The proliferation of Web UI Toolkits
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There must be hundreds out there. On my current list of "look at" are: Blueprint – A React UI toolkit for the web[^] Home | Aurelia[^] Customizable cross platform UI controls for mobile web and hybrid apps | Mobiscroll[^] UIkit[^] Should I care? As it is, I'm quite happy with jQWidgets - JavaScript UI Widgets framework[^], as it's what the pill I've decided to swallow, but I can't help wondering: 1. How did we get into this proliferated mess of options 2. Do any of these stand out as head-and-shoulders superior to the rest? 3. How can you even tell? :sigh: Marc
V.A.P.O.R.ware - Visual Assisted Programming / Organizational Representation Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802
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There must be hundreds out there. On my current list of "look at" are: Blueprint – A React UI toolkit for the web[^] Home | Aurelia[^] Customizable cross platform UI controls for mobile web and hybrid apps | Mobiscroll[^] UIkit[^] Should I care? As it is, I'm quite happy with jQWidgets - JavaScript UI Widgets framework[^], as it's what the pill I've decided to swallow, but I can't help wondering: 1. How did we get into this proliferated mess of options 2. Do any of these stand out as head-and-shoulders superior to the rest? 3. How can you even tell? :sigh: Marc
V.A.P.O.R.ware - Visual Assisted Programming / Organizational Representation Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802
Each of those is something slightly different from the next: Do you use React? Do you use Angular? Do you want something fully featured like both of those, but you don't want to use either? Do you just want a CSS framework like Bootstrap, but don't like the look of Bootstrap? It's true that there is a lot of noise out there, and for the developer who's just looking to get stuff done it can be unfriendly to say the least. I enjoy the wild west aspect of it, though. I got started late in my development career, so I never directly experienced "The Bubble" and all the tech-splosion that accompanied it, so I'm having fun with this stuff. :)
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Each of those is something slightly different from the next: Do you use React? Do you use Angular? Do you want something fully featured like both of those, but you don't want to use either? Do you just want a CSS framework like Bootstrap, but don't like the look of Bootstrap? It's true that there is a lot of noise out there, and for the developer who's just looking to get stuff done it can be unfriendly to say the least. I enjoy the wild west aspect of it, though. I got started late in my development career, so I never directly experienced "The Bubble" and all the tech-splosion that accompanied it, so I'm having fun with this stuff. :)
Vark111 wrote:
so I'm having fun with this stuff.
Yes, and I think you just hit on the problem. While it's great to have fun with all this stuff, let's say you're starting a web development effort (I'm not, thankfully) and you need to evaluate these so-called technologies, and as you mentioned, the underlying frameworks (React, Angular, etc), and decide the course of the pretty much the lifetime of the site, which could be years. So, there's a difference between the "having fun" free-for-all and the "what poison pill will I swallow" in a professional setting. Oh wait, silly me. Web development isn't professional. :doh: I should know that by now, given the Django/Rails experiences I've had. Marc
V.A.P.O.R.ware - Visual Assisted Programming / Organizational Representation Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802
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There must be hundreds out there. On my current list of "look at" are: Blueprint – A React UI toolkit for the web[^] Home | Aurelia[^] Customizable cross platform UI controls for mobile web and hybrid apps | Mobiscroll[^] UIkit[^] Should I care? As it is, I'm quite happy with jQWidgets - JavaScript UI Widgets framework[^], as it's what the pill I've decided to swallow, but I can't help wondering: 1. How did we get into this proliferated mess of options 2. Do any of these stand out as head-and-shoulders superior to the rest? 3. How can you even tell? :sigh: Marc
V.A.P.O.R.ware - Visual Assisted Programming / Organizational Representation Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802
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Jeremy Falcon wrote:
Me like.
