Looking for VPN recommendations
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Stefan_Lang wrote:
that for VPN I need to choose a provider.
Which means you're issue of caring about who has what data is still there. Now, it will be a VPN provider who sees your data. :^)
There are two kinds of people in the world: those who can extrapolate from incomplete data. There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
True. But supposedly many of them don't actually store these data. My greatest fear isn't so much who sees it now, but who may be gaining access to it for darker reasons in the future. With most internet companies located in the US, any of them might hand over data about me to any three letter 'intelligence' organization on a whim. Also, hackers have the nasty habit of breaking into even the most secured databases, and they may have even worse ideas about what they could do with it. Data that isn't stored, can't be handed over, or stolen.
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
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I'd definitely recommend avoiding one VPN service in particular: Troy Hunt: The importance of trust and integrity in a VPN provider (and how MySafeVPN blew it)[^]
"These people looked deep within my soul and assigned me a number based on the order in which I joined." - Homer
Thanks for the warning. It's always hard to decide on something when you're not aware of the pitfalls. ;)
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
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Consider me a total noob regarding networking, but wouldn't a proxy run at the same location, by myself, defeat the purpose of obfuscating that information?
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
You can get remote proxys also, but if Geolocation is your biggest concern, then VPN might be better option. If it's more about preventing data flowing in/out of your internet without your knowledgethen you could use a proxy to monitor/prevent/block traffic into and out of your network.
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True. But supposedly many of them don't actually store these data. My greatest fear isn't so much who sees it now, but who may be gaining access to it for darker reasons in the future. With most internet companies located in the US, any of them might hand over data about me to any three letter 'intelligence' organization on a whim. Also, hackers have the nasty habit of breaking into even the most secured databases, and they may have even worse ideas about what they could do with it. Data that isn't stored, can't be handed over, or stolen.
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
Stefan_Lang wrote:
But supposedly many of them don't actually store these data.
Supposedly is the keyword there.
Stefan_Lang wrote:
gaining access to it for darker reasons in the future.
I guess I have no imagination on this subject. What possible darker reasons are there? What are you actually concerned might happen? (Not looking to fight, I genuinely don't know.)
There are two kinds of people in the world: those who can extrapolate from incomplete data. There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
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Thank you very much for the link. I always like a (somewhat?) neutral source to compare products.
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
Enjoy! ;)
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I'm so fed up with more and more applications (including Windows itself) requiring internet connections and sending out tons of data with little or no control about what is sent and what it is used for. Also, more and more web sites liberally use geolocation data to artificially restrict what I can use, and how. While in some cases, there may be a legal foundation for this behaviour, I doubt that is true most of the time. It doesn't seem like anyone even cares to point that out - which to me is just another red flag, and I am well within my rights to deny that information. Anyway, I was wondering about ways to at least confound all these user data abusing techniques. There are only two things that came to my mind: using TOR, and using a VPN. I'm not sure how much either will help, but I understand that for VPN I need to choose a provider. Different providers provide different services, for a price - or, sometimes, free. And I have no idea what to look out for. So, my question to the community is, do you have recommendations for a first-time VPN user who just wants to retain a lttle more control over his personal data, even if obtained only through obscurity? I don't mind if down/upload speeds go down a bit. Also - this might be a stupid question, but I simply don't know - would it affect my choice of VPN if I were to use TOR, or does it even make sense to use TOR over a VPN? P.S. (2017-4-10): best info found so far: That One Privacy Site | VPN Section[^]
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
Multi years user of PIA, no issues - they allow 5 devices to be set up, and they can be used in parallel (sometimes I also use it on my android phone for gelocation specific apps - like streaming sports - I watch a brand of footy that's free to stream if you're "in Europe." - UK, Germany, Netherlands ... PIA lots of locations to choose from.) But, even before that: a lot of the data ms collects can already be blocked - disabling some task scheduler jobs - and using the windows firewall (firewall with advanced security - free, already built-in) 1. set it to filter outbound as well as in-bound connections 2. but then you will need to add rules, for say your browser - see next paragraph to make that easier 3. then disable some of the default outbound firewall rules (need to experiment which matter or not). On top of firewall with advanced security I use WFN (free, source code available) which shows a nice popup whenever any program without a rule tries to open a outbound connection, options to allow/block permanent/temporary (it writes the firewall rules for you) - for instance your browser needs to be able to connect outbound start the browser, click allow on the popup - done. - microsoft office apps absolutely do not (o2016 - no problems killing it's outbound)! start word, click deny on the popup, done! (need to do separartelt for excel etc) - some installers may need an outbound connection: use a temporary rule, WFN cleans it up by clicking the notification icon. Antivirus wants to update definitions - temporary rule.... As a final step, don't use your ISP's DNS servers (they also usually use/report what you've been looking for - and if done a deal with ms they share the data with them), set the DNS server to some other reputable public servers (i.e. open DNS: 208.67.222.222, google 8.8.8.8) - network adapter settings - IPv4 - properties
Sin tack the any key okay
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I'm so fed up with more and more applications (including Windows itself) requiring internet connections and sending out tons of data with little or no control about what is sent and what it is used for. Also, more and more web sites liberally use geolocation data to artificially restrict what I can use, and how. While in some cases, there may be a legal foundation for this behaviour, I doubt that is true most of the time. It doesn't seem like anyone even cares to point that out - which to me is just another red flag, and I am well within my rights to deny that information. Anyway, I was wondering about ways to at least confound all these user data abusing techniques. There are only two things that came to my mind: using TOR, and using a VPN. I'm not sure how much either will help, but I understand that for VPN I need to choose a provider. Different providers provide different services, for a price - or, sometimes, free. And I have no idea what to look out for. So, my question to the community is, do you have recommendations for a first-time VPN user who just wants to retain a lttle more control over his personal data, even if obtained only through obscurity? I don't mind if down/upload speeds go down a bit. Also - this might be a stupid question, but I simply don't know - would it affect my choice of VPN if I were to use TOR, or does it even make sense to use TOR over a VPN? P.S. (2017-4-10): best info found so far: That One Privacy Site | VPN Section[^]
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
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Stefan_Lang wrote:
But supposedly many of them don't actually store these data.
