Japan's plan for The DeathStar v1.0
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When you have people from all over the world you have no choice but to select one language that provides the best common ground for everyone. Too bad we will not get to see what consequences this has in a hundred years. English emerged out of the need of some Anglons, Saxons, Danes, Celts and later Normans (actually coming from France) who somehow had to talk to each other. Now people from all over the world use English for the same purpose and that will also have consequences. What we have here is only the beginning.
"I just exchanged opinions with my boss. I went in with mine and came out with his." - me, 2011 ---
I am endeavoring, Madam, to construct a mnemonic memory circuit using stone knives and bearskins - Mr. Spock 1935 and me 2011CDP1802 wrote:
When you have people from all over the world you have no choice but to select one language that provides the best common ground for everyone.
Yeah, but to down vote someone for posting in their langauge is zenophobic. :)
CDP1802 wrote:
English emerged out of the need of some Anglons, Saxons, Danes, Celts and later Normans
Angeln, where the Angles came from, is actually in Denmark (the south). I guess they spke a langage closer to Old Saxon than Old Norse. But there is precius little Celtic in English, possibly a gramatical form, but almost no words. http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/004037.html[^] This kind of makes sense. There werent that many Saxons invading Britain to take over completely, and aparently genetically most of us are descnded from Celtic stock rather than Germanic. So it could be the ability of the Celtic language to adopt foreign words, and in the Case of English, to the point of having replaced almost all their own, that we arrive at English as it is, whcih is what the article hints at.
Dr D Evans "The whole idea that carbon dioxide is the main cause of the recent global warming is based on a guess that was proved false by empirical evidence during the 1990s" financialpost
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CDP1802 wrote:
When you have people from all over the world you have no choice but to select one language that provides the best common ground for everyone.
Yeah, but to down vote someone for posting in their langauge is zenophobic. :)
CDP1802 wrote:
English emerged out of the need of some Anglons, Saxons, Danes, Celts and later Normans
Angeln, where the Angles came from, is actually in Denmark (the south). I guess they spke a langage closer to Old Saxon than Old Norse. But there is precius little Celtic in English, possibly a gramatical form, but almost no words. http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/004037.html[^] This kind of makes sense. There werent that many Saxons invading Britain to take over completely, and aparently genetically most of us are descnded from Celtic stock rather than Germanic. So it could be the ability of the Celtic language to adopt foreign words, and in the Case of English, to the point of having replaced almost all their own, that we arrive at English as it is, whcih is what the article hints at.
Dr D Evans "The whole idea that carbon dioxide is the main cause of the recent global warming is based on a guess that was proved false by empirical evidence during the 1990s" financialpost
If I'm not mistaken, it was a certain Julius Cesar who simply declared the people on one side of the Rhine to be Celts and those on the other side to be Germans. And then he moved on to conquer Brittania. We only know little of who they considered themselves to be, how they were related and how much this mattered to them at all. It certainly was not as simple as drawing some line on a map. Besides that, the city where I come from started out as a Roman garrison to secure the road against barbarian raids. So I can just guess what kind of people I would get to see if my ancestors of the last 2000 years would line up. Then again, probably everybody would be surprised who his ancestors were. Also, it does not matter if you write 'Anglon' or 'Angeln', 'Saxons' or 'Sachsen'. Those are just modern spellings for names from a time where no such rules existed. And we can't even say for sure which spelling comes closer to the original pronounciation of those names. A loss, but such things were researched long after the last people who actually spoke those languages in that form had died. Anyway, all I wanted to say is that this role of English as common ground for all kinds of people appears to continue.
"I just exchanged opinions with my boss. I went in with mine and came out with his." - me, 2011 ---
I am endeavoring, Madam, to construct a mnemonic memory circuit using stone knives and bearskins - Mr. Spock 1935 and me 2011 -
If I'm not mistaken, it was a certain Julius Cesar who simply declared the people on one side of the Rhine to be Celts and those on the other side to be Germans. And then he moved on to conquer Brittania. We only know little of who they considered themselves to be, how they were related and how much this mattered to them at all. It certainly was not as simple as drawing some line on a map. Besides that, the city where I come from started out as a Roman garrison to secure the road against barbarian raids. So I can just guess what kind of people I would get to see if my ancestors of the last 2000 years would line up. Then again, probably everybody would be surprised who his ancestors were. Also, it does not matter if you write 'Anglon' or 'Angeln', 'Saxons' or 'Sachsen'. Those are just modern spellings for names from a time where no such rules existed. And we can't even say for sure which spelling comes closer to the original pronounciation of those names. A loss, but such things were researched long after the last people who actually spoke those languages in that form had died. Anyway, all I wanted to say is that this role of English as common ground for all kinds of people appears to continue.
