For the first time ever
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I have been tasked to re-write an app in VB.Net I have never used VB.Net in my life. I created my first solution this morning and all I have to say is... :omg: :wtf: did I just get myself into.
Just along for the ride. "the meat from that butcher is just the dogs danglies, absolutely amazing cuts of beef." - DaveAuld (2011)
"No, that is just the earthly manifestation of the Great God Retardon." - Nagy Vilmos (2011)I coded in VB.Net for a long time. I'm using C# now (I willingly chose to make the transition, with no impetus of any kind, not even popular opinion). It's not really that bad: just a lot more verbose. I can see the appeal of C# nowadays, with some of the syntax, but honestly, you'll just have to write a few more lines of code. That's all. I honestly did consider writing a plugin at one stage that could 'expand' C# syntax into VB.Net, but I don't think that'd be practical :laugh: Oh hell, I'm a self-taught programmer. What's practical got to do with anything? ;P
Don't forget to rate my post if it helped! ;) "He has no enemies, but is intensely disliked by his friends." "His mother should have thrown him away, and kept the stork." "There's nothing wrong with you that reincarnation won't cure." "He loves nature, in spite of what it did to him."
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Alberto Bar-Noy wrote:
He is getting ready for retirement?
Funny you mention that. He has been with the company for 27 years. :)
Just along for the ride. "the meat from that butcher is just the dogs danglies, absolutely amazing cuts of beef." - DaveAuld (2011)
"No, that is just the earthly manifestation of the Great God Retardon." - Nagy Vilmos (2011)It's very hard to make older people learn something new, that's probably why the senior guy will resist moving to C#. On the other hand, you can throw real arguments against going to VB.Net. To mention a few: 1 - Going from C++ to C# is a much more fluent approach. 2 - If the company has more stuff based on C#, it means it has more C# skilled people and that means there are more resources if they are needed. Reduced dependency on the VB.Net guy. 3 - There are a lot more resources on the web for C# language than for VB.Net. This minimizes the need of reinventing the wheel or having to translate everything. As proof you can just perform a search of C# vs VB.Net articles on codeproject, you'll see that there are a lot more articles on C#. There are a lot more arguments to favor C#, but I don't want to get religious about it.
"To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems" - Homer Simpson
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I have been tasked to re-write an app in VB.Net I have never used VB.Net in my life. I created my first solution this morning and all I have to say is... :omg: :wtf: did I just get myself into.
Just along for the ride. "the meat from that butcher is just the dogs danglies, absolutely amazing cuts of beef." - DaveAuld (2011)
"No, that is just the earthly manifestation of the Great God Retardon." - Nagy Vilmos (2011)Just be grateful you're not using VB6.
When posting here, I do not represent anybody but myself.
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I have been tasked to re-write an app in VB.Net I have never used VB.Net in my life. I created my first solution this morning and all I have to say is... :omg: :wtf: did I just get myself into.
Just along for the ride. "the meat from that butcher is just the dogs danglies, absolutely amazing cuts of beef." - DaveAuld (2011)
"No, that is just the earthly manifestation of the Great God Retardon." - Nagy Vilmos (2011) -
I think that's great - you will learn a new language just like that! My advice is never create a Module, use OOP the way you do in C#, don't use ANY Basic commands that only exist for historical reasons (don't even learn about them). I believe those of us who know both VB.NET and C# have the advantage... ;) Edit: Oh, and use Option Strict ON
It’s not because things are difficult that we do not dare, it’s because we do not dare that things are difficult. ~Seneca
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It's very hard to make older people learn something new, that's probably why the senior guy will resist moving to C#. On the other hand, you can throw real arguments against going to VB.Net. To mention a few: 1 - Going from C++ to C# is a much more fluent approach. 2 - If the company has more stuff based on C#, it means it has more C# skilled people and that means there are more resources if they are needed. Reduced dependency on the VB.Net guy. 3 - There are a lot more resources on the web for C# language than for VB.Net. This minimizes the need of reinventing the wheel or having to translate everything. As proof you can just perform a search of C# vs VB.Net articles on codeproject, you'll see that there are a lot more articles on C#. There are a lot more arguments to favor C#, but I don't want to get religious about it.
