To my French friends
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My thoughts and prayers are with the French muslim community this morning. As a society, we (the west) must find a way to prevent whatever is driving good young men to actions like this. Whatever intolerance it is, must be rooted out by a sensible government.
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Bomb Mecca. Each time such an atrocity takes place, the affected country should bomb Mecca, Medina and any other place holy to Islam. Maybe they will stop then. If not, repeat the medicine.
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That's not right, it would make us just as bad as them. You can't condemn / attack an entire religion / people on the actions of a (relative) few. It's the individuals that misuse the religion to get whatever they want, chaos, money, power, ... It's those individuals we need to find and stop. Every religion has it's radicals, yes at the moment the islam has the worst one's (maybe), but that doesn't mean that every moslim is bad. And
Vivic wrote:
Maybe they will stop then.
They won't, and it most likely would have the opposite effect, more people would join the terrorist side. And before you ask: I'm an atheist so I don't care about the religion part.
Tom
Tom Deketelaere wrote:
That's not right, it would make us just as bad as them.
I reply only to this affirmation, as I don't agree with the proposed solution but this sentence always catches my attention. I (and I speak only for myself) wish not to be better than them. I wish to be able to go on with my life without the fear of an idiot coming to kill as much as he/she can without even the self-preservation instinct that every animal possess.
GCS d--- s-/++ a- C++++ U+++ P- L- E-- W++ N++ o+ K- w+++ O? M-- V? PS+ PE- Y+ PGP t++ 5? X R++ tv-- b+ DI+++ D++ G e++>+++ h--- ++>+++ y+++* Weapons extension: ma- k++ F+2 X If you think 'goto' is evil, try writing an Assembly program without JMP. -- TNCaver When I was six, there were no ones and zeroes - only zeroes. And not all of them worked. -- Ravi Bhavnani
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I hope you are safe. My thoughts are with you tonight.
This space for rent
I'm waiting for Obama to say something stupid again, like "It's almost as easy to buy a truck as it is a book... or a Glock.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013 -
So you're asking for intolerance of intolerance? It doesn't take long to get very, very complicated, does it?
I am not a number. I am a ... no, wait!
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That's not right, it would make us just as bad as them. You can't condemn / attack an entire religion / people on the actions of a (relative) few. It's the individuals that misuse the religion to get whatever they want, chaos, money, power, ... It's those individuals we need to find and stop. Every religion has it's radicals, yes at the moment the islam has the worst one's (maybe), but that doesn't mean that every moslim is bad. And
Vivic wrote:
Maybe they will stop then.
They won't, and it most likely would have the opposite effect, more people would join the terrorist side. And before you ask: I'm an atheist so I don't care about the religion part.
Tom
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This is the most ridiculous statement I have seen. Why do you want to do that. Statement like this inflames the situation.
cheers,
Super
------------------------------------------ Too much of good is bad,mix some evil in it
Ridiculous - well not in a necessarily strategic sense. A gorilla type army, particularly one that is highly dispersed, can go on indefinitely. The only way to really end such an insurgency is to attack the homeland to the extent that those sending them do not want any further damage as it is no longer worth the potential gains. Daesh, for all practical purposes, doesn't have a homeland. Furthermore, losses to troops are not a concern (martyrdom and all that), even for the troops. So - without an 'homeland' or troops that can be demoralized, what do you do? Attacks, such as in "everywhere", cannot be stopped directly. You need to hit the demoralizing option by whatever means. So - what shall it be? Remember: The Taliban was planted in Pakistan by the Saudis, financed and raised, Daesh by Qatar, Hezbalah is a 'we didn't do it' proxy for Iraq. On and on. So - what do you suggest we do? What will hurt enough to make them consider stopping? I've had some grizzly proposals of my own, but it's up to you. What is the most moral route (if that's what you wish): How many lives (of innocent bystanders) are you willing to merely mourn? When do you work on prevention? Your move.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
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I'm waiting for Obama to say something stupid again, like "It's almost as easy to buy a truck as it is a book... or a Glock.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013:thumbsup:
GCS d--- s-/++ a- C++++ U+++ P- L- E-- W++ N++ o+ K- w+++ O? M-- V? PS+ PE- Y+ PGP t++ 5? X R++ tv-- b+ DI+++ D++ G e++>+++ h--- ++>+++ y+++* Weapons extension: ma- k++ F+2 X If you think 'goto' is evil, try writing an Assembly program without JMP. -- TNCaver When I was six, there were no ones and zeroes - only zeroes. And not all of them worked. -- Ravi Bhavnani
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So you're asking for intolerance of intolerance? It doesn't take long to get very, very complicated, does it?
I am not a number. I am a ... no, wait!
