I hate MFC!!!
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>Why there is no good RAD tool for C++? For C++ or MFC? ?confused? I like MFC for Windows apps. Its a lightweight wrapper around a messy API. MFC for COM and COM's apostles is something I avoid like the plague, that's what ATL is for. I have serious trouble digesting the fact that you got 'STLs' logic in one day. Writing custom containers and iterators can be tough work, but having it all plug together is nice.
I like MFC for Windows apps. Its a lightweight wrapper around a messy API. MFC for COM and COM's apostles is something I avoid like the plague, that's what ATL is for. One thing that MFC is not, is lightweight. It is ok, if you do not want bulky, over-weight slow programs. Pankaj Without struggle, there is no progress
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It took me one day to develop the "logic" with STL, and now I'm working on damn UI for almost a week. Why there is no good RAD tool for C++? No wonder there are so many VB users. Die, MFC, die!!! :mad: :mad: :mad: :beer:
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Nemanja Trifunovic wrote: It took me one day to develop the "logic" with STL Sorry..wrong forum...Only these posts allowed : Dubya, Iraq, Oil.... Just Kidding..;P Kant Sonork-100.28114 Don't :beer: and Drive.
How about a post with GWB using STL to write software to work out how much oil there is in Iraq ;P Elaine The tigress is here :-D
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Nemanja Trifunovic wrote: It took me one day to develop the "logic" with STL Sorry..wrong forum...Only these posts allowed : Dubya, Iraq, Oil.... Just Kidding..;P Kant Sonork-100.28114 Don't :beer: and Drive.
No, you seem to be the only one obsessed with George Bush.:confused:
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It took me one day to develop the "logic" with STL, and now I'm working on damn UI for almost a week. Why there is no good RAD tool for C++? No wonder there are so many VB users. Die, MFC, die!!! :mad: :mad: :mad: :beer:
Try WTL or another framework then...;) Anna :rose: www.annasplace.me.uk
"Be yourself - not what others think you should be"
- Marcia GraeschTrouble with resource IDs? Try the Resource ID Organiser Add-In for Visual C++
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I like MFC for Windows apps. Its a lightweight wrapper around a messy API. MFC for COM and COM's apostles is something I avoid like the plague, that's what ATL is for. One thing that MFC is not, is lightweight. It is ok, if you do not want bulky, over-weight slow programs. Pankaj Without struggle, there is no progress
Ney, Ney... MFC with COM, OLE DB, and OLE is a fat ugly cow. MFC as a simple way to write windows apps is lightweight.
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Navin wrote: Let's see, you hate MFC, and you hate Linux... what *do* you like? From my CP profile: Enjoyes: C++ coding, reading, movies, sleeping, but most of all the company of his wife and baby daughter. Dislikes: GUI programming, writing documentation, garbage collectors, Open Source zealots. ;) :beer:
Nemanja Trifunovic wrote: Dislikes: GUI programming, writing documentation, garbage collectors, Open Source zealots. Problem solved! Find someone else to do the GUI. ;) Anna :rose: www.annasplace.me.uk
"Be yourself - not what others think you should be"
- Marcia GraeschTrouble with resource IDs? Try the Resource ID Organiser Add-In for Visual C++
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Try WTL or another framework then...;) Anna :rose: www.annasplace.me.uk
"Be yourself - not what others think you should be"
- Marcia GraeschTrouble with resource IDs? Try the Resource ID Organiser Add-In for Visual C++
Anna-Jayne Metcalfe wrote: Try WTL or another framework then I doubt WTL is easier at all. Besides, It's not me who decides :(( :beer:
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Shog9 wrote: lots&lots&lots&lots&lots&lots&lots&lots&lots of people use it Funny, I've used the same argument to defend VB, but it just doesn't work too well... :)
All you need in this life is ignorance and confidence, and then success is sure. -- Mark Twain
:laugh: Jeremy Falcon Imputek
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Yeah, MFC sucks. It'll kick you right in the nuts if you take your eyes off it for a second. It'll stab you in the back if you turn away. But it must have some advantage, 'cause lots&lots&lots&lots&lots&lots&lots&lots&lots of people use it, so who are you to argue? :rolleyes:
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Shog9 I see the way the salesmen stare into the sun I stood and watched them as they fell off one by one...
Shog9 wrote: But it must have some advantage, 'cause lots&lots&lots&lots&lots&lots&lots&lots&lots of people use it, so who are you to argue? How many other Microsoft mainstream toolkits are there? :) (No, WTL doesn't count as mainstream - it's not even supported by Microsoft!) One could use for instance Borland C++ Builder as an alternative, but I think Microsofts development tools and MSDN is overall better than Borland. I think that's the only reason MFC is so big - there is nothing to compete with it! I think they should scrap MFC and make a toolkit similar to WTL instead. But that would be a waste of lot of work and effort put into MFC, so I guess we'll have to stick with it for quite a while! -- Eventhough the forrest is full of trees, there's still no tree between the trees.
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Pheeewwww ....I was feeling like a tard... about to shirk off in my corner.
