For some perspective
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GUIs are good for a few specific things, but CLIs are better at everything else. :badger: OpenVMS rules! :badger:
I am always happy to see someone praise OpenVMS, not to mention things like VAXset, which was very powerful in its day.:cool:
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9082365 wrote:
Yes, because it makes no economic sense to do so. A developer's first priority is to feed and clothe themselves and their dependents
Exactly. My first few years out of college were spent in the Mac world although my background was Unix. Unfortunately, after that job ended, I found myself without a marketable skillset, and was lucky enough to retool for the Windows 3.1 market (yes, this was a few years back ;P ). Not knocking Macs (or Unix), but at that time and place I couldn't find a job using those skill sets. I loved both environments, but the jobs were in DOS/Windows ... and so was I. Since then? I go with market share. Got a family to support, so playing with the coolest tools takes a second priority behind having a paycheck. The great thing about the current world is that I can work in a Windows world, but can keep up knowledge in Linux, Android, etc. Computers are cheap enough that I can do what I want. :cool:
Yup, you moved to windows when windows was the future, just like I did, but it's looking less and less like windows will be the future, in future. They're continually burning bridges in every direction. The only thing that keeps them at the top is ms office, which businesses can't live without because of retraining costs/problems -- but they've been doing their level best to ruin that, too, with their constant "great, new features" which destroy features that people are used to using (forcing "invisible retraining" that costs a fortune in time and effort). But take care now of one of the millions of tiny annoyances in linux (which are obvious to us windows guys, but seemingly transparent/unimportant to linux devs), and you'll have a foot firmly in the door.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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Yup, you moved to windows when windows was the future, just like I did, but it's looking less and less like windows will be the future, in future. They're continually burning bridges in every direction. The only thing that keeps them at the top is ms office, which businesses can't live without because of retraining costs/problems -- but they've been doing their level best to ruin that, too, with their constant "great, new features" which destroy features that people are used to using (forcing "invisible retraining" that costs a fortune in time and effort). But take care now of one of the millions of tiny annoyances in linux (which are obvious to us windows guys, but seemingly transparent/unimportant to linux devs), and you'll have a foot firmly in the door.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
Mark_Wallace wrote:
Yup, you moved to windows when windows was the future, just like I did, but it's looking less and less like windows will be the future, in future.
yup! Which is why I play with Linux and am looking at Android. I have no clue which the next major platform will be, but I will be ready to move on! At the same time, Windows is heavily entrenched in major corporations. It may fizzle ... but that could take years, even decades. So we'll keep our eyes open along with our options! :laugh:
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Yup, you moved to windows when windows was the future, just like I did, but it's looking less and less like windows will be the future, in future. They're continually burning bridges in every direction. The only thing that keeps them at the top is ms office, which businesses can't live without because of retraining costs/problems -- but they've been doing their level best to ruin that, too, with their constant "great, new features" which destroy features that people are used to using (forcing "invisible retraining" that costs a fortune in time and effort). But take care now of one of the millions of tiny annoyances in linux (which are obvious to us windows guys, but seemingly transparent/unimportant to linux devs), and you'll have a foot firmly in the door.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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Yup, you moved to windows when windows was the future, just like I did, but it's looking less and less like windows will be the future, in future. They're continually burning bridges in every direction. The only thing that keeps them at the top is ms office, which businesses can't live without because of retraining costs/problems -- but they've been doing their level best to ruin that, too, with their constant "great, new features" which destroy features that people are used to using (forcing "invisible retraining" that costs a fortune in time and effort). But take care now of one of the millions of tiny annoyances in linux (which are obvious to us windows guys, but seemingly transparent/unimportant to linux devs), and you'll have a foot firmly in the door.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
Foot firmly in the door of what? My experience with the Linux world has been that no-one wants to pay for anything. So I get to spend my precious off work time impressing a group of ex Windows guys with a GUI wrapper around an existing system function and have the snooty Linux CLI users completely ignore it. Not much incentive to build a tool like that, otherwise it would've already been done. On the topic of Microsoft and Windows dying soon, that prediction fits right up there with the annual "It's the year of the Linux desktop" statements we've all read for the the last decade or more. Replacing desktop systems with anything other than a Windows or maybe MAC PC will remain prohibitively expensive for long time due to as has been mentioned the cost of retooling different "office" type programs and retraining folks who are already using the MS Office products. I wouldn't be planning to sell my M$ stock anytime soon if I had any.
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Mark_Wallace wrote:
less and less like windows will be the future, in future.
What will take it's place, do you think? And when?
