A word of thanks
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I'm never going to be in "Anna's" situation so I'm not worried about it. He/She can live however he/she wants, I just don't think this is the place to talk about it. Do you really think it necessary to "come out" in the CP Lounge?
Jason Henderson
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"If you are going through hell, keep going." - Sir Winston ChurchillJason Henderson wrote: Do you really think it necessary to "come out" in the CP Lounge? I don't think it's necessary ANYWHERE on CP. ------- signature starts "...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001 Please review the Legal Disclaimer in my bio. ------- signature ends
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He's saying that despite your sig preaching love and tolerance, you seem to be quite willing to make the occasional exception. Stick to your guns, for whatever reason you may be holding them. ------- signature starts "...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001 Please review the Legal Disclaimer in my bio. ------- signature ends
Oh! please. Simply, love and tolerance are different species. Loving my wife does not mean I will tolerate her sleeping with any man. In the same way, Jesus loving you does not mean he will tolerate you worshiping the devil. In fact, it is His love for you that will cause Him not to accept you worshipping the devil - He knows the result. I will not accept sin in the name of love - if you will, may it be. Best regards, Paul. Jesus Christ is LOVE! Please tell somebody.
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We can argue the point all day long, but if the sinner is not willing to change his or her life, they will be rejected by Jesus. Love does not equal acceptance/tolerance.
Jason Henderson
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"If you are going through hell, keep going." - Sir Winston ChurchillJason Henderson wrote: the sinner :confused: I guess my point is, and you said so yourself, it is for God to accept/reject someone into everlasting life. You don't know Anna, or most others, and it is not your place to judge, as you have already seemed to, calling her a sinner. I won't pretend to understand his situation/desires. I know someone who has gone through the whole transformation(we used to play guitar together), and still don't get it. But I don't think there's anything fundamentally wrong with it. Anyway, we disagree, and thats fine. Peace. BW The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to talk, mad to live, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding. - Jack Kerouac
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We can argue the point all day long, but if the sinner is not willing to change his or her life, they will be rejected by Jesus. Love does not equal acceptance/tolerance.
Jason Henderson
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"If you are going through hell, keep going." - Sir Winston Churchill -
I wonder how you would expect people to treat you in Anna's situation ? Would you like to meet my teddy bear ?
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Having a disease is not a sin. However, I agree with John Simmons, just b/c someone gave it a name, doesn't mean it's a real condition. Just like today, homosexuality used to be considered a mental condition that should be treated, now it's an "alternative lifestyle" and everyone's ok with it. A man physically changing his body to become a woman, and I'm assuming pursue relationships with men, is a sin. Christians are not to associate with people that are sinning with no desire to repent. "But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortioner--not even to eat with such a person." (1 Cor 5:11) "Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God." (1 Cor 6:9-11) Sodomite refers to the more masculine in the homosexual relationship while the greek word tranlated as "homesexual" refers to the more effeminate in the relationship. That some churches gladly welcome these people into their fellowship shows that that church does not value Scripture. Jason Gerard "This almost never matters, except quite often."
Jason Gerard wrote: However, I agree with John Simmons, just b/c someone gave it a name, doesn't mean it's a real condition I agree, we label things to give them status to remove ourselves from responsibility. As soon as we can name something and have a crooked doc. looking for fame back it up, we feel better about our personal problems which we need to solve ourselves and not run away from or use labels to shield us. However Anna is free to feel what she wants and do what she wants with her body IMO. If I do not like it then I will leave her alone but I will tolerate it, no skin off my nose. As for the explanations you gave regarding this "sin", thanks, I thought as much. Not that I agree with it, simply that at least I understand, and respect for that is his belief, why Paul said what he said, though IMO he should have not replied at all and just left it alone. Or does scripture advocate openly and actively pursuing "sinners" such as Anna? I am truthfully interested and not wanting to argue about it, just want to know :)
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South Africa -
Anna :) wrote: I'm glad to call you all my friends. Just exclude me, please. Best regards, Paul. Jesus Christ is LOVE! Please tell somebody.
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Anna :) wrote: I'm glad to call you all my friends. Just exclude me, please. Best regards, Paul. Jesus Christ is LOVE! Please tell somebody.