"To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems" - Homer Simpson
Re: point 2 The truth is, if you're advertising for his replacement (or any hire), having VB.NET in the job description will attract (in my experience) a less-skilled pool of developers. This is not to say that, on an individual basis, there aren't some highly skilled developers who happen to work in VB. Nor is it to say that all C# developers are better than any VB developers. There's a definite overlap. But, as a class, my experience has shown that C# developers are generally more skilled than VB developers. The point above about doing things in a language which isn't your everyday language just because one guy wants to is germane. What's next, someone decides they're really into Ruby, so an app is written in that just because?
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Re: point 2 The truth is, if you're advertising for his replacement (or any hire), having VB.NET in the job description will attract (in my experience) a less-skilled pool of developers. This is not to say that, on an individual basis, there aren't some highly skilled developers who happen to work in VB. Nor is it to say that all C# developers are better than any VB developers. There's a definite overlap. But, as a class, my experience has shown that C# developers are generally more skilled than VB developers. The point above about doing things in a language which isn't your everyday language just because one guy wants to is germane. What's next, someone decides they're really into Ruby, so an app is written in that just because?
agolddog wrote:
The truth is, if you're advertising for his replacement (or any hire), having VB.NET in the job description will attract (in my experience) a less-skilled pool of developers.
I agree with you there, for the same reasons you already mentioned. But VB.Net deves usually don't take this idea well.
"To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems" - Homer Simpson
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I have been tasked to re-write an app in VB.Net I have never used VB.Net in my life. I created my first solution this morning and all I have to say is... :omg: :wtf: did I just get myself into.
Just along for the ride. "the meat from that butcher is just the dogs danglies, absolutely amazing cuts of beef." - DaveAuld (2011)
"No, that is just the earthly manifestation of the Great God Retardon." - Nagy Vilmos (2011)The first time I used VB.Net I had to rewrite a program that spat out the wrong answer when scoring people against an affluence index after the programmer that wrote it had a nervous breakdown and left (figures). Was not fun.
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I have been tasked to re-write an app in VB.Net I have never used VB.Net in my life. I created my first solution this morning and all I have to say is... :omg: :wtf: did I just get myself into.
Just along for the ride. "the meat from that butcher is just the dogs danglies, absolutely amazing cuts of beef." - DaveAuld (2011)
"No, that is just the earthly manifestation of the Great God Retardon." - Nagy Vilmos (2011) -
It's very hard to make older people learn something new, that's probably why the senior guy will resist moving to C#. On the other hand, you can throw real arguments against going to VB.Net. To mention a few: 1 - Going from C++ to C# is a much more fluent approach. 2 - If the company has more stuff based on C#, it means it has more C# skilled people and that means there are more resources if they are needed. Reduced dependency on the VB.Net guy. 3 - There are a lot more resources on the web for C# language than for VB.Net. This minimizes the need of reinventing the wheel or having to translate everything. As proof you can just perform a search of C# vs VB.Net articles on codeproject, you'll see that there are a lot more articles on C#. There are a lot more arguments to favor C#, but I don't want to get religious about it.
"To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems" - Homer Simpson
Fabio Franco wrote:
It's very hard to make older people learn something new
The problem with you young spring chickens is that you tend to over-generalize about people. :laugh: I'm 54; I've spent the last 3 years moving from VB.NET to C#, I spent the 3 years previous to that moving from VB6 to VB.NET. In the last 12 years I learned ASP, PHP, Javascript, then ASP.NET. Now I'm learning and writing in Java, and learning to write RESTful web services to replace or expand our SOAP web services. In the last 2 years, my DBA knowledge has expanded beyond SQL Server to Oracle 11g. And that's just the major things I've had to learn. And it only covers my professional life; in private I'm learning Hebrew, working with stained glass, how to rappel and a hundred other things. In this profession, you cannot stop learning completely new stuff, or your value diminishes so much you're in danger of being the first to be downsized or, as my British pals might say, be made redundant. I expect to continue learning new stuff until I retire, if not beyond.
If goto is so bad, try writing an Assembly program without JMP.
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etkins wrote:
what was the original language? why?
Did you read the entire thread? ;) A1: C++ A2: Because bossman said so.
