Does anyone else thinks NUI is not the perfect next step for UIs ?
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_Maxxx_ wrote:
84% of statistics on the internet are made up.
I'm 93% sure you're full of shit.
Michael Martin Australia "I controlled my laughter and simple said "No,I am very busy,so I can't write any code for you". The moment they heard this all the smiling face turned into a sad looking face and one of them farted. So I had to leave the place as soon as possible." - Mr.Prakash One Fine Saturday. 24/04/2004
I'm 100% certain
MVVM# - See how I did MVVM my way ___________________________________________ Man, you're a god. - walterhevedeich 26/05/2011 .\\axxx (That's an 'M')
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And the OP is 93% full of sh!t.
I was brought up to respect my elders. I don't respect many people nowadays.
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easierPete O'Hanlon wrote:
And the OP is 93% full of sh!t.
What is the other 7% made up of?
Michael Martin Australia "I controlled my laughter and simple said "No,I am very busy,so I can't write any code for you". The moment they heard this all the smiling face turned into a sad looking face and one of them farted. So I had to leave the place as soon as possible." - Mr.Prakash One Fine Saturday. 24/04/2004
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Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
And the OP is 93% full of sh!t.
What is the other 7% made up of?
Michael Martin Australia "I controlled my laughter and simple said "No,I am very busy,so I can't write any code for you". The moment they heard this all the smiling face turned into a sad looking face and one of them farted. So I had to leave the place as soon as possible." - Mr.Prakash One Fine Saturday. 24/04/2004
Ill informed opinion.
I was brought up to respect my elders. I don't respect many people nowadays.
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier -
Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
And the OP is 93% full of sh!t.
What is the other 7% made up of?
Michael Martin Australia "I controlled my laughter and simple said "No,I am very busy,so I can't write any code for you". The moment they heard this all the smiling face turned into a sad looking face and one of them farted. So I had to leave the place as soon as possible." - Mr.Prakash One Fine Saturday. 24/04/2004
I can't speak for anyone else, but I estimate the 7% of me that is not full of shit, is vocabulary. yours, Bill
“Beginning, middle, and end of birth, growth, and perfection we behold is from contraries, by contraries, and to contraries; and whatever contrariety is, there is action, reaction, there is motion, diversity, multitude, order.”
Giordano Bruno, cosmologist, philosopher, burned at the stake for heresy on February 17, 1600. When condemned, he said to his Inquisitors: “Perhaps you pronounce this verdict against me with greater fear than I receive it.”
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I have rarely read such drivel, even in the Lounge!
Monster Maker wrote:
I don't think a high school child will customize is his computer before using paint.
Then you haven't been to a high school recently. One of the major issues in schools is supporting student PCs, as they will customise tehm to the point of being all but unusable given half a chance - so the computers have to be locked down to stop them customising
Monster Maker wrote:
He would prefer social network(where he has stuffs which he understands much better).
which he accesses via a computer UI !!
MVVM# - See how I did MVVM my way ___________________________________________ Man, you're a god. - walterhevedeich 26/05/2011 .\\axxx (That's an 'M')
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Then you haven't been to a high school recently. One of the major issues in schools is supporting student PCs, as they will customise tehm to the point of being all but unusable given half a chance - so the computers have to be locked down to stop them customising
That was just an example of person who knows nothing about pc. What he would like and prefer.
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which he accesses via a computer UI !!
It is like you are downloading other internet browsers from your internet explorer!
World is short of ideas!
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Monster Maker wrote:
i.e finding patterns what all i do on my pc(like google makes patterns what i search),
So My next application should collect information like if user uses keyboard collect everything the user type's. So that I can sell this information to the highest bidder? I am the new Google overlord. :laugh: MMMMUUUUUAAAAHHHHHAAAAA!
Frazzle the name say's it all
Always code as if the guy who ends up maintaining your code will be a violent psychopath who knows where you live.
John F. Woods
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So My next application should collect information like if user uses keyboard collect everything the user type's. So that I can sell this information to the highest bidder?
I already thought about it buddy, and made such application. It violates the privacy policy IT-Act 2000 A under my country's law section. And most importantly why the people will use your application ,giving all information about them knowing that you are selling it to the advertizers.
World is short of ideas!
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Not illogical but it has been tried and it led to difficulties, because if your ui is different to mine, and indeed different to everyone's, then support and training become an issue (as does learning the system for the user) Unless there is a global standard on how to store the set up, it makes moving between computers a problem too.
