Windows Phone 7 - Smart Phone haters and non geeks avert your eyes [modified]
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If you use the Zune software built into the phone, it'll play while in the background. I just tested this out (streaming music from the Zune Marketplace while browsing the web), just for you! :-D If you're talking about using a 3rd party media player instead of Zune, I believe that you're right that it won't play.
Exactly, you can't use Pandora and other apps in WP7. Taking away features people have come to expect is not the way to sell devices.
I know the language. I've read a book. - _Madmatt
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But way? It’s not like MS or Apple are not capable to create multi-threaded OS for a smart phone. We know that this has nothing to do with the hardware since for a single core processor it’s just simulated from the OS so probably there is a reason behind not doing this. I think they’ve decided that the usability of multi-tasking with this very small screen will be close to zero. Also it will make the phone more expensive because the additional memory required when more than one application is running. What is the situation with the Android? Do it have a multitasking?
The narrow specialist in the broad sense of the word is a complete idiot in the narrow sense of the word. Advertise here – minimum three posts per day are guaranteed.
Sorry but your arguments don't hold up. Android is capable of such tasks. I routinely have Pandora and a GPS tracking app running in the background while checking emails.
I know the language. I've read a book. - _Madmatt
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Exactly, you can't use Pandora and other apps in WP7. Taking away features people have come to expect is not the way to sell devices.
I know the language. I've read a book. - _Madmatt
I ask this seriously because I don't know and can't be bothered to fire up Google to find out ;) ... did the first version of the iPhone support backgrounding Pandora, etc.? If so, I can (kind of) see your point; however, even if it did, I'd rather have Microsoft produce a product that works well at everything it does than one that promises something that it delivers poorly. I believe that there will (eventually) be an update to allow third-party apps to run in the background if they need that capability. I imagine that it'll wind up being another thing the app has to ask permission to do (like accessing location info, etc.) and that most apps won't do it because most won't need to do so. I think that most apps (obviously not ones like Pandora) will work just fine with the push notification system that WP7 supports. That said, I really wish the twitter app supported push notifications (that, or that someone would point me toward one that does). Anyway, I upgraded from a WM6.5 device to my WP7-based Focus and haven't missed multitasking (except for twitter, that is, and that could be resolved if the app supported push) but then I don't use Pandora and the like.
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Need to try... Drop test, the iPhone is prone to a smashed screen Battery Life, the iPhone has dire battery life.
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Yes, I also tried yesterday in the at&t store, the AMOLED screen was stunning (I want 24" AMOLED monitor :rolleyes: ), and the fonts are so sharp. The overall OS was fluid, and more responsive than my iPhone 3GS. if you compare the weight and size of Samsung Focus, you will not notice that it's in your pocket. HTC Surround was disappointing, there was nothing surround about that... but I will still wait for the Dell Venue Pro. cant wait to buy one... :)
Rutvik Dave wrote:
but I will still wait for the Dell Venue Pro. cant wait to buy one...
Indeed. I like it very much too. I've been quite a "gadget hater", but this one I really want. Don't know why, I just want one. For the first time in my life I want a gadget. :)
I used to think.... Finally I realized it's no good.
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I ask this seriously because I don't know and can't be bothered to fire up Google to find out ;) ... did the first version of the iPhone support backgrounding Pandora, etc.? If so, I can (kind of) see your point; however, even if it did, I'd rather have Microsoft produce a product that works well at everything it does than one that promises something that it delivers poorly. I believe that there will (eventually) be an update to allow third-party apps to run in the background if they need that capability. I imagine that it'll wind up being another thing the app has to ask permission to do (like accessing location info, etc.) and that most apps won't do it because most won't need to do so. I think that most apps (obviously not ones like Pandora) will work just fine with the push notification system that WP7 supports. That said, I really wish the twitter app supported push notifications (that, or that someone would point me toward one that does). Anyway, I upgraded from a WM6.5 device to my WP7-based Focus and haven't missed multitasking (except for twitter, that is, and that could be resolved if the app supported push) but then I don't use Pandora and the like.