Just along for the ride. "the meat from that butcher is just the dogs danglies, absolutely amazing cuts of beef." - DaveAuld (2011)
"No, that is just the earthly manifestation of the Great God Retardon." - Nagy Vilmos (2011) -
Fabio Franco wrote:
It's very hard to make older people learn something new
The problem with you young spring chickens is that you tend to over-generalize about people. :laugh: I'm 54; I've spent the last 3 years moving from VB.NET to C#, I spent the 3 years previous to that moving from VB6 to VB.NET. In the last 12 years I learned ASP, PHP, Javascript, then ASP.NET. Now I'm learning and writing in Java, and learning to write RESTful web services to replace or expand our SOAP web services. In the last 2 years, my DBA knowledge has expanded beyond SQL Server to Oracle 11g. And that's just the major things I've had to learn. And it only covers my professional life; in private I'm learning Hebrew, working with stained glass, how to rappel and a hundred other things. In this profession, you cannot stop learning completely new stuff, or your value diminishes so much you're in danger of being the first to be downsized or, as my British pals might say, be made redundant. I expect to continue learning new stuff until I retire, if not beyond.
If goto is so bad, try writing an Assembly program without JMP.
TNCaver wrote:
The problem with you young spring chickens is that you tend to over-generalize about people
Sorry, I guess I forgot to say: "usually". And as I like to quote something I believe in: "Usually, every generalization is stupid." I'm not saying that older people can't learn anything new and I congratulate you for not stopping in time. But for experience, I've noticed that the majority of people over 40 tend to resist changes and leaving the comfort zone. It's not even limited to that. I myself noticed that now at my 28 years old am less willing to change my perspective that of when I was 20. It happens, our brain gets shaped so we become who we are and that includes on what we prefer to do and learn. Don't take this personally, it requires a very strong will to do what you do, but unfurtunally that's not the rule, but the exception. You probably know that because you probably also see that. On our industry we're forced to not stop in time or, like you already said, we become redundant. It's a good thing you know that. But since our industry is just becoming very popular since the past decade we're still to see the how aging affects us the youngsters in general. I see nowadays the older people getting forced to move, because they are still working on VB5, 6... Yes working on that today! But they are not moving because they want to, but because they have to.
"To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems" - Homer Simpson
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John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
What is everything else in your shop written in (as far as .Net is concerned), and did your boss say WHY he wanted it in VB?
Borland C++, C#, and the guy who wrote the app I am going to help rewrite, only codes now in VB.Net. He is a senior programmer/manager and my boss deferred preference to him.
Just along for the ride. "the meat from that butcher is just the dogs danglies, absolutely amazing cuts of beef." - DaveAuld (2011)
"No, that is just the earthly manifestation of the Great God Retardon." - Nagy Vilmos (2011)Yer noting "he's a senior programmer/manager" and (later) that he's worked for the company for 27 years, both implying he's aged. And you have your CP profile pict set to an aging Clint Eastwood. Uh-huh. Interesting...!
~ [Don't] Visual[ize the] Basic[s], C#[ly instead] ~ ASPX: Apple Simply Performs eXcellently
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Yer noting "he's a senior programmer/manager" and (later) that he's worked for the company for 27 years, both implying he's aged. And you have your CP profile pict set to an aging Clint Eastwood. Uh-huh. Interesting...!
~ [Don't] Visual[ize the] Basic[s], C#[ly instead] ~ ASPX: Apple Simply Performs eXcellently
Nice try. I'm not even 40 yet.
Just along for the ride. "the meat from that butcher is just the dogs danglies, absolutely amazing cuts of beef." - DaveAuld (2011)
"No, that is just the earthly manifestation of the Great God Retardon." - Nagy Vilmos (2011) -
I have been tasked to re-write an app in VB.Net I have never used VB.Net in my life. I created my first solution this morning and all I have to say is... :omg: :wtf: did I just get myself into.
Just along for the ride. "the meat from that butcher is just the dogs danglies, absolutely amazing cuts of beef." - DaveAuld (2011)
"No, that is just the earthly manifestation of the Great God Retardon." - Nagy Vilmos (2011) -
I haven't done anything major; but have used http://www.tangiblesoftwaresolutions.com/[^] for c# to vb conversions in the past. It converts projects not just code snippets.
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I have been tasked to re-write an app in VB.Net I have never used VB.Net in my life. I created my first solution this morning and all I have to say is... :omg: :wtf: did I just get myself into.
