Please fire the person in Microsoft that thought the charms thing is ok
-
You have to know the name to type first. Start menu doesn't require this ESP attribute for users.
I may not last forever but the mess I leave behind certainly will.
-
I agree to you word by word. What the hell has happened to UI design. Especially VS.
It's not only VS... MS Office has also begun shouting at me...
-
Try finding a budget holder who'll put a touch screen on a server. Most of them are too cheap. Although I can accept that using a computer with a touch screen over remote desktop might work. Who here has a touch screen on the computer they use to remote admin their server? I keep wishing you could use Kinect for PC the same as a touch screen and with the same gestures. Could be fun. I could sit in front of a 40" screen and wave my arms about. :laugh:
-
One assumes Windows-C does not work?
MVVM # - I did it My Way ___________________________________________ Man, you're a god. - walterhevedeich 26/05/2011 .\\axxx (That's an 'M')
Yep it does.
-
Try finding a budget holder who'll put a touch screen on a server. Most of them are too cheap. Although I can accept that using a computer with a touch screen over remote desktop might work. Who here has a touch screen on the computer they use to remote admin their server? I keep wishing you could use Kinect for PC the same as a touch screen and with the same gestures. Could be fun. I could sit in front of a 40" screen and wave my arms about. :laugh:
I can agree on that sentiment, but the attack was launched at the general UI design. Servers should stay servers. No way around that. However, seriously, try Windows 8.1 on a tablet/touchscreen. I find myself reaching for my desktop pc's screen more often than not these days, then disappointingly realizing that it doesn't support touch. Don't diss MS on this. Trust them, respond to them, give them time. They do listen, at least, unlike Apple etc. They brought back Start. They released RTM early. They will get there.
-
I have a quick test that the person that thought of, designed or approved the Windows 8 charms should take. Test: make them sit down in a computer, open terminal server and get into a Windows Server 2012 machine. Now ask them to try to show the charms bar instantly with the mouse 10 out of 10 times. It is not possible or you would have to be a ninja to do it consistently. If they fail, fire them! (Did Ballmer take the test?) Most people are not ninjas therefore it is not a nice user experience. Start button was way better. People need immediate reaction for an action, not guessing which one is the exact pixel to stand on top of. Make it simple, have a reaction for an action. Still want to get rid of the start button? Make a little triangle in the corner to fire it up. (You can also fix the screen with the apps but that is a separate topic) Make this the action that as a reaction Nonsense… You can see with pictures here: http://www.xaviermorera.com/2013/10/please-fire-the-person-in-microsoft-that-thought-the-charms-thing-is-ok/[^]
My new toy: www.cloudclipx.com -- If I have 8 hours to chop down a tree, I spend 6 sharpening my ax!
Doh! You're complaining because the charms bar is too hard to open?? I'm complaining because it's too damned EASY to open. I work in VS most of the day, using a laptop with a couple of screens. I have a mouse as well as my laptop's mousepad. I prefer to use the mouse but when I need to do some straight coding, I move the mouse well out of the way of the laptop keyboard, and this simple movement (that I've been making for years without problem) now results in the pointer going to the bottom right of screen and the bloody charms thing popping up, HIDING what I'm working on. I then need to alt-tab to get it back. But instinctively while my right hand is moving the mouse, my left is already starting to type, so I lose characters, or send them to the wrong app, or.. aagghhhhhhhh. This probably happens to me 30 - 40 times a day and it's driving me up the wall. Not charms, but a curse. :( :mad: :wtf:
-
I have a quick test that the person that thought of, designed or approved the Windows 8 charms should take. Test: make them sit down in a computer, open terminal server and get into a Windows Server 2012 machine. Now ask them to try to show the charms bar instantly with the mouse 10 out of 10 times. It is not possible or you would have to be a ninja to do it consistently. If they fail, fire them! (Did Ballmer take the test?) Most people are not ninjas therefore it is not a nice user experience. Start button was way better. People need immediate reaction for an action, not guessing which one is the exact pixel to stand on top of. Make it simple, have a reaction for an action. Still want to get rid of the start button? Make a little triangle in the corner to fire it up. (You can also fix the screen with the apps but that is a separate topic) Make this the action that as a reaction Nonsense… You can see with pictures here: http://www.xaviermorera.com/2013/10/please-fire-the-person-in-microsoft-that-thought-the-charms-thing-is-ok/[^]
My new toy: www.cloudclipx.com -- If I have 8 hours to chop down a tree, I spend 6 sharpening my ax!