Marc A. Brown wrote:
I believe that there will (eventually) be an update
Of course there will be an update to fix everything, it's a Microsoft product after all. The distribute first, fix later model works ok with some software but with so many devices on the market waiting for the promise of functionality won't sell yours. Users are already invested with several hundreds of dollars and multi-year contracts they can't just simply download another email client or decide to run mySql versus SQL Server.
I know the language. I've read a book. - _Madmatt
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Marc A. Brown wrote:
I believe that there will (eventually) be an update
Of course there will be an update to fix everything, it's a Microsoft product after all. The distribute first, fix later model works ok with some software but with so many devices on the market waiting for the promise of functionality won't sell yours. Users are already invested with several hundreds of dollars and multi-year contracts they can't just simply download another email client or decide to run mySql versus SQL Server.
I know the language. I've read a book. - _Madmatt
Wow, did Steve Ballmer pee in your Cheerios or something? ;) Seriously though, you'd prefer to see a new product that tries to do everything and fails to do any of it well instead of one that leaves some features out in order to do the included features well? I'd rather have a device that works well even if it doesn't do everything. Those missing features will come when they're solid. Loving the conversation, by the way!
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Wow, did Steve Ballmer pee in your Cheerios or something? ;) Seriously though, you'd prefer to see a new product that tries to do everything and fails to do any of it well instead of one that leaves some features out in order to do the included features well? I'd rather have a device that works well even if it doesn't do everything. Those missing features will come when they're solid. Loving the conversation, by the way!
If the device is not at least equal to existing devices no one is going to buy it. Spending hundreds of dollars to downgrade is not viable option or economically intelligent. I am not going to give up features and functionality and hope that one day I'll get them back. I'm not going to drop to a DSL connection while the cable company upgrades to fiber, I'll stick with the cable modem, then upgrade when available.
I know the language. I've read a book. - _Madmatt
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If the device is not at least equal to existing devices no one is going to buy it. Spending hundreds of dollars to downgrade is not viable option or economically intelligent. I am not going to give up features and functionality and hope that one day I'll get them back. I'm not going to drop to a DSL connection while the cable company upgrades to fiber, I'll stick with the cable modem, then upgrade when available.
I know the language. I've read a book. - _Madmatt
True if the feature in question is really important to you. In my case, support for pandora-like apps running in the background is a non-issue. Most or all of my multitasking needs can be met with live tiles and push notifications. Copy/paste, which is supposed to be available in early 2011, is somewhat more important but even that isn't a deal breaker for me. Stability is important to me and I just wasn't getting that with my previous device. I'm hopeful (optimistic even) that'll change with this phone. So, in my case I'd say that the upgrade makes sense. Which has nothing to do with your case, of course! ;)
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Yes, I also tried yesterday in the at&t store, the AMOLED screen was stunning (I want 24" AMOLED monitor :rolleyes: ), and the fonts are so sharp. The overall OS was fluid, and more responsive than my iPhone 3GS. if you compare the weight and size of Samsung Focus, you will not notice that it's in your pocket. HTC Surround was disappointing, there was nothing surround about that... but I will still wait for the Dell Venue Pro. cant wait to buy one... :)
Googling for Samsung Focus, first page: http://www.gizmocrunch.com/mobile/3989-samsung-focus-microsd-problems[^]
Wout
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I got a chance to try Windows Phone 7 phones at a store: samsung focus and HTC Surround. I must say the OS is awesome. What stands apart is the performance. My friend tested his iPhone 4 and samsung focus, side by side, and surprisingly windows phone 7 loaded the pages faster on the few sites we tried. The animations are really smooth and the UI is clearly different and refreshing. I am not crazy about the device themselves Samsung Focus is the only device I liked (form factor + it has a good AMOLED screen). Also, the phones are available at reasonably discounted prices on Amazon.com.
modified on Wednesday, November 10, 2010 7:01 PM
It doesn't seem that long since I was one of the only ones who was planning on buying one. It's interesting to see that it's gaining some traction here in the lounge.