Tolerate intolerance and you end up conquered. As in military conquered, i.e. slave. Then we wouldn't be able to propagate tolerance ideals because we'd be flogged or killed for doing so. NOTE: The second sentence ha been written using "we" instead of thye common "you" in order not to sound accusatory. There are probably better ways to phrase it but I'm no native speaker.
GCS d--- s-/++ a- C++++ U+++ P- L- E-- W++ N++ o+ K- w+++ O? M-- V? PS+ PE- Y+ PGP t++ 5? X R++ tv-- b+ DI+++ D++ G e++>+++ h--- ++>+++ y+++* Weapons extension: ma- k++ F+2 X If you think 'goto' is evil, try writing an Assembly program without JMP. -- TNCaver When I was six, there were no ones and zeroes - only zeroes. And not all of them worked. -- Ravi Bhavnani
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Ridiculous - well not in a necessarily strategic sense. A gorilla type army, particularly one that is highly dispersed, can go on indefinitely. The only way to really end such an insurgency is to attack the homeland to the extent that those sending them do not want any further damage as it is no longer worth the potential gains. Daesh, for all practical purposes, doesn't have a homeland. Furthermore, losses to troops are not a concern (martyrdom and all that), even for the troops. So - without an 'homeland' or troops that can be demoralized, what do you do? Attacks, such as in "everywhere", cannot be stopped directly. You need to hit the demoralizing option by whatever means. So - what shall it be? Remember: The Taliban was planted in Pakistan by the Saudis, financed and raised, Daesh by Qatar, Hezbalah is a 'we didn't do it' proxy for Iraq. On and on. So - what do you suggest we do? What will hurt enough to make them consider stopping? I've had some grizzly proposals of my own, but it's up to you. What is the most moral route (if that's what you wish): How many lives (of innocent bystanders) are you willing to merely mourn? When do you work on prevention? Your move.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
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Ridiculous - well not in a necessarily strategic sense. A gorilla type army, particularly one that is highly dispersed, can go on indefinitely. The only way to really end such an insurgency is to attack the homeland to the extent that those sending them do not want any further damage as it is no longer worth the potential gains. Daesh, for all practical purposes, doesn't have a homeland. Furthermore, losses to troops are not a concern (martyrdom and all that), even for the troops. So - without an 'homeland' or troops that can be demoralized, what do you do? Attacks, such as in "everywhere", cannot be stopped directly. You need to hit the demoralizing option by whatever means. So - what shall it be? Remember: The Taliban was planted in Pakistan by the Saudis, financed and raised, Daesh by Qatar, Hezbalah is a 'we didn't do it' proxy for Iraq. On and on. So - what do you suggest we do? What will hurt enough to make them consider stopping? I've had some grizzly proposals of my own, but it's up to you. What is the most moral route (if that's what you wish): How many lives (of innocent bystanders) are you willing to merely mourn? When do you work on prevention? Your move.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
Brilliant analysis! :thumbsup:
GCS d--- s-/++ a- C++++ U+++ P- L- E-- W++ N++ o+ K- w+++ O? M-- V? PS+ PE- Y+ PGP t++ 5? X R++ tv-- b+ DI+++ D++ G e++>+++ h--- ++>+++ y+++* Weapons extension: ma- k++ F+2 X If you think 'goto' is evil, try writing an Assembly program without JMP. -- TNCaver When I was six, there were no ones and zeroes - only zeroes. And not all of them worked. -- Ravi Bhavnani
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I hope you are safe. My thoughts are with you tonight.
This space for rent
Horribly, I had foreseen this method of attack over a decade ago - only it was executed in the form of a coordinated effort (rental trucks all over a country, small towns and large, creating serious nation-wide fear). Probably this is already on the horizon. There are others such possibilities - but like the above, I do not 'share' lest I plant a seed in someones mind. The driver is dead (I'm waiting for the Swiss minister of foreign affairs to call this an extra-judicial execution). They'll find another - or, noting the success, a small army of them. The real question for the West is - what needs to be done to motivate them to stop killing innocent people at random. Then, don't blink . . . just do it.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
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Ridiculous - well not in a necessarily strategic sense. A gorilla type army, particularly one that is highly dispersed, can go on indefinitely. The only way to really end such an insurgency is to attack the homeland to the extent that those sending them do not want any further damage as it is no longer worth the potential gains. Daesh, for all practical purposes, doesn't have a homeland. Furthermore, losses to troops are not a concern (martyrdom and all that), even for the troops. So - without an 'homeland' or troops that can be demoralized, what do you do? Attacks, such as in "everywhere", cannot be stopped directly. You need to hit the demoralizing option by whatever means. So - what shall it be? Remember: The Taliban was planted in Pakistan by the Saudis, financed and raised, Daesh by Qatar, Hezbalah is a 'we didn't do it' proxy for Iraq. On and on. So - what do you suggest we do? What will hurt enough to make them consider stopping? I've had some grizzly proposals of my own, but it's up to you. What is the most moral route (if that's what you wish): How many lives (of innocent bystanders) are you willing to merely mourn? When do you work on prevention? Your move.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
Spot on! :thumbsup:
You have just been Sharapova'd.
