Depressing
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Walking around the office this morning, I counted name plates - five Americans and 26 Indian/Pakistani.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
Walking around the office this morning, I counted name plates - five Americans and 26 Indian/Pakistani.
As a thought maybe the Americans should spend some more time doing the job rather than counting? Just a thought.
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What part of the US are you in? It isn't that bad in the UK, no where near, only a few Asians, so I guess the US must have really pushed to get them over while at the same time Americans didn't fancy a life as a coder. Don't blame them, its a pretty crap job in many ways, and you have to be cut out for it.
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You think that is bad, where I am currently has decided to move away from programmers and outsource (sole source) to two companies in India both convicted of felonies in the U.S. for Visa fraud. We have so many people on site that are rotated out ... in fact, some of them were involved in the recent Visa Fraud case. It isn't that there aren't enough developers in the United States but that companies think they don't need to have skill. Instead they outsource but don't insource the required staff to properly create specifications. So what you get is a large group of people that will say yes all the way until you hit a mountain. With no offense to any person from India, when I was learning to be a pilot I was warned by numerous instructors, When you here some one with an Accent from India be on the lookout, they will follow the rules into the ground. As a pilot with less than 200 hours I have had three encounters which I would say, "I am glad I was on the look out" but nothing reportable. Personally, I think outsource could be great but, I have yet to see a place where the programmers in house didn't spend the morning fixing the errors from overseas the previous night. I even worked at a place that gave the overseas people a "fake" environment and just did the work themselves because the offshore center did more bad than good.
Need custom software developed? I do custom programming based primarily on MS tools with an emphasis on C# development and consulting. "And they, since they Were not the one dead, turned to their affairs" -- Robert Frost "All users always want Excel" --Ennis Lynch
Ennis Ray Lynch, Jr. wrote:
I even worked at a place that gave the overseas people a "fake" environment and just did the work themselves because the offshore center did more bad than good.
Wow. Actually, wow about your whole post, but that last thing, that is just amazing. Marc
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John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
Walking around the office this morning, I counted name plates - five Americans and 26 Indian/Pakistani.
As a thought maybe the Americans should spend some more time doing the job rather than counting? Just a thought.
jschell wrote:
John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
Walking around the office this all morning, I counted name plates - five Americans European immigrants and 26 Indian/Pakistani.
As a thought maybe the Americans should spend some more time doing the job rather than counting?
Now you know what he does all day. :rolleyes:
The report of my death was an exaggeration - Mark Twain
Simply Elegant Designs JimmyRopes Designs
I'm on-line therefore I am. JimmyRopes -
Have you looked into this product[^]? ;)
Will Rogers never met me.
It would definitely come in handy so that John can communicate with of his work mates. :-D
The report of my death was an exaggeration - Mark Twain
Simply Elegant Designs JimmyRopes Designs
I'm on-line therefore I am. JimmyRopes -
Walking around the office this morning, I counted name plates - five Americans and 26 Indian/Pakistani.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
-----
You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013Well, in my office there are 3 Chinese, 1 from UAE, 1 from Brazil, 1 from Pakistan, 5 Persians and 1 American. I am the lone American and am definitely out numbered.
CQ de W5ALT
Walt Fair, Jr., P. E. Comport Computing Specializing in Technical Engineering Software
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Walking around the office this morning, I counted name plates - five Americans and 26 Indian/Pakistani.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013I know how you feel, from the other side. My team, 3 or possibly 4 locals, 6 Indian, 1 from Burma, 2 from the Philippines and me!
Never underestimate the power of human stupidity RAH
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Yup. I dropped the dots when I moved to England, as it was too tiresome to try to explain to people that it wasn't because I like heavy metal. :-D
:)
Wrong is evil and must be defeated. - Jeff Ello[^]
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Walking around the office this morning, I counted name plates - five Americans and 26 Indian/Pakistani.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013So what's the depressing part? - That you're prepared to work for a small sum of money - That your fellow country-men are less hard-working than others - Or that your performance is scrutinized more than it may have been in the past. As a 4th/5th generation Aussie, I can assure you that in a previous job at a local university, the hardest workers were all in from families that had been here for less time than mine, the majority coming from India or Sri-Lanka. They were the least likely to goof-off if they had 'spare' time when there was a process that could be improved, and the most likely to be what I considered bright. They were incidentally, the most friendly and family-oriented people too. Sure, my sample-size was tiny - there were only 300 of us that I had regular/semi-regular contact with. But I'd work with 'imports' every day of the week if I could, much sooner than 'locals'. Complacency is the enemy of the successful. :)
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So what's the depressing part? - That you're prepared to work for a small sum of money - That your fellow country-men are less hard-working than others - Or that your performance is scrutinized more than it may have been in the past. As a 4th/5th generation Aussie, I can assure you that in a previous job at a local university, the hardest workers were all in from families that had been here for less time than mine, the majority coming from India or Sri-Lanka. They were the least likely to goof-off if they had 'spare' time when there was a process that could be improved, and the most likely to be what I considered bright. They were incidentally, the most friendly and family-oriented people too. Sure, my sample-size was tiny - there were only 300 of us that I had regular/semi-regular contact with. But I'd work with 'imports' every day of the week if I could, much sooner than 'locals'. Complacency is the enemy of the successful. :)
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Jörgen Andersson wrote:
What's an american name?