"I just exchanged opinions with my boss. I went in with mine and came out with his." - me, 2011 ---
I am endeavoring, Madam, to construct a mnemonic memory circuit using stone knives and bearskins - Mr. Spock 1935 and me 2011CDP1802 wrote:
If I'm not mistaken, it was a certain Julius Cesar who simply declared the people on one side of the Rhine to be Celts and those on the other side to be Germans
But there was a langauge difference, no?
CDP1802 wrote:
Besides that, the city where I come from
Trier?
CDP1802 wrote:
Also, it does not matter if you write 'Anglon' or 'Angeln', 'Saxons' or 'Sachsen'.
True, but I only called it Angeln because thats what we call that part of Denmark: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angeln[^] Its an interesting language, English. How such a bastardised mess should become the worlds number one is perverse to the point of laughable. :)
Dr D Evans "The whole idea that carbon dioxide is the main cause of the recent global warming is based on a guess that was proved false by empirical evidence during the 1990s" financialpost
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CDP1802 wrote:
If I'm not mistaken, it was a certain Julius Cesar who simply declared the people on one side of the Rhine to be Celts and those on the other side to be Germans
But there was a langauge difference, no?
CDP1802 wrote:
Besides that, the city where I come from
Trier?
CDP1802 wrote:
Also, it does not matter if you write 'Anglon' or 'Angeln', 'Saxons' or 'Sachsen'.
True, but I only called it Angeln because thats what we call that part of Denmark: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angeln[^] Its an interesting language, English. How such a bastardised mess should become the worlds number one is perverse to the point of laughable. :)
Dr D Evans "The whole idea that carbon dioxide is the main cause of the recent global warming is based on a guess that was proved false by empirical evidence during the 1990s" financialpost
No. Castrum Juliacum. Jülich. There were language and cultural differences, but probably they were very gradual, from village to village and tribe to tribe. It just depended on who they had as neighbors and who they were friends or enemies with.
"I just exchanged opinions with my boss. I went in with mine and came out with his." - me, 2011 ---
I am endeavoring, Madam, to construct a mnemonic memory circuit using stone knives and bearskins - Mr. Spock 1935 and me 2011 -
Dan Neely wrote:
except that we'll never see one built; precisely because it would be an orbital death ray.
So I guess you also think, we will never see sharks with frickin' laser beams attached to their frickin' heads? :)
Dan Neely wrote:
a laser type transmission system
My double-fold tinfoil hat will protect me and reflect the laser beam into space. Where is the tin-foil hat emoticon when you need one?
"I love deadlines. I like the whooshing sound they make as they fly by." (DNA)
modified on Tuesday, May 24, 2011 11:22 AM
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Been there, done that (sort of)[^]. (it wasn't a good idea, BTW)
Software Zen:
delete this; -
Wouldn't it be easier to just build a pile of nuclear reactors up there? On the moon they should be safe from tsunamis or terrorists or whatever people complain about for the Earth bound ones. Or, are we worried about giving the moon cancer? Reactors could even be built only on the dark side so the moon wouldn't look like a pokeymon ball.
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Yeah, but that's still a major undertaking - you have to mine the uranium ore, build the refinery, refine it, build the power station, cart off the "used" fuel, bury it somewhere so people aren't walking into it every time they turn around. Ok, so you still have to do some of this with a moon-based solar power receiver, but at least you can start small and build it up as you go. But, the power is free once you have built it, and with no moving parts it should be very reliable - meteorites aside.
Real men don't use instructions. They are only the manufacturers opinion on how to put the thing together. Manfred R. Bihy: "Looks as if OP is learning resistant."
Ummm . . . The amount of specialized fissile material required for a reactor is negligible compared to the amount of specialized materials required to build enough photovoltaic cells to generate the same power. While it might be prohibitive to ship that many photovoltaic cells to the moon, it would be easy to ship enough fuel for a nuclear reactor. And I don't think it would be very difficult to find a suitable location for nuclear waste on the moon.
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Luna Ring[^] Shimizu Corporation construction firm’s research branch, CSP, unveiled a long-term planning project to install a belt of photovoltaic panels across the surface of the Moon. Power gathered from the 13,000 terrawatts of continuous solar energy the Moon’s surface receives daily would be beamed back to an Earth-based receiving station via microwave or laser transmission, where it would then be used to power public offices, hospitals and schools across the globe. A staff of remotely controlled robots would be in constant rotation to make repairs and provide maintenance for the LUNA RING installation, though the structure would require some human personnel on-site. To make the process more efficient, the proposed plan includes building the LUNA RING’s solar panels on the lunar surface using local materials, rather than launching pre-built panels to the site. Quoted from here.[^] I guess it makes sense, they're ruled by an emperor. I just didn't realize it was The Emperor.
Brad Deja Moo - When you feel like you've heard the same bull before.
