails for them on their behalf etc. Personally, I don't believe they should even be allowed an opinion on the matter unless they are informed and familiar enough with the technology in question, which they certainly aren't. This also relates to another question which is: Should there be laws regulating the Internet if they cannot be enforced?

                      If at first you don't succeed, you're not Chuck Norris.

                      L Offline
                      L Offline
                      Lost User
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #10

                      All laws that "apply" to the internet are inherently unenforceable.

                      L M 2 Replies Last reply
                      0
                      • 0 0x3c0

                        No. I don't like an person having an opinion on something they don't know anything about, and I apply the same principles to MPs; if anything, I apply it more-so, in that the people who pass the laws should know precisely what they're signing. Going after torrent sites really gets my goat up, since it exposes their complete lack of knowledge about the way parts of the Internet work.

                        fly904 wrote:

                        Should there be laws regulating the Internet if they cannot be enforced?

                        Never. They only serve to provide a stupid micro-manager with a six-figure salary.

                        OSDev :)

                        F Offline
                        F Offline
                        fly904
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #11

                        Computafreak wrote:

                        Never

                        That's interesting. Or are you just referring to Torrents? What about Hackers? People who write/distribute viruses? Should they be allowed to get away with what they do? I think they should be caught and punished. The question is how do we enforce it to catch them. The person who works out a way how will be a very rich man/woman. Are you also taking into account businesses who trade legitimately and are losing out due to illegal distribution of their product? With regards to Torrents, I don't believe that film companies in particular can complain too much about losing money due to piracy. Just cut back on the actors wages, they're not that good. Smaller music companies shouldn't lose out, people should support them, if they're any good :p

                        If at first you don't succeed, you're not Chuck Norris.

                        L 0 2 Replies Last reply
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                        • L Lost User

                          I think that's simplifying the issue a little to much. Rape is an age old crime, dating back to the times of...well... an erection. Technology is new, politicians know less and less about it especially as it gets more complex. It's not something handed down, it evolves day to day.

                          Check out the CodeProject forum Guidelines[^] The original soapbox 1.0 is back![^]

                          H Offline
                          H Offline
                          Henry Minute
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #12

                          Technology is older than you make out. Not computer technology, just technology has been around since before I was born, and I've been around for some time. Every new technology that comes along, the proponents and practitioners of that technology always claim it to be special and that law makers cannot possibly understand it and yet somehow they always seem to. Bletchley Park, Moon-shots (even if you don't believe in the landings), I could go on. These people who know nothing about technologies, somehow seem to muddle along, getting it largely correct. Sometimes there are one or two false starts along the way but usually they get there in the end. The whole question could be turned around to say that technical people are too wrapped up in their own world to be capable of voting sensibly in a General Election because they are insufficiently aware of the 'real world'. It wouldn't be true, of course, and it would be very extreme, but so is the point of view put forward by the OP.

                          Henry Minute Do not read medical books! You could die of a misprint. - Mark Twain Girl: (staring) "Why do you need an icy cucumber?" “I want to report a fraud. The government is lying to us all.”

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          0
                          • L Lost User

                            I think that's simplifying the issue a little to much. Rape is an age old crime, dating back to the times of...well... an erection. Technology is new, politicians know less and less about it especially as it gets more complex. It's not something handed down, it evolves day to day.

                            Check out the CodeProject forum Guidelines[^] The original soapbox 1.0 is back![^]

                            B Offline
                            B Offline
                            B rad A
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #13

                            EliottA wrote:

                            erection

                            EliottA wrote:

                            hand

                            I wonder what you are thinking about on a friday night :laugh: :laugh:

                            1 Reply Last reply
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                            • P PIEBALDconsult

                              fly904 wrote:

                              I don't believe they should even be allowed an opinion on the matter unless they are informed and familiar enough with the technology in question

                              Right, but they only get information from the lobby that's in favor of the legislation (and stand to make money by it and can then "donate" some of it back to the politician).

                              fly904 wrote:

                              Should there be laws regulating the Internet if they cannot be enforced?

                              I don't like any unenforceable law.

                              F Offline
                              F Offline
                              fly904
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #14

                              PIEBALDconsult wrote:

                              Right, but they only get information from the lobby that's in favor of the legislation (and stand to make money by it and can then "donate" some of it back to the politician).

                              That's not good for the advancement of technology, which really hacks me off.

                              If at first you don't succeed, you're not Chuck Norris.