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I'm waiting for Obama to say something stupid again, like "It's almost as easy to buy a truck as it is a book... or a Glock.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
-----
You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013Well - with your pre-programmed anti-Obama burp, the "say something stupid" has already been taken care of. Remember: Reagan traded arms for hostages. Bush II let the binLaden family flee/fly from the USA when everyone else was grounded - you've seen pictures of the Bushes (literally) holding hands with Saudi royalty (and kiss)[^]. You can be upset with what goes on in the US - but Obama didn't let the Koreans go nuclear. It took the money-hungry EU to close their eyes to Iran. And the GOP controlled House and Senate to make the last eight years the so amazingly unproductive. Obama has a sh*tload of dirty laundry - but nothing compared to his opposition.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
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9082365 wrote:
So you're asking for intolerance of intolerance?
No. Just intolerance of immorality.
There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
RyanDev wrote:
Just intolerance of immorality.
Immorality like, say, illegally invading a country on a pretext, having misled both your own cabinet and Parliament, because you wanted to please a hawkish President? Like I said, it gets complicated very quickly. There will never be an end to this as long as neither side recognises that some of the other's causes may be just and their grievances legitimate however base and evil their actions in support of them.
I am not a number. I am a ... no, wait!
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My thoughts and prayers are with the French muslim community this morning. As a society, we (the west) must find a way to prevent whatever is driving good young men to actions like this. Whatever intolerance it is, must be rooted out by a sensible government.
PradeepGaggandeep wrote:
My thoughts and prayers are with the French muslim community
Why do we (the West) have to figure out how to appease this community? Should they be involved in cleaning their own house. Maybe it wasn't your intent, but you've effectively absolved the perpetrators and blamed the victims.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
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PradeepGaggandeep wrote:
My thoughts and prayers are with the French muslim community
Why do we (the West) have to figure out how to appease this community? Should they be involved in cleaning their own house. Maybe it wasn't your intent, but you've effectively absolved the perpetrators and blamed the victims.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
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Well - with your pre-programmed anti-Obama burp, the "say something stupid" has already been taken care of. Remember: Reagan traded arms for hostages. Bush II let the binLaden family flee/fly from the USA when everyone else was grounded - you've seen pictures of the Bushes (literally) holding hands with Saudi royalty (and kiss)[^]. You can be upset with what goes on in the US - but Obama didn't let the Koreans go nuclear. It took the money-hungry EU to close their eyes to Iran. And the GOP controlled House and Senate to make the last eight years the so amazingly unproductive. Obama has a sh*tload of dirty laundry - but nothing compared to his opposition.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
If you had been paying attention you would have noticed that I said it doesn't matter who's in charge, the American people are NOT what's important to politicians. They don't pass laws for the benefit of their constituents - they do it to gain more power and money at the EXPENSE of said constituents. What happened with past presidents really is out of context. The one in charge right now is the one that's screwing the pooch, so that's the one I'm concentrating on. When the next president does something stupid, I'll harp on that as well.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
-----
You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
-----
When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013 -
If you had been paying attention you would have noticed that I said it doesn't matter who's in charge, the American people are NOT what's important to politicians. They don't pass laws for the benefit of their constituents - they do it to gain more power and money at the EXPENSE of said constituents. What happened with past presidents really is out of context. The one in charge right now is the one that's screwing the pooch, so that's the one I'm concentrating on. When the next president does something stupid, I'll harp on that as well.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
-----
You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
When the next president does something stupid, I'll harp on that as well.
That's fair enough. I just have in my mind a list of western "leaders", following 9/11, being apologists for Islam. All with the basic "Don't blame them all" speech. What we should have been hearing is from them, instead, saying "Don't blame us all". Certainly of late, there's been a flavor to your posts (true of us all) that flavors my interpretation of the above. I'll try to be more single-post oriented. The taste for oil is addictive. Lenin had it right when he said "When we're ready to hang the last capitalist he'll sell us the rope!"
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
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I hope you are safe. My thoughts are with you tonight.
This space for rent
A friend is down in Nice with his wife who's in recuperation after an illness. Really not too relaxing for them but I know they're okay.
veni bibi saltavi