Are you a coffee snob?
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Bottom line - if you wish to skip the read: Coffee Snob works both ways: making Starbucks the whipping boy is as snobby as worshiping the bag it comes in.
Bashing Starbucks is often PC for the right-wing - possibly because they see Starbucks as a left-wing enclave. Then main difference, in the store, is that Starbucks puts much more coffee in their coffee. I'm no coffee gourmet but there is a difference in coffees. I prefer "Latin roast" to standard "American roast", the former is a darker roast. Other people don't like the acidity that increases with the darker roasting. A lot of time it's just what they're used to, or getting on the band-wagon with those around them. They actually do Folgers where I am, now. I donated a bag of Cafe Caribe, which actually cost less, and everyone loved it. Still, it's back to Foglers because they bought a lot. Starbucks (or any other coffee), if brewed out-of-the-store, will be better or worse more on your technique then the coffee, itself. I was quite OK with the Folgers when they finally put in enough coffee so it didn't taste watery. None-the-less, there are serious taste differences in coffee. For a Starbucks type, for example, I like the "Sumatra" type - but there are others types because other people like others better. Some I don't like at all. As I said - I am no coffee - and am glad of it, so I can be content with anything that's strong enough (and not made from rancid beans). If the coffee's a bit unsavory - there are extremes in all things, I can drop some Star Anise into the pot and it will soon be rich and mellow. The Star Anise is reusable, too, for quite a few pots of coffee (works better after the first). So - really - my coffee taste is rich and mellow. I don't need to put a brand name on that to love it or hate it. That would be a real waste.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
As a Melbournean it's my destiny, or possibly doom, to be a coffee snob. I'm also not right-wing. I'm common-sense-wing. Coffee goes wrong (in my view) two ways 1. They burn or otherwise do horrible things to the beans. 2. They burn or otherwise do horrible things to the milk. Grinding the beans incorrectly, not cleaning the espresso machine, scorching the beans, pulling too long, not having enough pressure will make the shot 'orrible. Then the bizarre need in North America to steam the milk to around the melting point of tin. Have they not heard of protein denaturing[^]?? Crikey. Starbucks nails it on both counts: they love their beans black as the Ace of Spades[^] and their milk ready and able to inflict 3rd degree burns. Tone it down a bit on both fronts and they have a chance.
cheers Chris Maunder
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snorkie wrote:
My coworkers were complaining because we ran out of Starbucks
...and you're asking if we're coffee snobs. Doesn't that mean the conversation should be about, you know, coffee? I've given up trying to classify that burned brown stuff they offload.
cheers Chris Maunder
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I was once on an airport in 'Murica (Houston) and found my first Starbucks ever. That was a few years ago when there weren't a lot of Starbucks in the Netherlands yet (I actually still wouldn't know where to find one, but I know we have them). I don't drink coffee, but we sat down and I ordered something with apple juice. I burnt my tongue so friggin hard that I'll never go to Starbucks again, ever. It wasn't even a particularly good beverage :sigh: It's not their fault that I burnt my tongue, but I did, and someone's going to pay for it (besides me) :) Anyway, to answer your question, I only drink coffee that does not taste like coffee. Usually something with hot chocolate. Does that make me a coffee snob?
Best, Sander arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript SQL Server for C# Developers Succinctly Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
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As a Melbournean it's my destiny, or possibly doom, to be a coffee snob. I'm also not right-wing. I'm common-sense-wing. Coffee goes wrong (in my view) two ways 1. They burn or otherwise do horrible things to the beans. 2. They burn or otherwise do horrible things to the milk. Grinding the beans incorrectly, not cleaning the espresso machine, scorching the beans, pulling too long, not having enough pressure will make the shot 'orrible. Then the bizarre need in North America to steam the milk to around the melting point of tin. Have they not heard of protein denaturing[^]?? Crikey. Starbucks nails it on both counts: they love their beans black as the Ace of Spades[^] and their milk ready and able to inflict 3rd degree burns. Tone it down a bit on both fronts and they have a chance.
cheers Chris Maunder
You do know their are non-Espresso options both in and out of StarBucks? And I never met a latte . . . that I liked. Protein denaturing . . . unless you always eat your eggs raw, that shouldn't bother you. That, however, all distances itself from coffee - which, if basically just flavored milk is just that - flavored milk. REAL PROGRAMMERS DON'T DRINK LATTE ! Actually, the only practical use for any steamed milk beverage is to spill on someone else's keyboard. My favorite coffee cooker is vacuum drip - followed by mud (very finely ground coffee just dumped in the mug, then add boiling water). Only myself to blame for good or bad -
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
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If I was drinking a Starbucks I would have just sprayed it all over the screen.
cheers Chris Maunder
Just doing my job.
veni bibi saltavi
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My coworkers were complaining because we ran out of Starbucks coffee and are now drinking Folgers. I can't taste much of a difference between the two and its free! Personally I would rather be hooked on the cheap stuff anyway!
Hogan
I drink black coffee, and I can tell you there are differences between coffee brands.
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I drink black coffee, and I can tell you there are differences between coffee brands.