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Ummm . . . The amount of specialized fissile material required for a reactor is negligible compared to the amount of specialized materials required to build enough photovoltaic cells to generate the same power. While it might be prohibitive to ship that many photovoltaic cells to the moon, it would be easy to ship enough fuel for a nuclear reactor. And I don't think it would be very difficult to find a suitable location for nuclear waste on the moon.
As long as the launch does not fail. It makes a little difference when the rocket explodes or smacks into the ocean with either a load of uranium elements or a solar panel on board.
"I just exchanged opinions with my boss. I went in with mine and came out with his." - me, 2011 ---
I am endeavoring, Madam, to construct a mnemonic memory circuit using stone knives and bearskins - Mr. Spock 1935 and me 2011 -
As long as the launch does not fail. It makes a little difference when the rocket explodes or smacks into the ocean with either a load of uranium elements or a solar panel on board.
"I just exchanged opinions with my boss. I went in with mine and came out with his." - me, 2011 ---
I am endeavoring, Madam, to construct a mnemonic memory circuit using stone knives and bearskins - Mr. Spock 1935 and me 2011A failed launch would have no net effect on the radioactivity of the earth. At worst, it would create a dangerous local concentration (like around the Fukushima plant). On the other hand, every successful launch would actually make the earth less radioactive. Besides, precedents already exist. radioisotope thermoelectric generators have been used in spacecraft for 50 years. And there are many nuclear-powered warships that are built with the possibility in mind of their being blown up or sunk.
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Luna Ring[^] Shimizu Corporation construction firm’s research branch, CSP, unveiled a long-term planning project to install a belt of photovoltaic panels across the surface of the Moon. Power gathered from the 13,000 terrawatts of continuous solar energy the Moon’s surface receives daily would be beamed back to an Earth-based receiving station via microwave or laser transmission, where it would then be used to power public offices, hospitals and schools across the globe. A staff of remotely controlled robots would be in constant rotation to make repairs and provide maintenance for the LUNA RING installation, though the structure would require some human personnel on-site. To make the process more efficient, the proposed plan includes building the LUNA RING’s solar panels on the lunar surface using local materials, rather than launching pre-built panels to the site. Quoted from here.[^] I guess it makes sense, they're ruled by an emperor. I just didn't realize it was The Emperor.
Brad Deja Moo - When you feel like you've heard the same bull before.
My concern would be the programming and precision needed to beam the energy back to a specific spot on Earth. From the viewpoint of Luna, Japan is a moving target. And it's only accessible for a portion of the day. And what about the angle of incidence? At some points (twice a day?) Japan will be on the leading or receeding edge of our globe. A lot of that energy is going to hit the receiving station at a steep angle and bounce off until Luna is more or less directly overhead. To avoid waste you'd want to have receiving stations positioned around the Earth, each one getting a portion of the energy for a portion of the day. Oh, and don't forget to turn the beam off when you reposition for the next receiving station.
I'm not a programmer but I play one at the office
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That's a fairly inaccurate representation. Even at geosynchronous orbit, the footprint of any plausible size microwave transmitter would be measured in square miles, not city blocks. The effects would be more plausible for a laser type transmission system, except that we'll never see one built; precisely because it would be an orbital death ray.
3x12=36 2x12=24 1x12=12 0x12=18
Dan Neely wrote:
except that we'll never see one built; precisely because it would be an orbital death ray.
I recently did a little research on what happens to a technologically advanced country when a near-space EMP is exploded over its center (say Kansas for all of North America.) Since most politicians are either unaware of, or are ignoring this scenario and it is relatively easy to create -- far easier than an orbiting laser -- and countries like North Korea and Iran are very close to having the capability of building one, you're right - we'll never see one built.
In real engineering, you do what works in practice, even if the theory says it fails. In social engineering, you do what theory says works, even if it fails in practice.
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Ummm . . . The amount of specialized fissile material required for a reactor is negligible compared to the amount of specialized materials required to build enough photovoltaic cells to generate the same power. While it might be prohibitive to ship that many photovoltaic cells to the moon, it would be easy to ship enough fuel for a nuclear reactor. And I don't think it would be very difficult to find a suitable location for nuclear waste on the moon.
"it would be easy to ship enough fuel for a nuclear reactor" Just say NO! (I'm reminded of Challenger :(( ). As for a suitable palce for nuclear waste on the moon.. just toss it in barrels and bury them with appropriate separation. Of course.. I'm now reminded of Space 1999 :)
patbob
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Yeah, but that's still a major undertaking - you have to mine the uranium ore, build the refinery, refine it, build the power station, cart off the "used" fuel, bury it somewhere so people aren't walking into it every time they turn around. Ok, so you still have to do some of this with a moon-based solar power receiver, but at least you can start small and build it up as you go. But, the power is free once you have built it, and with no moving parts it should be very reliable - meteorites aside.