That one actually looked quite good, and is on the top of my list to look at further. Marc
V.A.P.O.R.ware - Visual Assisted Programming / Organizational Representation Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802
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There must be hundreds out there. On my current list of "look at" are: Blueprint – A React UI toolkit for the web[^] Home | Aurelia[^] Customizable cross platform UI controls for mobile web and hybrid apps | Mobiscroll[^] UIkit[^] Should I care? As it is, I'm quite happy with jQWidgets - JavaScript UI Widgets framework[^], as it's what the pill I've decided to swallow, but I can't help wondering: 1. How did we get into this proliferated mess of options 2. Do any of these stand out as head-and-shoulders superior to the rest? 3. How can you even tell? :sigh: Marc
V.A.P.O.R.ware - Visual Assisted Programming / Organizational Representation Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802
Marc Clifton wrote:
How did we get into this proliferated mess of options
By making it easy to make toolkits. Bear in mind that the most common definition of "toolkit" (particularly the web variety) is "repository for frameworks/libraries/etc that have been made by people who know what they're doing". They're like anthology books, compiled by people who can't write, but can only make stories written by others available.
Marc Clifton wrote:
Do any of these stand out as head-and-shoulders superior to the rest?
Some anthology books do actually have well-written intros/links between the stories, rather than just mindless, poorly thought out waffle. If the intros/links are as interesting to read as the stories, then it's a good 'un.
Marc Clifton wrote:
How can you even tell?
Don't look at the promises about how you can do A and B because this framework or that library is incorporated; look at How they're incorporated, and how well the infrastructure is written. Unfortunately, the most common "how well" is pretty abysmally.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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There must be hundreds out there. On my current list of "look at" are: Blueprint – A React UI toolkit for the web[^] Home | Aurelia[^] Customizable cross platform UI controls for mobile web and hybrid apps | Mobiscroll[^] UIkit[^] Should I care? As it is, I'm quite happy with jQWidgets - JavaScript UI Widgets framework[^], as it's what the pill I've decided to swallow, but I can't help wondering: 1. How did we get into this proliferated mess of options 2. Do any of these stand out as head-and-shoulders superior to the rest? 3. How can you even tell? :sigh: Marc
V.A.P.O.R.ware - Visual Assisted Programming / Organizational Representation Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802
I don't have any answers, but the W3C just upstreamed the shadow dom to dom standard earlier this month. It's been around since at least 2011, but looks like something that can build a more robust web component environment where you can mix and match UI or other components without breaking things. When I looked at it earlier this year, it was just too complex to implement, but as soon as support becomes more uniform, it could be great.
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There must be hundreds out there. On my current list of "look at" are: Blueprint – A React UI toolkit for the web[^] Home | Aurelia[^] Customizable cross platform UI controls for mobile web and hybrid apps | Mobiscroll[^] UIkit[^] Should I care? As it is, I'm quite happy with jQWidgets - JavaScript UI Widgets framework[^], as it's what the pill I've decided to swallow, but I can't help wondering: 1. How did we get into this proliferated mess of options 2. Do any of these stand out as head-and-shoulders superior to the rest? 3. How can you even tell? :sigh: Marc
V.A.P.O.R.ware - Visual Assisted Programming / Organizational Representation Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802
Hi Marc, Just my 2 cents for your questions 1. We got into this mess since nothing is perfect and can be bettered. Inevitably a javascript toolkit/framework will have its shortcoming, people will jump on the opportunity to fix it (albeit by spinning up a new framework). Look ma we have this new! thing that fixes the problems of that other framework. And oh btw it introduces a diff kinds of problems (which will be fixed by some other toolkit). Angular 1 -> Angular 2 -> Angular 3 React Aurelia you name it 2. If you want to believe a salesman then you have just the perfect toolkit for all your requirements. Now coming back to reality you have evaluate the frameworks purported claims against your own requirements. I would recommend having a grid listing at least your top level requirements :-D and checking off against the diff frameworks. Then pick the one which you can swallow with least difficulty. :sigh: 3. No, one can't tell if they've not used at least couple of them. I would really like to find someone who has dipped their fingers in majority of them and take their advice too. Anyone?:confused:
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There must be hundreds out there. On my current list of "look at" are: Blueprint – A React UI toolkit for the web[^] Home | Aurelia[^] Customizable cross platform UI controls for mobile web and hybrid apps | Mobiscroll[^] UIkit[^] Should I care? As it is, I'm quite happy with jQWidgets - JavaScript UI Widgets framework[^], as it's what the pill I've decided to swallow, but I can't help wondering: 1. How did we get into this proliferated mess of options 2. Do any of these stand out as head-and-shoulders superior to the rest? 3. How can you even tell? :sigh: Marc
V.A.P.O.R.ware - Visual Assisted Programming / Organizational Representation Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802
Hi Marc, Thanks for sharing! There a lot of tools out there and a lot of developers we come across looking for advice on what to use and when to use it. I always say it depends. Btw, full disclosure: I am Levi from Mobiscroll and I am not here to sell you anything 😊 My first question is, if you are happy with jQWidgets why are you looking for something else? I would advise against looking for just the sake of looking. We're developers and we all like to play with the new shiny stuff, but we rarely find game changers and let's face it, nobody will suddenly move to a new framework in a real-world application just because it's new. So trying things is good, but switching over from something that fits the current needs doesn't make sense. Secondly there a lot of tools because there are a lot of developers who are building on top of existing technologies and new ones that are constantly coming out. We've been around since 2011, and our take on this is shipping tools that actually provide value to people by helping them deliver refined and great experiences. Our products work as stand-alone components, like the Date & Time or Calendar, so you don't have to switch from framework X just to make date picking better. That doesn't mean we don't have to keep up with Angular 2, React, Ember ... and everything new that comes out. At the beginning we were only supporting jQuery, now we support plain Javascript, Angular, React, Knockout ... because we don't want you to switch from one technology to another just because it's a more recent release. Also, we do want you to use what you know. Keep focusing on what's important, tools are just tools, at the end of the day they should help you be better at what you do 🚀
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There must be hundreds out there. On my current list of "look at" are: Blueprint – A React UI toolkit for the web[^] Home | Aurelia[^] Customizable cross platform UI controls for mobile web and hybrid apps | Mobiscroll[^] UIkit[^] Should I care? As it is, I'm quite happy with jQWidgets - JavaScript UI Widgets framework[^], as it's what the pill I've decided to swallow, but I can't help wondering: 1. How did we get into this proliferated mess of options 2. Do any of these stand out as head-and-shoulders superior to the rest? 3. How can you even tell? :sigh: Marc
V.A.P.O.R.ware - Visual Assisted Programming / Organizational Representation Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802
Hi Marc, Thanks for sharing! There a lot of tools out there and a lot of developers we come across looking for advice on what to use and when to use it. I always say it depends. Btw, full disclosure: I am Levi from Mobiscroll and I am not here to sell you anything 😊 My first question is, if you are happy with jQWidgets why are you looking for something else? I would advise against looking for just the sake of looking. We're developers and we all like to play with the new shiny stuff, but we rarely find game changers and let's face it, nobody will suddenly move to a new framework in a real-world application just because it's new. So trying things is good, but switching over from something that fits the current needs doesn't make sense. Secondly there a lot of tools because there are a lot of developers who are building on top of existing technologies and new ones that are constantly coming out. We've been around since 2011, and our take on this is shipping tools that actually provide value to people by helping them deliver refined and great experiences. Our products work as stand-alone components, like the Date & Time or Calendar, so you don't have to switch from framework X just to make date picking better. That doesn't mean we don't have to keep up with Angular 2, React, Ember ... and everything new that comes out. At the beginning we were only supporting jQuery, now we support plain Javascript, Angular, React, Knockout ... because we don't want you to switch from one technology to another just because it's a more recent release. Also, we do want you to use what you know. Keep focusing on what's important, tools are just tools, at the end of the day they should help you be better at what you do 🚀
