"GUI" developers [modified]
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OK, there is this guy in the C++ forum attempting to build his project from the command line. He's been told to build the project with "devenv /rebuild" but he gets "devenv is not recognized as internal or external command" and doesn't know what that means. I know that for most users the OS is just a thin layer of shiny buttons and fancy colors but a developer should know what's happening beneath (or beyond) that, don't you think?
modified on Friday, November 13, 2009 5:30 AM
Just wanted to thank you for the fingerprints I now have all over my screen from trying to kill your profile bug. :doh:
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OK, there is this guy in the C++ forum attempting to build his project from the command line. He's been told to build the project with "devenv /rebuild" but he gets "devenv is not recognized as internal or external command" and doesn't know what that means. I know that for most users the OS is just a thin layer of shiny buttons and fancy colors but a developer should know what's happening beneath (or beyond) that, don't you think?
modified on Friday, November 13, 2009 5:30 AM
Hear hear! I've said it before and I'll say it again -- but I don't have to this time because you said it. There are certain tasks where a GUI excels and others where a command line excels -- use the right tool for the right job. On my last job I received a certain amount of ridicule because I spent so much time at the DOS prompt. I told people I was looking at the raw matrix.
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OK, there is this guy in the C++ forum attempting to build his project from the command line. He's been told to build the project with "devenv /rebuild" but he gets "devenv is not recognized as internal or external command" and doesn't know what that means. I know that for most users the OS is just a thin layer of shiny buttons and fancy colors but a developer should know what's happening beneath (or beyond) that, don't you think?
modified on Friday, November 13, 2009 5:30 AM
Michael Schubert wrote:
I know that for most users the OS is just a thin layer of shiny buttons and fancy colors but a developer should know what's happening beneath (or beyond) that, don't you think?
Personally, I think anyone who calls themselves a developer should have at least one decent sized app written in assembly language--by that, I mean, pick an emulator of your choice that targets a GameBoy, C64, Apple, or some other similar ancient machine, and write something, so you learn about hardware, registers, stacks, memory management, etc. But then again, that's just me and my weird way of looking at things. [edit]I think my point is made by the forum post below "why .net devs did that" :doh: [/edit] Marc
I'm not overthinking the problem, I just felt like I needed a small, unimportant, uninteresting rant! - Martin Hart Turner
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Sure! I think when someone is learning programing he should try to use low tech tools such as notepad and command line tools.
Rama Krishna Vavilala wrote:
I think when someone is learning programing he should try to use low tech tools such as notepad...
Back when I was using VC++ 1.x, it had no resource editor, thus I made my first few GUI programs using Notepad to create/modify the resource file. I was later introduced to Borland's Resource Editor.
"Old age is like a bank account. You withdraw later in life what you have deposited along the way." - Unknown
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agreed. Excepting penguins I doubt there's more than a handful of people under the age of 20 with non-trivial levels of commandline skills. Win95 removed any need for it from the average PC user.
3x12=36 2x12=24 1x12=12 0x12=18
Dan Neely wrote:
Win95 removed any need for it from the average PC user
Hah! You are totally wrong there: "Format c:" and "fdisk" were things you had to know how to do to work with win95, and superb command line skills were needed to get a boot disk that could see the CD (and the mouse) for reinstall when it all went Pete Tong! :laugh:
No trees were harmed in the sending of this message; however, a significant number of electrons were slightly inconvenienced. This message is made of fully recyclable Zeros and Ones "Rumour has it that if you play Microsoft CDs backwards you will hear Satanic messages.Worse still, is that if you play them forwards they will install Windows"
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Dan Neely wrote:
Win95 removed any need for it from the average PC user
Hah! You are totally wrong there: "Format c:" and "fdisk" were things you had to know how to do to work with win95, and superb command line skills were needed to get a boot disk that could see the CD (and the mouse) for reinstall when it all went Pete Tong! :laugh:
No trees were harmed in the sending of this message; however, a significant number of electrons were slightly inconvenienced. This message is made of fully recyclable Zeros and Ones "Rumour has it that if you play Microsoft CDs backwards you will hear Satanic messages.Worse still, is that if you play them forwards they will install Windows"
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Sure! I think when someone is learning programing he should try to use low tech tools such as notepad and command line tools.