White Eagle Running Bear Crazy Horse Geronimo Little Turtle Sitting Bull Abooksigun Abukcheech Akule Chochmingwu Choviohoya Kokyangwuti Naalnish Naalyehe ya sidahi Kohkahycumest Nahiossi And my favorite Kuwanyamtiwa - Beautiful badger going over the hill (Hopi) Names like that. :-D
The report of my death was an exaggeration - Mark Twain
Simply Elegant Designs JimmyRopes Designs
Think inside the box! ProActive Secure Systems
I'm on-line therefore I am. JimmyRopesJimmyRopes wrote:
Chochmingwu
Choch Ming Wu is Chinese!
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The reason for the fewer numbers in the UK is because all of the work has been shipped out to India! ;)
Nope. The level of racism is far higher in the UK. I know an Indian girl with a Master's degree from Penn State University who couldn't get a job as a coder in the UK while high school graduates were being hired for coding positions. PS. If she had stayed in the US, she would have found a job. She married and had to move to the UK to be with her husband.
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Considering his description of some of his massive fecal deposits, I believe his name was "Little Bear That Dams The Stream". ;P
He is no beaver! ;P
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It would definitely come in handy so that John can communicate with of his work mates. :-D
The report of my death was an exaggeration - Mark Twain
Simply Elegant Designs JimmyRopes Designs
I'm on-line therefore I am. JimmyRopesNaah! The most common languages would be Telugu and Tamil, not Hindi.
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Naah! The most common languages would be Telugu and Tamil, not Hindi.
Vivic wrote:
Naah!
The most common languages would be Telugu and Tamil, not Hindi.Sorry, I don't know about Indian languages. I was just thinking about the situation here in Issan (Northeast Thailand) although most villagers speak either Khmer or Lao the children learn Thai in school. Similarly in China although there are many regional dialects every school student learns Mandarin. Excuse me for my ignorance of India but I thought Hindi is the language taught in school in India. :-O
The report of my death was an exaggeration - Mark Twain
Simply Elegant Designs JimmyRopes Designs
I'm on-line therefore I am. JimmyRopes -
JimmyRopes wrote:
Chochmingwu
Choch Ming Wu is Chinese!
Vivic wrote:
Choch Ming Wu is Chinese!
Chochmingwu - a girls name meaning "Corn Mother" (Hopi) Native Americans did emigrate from Asia, but I don't know if there is any similarity in the languages.
The report of my death was an exaggeration - Mark Twain
Simply Elegant Designs JimmyRopes Designs
I'm on-line therefore I am. JimmyRopes -
Hmm, What's an american name? :doh: Serious question.
Wrong is evil and must be defeated. - Jeff Ello[^]
One that doesn't start with "pradeep" (merely an example, but you catch my drift, or at least you should).
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
-----
You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
-----
When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013 -
You think that is bad, where I am currently has decided to move away from programmers and outsource (sole source) to two companies in India both convicted of felonies in the U.S. for Visa fraud. We have so many people on site that are rotated out ... in fact, some of them were involved in the recent Visa Fraud case. It isn't that there aren't enough developers in the United States but that companies think they don't need to have skill. Instead they outsource but don't insource the required staff to properly create specifications. So what you get is a large group of people that will say yes all the way until you hit a mountain. With no offense to any person from India, when I was learning to be a pilot I was warned by numerous instructors, When you here some one with an Accent from India be on the lookout, they will follow the rules into the ground. As a pilot with less than 200 hours I have had three encounters which I would say, "I am glad I was on the look out" but nothing reportable. Personally, I think outsource could be great but, I have yet to see a place where the programmers in house didn't spend the morning fixing the errors from overseas the previous night. I even worked at a place that gave the overseas people a "fake" environment and just did the work themselves because the offshore center did more bad than good.
Need custom software developed? I do custom programming based primarily on MS tools with an emphasis on C# development and consulting. "And they, since they Were not the one dead, turned to their affairs" -- Robert Frost "All users always want Excel" --Ennis Lynch
The general quality of work isn't the real issue though (that's for a whole other thread that will be roundly down-voted simply because CodeProject has been overrun by those very "programmers"). My complaint is actually the severely lopsided ratio of 3rd world programmers. In the last year, they've moved the entire support department to India (40 Americans lost their jobs when that happened). They followed that up by replacing American programmers that quit with off-shore "resources", making no attempt to retain what were roundly considered to be key personnel. Last week, I was ordered to hand-off some rather important dev work to Indian contractors, and the people that rely on that development effort are none too happy about it. I honestly have no feeling as to the suitability of the new contractors to even accomplish the task. To add insult to injury, the principal dev on our flagship product has been performing knowledge transfer sessions to the same two Indian devs regarding all phases of development on that product. Not only are they replacing us with Indians because they'll work for $0.25/hour, but they're making us help them do it. Before anyone suggests it, yes I'm looking for another job, and this is where they twist the knife, so to speak. I'm being contacted mostly (about 95%) by off-shored head hunters. Really? I've started telling them I will not discuss job prospects with off-shore recruiters.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013 -
Guess what? You forgot to count yourself, which makes the total count 32. There... how do you feel now? ;P Seriously JSOP, look at CP, it's just hamsters working really hard, and Chris and bunch of other people are taking all the credit, while Bob still rocks! Who cares?
Remind Me This - Manage, Collaborate and Execute your Project in the Cloud
I'm not an immigrant. My family has been here since the 1600s, and I was born here - I think that qualifies me as a natural-born American. And if you want to take it to such an absurd level, we're all immigrants from Africa (according to the latest favorite scientific genetic theory).
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
-----
You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
-----
When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013 -
It would definitely come in handy so that John can communicate with of his work mates. :-D
The report of my death was an exaggeration - Mark Twain
Simply Elegant Designs JimmyRopes Designs
I'm on-line therefore I am. JimmyRopesThat might be appropriate if I had the slightest desire to communicate with them. They're in my country - they should learn English or go the f*ck home.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013
