CEO who trashed .NET developers
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Pot, Kettle? He's running a web based app company (yawn!) almost certainly done in such wunderkind languages like ruby or php, and he's making fun of .Net developers? Spare me please!!! And this from the hiring section of the site: "Even more talented in a programming way. You can instantly visualize solutions to problems big and small. Your code is always clean, well commented, has good nomenclature and indentation. You can switch on a dime between C++, PHP, Bash, Cron, HTML, CSS, JavaScript, jQuery, Dwoo, SQL — not because you know them all, but because you're the sort of person who can just pick it up and figure it out. If you're this sort of person, you'll know what we mean. If not, then this position isn't for you." Cron is a programming language? OK Bash sort of is, but WTF is Dwoo? And the rest is Web 2.0 toys. You're right that position definitely *isn't* for me.
¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire! SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0 0 rows returned Save an Orange - Use the VCF! Personal 3D projects Just Say No to Web 2 Point Blow
Jim Crafton wrote:
but WTF is Dwoo?
Dwoo is a PHP5 template engine which is (almost) fully compatible with Smarty templates and plugins, but is written from scratch for PHP5, and adds many features.
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Think whatever you like, I'm just a developer who is sick of seeing .NET trashed by the ABMr crowd. Jerkface is one of the few bloggers that stick up to them unlike most MVPs and .NET platform evangelists that just sit there and say nothing. The same thing happened with Evernote. They all just sat quietly while .NET was publicly trashed.
Member 3690834 wrote:
Think whatever you like, I'm just a developer who is sick of seeing .NET trashed by the ABMr crowd. Jerkface is one of the few bloggers that stick up to them unlike most MVPs and .NET platform evangelists that just sit there and say nothing. The same thing happened with Evernote. They all just sat quietly while .NET was publicly trashed.
Is that a really long way of saying "correct"?
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The CEO of some startup trashed .net developers in a flamebait post that has been Slashdotted: http://blog.expensify.com/2011/03/25/ceo-friday-why-we-dont-hire-net-programmers/[^] Binary Playhouse responded with this post: http://www.binplay.com/2011/03/why-ceos-should-not-be-hired-to-write_28.html[^] But of course the CEO hasn't responded and Slashdot supposedly pulled the BP response even though it was voted up. Let's keep passing it around until everyone knows what an ass he is.
Yes, let's keep passing it around! It's such a great post! For comedy value, I mean... I love the burger analogy...
Clueless CEO Wrote:
Programming with .NET is like cooking in a McDonalds kitchen
Ok, with ya so far... The .NET framework components are the cooking utensils, right? And I guess McDonalds = Microsoft... Very clever.
Clueless CEO Wrote:
It is full of amazing tools that automate absolutely everything. Just press the right button and follow the beeping lights, and you can churn out flawless 1.6 oz burgers faster than anybody else on the planet.
Uh, everything? I should ask someone where the "Send trade to stock exchange" button is... Hold on, let me check MSDN... Nope, not there. But back to the analogy... So burgers are programs, right? Ok, so if I push the magic button, I can make one specific kind of program...
Clueless CEO Wrote:
However, if you need to make a 1.7 oz burger, you simply can’t.
What happened to being able to automate absolutely everything? That was only about two sentences ago...
Clueless CEO Wrote:
There’s no button for it.
Yeah, but there wasn't a button for the other one either. So since I didn't actually use the button, can't I just change one variable and make it a "1.7 oz burger" instead of a "1.6 oz burger"? That's kinda how coding works.
Clueless CEO Wrote:
The patties are pre-formed in the wrong size.
//double PATTY_SIZE = 1.6;
double PATTY_SIZE = 1.7;Clueless CEO Wrote:
They start out frozen so they can’t be smushed up and reformed, and the thawing machine is so tightly integrated with the cooking machine that there’s no way to intercept it between the two.
Wait, what? So what does the thawing machine represent? Is that the pre-compiler or the linker? And is the cooking machine the JIT compiler? Uhh... Do I need to install PostSharp?
Clueless CEO Wrote:
A McDonalds kitchen makes exactly what’s on the McDonalds menu — and does so in an absolutely foolproof fashion.
Yeah, but what about the thawing machine? Get back to the analogy here...
Clueless CEO Wrote:
But it can’t go off the menu, and any
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The CEO of some startup trashed .net developers in a flamebait post that has been Slashdotted: http://blog.expensify.com/2011/03/25/ceo-friday-why-we-dont-hire-net-programmers/[^] Binary Playhouse responded with this post: http://www.binplay.com/2011/03/why-ceos-should-not-be-hired-to-write_28.html[^] But of course the CEO hasn't responded and Slashdot supposedly pulled the BP response even though it was voted up. Let's keep passing it around until everyone knows what an ass he is.
REPOST!