There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
Lemme just check my crystal ball... Oh, wait! I'm not a fortune teller! But what I do see is that, despite the absolutely massive wumao campaign by ms (orders of magnitude larger than any they've tried to pull off in the past), the "best/safest windows ever" (according to the wumao) is becoming more and more reviled by average users and business users, not just the savvy. It's going way beyond any anti-ms stuff in the past -- but that's hardly surprising; two boner OSes in a row is five too many; and the mess they're making of ms office + the ridiculously heavy push toward cloud services (which most people and few businesses trust) is really feeding back hard (not that they're paying attention to negative feedback). The biggest problem is that they've put themselves in a position where they can't U-turn -- they can't do a "sorry about Vista; have Weven" again, because, well, you can't do that more than once without looking completely incompetent, and you certainly can't do it after pushing Two duff revisions of a product as hard as they've pushed them. They won't collapse, obviously; they're way too big. But they're forcing themselves into the same position as Big Blue, where they'll still be a household name, but not many "households" will actually use their flagship product. If linux weren't such a pile of user-unfriendly sh1te, it would have overtaken ms in more than just the server market, by now. As windows users start looking for alternatives, linux will grow, and so will the demand for the kind of user-friendliness that windows users are used to. We're entering another period where names will be made. I think that's cool -- and about time!
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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Yup, you moved to windows when windows was the future, just like I did, but it's looking less and less like windows will be the future, in future. They're continually burning bridges in every direction. The only thing that keeps them at the top is ms office, which businesses can't live without because of retraining costs/problems -- but they've been doing their level best to ruin that, too, with their constant "great, new features" which destroy features that people are used to using (forcing "invisible retraining" that costs a fortune in time and effort). But take care now of one of the millions of tiny annoyances in linux (which are obvious to us windows guys, but seemingly transparent/unimportant to linux devs), and you'll have a foot firmly in the door.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
Did wheelman570z get banned, or something? He made valid points, but when I answered, I was told that the message I was responding to didn't exist. OK, so maybe he was a tiny bit vehement (a really tiny bit; totally acceptable), but there was no bad language, and expressing opinions vehemently is what lounges are for -- and, as I say, he made valid points that are worth discussing. I feel like I've been robbed of an intelligent discussion. Oh, wait! I Have been robbed of an intelligent discussion Now I'm stuck with that bluddy ryandev! Om Mane Padme Om, and all that.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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Lemme just check my crystal ball... Oh, wait! I'm not a fortune teller! But what I do see is that, despite the absolutely massive wumao campaign by ms (orders of magnitude larger than any they've tried to pull off in the past), the "best/safest windows ever" (according to the wumao) is becoming more and more reviled by average users and business users, not just the savvy. It's going way beyond any anti-ms stuff in the past -- but that's hardly surprising; two boner OSes in a row is five too many; and the mess they're making of ms office + the ridiculously heavy push toward cloud services (which most people and few businesses trust) is really feeding back hard (not that they're paying attention to negative feedback). The biggest problem is that they've put themselves in a position where they can't U-turn -- they can't do a "sorry about Vista; have Weven" again, because, well, you can't do that more than once without looking completely incompetent, and you certainly can't do it after pushing Two duff revisions of a product as hard as they've pushed them. They won't collapse, obviously; they're way too big. But they're forcing themselves into the same position as Big Blue, where they'll still be a household name, but not many "households" will actually use their flagship product. If linux weren't such a pile of user-unfriendly sh1te, it would have overtaken ms in more than just the server market, by now. As windows users start looking for alternatives, linux will grow, and so will the demand for the kind of user-friendliness that windows users are used to. We're entering another period where names will be made. I think that's cool -- and about time!
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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I'm not sure which desktop manager (Unity I think) I logged into Ubuntu with the other day but I needed to search for some files. There was no way to do it. No menu item, nothing. A quick google search gave me lots of articles of how to find files using command lines. No thanks. I finally logged back in using a different desktop manager and it was in the File menu under "Go." Microsoft may be far from perfect but I don't see any alternative that is anywhere close to as good as Microsoft. And I've been able to have a good career because of Microsoft and don't see any reason why that won't continue.
There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
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Mark_Wallace wrote:
What the linux community is missing is windows developers
Can't imagine why that would be! :doh:
I am not a number. I am a ... no, wait!
Because linux community is an open source community. It can't feed me. That's why.
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In default Ubuntu - In unity, you just press the windows key (or otherwise select the menu) and start typing. Unless it's been configured otherwise, it works the same way windows does. It's exactly as non-obvious as the Windows 10 approach.
pmauriks wrote:
It's exactly as non-obvious as the Windows 10 approach.
But in Windows 10 if you have the file explorer open you can search from there, which makes more sense.
There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
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I'm not sure which desktop manager (Unity I think) I logged into Ubuntu with the other day but I needed to search for some files. There was no way to do it. No menu item, nothing. A quick google search gave me lots of articles of how to find files using command lines. No thanks. I finally logged back in using a different desktop manager and it was in the File menu under "Go." Microsoft may be far from perfect but I don't see any alternative that is anywhere close to as good as Microsoft. And I've been able to have a good career because of Microsoft and don't see any reason why that won't continue.
There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.