MVVM# - See how I did MVVM my way ___________________________________________ Man, you're a god. - walterhevedeich 26/05/2011 .\\axxx (That's an 'M')
Ok Maxx, we can't fight that why the companies are not trying something, what i personally think. Its totally their call. Lastly, just answer 1 question. what will you prefer, -an OS which makes you learn something, by associating it with what you have already learnt in life - or the MAC OS which expects that you should learn about it first and then make him do something rest i am a biggest fool on earth, thanks for commenting on my viewpoint. stay excellent!
World is short of ideas!
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84% of statistics on the internet are made up.
MVVM# - See how I did MVVM my way ___________________________________________ Man, you're a god. - walterhevedeich 26/05/2011 .\\axxx (That's an 'M')
i know,i am talking about the 16%..
World is short of ideas!
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Ok Maxx, we can't fight that why the companies are not trying something, what i personally think. Its totally their call. Lastly, just answer 1 question. what will you prefer, -an OS which makes you learn something, by associating it with what you have already learnt in life - or the MAC OS which expects that you should learn about it first and then make him do something rest i am a biggest fool on earth, thanks for commenting on my viewpoint. stay excellent!
World is short of ideas!
Current ui paradigms in OS use things we 'have already learned in life' - such as pressing buttons, stacking things on top of one another, reading lists, associating pictures wi actions etc. etc. etc. So, would I prefer An os GUI that uses my personal habits to tailor its icons, menus, etc, to make it 'easier' for me to use? Not particularly. With consistency comes familiarity, and so ease of use. It might seem like a good idea but people don't generally have a problem learning the basics of an OS ui, because there is cross platform consistency, so moving from Mac to windows to Linux is generally quite easy because of the similarities in the presentation. Use a learning ui paradigm and the user would struggle more in moving from OS to OS Neil the new one had learned from them. And the majority of computer users are using the computer as a tool to perform some function, and are not software devs or geeks who want something more.
MVVM# - See how I did MVVM my way ___________________________________________ Man, you're a god. - walterhevedeich 26/05/2011 .\\axxx (That's an 'M')
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Well if this supposed "NUI" is the same heap of crap that's called Metro then no, it's a backwards step.
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Sure, when you can perform open heart surgery, then it's fair for you to expect that busy doctor to have knowledge about coding. Your youth and inexperience is showing.
I was brought up to respect my elders. I don't respect many people nowadays.
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easierPete O'Hanlon wrote:
Sure, when you can perform open heart surgery, then it's fair for you to expect that busy doctor to have knowledge about coding
Certainly not the best analogy since most doctors do not know that either. And there isn't any opportunity to learn it on your nor pick it up on your own.
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Nope, I think about a third of humanity is mentally rigged to cough up new ideas, which the other two thirds do their best to shoot them down ...
I think you are talking about innovation. World is short of ideas and that's the only reason people steal it. But innovations are overflowing as 1 idea can be associated with a million innovations. Secondly, i never want that actually(that would be done in 100 years or so matching all probabilities), what i want to convey is that people like to understand and do thing their own way. So the UI should be made their way(or make a step towards that goal), then only the time understanding windows would be utilized in implementing the ideas innovations.
I miss bitten apple! :'(
Monster Maker wrote:
World is short of ideas and that's the only reason people steal it.
Nope. Plenty of ideas. All of them based on existing idioms and many duplicated (unintentionally). But successfully taking an idea to produce something that other people will use is a far, far different thing.
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Sir, you can drive cars only in one boring way, everyday. With little or small manipulations. But when it comes on coding, sky is the limit. You can program to the same output, with different logic everyday. And logic is about your idea of doing things. So why not collect that idea from every field.
World is short of ideas
Monster Maker wrote:
But when it comes on coding, sky is the limit.
You can program to the same output, with different logic everyday.
And logic is about your idea of doing things.
So why not collect that idea from every field.If you are suggesting that there is some way to create a UI that allows people to program new concepts - it is very unlikely to happen. People have been attempting to do that for at least 30 years. And there has been almost no success. If it was possible then the process would already exist and people would be improving on it. Instead every attempt it heralded as the next best thing but in even limited usage all start to exhibit severe limits.
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Ok Maxx, we can't fight that why the companies are not trying something, what i personally think. Its totally their call. Lastly, just answer 1 question. what will you prefer, -an OS which makes you learn something, by associating it with what you have already learnt in life - or the MAC OS which expects that you should learn about it first and then make him do something rest i am a biggest fool on earth, thanks for commenting on my viewpoint. stay excellent!
World is short of ideas!
Monster Maker wrote:
we can't fight that why the companies are not trying something, what i personally think. Its totally their call.
The point is that people HAVE tried this. It doesn't work well. Not even close. And that is why companies don't pursue it.