I have CDO, it's OCD with the letters in the right order; just as they ruddy well should be
Forgive your enemies - it messes with their heads
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Googling for Samsung Focus, first page: http://www.gizmocrunch.com/mobile/3989-samsung-focus-microsd-problems[^]
Wout
Yeah they have these hidden micro sd slots on all the windows phone device, with the sticker on it that, if you put card in here you will void your warranty. even at&t store will refuse to put the card for you... i don't know what is the problem. Try this cool Samsung Omnia 7 site[^], it's just cool how they have used silverlight. more information (if you can find it) than Microsoft windows mobile site... :)
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It doesn't seem that long since I was one of the only ones who was planning on buying one. It's interesting to see that it's gaining some traction here in the lounge.
I have CDO, it's OCD with the letters in the right order; just as they ruddy well should be
Forgive your enemies - it messes with their heads
Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
It's interesting to see that it's gaining some traction here in the lounge.
It is an MS developers forum, so you should expect that at least a few people will get the windows phone 7. It will be interesting to see if it can be a game changer. The start has been pretty good.
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I ask this seriously because I don't know and can't be bothered to fire up Google to find out ;) ... did the first version of the iPhone support backgrounding Pandora, etc.? If so, I can (kind of) see your point; however, even if it did, I'd rather have Microsoft produce a product that works well at everything it does than one that promises something that it delivers poorly. I believe that there will (eventually) be an update to allow third-party apps to run in the background if they need that capability. I imagine that it'll wind up being another thing the app has to ask permission to do (like accessing location info, etc.) and that most apps won't do it because most won't need to do so. I think that most apps (obviously not ones like Pandora) will work just fine with the push notification system that WP7 supports. That said, I really wish the twitter app supported push notifications (that, or that someone would point me toward one that does). Anyway, I upgraded from a WM6.5 device to my WP7-based Focus and haven't missed multitasking (except for twitter, that is, and that could be resolved if the app supported push) but then I don't use Pandora and the like.
As Mark said, WP7 doing the catch-up will not work well for Microsoft as there are already available mature products (iPhone and Android). You already had a WM6.5 that you then upgrade to WP7 but I suppose a lot of people will base their purchase on what features are available now, not in the next 2 years.
"A democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where fifty-one percent of the people may take away the rights of the other forty-nine." - Thomas Jefferson "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." - Benjamin Franklin Edbert Sydney, Australia
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As Mark said, WP7 doing the catch-up will not work well for Microsoft as there are already available mature products (iPhone and Android). You already had a WM6.5 that you then upgrade to WP7 but I suppose a lot of people will base their purchase on what features are available now, not in the next 2 years.
"A democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where fifty-one percent of the people may take away the rights of the other forty-nine." - Thomas Jefferson "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." - Benjamin Franklin Edbert Sydney, Australia
Perhaps, but I'm not convinced the average consumer is going to "get" that the OS is lacking because they can't background a third party app. They're going to see ads touting how different it is and how it'll be easier to use. They'll use the Zune player on their device which does play while it's in the background and they'll be happy with the experience. I think the people who are going to be up in arms are going to be geeks. As one, I wasn't thrilled at the idea of no multitasking and copy/paste; however, I understand why they're missing. And everything I heard or read before release said that the release version of the OS was going to be quite solid - and so far I haven't been disappointed. I think the thing that could've killed them would've been an empty app marketplace (like Palm's when the Pre was released). But the marketplace doesn't look empty to me. I haven't installed much (just a handful of apps) but while browsing, I got the impression of a decently stocked store. Obviously it's not as well stocked as Apple's, but it seems to be off to a good start and it should only grow.
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phannon86 wrote:
1. The ability to tether without having to pay my carrier extra, or even tell them at all
Give it time. Rootkits aren't written overnight...
3x12=36 2x12=24 1x12=12 0x12=18
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:-D :-D :-D But can you actually make a "phone" call. :-D :-D :-D
I wasn't, now I am, then I won't be anymore.
There is an app for that! :P it's in development though... muahahaha! :rolleyes:
A train station is where the train stops. A bus station is where the bus stops. On my desk, I have a work station.... _________________________________________________________ My programs never have bugs, they just develop random features.
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Sorry but your arguments don't hold up. Android is capable of such tasks. I routinely have Pandora and a GPS tracking app running in the background while checking emails.
