Pearl Harbor Day
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I knew you had an opinion to express, much better than bollocks - don't you think? Christian Graus wrote: We are told to toe the line and send our children to die in Bushes war, a war which American UN inspectors say will happen no matter what Iraq does, because Bush is setting it up that way. I prefer to think for myself rather than believe what is fed to me by people with no reason to tell me the truth. As do I. Did you ever consider maybe Bush is simply threatening Saddam with the only thing he understands? Mike Mullikin :beer:
It is really hard to be a professional and do things right, in a company full of monkeys. - Michael P. Butler, The Soapbox
Mike Mullikin wrote: the only thing he understands Does the 'he' here refer to Bush or Saddam?
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Germany declared war on America after pearl harbour , ending the internal argument about if the US should get involved . The isolationists wanted to stay out of Europe , much like today when much of US politics is inward looking and successive presidents have been heavily criticised for spending so much time on forigen affairs . Unfortunatly now , as then , events dictate politics just as much as politics dictate events.
Andrew Torrance wrote: much like today when much of US politics is inward looking and successive presidents have been heavily criticised for spending so much time on forigen affairs . Agreed, thats my view of the US as well. American electors seem to vote on a lot of internal issues but pay little attention to foreign policy. Then when political events lead them into situations like Sept 11, they act bewildered. Andrew Torrance wrote: events dictate politics just as much as politics dictate events. Agreed, for example a high percentage of what G W Bush is currently doing would be done by any President, Republican, Democrat, whatever. Regardz Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
You are the intrepid one, always willing to leap into the fray! A serious character flaw, I might add, but entertaining. Said by Roger Wright about me.
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Shroom wrote: 2) Conspiracy theories aside, had the U.S. not become involved in Europe, Hitler would have invaded England. I think the US was already strongly involved. Leand lease was not a small impact. I just watched a show on Sink the Bismark last night. I did not remember that those PBY Catalina's in the Royal Naval Air Command had US pilots. "I will find a new sig someday."
Michael A. Barnhart wrote: I think the US was already strongly involved. That is my "take" on it now as well. I don't think the average US citizen realised what was really going on. Germany's declaration 10,Dec,41 declaration was really just a formality. Similar is Iraq today, The US has been at war with Iraq in effect for months now. I don't consider Rooservelt was wrong, but I think history disorts the truth a fair bit. Pearl Harbor was an operational level disaster for the US. But the US had been coming closer and closer to open war with every step leading up till Dec 7,. Regardz Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
You are the intrepid one, always willing to leap into the fray! A serious character flaw, I might add, but entertaining. Said by Roger Wright about me.
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I agree - I have not done as badly ( 2.7 with four votes ) but I'd appreciate someone telling me why they disagree, assuming you're not the only person to give me a 1 for that post, of course. I don't believe I've voted, I don't think the voting system is for telling people if we like their opinion or not. Christian No offense, but I don't really want to encourage the creation of another VB developer. - Larry Antram 22 Oct 2002 C# will attract all comers, where VB is for IT Journalists and managers - Michael P Butler 05-12-2002 Again, you can screw up a C/C++ program just as easily as a VB program. OK, maybe not as easily, but it's certainly doable. - Jamie Nordmeyer - 15-Nov-2002
Christian Graus wrote: I don't think the voting system is for telling people if we like their opinion or not. It shouldn't be. That's what the [reply] link is for.
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The 2004 elections can't come fast enough for me. Sounds like the Dems are going to run Gore again. Please give us someone else! And the second choice behind Gore is Hillary Clinton. ------------------------------------------ "Isn't it funny how people say they'll never grow up to be their parents, then one day they look in the mirror and they're moving aircraft carriers into the Gulf region?" - The Onion
Hillary would be better than Gore The Bore. I wish Liebermann would run. Although I have some differences of opinion with the man, at least when he opens his mouth something intelligent comes out. Marc Help! I'm an AI running around in someone's f*cked up universe simulator.