Real men don't use instructions. They are only the manufacturers opinion on how to put the thing together. Manfred R. Bihy: "Looks as if OP is learning resistant."
You would not need to find / mine Uranium. There is a supply of Helium-3 on the Moon which is very good for fusion reactors. IIRC, it was suggested that the supply of He3 would be a sufficiently good reason to resume lunar exploration. I am not a nuclear physicist and my memory isn't what it used to be, so the 'fact's above may not be 100% correct; but I am sure one (or more) of you will be able to correct me.
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Luna Ring[^] Shimizu Corporation construction firm’s research branch, CSP, unveiled a long-term planning project to install a belt of photovoltaic panels across the surface of the Moon. Power gathered from the 13,000 terrawatts of continuous solar energy the Moon’s surface receives daily would be beamed back to an Earth-based receiving station via microwave or laser transmission, where it would then be used to power public offices, hospitals and schools across the globe. A staff of remotely controlled robots would be in constant rotation to make repairs and provide maintenance for the LUNA RING installation, though the structure would require some human personnel on-site. To make the process more efficient, the proposed plan includes building the LUNA RING’s solar panels on the lunar surface using local materials, rather than launching pre-built panels to the site. Quoted from here.[^] I guess it makes sense, they're ruled by an emperor. I just didn't realize it was The Emperor.
Brad Deja Moo - When you feel like you've heard the same bull before.
Aside from the crazy possibility of accidentally mis-beaming the microwaves/lasers, or the fact that all global flight paths that would need to be diverted in order to avoid the constant stream of radiation beamed down, how can any one company get the right to build (or mine something) on the moon? :^) I wonder if they went to the Lunar Embassy to register their land claim (Lunar Embassy[^]) or buy their land? (Buying Lunar Land[^])
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"it would be easy to ship enough fuel for a nuclear reactor" Just say NO! (I'm reminded of Challenger :(( ). As for a suitable palce for nuclear waste on the moon.. just toss it in barrels and bury them with appropriate separation. Of course.. I'm now reminded of Space 1999 :)
patbob
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Luna Ring[^] Shimizu Corporation construction firm’s research branch, CSP, unveiled a long-term planning project to install a belt of photovoltaic panels across the surface of the Moon. Power gathered from the 13,000 terrawatts of continuous solar energy the Moon’s surface receives daily would be beamed back to an Earth-based receiving station via microwave or laser transmission, where it would then be used to power public offices, hospitals and schools across the globe. A staff of remotely controlled robots would be in constant rotation to make repairs and provide maintenance for the LUNA RING installation, though the structure would require some human personnel on-site. To make the process more efficient, the proposed plan includes building the LUNA RING’s solar panels on the lunar surface using local materials, rather than launching pre-built panels to the site. Quoted from here.[^] I guess it makes sense, they're ruled by an emperor. I just didn't realize it was The Emperor.
Brad Deja Moo - When you feel like you've heard the same bull before.
These projects would benefit from having a physicist and an economist on the team. They would quickly point out that neither the physics nor the economics will ever work. As people have pointed out the beam spread over that distance is huge: A "pencil beam directly generated by a common helium-neon laser would spread out to a size of perhaps 500 kilometers" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser[^] in diameter. i.e. 196,350 square Km. Not including the diffraction due to atmospheric effects. Thats a lot of ground to cover with collection equipment! Microwave transmission would have an even larger beam spread. It would be more effective to simply locate the solar panels on earth instead. Except for one minor problem: It takes between 20 and 40 years (depending on your assumptions) to recover the energy used to manufacture solar panels. Using 24 hrs per day of peak production as might be possible on the moon could reduce this to approximately 10 years. But now add in the energy cost of transporting solar panels (or the equipment to make them) to the moon and the energy breakeven point is past the service life (approximately 30 years) of the panels. In other words the panels would wear out before they gave back as much energy as it took to manufacture and get them to the moon. Not to mention the high cost of servicing them! There is not enough suitable land in the world for windmills, solar panels or biomass fuels to ever provide the energy the world needs. If you doubt this, remember that the total energy recovered from any of these "renewable" sources can never be higher than the solar energy falling on the area devoted to collection times the efficiency of conversion (for solar panels between 15 and 40%). Do your own calculations. Oil and coal work because Mother Nature has been concentrating solar energy into oil or coal for eons. Hydroelectric works because the entire ocean acts as a collection area. There are only four viable large scale energy sources that are both physically and economically possible; Nuclear, petroleum,coal and hydroelectric. The sooner we realize that the so called green solutions are not physically viable, the sooner we can get on with a real energy program that minimizes the impact on the environment instead of wishing and hoping there was a magic wand.
Melting Away www.deals-house.com www.innovative--concepts
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:)
"I love deadlines. I like the whooshing sound they make as they fly by." (DNA)