Just along for the ride. "the meat from that butcher is just the dogs danglies, absolutely amazing cuts of beef." - DaveAuld (2011)
"No, that is just the earthly manifestation of the Great God Retardon." - Nagy Vilmos (2011)And the problem with this is? There is no good reason to choose C# over VB or VB over C#. It all comes down to whether you prefer IF .... THEN ... ELSE ... END IF or IF .... { ...; } else { ...; } I have yet to find anything that you can do in one language that you can't do in the other. I prefer VB simply because of my background (PL/I), but this is nothing more than my personal aesthetic preference. To argue that one is better than the other is merely religious bigotry.
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And the problem with this is? There is no good reason to choose C# over VB or VB over C#. It all comes down to whether you prefer IF .... THEN ... ELSE ... END IF or IF .... { ...; } else { ...; } I have yet to find anything that you can do in one language that you can't do in the other. I prefer VB simply because of my background (PL/I), but this is nothing more than my personal aesthetic preference. To argue that one is better than the other is merely religious bigotry.
RobertBarnes wrote:
To argue that one is better than the other is merely religious bigotry.
I guess I'm a bigot then.
Just along for the ride. "the meat from that butcher is just the dogs danglies, absolutely amazing cuts of beef." - DaveAuld (2011)
"No, that is just the earthly manifestation of the Great God Retardon." - Nagy Vilmos (2011) -
It's very hard to make older people learn something new, that's probably why the senior guy will resist moving to C#. On the other hand, you can throw real arguments against going to VB.Net. To mention a few: 1 - Going from C++ to C# is a much more fluent approach. 2 - If the company has more stuff based on C#, it means it has more C# skilled people and that means there are more resources if they are needed. Reduced dependency on the VB.Net guy. 3 - There are a lot more resources on the web for C# language than for VB.Net. This minimizes the need of reinventing the wheel or having to translate everything. As proof you can just perform a search of C# vs VB.Net articles on codeproject, you'll see that there are a lot more articles on C#. There are a lot more arguments to favor C#, but I don't want to get religious about it.
"To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems" - Homer Simpson
Fabio Franco wrote:
It's very hard to make older people learn something new
... what nonsense. The older we get, the more adaptable we become, as in reality there's really very little that's really "new". We've probably seen it before (and maybe written the compiler for it!) when it was new the first time around. However, the older we get, the less concerned we are about adding new buzzwords to our CV, as there's increasingly little likelihood we'll ever be touting our CVs around again. Thus we may not be quite so keen to jump on the latest bandwagon, and use a slightly more reasoned approach for adopting any new technology / language / toolset etc. It may very well be that this reasoned approach includes considerations such as "I've used it for years and am extremely capable with it"; "it's been around long enough for most bugs to be ironed out"; "it's been around long enough for a sizeable community of support to build up" etc.. etc.. but I would count these as perfectly valid and sensible approaches to throw out one approach in favour of a newer one. What I would point out though, is that as the O.P. has just rewritten the Borland stuff to VB.Net, he now obviously "knows" VB.Net and has just therefore removed one stumbling block to converting to it. There are now TWO vb.net developers in the department, instead of just one.... :laugh: Derek TP
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Fabio Franco wrote:
It's very hard to make older people learn something new
... what nonsense. The older we get, the more adaptable we become, as in reality there's really very little that's really "new". We've probably seen it before (and maybe written the compiler for it!) when it was new the first time around. However, the older we get, the less concerned we are about adding new buzzwords to our CV, as there's increasingly little likelihood we'll ever be touting our CVs around again. Thus we may not be quite so keen to jump on the latest bandwagon, and use a slightly more reasoned approach for adopting any new technology / language / toolset etc. It may very well be that this reasoned approach includes considerations such as "I've used it for years and am extremely capable with it"; "it's been around long enough for most bugs to be ironed out"; "it's been around long enough for a sizeable community of support to build up" etc.. etc.. but I would count these as perfectly valid and sensible approaches to throw out one approach in favour of a newer one. What I would point out though, is that as the O.P. has just rewritten the Borland stuff to VB.Net, he now obviously "knows" VB.Net and has just therefore removed one stumbling block to converting to it. There are now TWO vb.net developers in the department, instead of just one.... :laugh: Derek TP
My OP, was a bit too short to make a point, see the post above yours with a more argued reply. In any case, I don't really think older people become more adaptable, they simply know more and can handle more situations. I don't really think the new is the strongest characteristic of elder people. That's a fact any neurologist will confirm. A child is much more likely to learn how to use a computer than an elder. Given these are completely new to both.
"To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems" - Homer Simpson