sensitivity and ethnic diversity means celebrating difference, not hiding from it. - Christian Graus -
Colin Davies wrote: Colin Davies wrote: America could have offered a peace to Germany by unfreezing the German American assets, instead of joining the Atlantic Charter with great Britain. That would require honesty on the part of Adolph Hitler, which is a fallacy. Name one peace treaty that Hitler ever honored. Colin Davies wrote: IMHO: Roosevelts signature to that was the first American shot in the WW2. But then his election promise was "I have said this before, but I shall say it again and again and again: Your boys are not going to be sent into any foreign wars." I don't understand, are you saying that a war declared upon the United States by Germany was a "foreign war"? Germany seemed to have enough problems crossing the English Channel, Let alone the Atlantic. Germany was chipping away at their air & sea defenses first. This is basic military strategy, not any deficiency of the German army. Jeff Sand jsand at interaccess dot com
Shroom wrote: That would require honesty on the part of Adolph Hitler, which is a fallacy. Name one peace treaty that Hitler ever honored. I believe Native Americans say the same about the US. :-) Shroom wrote: I don't understand, are you saying that a war declared upon the United States by Germany was a "foreign war"? Yes, It takes at least two to make a war, that is on differing continents. The US was siding closer and closer with the Allies leading up to Pearl Harbor. Regardz Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
You are the intrepid one, always willing to leap into the fray! A serious character flaw, I might add, but entertaining. Said by Roger Wright about me.
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Andrew Torrance wrote: much like today when much of US politics is inward looking and successive presidents have been heavily criticised for spending so much time on forigen affairs . Agreed, thats my view of the US as well. American electors seem to vote on a lot of internal issues but pay little attention to foreign policy. Then when political events lead them into situations like Sept 11, they act bewildered. Andrew Torrance wrote: events dictate politics just as much as politics dictate events. Agreed, for example a high percentage of what G W Bush is currently doing would be done by any President, Republican, Democrat, whatever. Regardz Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
You are the intrepid one, always willing to leap into the fray! A serious character flaw, I might add, but entertaining. Said by Roger Wright about me.
a high percentage of what G W Bush is currently doing would be done by any President, Republican, Democrat, whatever No, I disagree. A democrat wouldn't be opening up the Alaskan Reserves, wouldn't be targetting Iraq, would have a different approach with the North Koreans, would be much more active in a peace deal with Palestine and Israel, and would probably be focusing more on prevention in terms of defense, as opposed to in terms of offense. And at home, there would be a different approach to the Enron et al fiasco, etc. At least, so says my crystal ball. Marc Help! I'm an AI running around in someone's f*cked up universe simulator.
sensitivity and ethnic diversity means celebrating difference, not hiding from it. - Christian Graus -
a high percentage of what G W Bush is currently doing would be done by any President, Republican, Democrat, whatever No, I disagree. A democrat wouldn't be opening up the Alaskan Reserves, wouldn't be targetting Iraq, would have a different approach with the North Koreans, would be much more active in a peace deal with Palestine and Israel, and would probably be focusing more on prevention in terms of defense, as opposed to in terms of offense. And at home, there would be a different approach to the Enron et al fiasco, etc. At least, so says my crystal ball. Marc Help! I'm an AI running around in someone's f*cked up universe simulator.
sensitivity and ethnic diversity means celebrating difference, not hiding from it. - Christian GrausI think I have to agree with Colin here. Keep in mind Democrats were in charge when Korea started and when Vietnam changed from a small advisor force to major involvment with ground troups. So history does not support your line of thought. Also the general trend of Democratic leadership to the defense budget is just to cut it, not focus the work (I am being very stero typical with that commnet.) IMO "I will find a new sig someday."
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zarzor wrote: Let everyone knows that the important objects for us: ( OIL + SHARON) :confused: WTF? Don't get me wrong, Sharon's a great gal, and i'm sure there are many who would love to see her covered with oil... But, it's rather disrespectful (not to mention distressingly confusing) to bring up your personal fetishes when someone is talking about his dead brother... :|
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Shog9 This is my December These are my snow covered dreams This is me pretending This is all I need...
Shog9 wrote: Sharon's a great gal, and i'm sure there are many who would love to see her covered with oil :laugh: I'm missing an emoticon :Shwing!: a description would probably not fit the lounge :rolleyes:
I hurt so bad inside I wish you could see the world through my eyes It stays the same I just wanna laugh again
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The 2004 elections can't come fast enough for me. Sounds like the Dems are going to run Gore again. Please give us someone else! And the second choice behind Gore is Hillary Clinton. ------------------------------------------ "Isn't it funny how people say they'll never grow up to be their parents, then one day they look in the mirror and they're moving aircraft carriers into the Gulf region?" - The Onion
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Sadly, the situation is being exploited by Bush for political gain which simply puts people at risk. Have you noticed how very little attention is paid to what is happening other than this 'war against terrorism' ? Would you like to meet my teddy bear ?