I know the language. I've read a book. - _Madmatt
Not to be a complete twit about it but you're not the "average user". You're a geek who does more things with less than the average "smart phone" user. V1 of WP7 doesn't target you specifically, it targets the sheep masses who think the iPhone (when it was released) was actually worth standing in line for a week just to buy it on day one and Microsoft is hoping to herd up some of the sheep with some slick advertising (admittedly the commercials are funny and thought provoking) and a slightly different user interface based upon a well received Zune Metro UI (for those people who weren't sheep and actually bought a Zune). That said, Microsoft, I'm sure, has a list of things they will be slipstreaming into the phones, copy/cut and paste are already on that list for the next OTA update. Hell, how long did it take the iPhone to implement multitasking? And even their implementation isn't complete, it uses a combination of pausing apps in the background and using services in place of "free for all" multitasking to acccomplish a form of simulated multitasking. And there are people who rave (I'm taking foaming at the mouth raving) about how "perfect" it is. And everything I can find on Android indicates that it uses the exact same methodology as the iOS 4 for "multitasking". So... When Microsoft comes up with a solution that they can get the app developers onboard with that doesn't violate someone else's IP or has reasonable licensing terms, I'm certain they will push an update that allows this for third party apps.
Mike Poz
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Not to be a complete twit about it but you're not the "average user". You're a geek who does more things with less than the average "smart phone" user. V1 of WP7 doesn't target you specifically, it targets the sheep masses who think the iPhone (when it was released) was actually worth standing in line for a week just to buy it on day one and Microsoft is hoping to herd up some of the sheep with some slick advertising (admittedly the commercials are funny and thought provoking) and a slightly different user interface based upon a well received Zune Metro UI (for those people who weren't sheep and actually bought a Zune). That said, Microsoft, I'm sure, has a list of things they will be slipstreaming into the phones, copy/cut and paste are already on that list for the next OTA update. Hell, how long did it take the iPhone to implement multitasking? And even their implementation isn't complete, it uses a combination of pausing apps in the background and using services in place of "free for all" multitasking to acccomplish a form of simulated multitasking. And there are people who rave (I'm taking foaming at the mouth raving) about how "perfect" it is. And everything I can find on Android indicates that it uses the exact same methodology as the iOS 4 for "multitasking". So... When Microsoft comes up with a solution that they can get the app developers onboard with that doesn't violate someone else's IP or has reasonable licensing terms, I'm certain they will push an update that allows this for third party apps.
Mike Poz
Mike Poz wrote:
You're a geek who does more things with less than the average "smart phone" user.
To the contrary. I use my phone less than an "average user" and those users expect those features.
Mike Poz wrote:
how long did it take the iPhone to implement multitasking?
There is the point. Exiting devices already have the functionality and WP7 is being measured against them, not what potential it has in the future. Are you going to buy new a car with the spare tire donuts instead of normal tires with the promise that you'll get normal tires in the future? The car functions, you can drive it? Will you be happy with others zooming past you? What happens when the new tires are delayed because of technical difficulties?
I know the language. I've read a book. - _Madmatt
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Mike Poz wrote:
You're a geek who does more things with less than the average "smart phone" user.
To the contrary. I use my phone less than an "average user" and those users expect those features.
Mike Poz wrote:
how long did it take the iPhone to implement multitasking?
There is the point. Exiting devices already have the functionality and WP7 is being measured against them, not what potential it has in the future. Are you going to buy new a car with the spare tire donuts instead of normal tires with the promise that you'll get normal tires in the future? The car functions, you can drive it? Will you be happy with others zooming past you? What happens when the new tires are delayed because of technical difficulties?
I know the language. I've read a book. - _Madmatt
Honestly, when it comes to cell phones, that's what I have, a cell phone. I don't need a small electronic gadget to validate my life. It sounds like you're of the same cut. So really, any shortcomings that the WP7 phone have don't affect me at all and I honestly fail to see how they affect you. What I do know is that the majority of the people who complain about shortcomings in anything are generally the smaller percentage of users. Note that's *generally*, I acknowledge that there are some things that should "just work", oh, like, phone calls. Point in fact, I work with a lot of people who have iPhones and the number of them that actually used cut/copy and paste when it became available number in the very low single digits. With regard to multitasking, it is what it is. Microsoft will come out with an implementation, and I'm not going to pout about it because really, when all is said and done, it's just not that critical to my existance. Seriously.
Mike Poz