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              0
                              • F fly904

                                Should people who know absolutely nothing about technology be allowed to make laws on it? I'm talking about laws regarding the Internet in particular. The people in question are the politicians in the Houses' of Commons and Lords, Lords in particular, or any other governing body, who don't know what the technology even does or is. There are even some politicians who have never even used a computer and have secretaries to email and read emails for them on their behalf etc. Personally, I don't believe they should even be allowed an opinion on the matter unless they are informed and familiar enough with the technology in question, which they certainly aren't. This also relates to another question which is: Should there be laws regulating the Internet if they cannot be enforced?

                                If at first you don't succeed, you're not Chuck Norris.

                                L Offline
                                L Offline
                                Lost User
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #15

                                You appear to be suffering from the misunderstanding of what happens in the creation of law in Britain. Educate yourself. Start here House of Lords[^]. Then ask your University's library for their catalog of books and articles on this subject, your will be surprised on what you can find out.

                                F 1 Reply Last reply
                                0
                                • H Henry Minute

                                  Many, if not the majority (you can never be sure with MPs :) ), have no experience of rape. Are you saying that they should not be allowed to pass laws on rape?

                                  Henry Minute Do not read medical books! You could die of a misprint. - Mark Twain Girl: (staring) "Why do you need an icy cucumber?" “I want to report a fraud. The government is lying to us all.”

                                  P Online
                                  P Online
                                  PIEBALDconsult
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #16

                                  Henry Minute wrote:

                                  have no experience of rape

                                  Not from the receiving end anyway... :~

                                  H 1 Reply Last reply
                                  0
                                  • L Lost User

                                    All laws that "apply" to the internet are inherently unenforceable.

                                    L Offline
                                    L Offline
                                    Luc Pattyn
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #17

                                    harold aptroot wrote:

                                    All laws that "apply" to the internet are inherently unenforceable

                                    Nope. The internet reaches its public trough service providers, they are domestic and need to obey the national laws. So they are enforceable, and sometimes it is pretty easy. Look at the way DNS forgets about some sites in e.g. China. :)

                                    Luc Pattyn


                                    I only read code that is properly indented, and rendered in a non-proportional font; hint: use PRE tags in forum messages


                                    Local announcement (Antwerp region): Lange Wapper? Neen!


                                    L 1 Reply Last reply
                                    0
                                    • L Luc Pattyn

                                      harold aptroot wrote:

                                      All laws that "apply" to the internet are inherently unenforceable

                                      Nope. The internet reaches its public trough service providers, they are domestic and need to obey the national laws. So they are enforceable, and sometimes it is pretty easy. Look at the way DNS forgets about some sites in e.g. China. :)

                                      Luc Pattyn


                                      I only read code that is properly indented, and rendered in a non-proportional font; hint: use PRE tags in forum messages


                                      Local announcement (Antwerp region): Lange Wapper? Neen!


                                      L Offline
                                      L Offline
                                      Lost User
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #18

                                      Just use a cheap VPN service to a country that cares less

                                      L 1 Reply Last reply
                                      0
                                      • F fly904

                                        Should people who know absolutely nothing about technology be allowed to make laws on it? I'm talking about laws regarding the Internet in particular. The people in question are the politicians in the Houses' of Commons and Lords, Lords in particular, or any other governing body, who don't know what the technology even does or is. There are even some politicians who have never even used a computer and have secretaries to email and read emails for them on their behalf etc. Personally, I don't believe they should even be allowed an opinion on the matter unless they are informed and familiar enough with the technology in question, which they certainly aren't. This also relates to another question which is: Should there be laws regulating the Internet if they cannot be enforced?

                                        If at first you don't succeed, you're not Chuck Norris.

                                        A Offline
                                        A Offline
                                        AspDotNetDev
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #19

                                        fly904 wrote:

                                        Should there be laws regulating the Internet if they cannot be enforced?

                                        Who says they can't be enforced?

                                        Visual Studio is an excellent GUIIDE.

                                        F 1 Reply Last reply
                                        0
                                        • L Lost User

                                          Just use a cheap VPN service to a country that cares less

                                          L Offline
                                          L Offline
                                          Luc Pattyn
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #20

                                          The internet backbone servicing your country is operated by some local companies or organizations; the laws apply to them too, so they can be made to implement black lists. Examples of black lists are plenty. :)

                                          Luc Pattyn


                                          I only read code that is properly indented, and rendered in a non-proportional font; hint: use PRE tags in forum messages


                                          Local announcement (Antwerp region): Lange Wapper? Neen!


                                          L 1 Reply Last reply
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