How much knowing math well helps programmer?!
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Recently I had a fun discussion with my colleague(he works on algorithms) on this topic, thought you guys would give some insight.
Depending on the type of work being performed, math may be very important. Working in a manufacturing environment, I use math every day to: determine the volume of a product produced (massive rolls of paper) determine the volume of a product in a cylinder (natural gas or LPG) Since we are a multi-national company, we are also required to convert between US and Metric systems and be able to report in either. Paper can be measured in pounds per ream (a standard size) or grams per square metre. Understanding the math, and hence the equation, is absolutely required. Tim
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I am not sure if you are for or against my comment with that one? However, there are multiple definitions of "Logic" so if you are against me then I meant one of the other ones :laugh:
My opinions are right, and yours are wrong! (or at least that is my opinion)
You said maths is not required, but logic is. Therefore your comment made no sense. Unless of course you meant philosophical logic rather than mathematical logic. In which case you are lacking in logic because you do not fully understand the argument we are having.
Every man can tell how many goats or sheep he possesses, but not how many friends.
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Good eye. He does seem hung up on that word doesn't he?
I may be schizophrenic, but at least I have each other.
Yes, I was physically abused with a copy of Hamlet as a child. My shrink says that is the reason I use it so much... I often have to see a shrink in to keep my grammar in check you see
My opinions are right, and yours are wrong! (or at least that is my opinion)
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Dalek Dave wrote:
unless you are developing for a very arcane discipline that requires obtuse and cryptic sums.
Such as accounting, where very large sums on the Income sheet magically become small ones when moved to the Tax Due sheet.
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Recently I had a fun discussion with my colleague(he works on algorithms) on this topic, thought you guys would give some insight.
Aside from the obvious need to understand logic, you need to have a firm grasp of algebra in many cases... Trigonometry and geometry are useful for graphics or game programming, but not that important for anything else. Calculus, you probably don't need, unless you're doing REALLY advanced stuff, like market trading algorithms or maybe some kinds of scientific research... EDIT: Ok, maybe Trig and Geometry have other uses (Seeing Tim's post above mine)... But if you're only using it that infrequently, you can probably just look up the formulas.
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Author of the Guardians Saga (Sci-Fi/Fantasy novels) -
Recently I had a fun discussion with my colleague(he works on algorithms) on this topic, thought you guys would give some insight.
I think that the most appropiate answer here falls in the category of "depending on the task to be accomplished". :rose:
[www.tamelectromecanica.com] Robots, CNC and PLC machines for grinding and polishing.
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You said maths is not required, but logic is. Therefore your comment made no sense. Unless of course you meant philosophical logic rather than mathematical logic. In which case you are lacking in logic because you do not fully understand the argument we are having.
Every man can tell how many goats or sheep he possesses, but not how many friends.
I didn't say logic was required. I said it helps, and by that I mean being a logical thinker is a plus. like someone that has good problem solving skills etc. If you mean the AND/OR/NOT etc. logic then that is certainly another plus in some areas of programming
My opinions are right, and yours are wrong! (or at least that is my opinion)
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Recently I had a fun discussion with my colleague(he works on algorithms) on this topic, thought you guys would give some insight.
A good solid understanding of maths - it's shortened from mathematics not mathematic - is a must in anything by the most trivial application. [example: How do you determine a hash code and how will you know if it's good?] You need a good knowledge of logic. Is the decision point in your if statement correct? An understanding of how things work under the hood helps when implementing. A true example, we had to sort a list on the fly as it came in, probably 80-100 items through per minute and it needed to refresh the display. Easy yes? The sort algorythym moved about the values rather than the references and it was pants, a quick index in the middle and sorting was reduced to negligible. Only sorting when refreshing the display was another cheap improvement.
Panic, Chaos, Destruction. My work here is done. Drink. Get drunk. Fall over - P O'H OK, I will win to day or my name isn't Ethel Crudacre! - DD Ethel Crudacre I cannot live by bread alone. Bacon and ketchup are needed as well. - Trollslayer Have a bit more patience with newbies. Of course some of them act dumb - they're often *students*, for heaven's sake - Terry Pratchett
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Yes, I was physically abused with a copy of Hamlet as a child. My shrink says that is the reason I use it so much... I often have to see a shrink in to keep my grammar in check you see
My opinions are right, and yours are wrong! (or at least that is my opinion)
Now we know the rest of the story.
I may be schizophrenic, but at least I have each other.
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You said maths is not required, but logic is. Therefore your comment made no sense. Unless of course you meant philosophical logic rather than mathematical logic. In which case you are lacking in logic because you do not fully understand the argument we are having.
Every man can tell how many goats or sheep he possesses, but not how many friends.
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I didn't say logic was required. I said it helps, and by that I mean being a logical thinker is a plus. like someone that has good problem solving skills etc. If you mean the AND/OR/NOT etc. logic then that is certainly another plus in some areas of programming
My opinions are right, and yours are wrong! (or at least that is my opinion)
Logic is vital in all areas of programming, you cannot do it without. What you are calling logic or logical thinking, problem solving, is just more maths. Maths is not just numbers and equations.
Every man can tell how many goats or sheep he possesses, but not how many friends.
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A good solid understanding of maths - it's shortened from mathematics not mathematic - is a must in anything by the most trivial application. [example: How do you determine a hash code and how will you know if it's good?] You need a good knowledge of logic. Is the decision point in your if statement correct? An understanding of how things work under the hood helps when implementing. A true example, we had to sort a list on the fly as it came in, probably 80-100 items through per minute and it needed to refresh the display. Easy yes? The sort algorythym moved about the values rather than the references and it was pants, a quick index in the middle and sorting was reduced to negligible. Only sorting when refreshing the display was another cheap improvement.