Well, lots of people have answered you appropriately but I'd like to make a suggestion. If you have nothing positive to say then don't say anything! It's quite simple - your opinion was not asked for, an offer of friendship was made. If you choose to reject it there is no need to make that public. Unfortunately, your flippant comment has effectively hijacked this thread. Are you happy now? Why do some people feel the need to express their feelings no matter who they offend? :mad: "The folly of man is that he dreams of what he can never achieve rather than dream of what he can."
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John, you can hide who you are if you wish. I won't condemn you for that, and nor should anyone else. I won't and can't do that though, so don't ask me. I've done what I had to, and I'm not going to pretend to have a past I didn't have. Anna :rose: "Be yourself - not what others think you should be"
- Marcia GraeschOh come on the hell on - give us a decent reply, not some glucose-coated cream-pie, un-sincere sensitivity crap. Be a man while you can still back it up... ------- signature starts "...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001 Please review the Legal Disclaimer in my bio. ------- signature ends
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Jason Henderson wrote: the sinner :confused: I guess my point is, and you said so yourself, it is for God to accept/reject someone into everlasting life. You don't know Anna, or most others, and it is not your place to judge, as you have already seemed to, calling her a sinner. I won't pretend to understand his situation/desires. I know someone who has gone through the whole transformation(we used to play guitar together), and still don't get it. But I don't think there's anything fundamentally wrong with it. Anyway, we disagree, and thats fine. Peace. BW The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to talk, mad to live, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding. - Jack Kerouac
brianwelsch wrote: You don't know Anna, or most others, and it is not your place to judge, as you have already seemed to, calling her a sinner. "the sinner" was a generalization referring to those that sin and do not repent (keep on sinning), although I believe that what Anna is doing is sinful if he now has sex with men. He is a man and always will be. It is my place to judge. We all judge people everyday. The wrongness of judging comes when you are hypocritical in your judgments.
Jason Henderson
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"If you are going through hell, keep going." - Sir Winston Churchill -
I hate to disappoint you, but Jesus is a big part of my Life. My Faith is stronger than ever. :) Anna :rose: "Be yourself - not what others think you should be"
- Marcia GraeschThat's great! Your strong faith should transform your life and how you live.
Jason Henderson
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"If you are going through hell, keep going." - Sir Winston Churchill -
this->MoveTo(_T("Jerry Springer"));Nitron _________________________________________-- message sent on 100% recycled electrons. -
Oh! please. Simply, love and tolerance are different species. Loving my wife does not mean I will tolerate her sleeping with any man. In the same way, Jesus loving you does not mean he will tolerate you worshiping the devil. In fact, it is His love for you that will cause Him not to accept you worshipping the devil - He knows the result. I will not accept sin in the name of love - if you will, may it be. Best regards, Paul. Jesus Christ is LOVE! Please tell somebody.
Paul Selormey wrote: In fact, it is His love for you that will cause Him not to accept you worshipping the devil - He knows the result. Well then why did'nt you show any love towards Anna? I accept love and tolerance are different, I agree. But you simply damned her without offering her any chance or opportunity for redemption. In fact you walked away from her. I guess that is my problem with your reply.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South Africa -
Roger Allen wrote: Good luck, and I hope things go well for you. Life is too short to hold small differences like this against people, or even big differences for that matter. Just accept them for who and what they are. Thank you Roger. I try my best, no matter what some may think! Anna :rose: "Be yourself - not what others think you should be"
- Marcia GraeschAnna :) wrote: I try my best Just be yourself I say, nothing more anyone can ask or demand.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South Africa -
Well, lots of people have answered you appropriately but I'd like to make a suggestion. If you have nothing positive to say then don't say anything! It's quite simple - your opinion was not asked for, an offer of friendship was made. If you choose to reject it there is no need to make that public. Unfortunately, your flippant comment has effectively hijacked this thread. Are you happy now? Why do some people feel the need to express their feelings no matter who they offend? :mad: "The folly of man is that he dreams of what he can never achieve rather than dream of what he can."