Monster Maker wrote:
-an OS which makes you learn something, by associating it with what you have already learnt in life
That statement completely ignores something - complexity. It seems to suggest that the totality of human experience can be codified. Even if possible (which I doubt due to economics) current technology far, far from being able to do it.
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80% people down-vote the thing which they don't understand. and i can't help it..!! Besties..
World is short of ideas!
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Rich are getting richer and poor getting poorer. I am speaking with reference to technology. I was thrown out of my OS lab when i argued that NUI is just not a great idea. We are making it easier and easier for common people than raising their standards or telling them more about computer technology. I think they would prefer learning how to code(so that they can solve their problems by themselves and not waiting for a s/w or an app that will solve it for them) than having installed computer on their face(google glasses)
World is short of ideas!
Monster Maker wrote:
I think they would prefer learning how to code(so that they can solve their problems by themselves and not waiting for a s/w or an app that will solve it for them) than having installed computer on their face(google glasses)
I'm curious what planet you live on, is the sky blue like ours? ;P Back in '78, it was one of the West Coast Computer Faires held in San Jose, CA where I attended a session that a panel of self professed "experts" declared that the COBOL program was soon to be extinct since going forward, all school children would be learning how to program. This old gentleman, (well, old to me, as was a wee sprout) stood up and said they were wrong. He said look around, everyone in this room knows how to read and write. How many are going to write novels? I wish I had a video of that moment. I thought he had nailed it, while the panel avoided looking at him and no doubt hoped security would remove the old fool. To paraphrase a line from Dr. Strangelove, "Programming is too important to be left to users. They have neither the time, the training, nor the inclination for strategic thought."
Psychosis at 10 Film at 11 Those who do not remember the past, are doomed to repeat it. Those who do not remember the past, cannot build upon it.
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Monster Maker wrote:
I think they would prefer learning how to code(so that they can solve their problems by themselves and not waiting for a s/w or an app that will solve it for them) than having installed computer on their face(google glasses)
I'm curious what planet you live on, is the sky blue like ours? ;P Back in '78, it was one of the West Coast Computer Faires held in San Jose, CA where I attended a session that a panel of self professed "experts" declared that the COBOL program was soon to be extinct since going forward, all school children would be learning how to program. This old gentleman, (well, old to me, as was a wee sprout) stood up and said they were wrong. He said look around, everyone in this room knows how to read and write. How many are going to write novels? I wish I had a video of that moment. I thought he had nailed it, while the panel avoided looking at him and no doubt hoped security would remove the old fool. To paraphrase a line from Dr. Strangelove, "Programming is too important to be left to users. They have neither the time, the training, nor the inclination for strategic thought."
Psychosis at 10 Film at 11 Those who do not remember the past, are doomed to repeat it. Those who do not remember the past, cannot build upon it.
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I'm curious what planet you live on, is the sky blue like ours?
Are you a computer faculty somewhere? :-D You resemble mine..
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Back in '78
If you are comparing 2013 with 1978, then let me tell you only the sky is blue since then. I am sure respected Dr. Strangelove had no facebook account,nor iphone and was unknown what wonders would be done by visual studio before making that comment. Things have changed from then sir. Learning cobol is far different from learning javascript(you must be knowing) and working on windows-8 is different from mainframe. 8 year infants today know how to configure iphone, where they would find cheats of their games,google can answer them anything. and 1000's of other services they would use in future. Don't you think they deserve to know some more knowledge(not only coding) about OS, so that they can implement their own idea in between something that has become so important part of their lives. As a student we don't like to just sit and see things happening. We got to know some working behind the scenes so that we can manipulate or customize it in our way for our personal use. And don't go back in 78 , think about next 78(2078)
World is short of ideas!
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Monster Maker wrote:
I think they would prefer learning how to code(so that they can solve their problems by themselves and not waiting for a s/w or an app that will solve it for them) than having installed computer on their face(google glasses)
I'm curious what planet you live on, is the sky blue like ours? ;P Back in '78, it was one of the West Coast Computer Faires held in San Jose, CA where I attended a session that a panel of self professed "experts" declared that the COBOL program was soon to be extinct since going forward, all school children would be learning how to program. This old gentleman, (well, old to me, as was a wee sprout) stood up and said they were wrong. He said look around, everyone in this room knows how to read and write. How many are going to write novels? I wish I had a video of that moment. I thought he had nailed it, while the panel avoided looking at him and no doubt hoped security would remove the old fool. To paraphrase a line from Dr. Strangelove, "Programming is too important to be left to users. They have neither the time, the training, nor the inclination for strategic thought."