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As a Melbournean it's my destiny, or possibly doom, to be a coffee snob. I'm also not right-wing. I'm common-sense-wing. Coffee goes wrong (in my view) two ways 1. They burn or otherwise do horrible things to the beans. 2. They burn or otherwise do horrible things to the milk. Grinding the beans incorrectly, not cleaning the espresso machine, scorching the beans, pulling too long, not having enough pressure will make the shot 'orrible. Then the bizarre need in North America to steam the milk to around the melting point of tin. Have they not heard of protein denaturing[^]?? Crikey. Starbucks nails it on both counts: they love their beans black as the Ace of Spades[^] and their milk ready and able to inflict 3rd degree burns. Tone it down a bit on both fronts and they have a chance.
cheers Chris Maunder
LMAO! Have you tried drinking coffee in Japan? I have never had a good brew other than from out of a tin (yes there are hot coffee vending machines in Japan). Brewed coffee is very expensive and tastes like a squeezed sweat laden t-shirt!
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Coffee is just a carrier for sugar.
A good brew that is not burnt needs no sugar...
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A good brew that is not burnt needs no sugar...
You seem to have missed the point. It's not about the coffee; it's all about the sugar.
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A good brew that is not burnt needs no sugar...
no, not missed ... sugar can help towards softening the burnt beans...
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We don't have Starbucks (well, actually we have only one, fairly recent) in Italy and to tell you the truth, it would be useless here. We have hundreds of cafès and if someone is on the move he will take a coffee directly at the counter (very common) in less than two minutes instead of taking away. It usually costs around 1€ that way, and pastries too, so it's cheap. While I'm in London though Starbucks is a blessing: London requires an awful lot of walking and while being slightly warmer than the parts of Italy I come from it's also freaking windy and damp. Being able to keep on moving while holding a moderately sized cup of hot coffee is a real blessing from the skies - most of the time I'm not even interested in the coffee itself but anything warm would do. The usual italian way doesn't help as much since the coffee is extremely shorter and the few minutes in the heated cafè are never enough. Also the cities are smaller and more cramped so there is less to walk.
* CALL APOGEE, SAY AARDWOLF * GCS d--- s-/++ a- C++++ U+++ P- L- E-- W++ N++ o+ K- w+++ O? M-- V? PS+ PE- Y+ PGP t++ 5? X R++ tv-- b+ DI+++ D++ G e++>+++ h--- ++>+++ y+++* Weapons extension: ma- k++ F+2 X * Never pay more than 20 bucks for a computer game. * I'm a puny punmaker.
I loved travelling in Italy. Every time the wife got attacked by a shop there would always be a cafe nearby where I could get the cheapest espresso that generally was better than most restaurant efforts. Bouncing off the walls by the end of the afternoon :sigh:
Never underestimate the power of human stupidity RAH
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My coworkers were complaining because we ran out of Starbucks coffee and are now drinking Folgers. I can't taste much of a difference between the two and its free! Personally I would rather be hooked on the cheap stuff anyway!
Hogan
I am from Austria and every time when we are in the States we got coffee issues. On our project sites we try to get the strongest roast possible, and it still is just like tea, tasting too bitter overall. But not much flavor. One day a colleague from Switzerland took his Espresso cooker with him, and along some real coffee. First problem was, with 110V AC it took ages to get it hot, but then this was really nice! However, our American co-workers nearly got a stroke from this strength :) BR Florian
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I loved travelling in Italy. Every time the wife got attacked by a shop there would always be a cafe nearby where I could get the cheapest espresso that generally was better than most restaurant efforts. Bouncing off the walls by the end of the afternoon :sigh:
Never underestimate the power of human stupidity RAH
Mycroft Holmes wrote:
cafe nearby where I could get the cheapest espresso that generally was better than most restaurant efforts.
That's a general rule actually, restaurant coffee usually is far worst than cafè ones as they usually have less specialized equipment and less trained personnel. It takes several months of training just to get the coffee right for a barman, it's not as easy as it seems. When you're lucky restaurant coffee is barely drinkable, it's an additional service and overcharged for. Many people wait to get to the nearest cafè after a meal.
Mycroft Holmes wrote:
Bouncing off the walls by the end of the afternoon :sigh:
Espresso is short but full of caffeine, without the digestion needed by the milk it gives less aftercrash. Makes people jump - which is needed given the usually relaxed lifestyle in Italy.
* CALL APOGEE, SAY AARDWOLF * GCS d--- s-/++ a- C++++ U+++ P- L- E-- W++ N++ o+ K- w+++ O? M-- V? PS+ PE- Y+ PGP t++ 5? X R++ tv-- b+ DI+++ D++ G e++>+++ h--- ++>+++ y+++* Weapons extension: ma- k++ F+2 X * Never pay more than 20 bucks for a computer game. * I'm a puny punmaker.
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Brent Jenkins wrote:
Have you come across any coffee in the UK that's anything close to good (like in France)?