Panic, Chaos, Destruction. My work here is done. Drink. Get drunk. Fall over - P O'H OK, I will win to day or my name isn't Ethel Crudacre! - DD Ethel Crudacre I cannot live by bread alone. Bacon and ketchup are needed as well. - Trollslayer Have a bit more patience with newbies. Of course some of them act dumb - they're often *students*, for heaven's sake - Terry Pratchett
Much as I admire your attempt to teach them the correct spelling of MATHS, I feel I must pull you up on this line...
Nagy Vilmos wrote:
An understanding of how things work under the hood helps when implementing.
Bonnet, surely? Just sayin'
------------------------------------ I will never again mention that I was the poster of the One Millionth Lounge Post, nor that it was complete drivel. Dalek Dave CCC Link[^] Trolls[^]
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In any other business (except perhaps law!) doing two minutes work and charging for 15 minutes would be classed as fraud.
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A good solid understanding of maths - it's shortened from mathematics not mathematic - is a must in anything by the most trivial application. [example: How do you determine a hash code and how will you know if it's good?] You need a good knowledge of logic. Is the decision point in your if statement correct? An understanding of how things work under the hood helps when implementing. A true example, we had to sort a list on the fly as it came in, probably 80-100 items through per minute and it needed to refresh the display. Easy yes? The sort algorythym moved about the values rather than the references and it was pants, a quick index in the middle and sorting was reduced to negligible. Only sorting when refreshing the display was another cheap improvement.
Panic, Chaos, Destruction. My work here is done. Drink. Get drunk. Fall over - P O'H OK, I will win to day or my name isn't Ethel Crudacre! - DD Ethel Crudacre I cannot live by bread alone. Bacon and ketchup are needed as well. - Trollslayer Have a bit more patience with newbies. Of course some of them act dumb - they're often *students*, for heaven's sake - Terry Pratchett
Nagy Vilmos wrote:
algorythym
And another one!
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Nagy Vilmos wrote:
algorythym
And another one!
Surrey, may spill chicken is bracken.
Panic, Chaos, Destruction. My work here is done. Drink. Get drunk. Fall over - P O'H OK, I will win to day or my name isn't Ethel Crudacre! - DD Ethel Crudacre I cannot live by bread alone. Bacon and ketchup are needed as well. - Trollslayer Have a bit more patience with newbies. Of course some of them act dumb - they're often *students*, for heaven's sake - Terry Pratchett
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Recently I had a fun discussion with my colleague(he works on algorithms) on this topic, thought you guys would give some insight.
A lot depends on which field of mathematics, and on what you are coding. I was a math major in college. Some classes focused on logic and analysis: analytic geometry, abstract algebra and discrete math. That discipline is very helpful for just about any task. Most mathematics -- calculus, trigonometry, set theory, statistics -- are useful in programming only if you are going to be writing code that performs arithmetic calculations. Even then, you really aren't doing much original work, and a basic maths library will work just fine. Where you need a mathematical background is if you are, say, working for a company that writes basic maths libraries, or are part of a research team and need to take ideas and write them into simulations.
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In any other business (except perhaps law!) doing two minutes work and charging for 15 minutes would be classed as fraud.
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In any other business (except perhaps law!) doing two minutes work and charging for 15 minutes would be classed as fraud.
A lawyer charges 15 minutes for the paperwork recording the fifteen minutes billed for the 2 minutes effort they got the secretary to do for them. :-D
Panic, Chaos, Destruction. My work here is done. Drink. Get drunk. Fall over - P O'H OK, I will win to day or my name isn't Ethel Crudacre! - DD Ethel Crudacre I cannot live by bread alone. Bacon and ketchup are needed as well. - Trollslayer Have a bit more patience with newbies. Of course some of them act dumb - they're often *students*, for heaven's sake - Terry Pratchett
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Much as I admire your attempt to teach them the correct spelling of MATHS, I feel I must pull you up on this line...
Nagy Vilmos wrote:
An understanding of how things work under the hood helps when implementing.
Bonnet, surely? Just sayin'
------------------------------------ I will never again mention that I was the poster of the One Millionth Lounge Post, nor that it was complete drivel. Dalek Dave CCC Link[^] Trolls[^]
Touché M. Pussy-Cat
Panic, Chaos, Destruction. My work here is done. Drink. Get drunk. Fall over - P O'H OK, I will win to day or my name isn't Ethel Crudacre! - DD Ethel Crudacre I cannot live by bread alone. Bacon and ketchup are needed as well. - Trollslayer Have a bit more patience with newbies. Of course some of them act dumb - they're often *students*, for heaven's sake - Terry Pratchett
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Logic is vital in all areas of programming, you cannot do it without. What you are calling logic or logical thinking, problem solving, is just more maths. Maths is not just numbers and equations.
Every man can tell how many goats or sheep he possesses, but not how many friends.
ChrisElston wrote:
Logic is vital in all areas of programming, you cannot do it without.
Are you just arguing with me for the sake of it? This is the second response where you are claiming I have said something that was not in my message. Why don't you read in again (or properly for the first time)... I said, "good logic skills is a big help for programming". This does not say it is required, this does not say you can program with zero logic. This means, better logic skills are of benefit.
ChrisElston wrote:
Logic is vital in all areas of programming, you cannot do it without.
If you learn to apply techniques you don't need to have logic. You get set requirements, you fulfil them with things you have read (other people's logic) and I would say (with my own logic) that there are programmers out that who get by like this just fine. Learn the theory, apply the theory. However, my opinion is a programmer will be better with good logic skills. Now, feel free to discard everything I just said, and comment on completely made up sentences as they form in your head
My opinions are right, and yours are wrong! (or at least that is my opinion)