A guide to posting questions on CodeProject[^]
Dave Kreskowiak -
Funny bit, I know someone who works for him. Said employee linked me to the article to get my reaction as he knew the kind of evil I cook up in .net without a lot of the automated tools. The tools have their place, they make a lot of standard interactions easier. If that's all your doing .net is about as good as you can get. If they aren't what you're doing, well, you can still do most anything you can in other languages, though overhead will probably be more than some other languages.
Distind wrote:
the kind of evil I cook up in .net without a lot of the automated tools
Reminds me of the time I created this awesome class that could do practicaly....everything System.IO.MemoryStream class do :( Oh well, rookie days were good, everything looked shiny and like a new toy :laugh:
"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't--either way, you are right." — Henry Ford
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Think whatever you like, I'm just a developer who is sick of seeing .NET trashed by the ABMr crowd. Jerkface is one of the few bloggers that stick up to them unlike most MVPs and .NET platform evangelists that just sit there and say nothing. The same thing happened with Evernote. They all just sat quietly while .NET was publicly trashed.
Member 3690834 wrote:
most MVPs and .NET platform evangelists that just sit there and say nothing.
Because you don't feed trolls... I even don't know that stupid guy, who cares man, what that one guy (who is not even well-known) is going to do ? We trash VB here at CP everyday (for fun), and we don't see any VB programmer offended. Unfortunately that guy got what he wants (free publicity), now you will recognize that website/guy, which you haven't heard of before. right ? I am not taking any sides, I am just saying... :)
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Member 3690834 wrote:
Think whatever you like, I'm just a developer who is sick of seeing .NET trashed by the ABMr crowd. Jerkface is one of the few bloggers that stick up to them unlike most MVPs and .NET platform evangelists that just sit there and say nothing. The same thing happened with Evernote. They all just sat quietly while .NET was publicly trashed.
Is that a really long way of saying "correct"?
No I am not him if that is what you are suggesting. A lot of people link to his posts in forums, maybe they are all are Jerkface too? Jerkface is popular because he is one of the few bloggers that deals with the ABMr crowd directly. But maybe you would prefer it if all .net devs just sat and cowered as sites like Slashdot trash anyone that uses Microsoft tech. Just pretend they don't exist even though millions of people read Slashdot.
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No I am not him if that is what you are suggesting. A lot of people link to his posts in forums, maybe they are all are Jerkface too? Jerkface is popular because he is one of the few bloggers that deals with the ABMr crowd directly. But maybe you would prefer it if all .net devs just sat and cowered as sites like Slashdot trash anyone that uses Microsoft tech. Just pretend they don't exist even though millions of people read Slashdot.
Member 3690834 wrote:
No I am not him if that is what you are suggesting. A lot of people link to his posts in forums, maybe they are all are Jerkface too?
I thought the implication was that you previously linked to this stuff in the Lounge, not that you are the person in the link. I know somebody linked to everything you linked to... not sure if it was you who did that or if it was somebody else.
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Member 3690834 wrote:
most MVPs and .NET platform evangelists that just sit there and say nothing.
Because you don't feed trolls... I even don't know that stupid guy, who cares man, what that one guy (who is not even well-known) is going to do ? We trash VB here at CP everyday (for fun), and we don't see any VB programmer offended. Unfortunately that guy got what he wants (free publicity), now you will recognize that website/guy, which you haven't heard of before. right ? I am not taking any sides, I am just saying... :)
With Evernote the CEO was definitely trolling for publicity as well but Scott H. still should have responded to him instead of just pretending Evernote no longer existed. It just made him look cowardly since up until then he was praising Evernote as an example of a great .NET program. That Evernote post made it into Dr. Dobb's and is still linked to in forums as an example of why WPF should not be used.
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Member 3690834 wrote:
No I am not him if that is what you are suggesting. A lot of people link to his posts in forums, maybe they are all are Jerkface too?
I thought the implication was that you previously linked to this stuff in the Lounge, not that you are the person in the link. I know somebody linked to everything you linked to... not sure if it was you who did that or if it was somebody else.
Oh I thought it was obvious that I linked to it before because my name is on the post.
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Yes, let's keep passing it around! It's such a great post! For comedy value, I mean... I love the burger analogy...
Clueless CEO Wrote:
Programming with .NET is like cooking in a McDonalds kitchen
Ok, with ya so far... The .NET framework components are the cooking utensils, right? And I guess McDonalds = Microsoft... Very clever.
Clueless CEO Wrote:
It is full of amazing tools that automate absolutely everything. Just press the right button and follow the beeping lights, and you can churn out flawless 1.6 oz burgers faster than anybody else on the planet.
Uh, everything? I should ask someone where the "Send trade to stock exchange" button is... Hold on, let me check MSDN... Nope, not there. But back to the analogy... So burgers are programs, right? Ok, so if I push the magic button, I can make one specific kind of program...
Clueless CEO Wrote:
However, if you need to make a 1.7 oz burger, you simply can’t.