In central London there is Waterstones, an enormous bookshop. It has both a cafè and a restaurant... the cafè makes a passable espresso (but I only took it twice in several years). In the UK I usually binge on Starbucks given that it's an "exotic" experience for people who don't have that shop chain - in fact they're usually chock full of italians :D I was to try "Cafè Nero" but the pastries weren't interesting so I got out and sought a Starbucks. Cafè Costa is good but I only took a cappuccino once and that's very hard to elephant up - it takes an unusual amount of talent to make a bad cappuccino.
* CALL APOGEE, SAY AARDWOLF * GCS d--- s-/++ a- C++++ U+++ P- L- E-- W++ N++ o+ K- w+++ O? M-- V? PS+ PE- Y+ PGP t++ 5? X R++ tv-- b+ DI+++ D++ G e++>+++ h--- ++>+++ y+++* Weapons extension: ma- k++ F+2 X * Never pay more than 20 bucks for a computer game. * I'm a puny punmaker.
Starbucks coffee is barely drinkable, their tea is, in the words of Douglas Adams " a liquid almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea". Costa coffee I find too strong and bitter, with little coffee flavour. Of the chains, I like Nero best, Leon isn't bad. Most of the time I make my own (as I work mostly at home) and - having tried every coffee they sell, and plenty of others from different suppliers - keep coming back to Mayfair Blend from the Drury Tea and Coffee Company on New Row in London. And no, I don't have any connection to them other than as a customer 8)
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We don't have Starbucks (well, actually we have only one, fairly recent) in Italy and to tell you the truth, it would be useless here. We have hundreds of cafès and if someone is on the move he will take a coffee directly at the counter (very common) in less than two minutes instead of taking away. It usually costs around 1€ that way, and pastries too, so it's cheap. While I'm in London though Starbucks is a blessing: London requires an awful lot of walking and while being slightly warmer than the parts of Italy I come from it's also freaking windy and damp. Being able to keep on moving while holding a moderately sized cup of hot coffee is a real blessing from the skies - most of the time I'm not even interested in the coffee itself but anything warm would do. The usual italian way doesn't help as much since the coffee is extremely shorter and the few minutes in the heated cafè are never enough. Also the cities are smaller and more cramped so there is less to walk.
* CALL APOGEE, SAY AARDWOLF * GCS d--- s-/++ a- C++++ U+++ P- L- E-- W++ N++ o+ K- w+++ O? M-- V? PS+ PE- Y+ PGP t++ 5? X R++ tv-- b+ DI+++ D++ G e++>+++ h--- ++>+++ y+++* Weapons extension: ma- k++ F+2 X * Never pay more than 20 bucks for a computer game. * I'm a puny punmaker.
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Yes, and Starbucks is like dishwater.
Starbucks is just about all dark roast, which although not inherently evil, often allows cheap coffee to be used (and in their case sold for excessive prices). Unfortunately, Trader Joe's tends toward dark roasts as well; unfortunately, because some of theirs are good and reasonable (others, not so much; don't bother with their Kona, but if they ever have Jamaica Blue Mountain again, it was good and a reasonable price for that, even if not top-notch; and their "Smooth and Mellow Blend" is decent).
ftp> get |fortune 377 I/O error: smart remark generator failed
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Yes, and Starbucks is like dishwater.
Starbucks is just about all dark roast, which although not inherently evil, often allows cheap coffee to be used (and in their case sold for excessive prices). Unfortunately, Trader Joe's tends toward dark roasts as well; unfortunately, because some of theirs are good and reasonable (others, not so much; don't bother with their Kona, but if they ever have Jamaica Blue Mountain again, it was good and a reasonable price for that, even if not top-notch; and their "Smooth and Mellow Blend" is decent).
ftp> get |fortune 377 I/O error: smart remark generator failed
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I agree there are differences. But I find the differences about the same as those between Coke and Pepsi. Basically the same thing.
Hogan
snorkie wrote:
Coke and Pepsi. Basically the same thing
Burn the heretic! BURN HIM!
Software Zen:
delete this; -
My coworkers were complaining because we ran out of Starbucks coffee and are now drinking Folgers. I can't taste much of a difference between the two and its free! Personally I would rather be hooked on the cheap stuff anyway!
Hogan
Oh, I am so much of a snob, it's painful. I buy online only because nothing in the stores is worth a crap. I have several different coffee making utensils, like a ceramic filter holder that sits on top of the cup, a water heater with 1-degree accuracy so I can heat the water to the perfect temperature, an espresso press that I use at work, and a Japanese hand-powered bean grinder, because there's so much darn Zen in grinding your own beans by hand. I prefer the Italian roast to all others, although a really good but not burnt French roast can be a pleasure as well. I've tried the flavored varieties, but I always come back to un-flavored. As far as beans go, the Arabica is the one I most commonly drink, only because it is the most common bean to be found in these here parts, y'all. The Kona bean is interesting, but I'm not keen on the flavors. The Kenya AA is a darn good bean as well, but my favorite (currently) is the Jamaican Blue Mountain bean. When I make my single cups of coffee by pouring 209-degree (F) water over Jamaican Blue beans ground moments before and letting the water drip for several minutes through an oil-absorbing filter to remove the majority of any bitterness, my wife calls me a snob. I love it. :)