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There must be hundreds out there. On my current list of "look at" are: Blueprint – A React UI toolkit for the web[^] Home | Aurelia[^] Customizable cross platform UI controls for mobile web and hybrid apps | Mobiscroll[^] UIkit[^] Should I care? As it is, I'm quite happy with jQWidgets - JavaScript UI Widgets framework[^], as it's what the pill I've decided to swallow, but I can't help wondering: 1. How did we get into this proliferated mess of options 2. Do any of these stand out as head-and-shoulders superior to the rest? 3. How can you even tell? :sigh: Marc
V.A.P.O.R.ware - Visual Assisted Programming / Organizational Representation Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802
Hi Marc, Thanks for sharing! There a lot of tools out there and a lot of developers we come across looking for advice on what to use and when to use it. I always say it depends. Btw, full disclosure: I am Levi from [Mobiscroll](https://mobiscroll.com) and I am not here to sell you anything 😊 My first question is, if you are happy with jQWidgets why are you looking for something else? I would advise against looking for just the sake of looking. We're developers and we all like to play with the new shiny stuff, but we rarely find game changers and let's face it, nobody will suddenly move to a new framework in a real-world application just because it's new. So trying things is good, but switching over from something that fits the current needs doesn't make sense. Secondly there a lot of tools because there are a lot of developers who are building on top of existing technologies and new ones that are constantly coming out. We've been around since 2011, and our take on this is shipping tools that actually provide value to people by helping them deliver refined and great experiences. Our products work as stand-alone components, like the Date & Time or [Calendar](https://mobiscroll.com/responsive-calendar), so you don't have to switch from framework X just to make date picking better. That doesn't mean we don't have to keep up with Angular 2, React, Ember ... and everything new that comes out. At the beginning we were only supporting jQuery, now we support plain Javascript, Angular, React, Knockout ... because we don't want you to switch from one technology to another just because it's a more recent release. Also, we do want you to use what you know. Keep focusing on what's important, tools are just tools, at the end of the day they should help you be better at what you do 🚀
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There must be hundreds out there. On my current list of "look at" are: Blueprint – A React UI toolkit for the web[^] Home | Aurelia[^] Customizable cross platform UI controls for mobile web and hybrid apps | Mobiscroll[^] UIkit[^] Should I care? As it is, I'm quite happy with jQWidgets - JavaScript UI Widgets framework[^], as it's what the pill I've decided to swallow, but I can't help wondering: 1. How did we get into this proliferated mess of options 2. Do any of these stand out as head-and-shoulders superior to the rest? 3. How can you even tell? :sigh: Marc
V.A.P.O.R.ware - Visual Assisted Programming / Organizational Representation Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802
Hi Marc, Thanks for sharing! There a lot of tools out there and a lot of developers we come across looking for advice on what to use and when to use it. I always say it depends. Btw, full disclosure: I am Levi from [Mobiscroll](https://mobiscroll.com) and I am not here to sell you anything My first question is, if you are happy with jQWidgets why are you looking for something else? I would advise against looking for just the sake of looking. We're developers and we all like to play with the new shiny stuff, but we rarely find game changers and let's face it, nobody will suddenly move to a new framework in a real-world application just because it's new. So trying things is good, but switching over from something that fits the current needs doesn't make sense. Secondly there a lot of tools because there are a lot of developers who are building on top of existing technologies and new ones that are constantly coming out. We've been around since 2011, and our take on this is shipping tools that actually provide value to people by helping them deliver refined and great experiences. Our products work as stand-alone components, like the [Date & Time](https://mobiscroll.com/mobile-date-and-time-picker) or [Calendar](https://mobiscroll.com/responsive-calendar), so you don't have to switch from framework X just to make date picking better. That doesn't mean we don't have to keep up with Angular 2, React, Ember ... and everything new that comes out. At the beginning we were only supporting jQuery, now we support plain Javascript, Angular, React, Knockout ... because we don't want you to switch from one technology to another just because it's a more recent release. Also, we do want you to use what you know. Keep focusing on what's important, tools are just tools, at the end of the day they should help you be better at what you do