Psychosis at 10 Film at 11 Those who do not remember the past, are doomed to repeat it. Those who do not remember the past, cannot build upon it.
A very powerful message. The trouble is that some computer skills are so basic, they are akin to reading and writing, not akin to becoming a novelist. Learning to communicate with a computer is very akin to learning to communicate by, say, writing a letter. Although people lived their lives without being able to read and write, I think you'd agree that because reading and writing were made part of a basic education, quality of life has had an enormous potential to improve. Making informed decisions is usually preferable to leaving things to chance. The skill of reading brought the knowledge of books to the masses. The skill of communicating with a computer has the potential to allow the masses to discover information, evaluate data, perform their duties with more efficiency than ever before. Also, I find it interesting that a discussion of user interfaces have led to a discussion of whether or not people should know how to code. It would seem that non-computer users cannot differentiate the two. Scary. I wonder too, whether people would question their heart surgeon if he/she tried to use a butter knife. Maybe not. I've learned not to implicitly trust user interfaces. Probably because they don't pay malpractice insurance.
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You do know that you haven't properly understood what NUI's actually are
Let me tell you, you haven't understood my question. I have no debate against NUI, i have a debate against UI bieng generic and same to everybody. Next time read that message twice before calling it a spam. Because the thing which u don't understand is not always a spam.
World is short of ideas!
Monster Maker wrote:
i have a debate against UI bieng generic and same to everybody.
I am really glad someone has finally brought this up! When the term natural user interface was coined I was downright perplexed by the fact that it wasn't wholley user-defined (because 'natural' is such a subjective term). This summer, I will begin developing an app that will *try* to realize that goal, but I am inexperienced, so don't get your hopes up too far. Also, LEAP motion won't let me into their developer sdk because I'm so inexperienced. Hopefully, when they start to sell devices in May, they will open up the developer community a bit more.
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I'm curious what planet you live on, is the sky blue like ours?
Are you a computer faculty somewhere? :-D You resemble mine..
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Back in '78
If you are comparing 2013 with 1978, then let me tell you only the sky is blue since then. I am sure respected Dr. Strangelove had no facebook account,nor iphone and was unknown what wonders would be done by visual studio before making that comment. Things have changed from then sir. Learning cobol is far different from learning javascript(you must be knowing) and working on windows-8 is different from mainframe. 8 year infants today know how to configure iphone, where they would find cheats of their games,google can answer them anything. and 1000's of other services they would use in future. Don't you think they deserve to know some more knowledge(not only coding) about OS, so that they can implement their own idea in between something that has become so important part of their lives. As a student we don't like to just sit and see things happening. We got to know some working behind the scenes so that we can manipulate or customize it in our way for our personal use. And don't go back in 78 , think about next 78(2078)
World is short of ideas!
Monster Maker wrote:
Are you a computer faculty somewhere? :-D You resemble mine..
Aw, the inexperience, naivety, and idealism of youth...it is really a good thing to have, but you will start to see patterns as you get older. Patterns like, everyone will soon be a programmer, programming is a dying profession, computers will be programming themselves soon, and my favorite, everything worthwhile has already been programmed.
Monster Maker wrote:
I am sure respected Dr. Strangelove had no facebook account,nor iphone and was unknown what wonders would be done by visual studio before making that comment.
Dr. Strangelove did not make that comment I paraphrased, General Jack D. Ripper did. But you'd know that if you had ever seen the movie.
Monster Maker wrote:
Things have changed from then sir. Learning cobol is far different from learning javascript(you must be knowing) and working on windows-8 is different from mainframe.
Not really. It is still stringing commands for a non thinking entity to follow without question. The syntax is different, but in 20 years or so, someone will tell you the same about JavaScript and whatever is the fad language of the time. Oh, please tell me you're not one of those idiots who pop up every once in a while and say that if it were in your power, you'd eliminate Assembly programming. :-D
Monster Maker wrote:
8 year infants today know how to configure iphone,
Configuring is not programming. My grandchildren have been using computers since they were 2 1/2 (although they don't get the hang of mouse clicking until they were 3 1/2), but none of them had the inclination to become programmers. I still hold out hope for the great grandchildren, but they are not old enough to use computers yet. My children ignored my daily use of computers until they finally saw the light of employment, but they are not programmers, just users. Using a spreadsheet is not programming, even though it does require some rigor in thought. VisiCalc was one of the programs that were cited to me as justification that programmers will soon be obsolete. That, and CASE programming. You don't hear anything about CASE anymore, that was where you were to tell the computer in general terms what you wanted done and then it would write the program for you. Didn't really work out except