I assume you have a keyboard. Windows-C gets you to the charms fast. I can find no use-case for going back to anything as clunky as the Start Menu or any new pretenders such as Start-88. I have arranged the Start Page to suit my usage eg most frequently required on the left - sensible groupings - eliminating links to unused programs. Also put frequently used desktop programs as shortcuts on desktop. The beauty of Windows has always been its configurability. For rarely used programs, such as regedit, I resort to the Windows-R Run option. I spend 90% of my time in (on?) the desktop but find no issue in dropping into the start page if need be - the transition is so quick and fluid - especially using wheel-mouse (this was even the case with an old laptop with only 512MB of RAM). Other people mention the (shouting) caps menus in VS and Office. They do look bad but these are easily fixed and converted to lowercase and all is well. I have used every version of Windows since Windows 1. Favourites 3.1, 98, XP, 7, and 8. (By the way I also use Mac OSX, IOS7, and Android).
-
I have a quick test that the person that thought of, designed or approved the Windows 8 charms should take. Test: make them sit down in a computer, open terminal server and get into a Windows Server 2012 machine. Now ask them to try to show the charms bar instantly with the mouse 10 out of 10 times. It is not possible or you would have to be a ninja to do it consistently. If they fail, fire them! (Did Ballmer take the test?) Most people are not ninjas therefore it is not a nice user experience. Start button was way better. People need immediate reaction for an action, not guessing which one is the exact pixel to stand on top of. Make it simple, have a reaction for an action. Still want to get rid of the start button? Make a little triangle in the corner to fire it up. (You can also fix the screen with the apps but that is a separate topic) Make this the action that as a reaction Nonsense… You can see with pictures here: http://www.xaviermorera.com/2013/10/please-fire-the-person-in-microsoft-that-thought-the-charms-thing-is-ok/[^]
My new toy: www.cloudclipx.com -- If I have 8 hours to chop down a tree, I spend 6 sharpening my ax!
Why do it with the mouse when you can hit Win-C so easily?
-
It's not only VS... MS Office has also begun shouting at me...
Windows 8 UI is targeting to consumer market; and MS is fascinating to port games on it. The UI does not make sense for most business apps.
-
Why do it with the mouse when you can hit Win-C so easily?
what? a new Hotkey-Combination? I will have to change my own bindings then... :sigh: should I ever upgrade to Windows 8 ;P
-
Windows 8 UI is targeting to consumer market; and MS is fascinating to port games on it. The UI does not make sense for most business apps.
Completely agree. Charms does not work very good on desktops without a touchscreen. Most Microsoft consumers used desktops, so why alienate those people. I have to say it, Charms is not charming.
-
It's not only VS... MS Office has also begun shouting at me...
Also Outlook 2013, when you have the reading pane enabled. Instead of showing you the content of the email message (what Outlook is presumably all about), shows you a huge header about the sender and their status. Going back to Rajesh's post, I've long held that software which can't get the little things right likely does not get the big things right. I think Win 8 qualifies. Take an OS which worked perfrectly fine for the majority of non-touchscreen users, and force them to pretend their device is a touchscreen. Grrrr!