What happened to being able to automate absolutely everything? That was only about two sentences ago...
Clueless CEO Wrote:
There’s no button for it.
Yeah, but there wasn't a button for the other one either. So since I didn't actually use the button, can't I just change one variable and make it a "1.7 oz burger" instead of a "1.6 oz burger"? That's kinda how coding works.
Clueless CEO Wrote:
The patties are pre-formed in the wrong size.
//double PATTY_SIZE = 1.6;
double PATTY_SIZE = 1.7;Clueless CEO Wrote:
They start out frozen so they can’t be smushed up and reformed, and the thawing machine is so tightly integrated with the cooking machine that there’s no way to intercept it between the two.
Wait, what? So what does the thawing machine represent? Is that the pre-compiler or the linker? And is the cooking machine the JIT compiler? Uhh... Do I need to install PostSharp?
Clueless CEO Wrote:
A McDonalds kitchen makes exactly what’s on the McDonalds menu — and does so in an absolutely foolproof fashion.
Yeah, but what about the thawing machine? Get back to the analogy here...
Clueless CEO Wrote:
But it can’t go off the menu, and any
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
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The CEO of some startup trashed .net developers in a flamebait post that has been Slashdotted: http://blog.expensify.com/2011/03/25/ceo-friday-why-we-dont-hire-net-programmers/[^] Binary Playhouse responded with this post: http://www.binplay.com/2011/03/why-ceos-should-not-be-hired-to-write_28.html[^] But of course the CEO hasn't responded and Slashdot supposedly pulled the BP response even though it was voted up. Let's keep passing it around until everyone knows what an ass he is.
Well - after reading your responses, I really wonder if anyone of you thought about the article ... This guy doesn't say really he will not hire any .NET dev, and also he isn't really ranting about .NET He only says that if one exclusively (or almost) is developing for .NET, she will have no clue (or loose the clue) for what's going on really BEHIND the compiler. While that might be ok for todays super duper desktop PCs, in i.e. embedded systems it would be a nightmare (you can't rely on a GC that frees memory a couple of seconds later than possible) And he states that PURE .NET developers are a bit inflexible 'cause of the bounds (restrictions) of the framework. Last point: he named the .NET a language, but isn't it one ? (.NET framework == MSIL) == TRUE
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Think whatever you like, I'm just a developer who is sick of seeing .NET trashed by the ABMr crowd. Jerkface is one of the few bloggers that stick up to them unlike most MVPs and .NET platform evangelists that just sit there and say nothing. The same thing happened with Evernote. They all just sat quietly while .NET was publicly trashed.
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Well - after reading your responses, I really wonder if anyone of you thought about the article ... This guy doesn't say really he will not hire any .NET dev, and also he isn't really ranting about .NET He only says that if one exclusively (or almost) is developing for .NET, she will have no clue (or loose the clue) for what's going on really BEHIND the compiler. While that might be ok for todays super duper desktop PCs, in i.e. embedded systems it would be a nightmare (you can't rely on a GC that frees memory a couple of seconds later than possible) And he states that PURE .NET developers are a bit inflexible 'cause of the bounds (restrictions) of the framework. Last point: he named the .NET a language, but isn't it one ? (.NET framework == MSIL) == TRUE
What you want to bring logic and common sense to a flame war, shame on you. Let them play, it keeps the rest of us entertained.
Never underestimate the power of human stupidity RAH
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The CEO of some startup trashed .net developers in a flamebait post that has been Slashdotted: http://blog.expensify.com/2011/03/25/ceo-friday-why-we-dont-hire-net-programmers/[^] Binary Playhouse responded with this post: http://www.binplay.com/2011/03/why-ceos-should-not-be-hired-to-write_28.html[^] But of course the CEO hasn't responded and Slashdot supposedly pulled the BP response even though it was voted up. Let's keep passing it around until everyone knows what an ass he is.
Maybe its just jealousy by people not able to release code at the same pace as a .Net dev. I've developed in a few IDE's : Borland C++ (dos), Delphi, Borland Visual C++, Eclipse , Visual Studio and by far I find VS the best of the lot. While other languages are similar in syntax ( java etc ) , I found that working with their IDE's was just that much bigger of a pain in getting something done. For example, I've developed for mobile using VS 2005 and VB to windows CE devices, yet comparing that to developing in Java for BlackBerry is like chalk and cheese. Yes, Eclipse is open and all is well and good but companies\SME's etc expect results, not developers taking unnecesary longer periods to complete projects.
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Read the rest, don't just stop at C++ "PHP, HTML, CSS, JavaScript, jQuery, Dwoo" I'll wager a LOT that very little C++ is actually used. Or that it's used in the mobile apps section, and most of that is pretty trivial.
¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire! SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0 0 rows returned Save an Orange - Use the VCF! Personal 3D projects Just Say No to Web 2 Point Blow
I read the whole thing, just don't think C++ should be called a web toy.
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