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So, you're as intolerant of my opinion as I am of the whole idea of Gender Dysphoria being real? ------- signature starts "...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001 Please review the Legal Disclaimer in my bio. ------- signature ends
I'm intolerant of your opinion unless you care to back it up. The person you're happy to lambast so viciously has obviously researched their condition and is so confident that GD is real, that they are prepared to go ahead and do what must be done. I wonder then, can you be as sure what your opinion is based on is is just as valid? Anyway, as I implied in a reply above, there is a line between offering an honest opinion and just being deliberately nasty. Seems that you're happy to high-jump your way across it. Anyway, if you object so strongly, then stand by your convictions and don't read Anna's posts or are you just here to cause trouble? "The folly of man is that he dreams of what he can never achieve rather than dream of what he can."
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Well, lots of people have answered you appropriately but I'd like to make a suggestion. If you have nothing positive to say then don't say anything! It's quite simple - your opinion was not asked for, an offer of friendship was made. If you choose to reject it there is no need to make that public. Unfortunately, your flippant comment has effectively hijacked this thread. Are you happy now? Why do some people feel the need to express their feelings no matter who they offend? :mad: "The folly of man is that he dreams of what he can never achieve rather than dream of what he can."
phykell wrote: Why do some people feel the need to express their feelings no matter who they offend? Like Anna did? An offer of friendship is one thing, but telling people you're a woman trapped in a man's body is a little over the top. It doesn't belong here and you can expect everyone to accept it.
Jason Henderson
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"If you are going through hell, keep going." - Sir Winston Churchill -
Well, lots of people have answered you appropriately but I'd like to make a suggestion. If you have nothing positive to say then don't say anything! It's quite simple - your opinion was not asked for, an offer of friendship was made. If you choose to reject it there is no need to make that public. Unfortunately, your flippant comment has effectively hijacked this thread. Are you happy now? Why do some people feel the need to express their feelings no matter who they offend? :mad: "The folly of man is that he dreams of what he can never achieve rather than dream of what he can."
phykell wrote: ...an offer of friendship was made. If you choose to reject it there is no need to make that public. Oh, please - read your statement again. Please, please, and please a little bit of logic here will help. phykell wrote: Unfortunately, your flippant comment has effectively hijacked this thread. Are you happy now? Happy? no - I will prefer to do anything that will rescure him from his current mess, Christianity aside. Best regards, Paul. Jesus Christ is LOVE! Please tell somebody.
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Jason Gerard wrote: However, I agree with John Simmons, just b/c someone gave it a name, doesn't mean it's a real condition I agree, we label things to give them status to remove ourselves from responsibility. As soon as we can name something and have a crooked doc. looking for fame back it up, we feel better about our personal problems which we need to solve ourselves and not run away from or use labels to shield us. However Anna is free to feel what she wants and do what she wants with her body IMO. If I do not like it then I will leave her alone but I will tolerate it, no skin off my nose. As for the explanations you gave regarding this "sin", thanks, I thought as much. Not that I agree with it, simply that at least I understand, and respect for that is his belief, why Paul said what he said, though IMO he should have not replied at all and just left it alone. Or does scripture advocate openly and actively pursuing "sinners" such as Anna? I am truthfully interested and not wanting to argue about it, just want to know :)
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaPaul Watson wrote: Or does scripture advocate openly and actively pursuing "sinners" such as Anna? I am truthfully interested and not wanting to argue about it, just want to know Scripture does not advocate pursuing sinners ala the Salem witch hunts. Christians are to be a light in the darkness. We are to spread the gospel to all that will hear it. We can not force anyone to believe but we cannot tolerate sin either. Anna was kicked out of her previous church and found a new one. She considers herself a Christian. A Christian has a duty to other Christians to show them their error so they may repent, and if they do not repent, we are to not have fellowship with them. In my city, there is a Metro Church, that is, a church for gays and lesbians. Now, despite the passages I quoted, and a few others that condemn their lifestyle, these people claim to be christians. That's like me claiming to be a 47 year old black man. (I'm a 21 year old white guy, btw) A Catholic priest recently said in response to the pedophilia in his institution, that, "the church is for sinners." Well, it is, but not for continuing sinners but repentant ones. ""Not everyone who says to Me, "Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. Many will say to Me in that day, "Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?' And then I will declare to them, "I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!'" (Matt 7:21-23) Jason Gerard "This almost never matters, except quite often."