-
I have a quick test that the person that thought of, designed or approved the Windows 8 charms should take. Test: make them sit down in a computer, open terminal server and get into a Windows Server 2012 machine. Now ask them to try to show the charms bar instantly with the mouse 10 out of 10 times. It is not possible or you would have to be a ninja to do it consistently. If they fail, fire them! (Did Ballmer take the test?) Most people are not ninjas therefore it is not a nice user experience. Start button was way better. People need immediate reaction for an action, not guessing which one is the exact pixel to stand on top of. Make it simple, have a reaction for an action. Still want to get rid of the start button? Make a little triangle in the corner to fire it up. (You can also fix the screen with the apps but that is a separate topic) Make this the action that as a reaction Nonsense… You can see with pictures here: http://www.xaviermorera.com/2013/10/please-fire-the-person-in-microsoft-that-thought-the-charms-thing-is-ok/[^]
My new toy: www.cloudclipx.com -- If I have 8 hours to chop down a tree, I spend 6 sharpening my ax!
I thinks the charms bar is ok, what's not ok is that they make it the only place where you can turn off your computer, I think they should have put these options under the User Image/Name on the Start Page, just below Log Out.
CEO at: - Rafaga Systems - Para Facturas - Modern Components for the moment...
-
I have a quick test that the person that thought of, designed or approved the Windows 8 charms should take. Test: make them sit down in a computer, open terminal server and get into a Windows Server 2012 machine. Now ask them to try to show the charms bar instantly with the mouse 10 out of 10 times. It is not possible or you would have to be a ninja to do it consistently. If they fail, fire them! (Did Ballmer take the test?) Most people are not ninjas therefore it is not a nice user experience. Start button was way better. People need immediate reaction for an action, not guessing which one is the exact pixel to stand on top of. Make it simple, have a reaction for an action. Still want to get rid of the start button? Make a little triangle in the corner to fire it up. (You can also fix the screen with the apps but that is a separate topic) Make this the action that as a reaction Nonsense… You can see with pictures here: http://www.xaviermorera.com/2013/10/please-fire-the-person-in-microsoft-that-thought-the-charms-thing-is-ok/[^]
My new toy: www.cloudclipx.com -- If I have 8 hours to chop down a tree, I spend 6 sharpening my ax!
-
what? a new Hotkey-Combination? I will have to change my own bindings then... :sigh: should I ever upgrade to Windows 8 ;P
Nicholas Marty wrote:
a new Hotkey-Combination? I will have to change my own bindings then... :sigh:
Either that or get a trackpad that supports Win8 gestures so that you can use it to swipe the charm bar into view (I have one of these for my desktop machine).
Nicholas Marty wrote:
should I ever upgrade to Windows 8
You should! :-D
-
I thinks the charms bar is ok, what's not ok is that they make it the only place where you can turn off your computer, I think they should have put these options under the User Image/Name on the Start Page, just below Log Out.
CEO at: - Rafaga Systems - Para Facturas - Modern Components for the moment...
RafagaX wrote:
I think they should have put these options under the User Image/Name on the Start Page, just below Log Out.
Agreed.
-
Doh! You're complaining because the charms bar is too hard to open?? I'm complaining because it's too damned EASY to open. I work in VS most of the day, using a laptop with a couple of screens. I have a mouse as well as my laptop's mousepad. I prefer to use the mouse but when I need to do some straight coding, I move the mouse well out of the way of the laptop keyboard, and this simple movement (that I've been making for years without problem) now results in the pointer going to the bottom right of screen and the bloody charms thing popping up, HIDING what I'm working on. I then need to alt-tab to get it back. But instinctively while my right hand is moving the mouse, my left is already starting to type, so I lose characters, or send them to the wrong app, or.. aagghhhhhhhh. This probably happens to me 30 - 40 times a day and it's driving me up the wall. Not charms, but a curse. :( :mad: :wtf:
Have you ever considered one of those programs like Start8, Power8, Start Menu Reviver, etc? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Start_Menu_replacements_for_Windows_8[^] has a bunch of freeware listings of programs of this sort. One common theme is turning off the charms, restoring the start menu to a Win7 state (yet still using win8, course with the fully functional start menu back you don't even need the charms), and most will bypass the Metro startup, going into the Windows desktop at startup. I got sick of the whole thing early, but didn't have a Windows 7 install CD. However, for the sake of staying legal, a friend suggested this option to me.