I'm not sure if you're sarcastic or not, but yeah, I agree. When you have to go through the "crap", you learn two valuable lessons: 1) You know how it works under the hood, thus gaining an understanding of how it works. Invaluable when you end up in situations like the "GUI" developer. You don't have to yank someone else to get it done - you can do it yourself. 2) You get to learn early on that programming can be tedious. There will be days when you wish you had picked another job. Learning the hard way gives you a higher tolerance threshold.
-- Kein Mitleid Für Die Mehrheit
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I'm not sure if you're sarcastic or not, but yeah, I agree. When you have to go through the "crap", you learn two valuable lessons: 1) You know how it works under the hood, thus gaining an understanding of how it works. Invaluable when you end up in situations like the "GUI" developer. You don't have to yank someone else to get it done - you can do it yourself. 2) You get to learn early on that programming can be tedious. There will be days when you wish you had picked another job. Learning the hard way gives you a higher tolerance threshold.
-- Kein Mitleid Für Die Mehrheit
Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote:
sarcastic
No, I am very serious. Most of the times I try to learn new things doing it the old fashioned way. I have learned so many things just by writing make files and msbuild files using notepad. Recently I created a Silverlight project from scratch.
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Sure! I think when someone is learning programing he should try to use low tech tools such as notepad and command line tools.
you must be a genius! i bring up notepad using the command prompt and then i keep typing all kings of command in notepad, but alas, nothing is happening what am i doing wrong? i need your help urgently!!!
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OK, there is this guy in the C++ forum attempting to build his project from the command line. He's been told to build the project with "devenv /rebuild" but he gets "devenv is not recognized as internal or external command" and doesn't know what that means. I know that for most users the OS is just a thin layer of shiny buttons and fancy colors but a developer should know what's happening beneath (or beyond) that, don't you think?
modified on Friday, November 13, 2009 5:30 AM
Maybe developers should have a mandatory period developing with vi and a CygWin install…and that's it! Or, if they want to start like I did (VAX TPU + VAXset + VAX C/FORTRAN), that'sfine :-)
Java, Basic, who cares - it's all a bunch of tree-hugging hippy cr*p
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Maybe developers should have a mandatory period developing with vi and a CygWin install…and that's it! Or, if they want to start like I did (VAX TPU + VAXset + VAX C/FORTRAN), that'sfine :-)
Java, Basic, who cares - it's all a bunch of tree-hugging hippy cr*p
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Next I suppose you'll suggest giving your tech writers a set of stone cutting/carving tools and map to the local quarry. :rolleyes:
3x12=36 2x12=24 1x12=12 0x12=18
No, I was going to give them papyrus reeds so they could make their own paper. Seriously, though - you see the gap between IDE and command-line tools as that large? Interesting.
Java, Basic, who cares - it's all a bunch of tree-hugging hippy cr*p
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Maybe developers should have a mandatory period developing with vi and a CygWin install…and that's it! Or, if they want to start like I did (VAX TPU + VAXset + VAX C/FORTRAN), that'sfine :-)
Java, Basic, who cares - it's all a bunch of tree-hugging hippy cr*p
I, too, learned on DEC equipment. With TECO and EDT, no TPU or vi. It has occurred to me, that if I ever teach I should bring one of my AlphaServers in and have the students Telnet in and try to write something.
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No, I was going to give them papyrus reeds so they could make their own paper. Seriously, though - you see the gap between IDE and command-line tools as that large? Interesting.
Java, Basic, who cares - it's all a bunch of tree-hugging hippy cr*p