Actually, STL isn't that hard to learn at all! Generic Programming and the STL: Using and Extending the C++ Standard Template Library [^] gave me enough Ohs, Ahs and Ahas to get me going. You just need to understand some basic concepts which are, contrary to manys belief, very simple. 1 day is perhaps a bit short, but a week is enough to learn how to extend the STL. A couple of months perhaps to master it. -- Eventhough the forrest is full of trees, there's still no tree between the trees.
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Anna-Jayne Metcalfe wrote: Try WTL or another framework then I doubt WTL is easier at all. Besides, It's not me who decides :(( :beer:
I find it easier actually. But maybe that's just me. :) Nemanja Trifunovic wrote: Besides, It's not me who decides Hey, know what? I get to be part of these decisions. :rolleyes::-D -- Eventhough the forrest is full of trees, there's still no tree between the trees.
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Navin wrote: Let's see, you hate MFC, and you hate Linux... what *do* you like? From my CP profile: Enjoyes: C++ coding, reading, movies, sleeping, but most of all the company of his wife and baby daughter. Dislikes: GUI programming, writing documentation, garbage collectors, Open Source zealots. ;) :beer:
Nemanja Trifunovic wrote: C++ coding movies sleeping GUI programming writing documentation garbage collectors Open Source zealots Amen! May I assume that you also dislike Java? Can I be your friend? :-D -- Eventhough the forrest is full of trees, there's still no tree between the trees.
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I still want some of that smoke though. ;P -- Eventhough the forrest is full of trees, there's still no tree between the trees.
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It took me one day to develop the "logic" with STL, and now I'm working on damn UI for almost a week. Why there is no good RAD tool for C++? No wonder there are so many VB users. Die, MFC, die!!! :mad: :mad: :mad: :beer:
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Stuart van Weele wrote: What exactly is the problem? The problem is that if I want to paint an edit control background at compile time, I should right-click on that control and pick the color from a palette - not to mess with WM_CTLCOLOREDIT. Simple things should be done simply. Stuart van Weele wrote: Granted, the tools are not real CASE tools and the GUIs they create a not flashy, but they get the job done. In a week. Real tools should get the same job done in a day. :beer:
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Your problem is not MFC. You hate GUI programming too I Love GUI programming. I like++ MFC
Angels banished from heaven have no choice but to become demons Cowboy Bebop
KaЯl wrote: Your problem is not MFC. You hate GUI programming too I don't like GUI programming, and that's exactly why I need something to help me finish it quickly. Therefore, MFC is a part of the problem. :beer:
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.NET isn't much better, in my opinion. That's why I use my own framework built on top of MFC so I only went through the pain once. Now I'm porting the whole thing over to .NET, because it's so lame also! (see my CP articles on the Application Automation Layer). Marc Help! I'm an AI running around in someone's f*cked up universe simulator.
Sensitivity and ethnic diversity means celebrating difference, not hiding from it. - Christian Graus
Every line of code is a liability - Taka Muraoka -
Actually, STL isn't that hard to learn at all! Generic Programming and the STL: Using and Extending the C++ Standard Template Library [^] gave me enough Ohs, Ahs and Ahas to get me going. You just need to understand some basic concepts which are, contrary to manys belief, very simple. 1 day is perhaps a bit short, but a week is enough to learn how to extend the STL. A couple of months perhaps to master it. -- Eventhough the forrest is full of trees, there's still no tree between the trees.
>A couple of months perhaps to master it. Mastery of the STL to me implies the ability to use all parts of it with ease and the innnate understanding of why certain choices were made in its design. The same goes for C, C++, MFC, etc.... It took me about a year to get the hang of all the container classes, and probably another year or so before I added a custom container type. I rarely use the multiset and multimap container, and I've never used the heap container. find, find_if and for_each are algorithm staples, but I've never used any of the set_ functions, nor have opportunities for search_n, mismatch, and the others I cannot remember. I can't imagine someone obtaining the experience to use these items efficently in just a few months. Heck, I can't even imagine the average programmer needing them all in a few months. There's more to mastery than pressing F1.
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Stuart van Weele wrote: What exactly is the problem? The problem is that if I want to paint an edit control background at compile time, I should right-click on that control and pick the color from a palette - not to mess with WM_CTLCOLOREDIT. Simple things should be done simply. Stuart van Weele wrote: Granted, the tools are not real CASE tools and the GUIs they create a not flashy, but they get the job done. In a week. Real tools should get the same job done in a day. :beer:
Nemanja Trifunovic wrote: The problem is that if I want to paint an edit control background at compile time, I should right-click on that control and pick the color from a palette - not to mess with WM_CTLCOLOREDIT. Simple things should be done simply. And you have this universal list of "simple things"? The reality of software is for a class library to anticipate every design decision a developer wants to make it would have to be incredibly huge and likely incredibly complicated. A bigger reality is that there is no need to "paint an edit control background" unless you really like creating non-standard interfaces that your users will hate. Nemanja Trifunovic wrote: Real tools should get the same job done in a day. Based on what? I've never seen such a tool that creates anything but crap. The computer highway is littered with the carcases of companies claiming to have invented the perfect rapid application development tool. In the end software engineering requires human thought and nothing will ever get around that. (The irony is that many developers here on Code Project, including myself, probably could have developed your UI in a day using nothing but MFC. Yet, I couldn't do the same with OWL, even though I've used it before. I'm simply not an expert in it.)