-
If you don't know what app you want to use, please turn off the computer and go home. Especially if you installed it.
Really? Any serious dev is going to have massive numbers of applications installed, including tools you use a few times a year or less. Some of these tools are renamed occasionally when new versions are released. Example: I still go looking for "Ethereal" half the time I want Wireshark. Do you really want to pause and have to think what the actual name of some auxiliary app that came with your IDE or DBMS is called, or the diagnostics tool that you rarely need? Or, that thing you installed and meant to try out a while back but then got busy and therefore have never even used yet? I have hundreds of applications across several entire domains of computer use on my system, and while 95% of the time I just hit "start" and begin typing, the lack of being able to create a categorized, hierarchical menu system is a substantive loss for being able to find things in that other 5% of the time when navigating would be faster than pausing and extensively scanning one's own brain. What is the point in removing the ability to browse by task? In fact, where this is even more helpful is if the computer has more than one user. Does my wife know the names of all the things I have installed on one of our home computers? No, but she might be able to find something she needs if she can explore the menu. Scanning a flat screen of 200 tiles will just make her eyes glaze over. I actually like Windows 8 in most ways, and most everyone trembling in fear over upgrading from Windows 7 is over-anxious with little good reason. But this is nevertheless a legitimate gripe.
-
Right on the money. The problem with the full screen start menu is that it is horrible. It shows hundreds of things you don't need and can't really group in a nice way. Oh well, I covered it here: http://www.xaviermorera.com/2013/07/windows-8-folders/[^] The problem with Microsoft is that the "me too" strategy worked so well in the past, that they are trying it now again but taking really really bad decisions.
Present anytime, anywhere: www.ccview.me Clipboard in the cloud: www.cloudclipx.com -- If I have 8 hours to chop down a tree, I spend 6 sharpening my ax! And I mostly do in CodeProject and Pluralsight!
Not sure what you mean you can't group in a nice way. It's very easy to group programs, I use task based grouping such as Programming, Publishing, CADD, Utilities, etc. Have to admit 8.1 does this better since you don't have to delete all the programs from the Start Screen, you have to add what you want while everything is added to the "Apps" screen (not the Start Screen) It's much faster for me to hit the Windows button and select a program from the start screen than to hit Start>Programs>Company X> Application. Of course for my most used programs everything is on the Task Bar for even quicker access.
-
Really? Any serious dev is going to have massive numbers of applications installed, including tools you use a few times a year or less. Some of these tools are renamed occasionally when new versions are released. Example: I still go looking for "Ethereal" half the time I want Wireshark. Do you really want to pause and have to think what the actual name of some auxiliary app that came with your IDE or DBMS is called, or the diagnostics tool that you rarely need? Or, that thing you installed and meant to try out a while back but then got busy and therefore have never even used yet? I have hundreds of applications across several entire domains of computer use on my system, and while 95% of the time I just hit "start" and begin typing, the lack of being able to create a categorized, hierarchical menu system is a substantive loss for being able to find things in that other 5% of the time when navigating would be faster than pausing and extensively scanning one's own brain. What is the point in removing the ability to browse by task? In fact, where this is even more helpful is if the computer has more than one user. Does my wife know the names of all the things I have installed on one of our home computers? No, but she might be able to find something she needs if she can explore the menu. Scanning a flat screen of 200 tiles will just make her eyes glaze over. I actually like Windows 8 in most ways, and most everyone trembling in fear over upgrading from Windows 7 is over-anxious with little good reason. But this is nevertheless a legitimate gripe.
Easy fix for seeing your old start menu listing without having to use 3rd party apps, create a shortcut on the Start Screen to C:\ProgramData\Microsoft\Windows\Start Menu\Programs and you'll see a folder view of all the programs listed in a treeview format.