Supposedly is the keyword there.
Stefan_Lang wrote:
gaining access to it for darker reasons in the future.
I guess I have no imagination on this subject. What possible darker reasons are there? What are you actually concerned might happen? (Not looking to fight, I genuinely don't know.)
There are two kinds of people in the world: those who can extrapolate from incomplete data. There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
RyanDev wrote:
What possible darker reasons are there?
To be honest, I have trouble coming up with a concrete example. But in real life I learned that just because you can't think of a way how someone could take advantage of you, that there isn't one. As a programmer, I try to watch out for unexpected errors. I don't know what bugs the programs I write will expose in the future. It's not that I built them into the program on purpose, but I simply didn't forsee the specific circumstances causing an issue. Therefore I take precautions to restrict the likelyhood of bugs, and the effect that they can have. As a private person, I watch out for unexpected ways others can take advantage of me. Unfortunately I don't have a sufficiently dark mind to think of all such possibilities. Therefore, as a precaution, I try to keep as much of my personal information close to me as possible. That way I am offering a smaller attack surface, and I limit the potential damage others could cause me.
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
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Multi years user of PIA, no issues - they allow 5 devices to be set up, and they can be used in parallel (sometimes I also use it on my android phone for gelocation specific apps - like streaming sports - I watch a brand of footy that's free to stream if you're "in Europe." - UK, Germany, Netherlands ... PIA lots of locations to choose from.) But, even before that: a lot of the data ms collects can already be blocked - disabling some task scheduler jobs - and using the windows firewall (firewall with advanced security - free, already built-in) 1. set it to filter outbound as well as in-bound connections 2. but then you will need to add rules, for say your browser - see next paragraph to make that easier 3. then disable some of the default outbound firewall rules (need to experiment which matter or not). On top of firewall with advanced security I use WFN (free, source code available) which shows a nice popup whenever any program without a rule tries to open a outbound connection, options to allow/block permanent/temporary (it writes the firewall rules for you) - for instance your browser needs to be able to connect outbound start the browser, click allow on the popup - done. - microsoft office apps absolutely do not (o2016 - no problems killing it's outbound)! start word, click deny on the popup, done! (need to do separartelt for excel etc) - some installers may need an outbound connection: use a temporary rule, WFN cleans it up by clicking the notification icon. Antivirus wants to update definitions - temporary rule.... As a final step, don't use your ISP's DNS servers (they also usually use/report what you've been looking for - and if done a deal with ms they share the data with them), set the DNS server to some other reputable public servers (i.e. open DNS: 208.67.222.222, google 8.8.8.8) - network adapter settings - IPv4 - properties
Sin tack the any key okay
Thank you for writing up all that advice. I'll see if I can make something of that - as I mentioned above, I'm not very familiar with all these networking options. WFN sounds nice: we already had to adjust the router firewall settings because it blocked a program. Sounds like WFN is just the right program to deal with these kind of things.
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
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RyanDev wrote:
What possible darker reasons are there?
To be honest, I have trouble coming up with a concrete example. But in real life I learned that just because you can't think of a way how someone could take advantage of you, that there isn't one. As a programmer, I try to watch out for unexpected errors. I don't know what bugs the programs I write will expose in the future. It's not that I built them into the program on purpose, but I simply didn't forsee the specific circumstances causing an issue. Therefore I take precautions to restrict the likelyhood of bugs, and the effect that they can have. As a private person, I watch out for unexpected ways others can take advantage of me. Unfortunately I don't have a sufficiently dark mind to think of all such possibilities. Therefore, as a precaution, I try to keep as much of my personal information close to me as possible. That way I am offering a smaller attack surface, and I limit the potential damage others could cause me.
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
Stefan_Lang wrote:
But in real life I learned that just because you can't think of a way how someone could take advantage of you, that there isn't one.
Of course. I feel like this is similar to if someone wanted to come by my house and take a picture of my grass or my tree. What specific data are you concerned about? What sites you are seeing? I'm not even sure what else they could get.
There are two kinds of people in the world: those who can extrapolate from incomplete data. There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
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Stefan_Lang wrote:
But in real life I learned that just because you can't think of a way how someone could take advantage of you, that there isn't one.
Of course. I feel like this is similar to if someone wanted to come by my house and take a picture of my grass or my tree. What specific data are you concerned about? What sites you are seeing? I'm not even sure what else they could get.
There are two kinds of people in the world: those who can extrapolate from incomplete data. There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
Ah, you're thinking of browsing. I'm more concerned about stuff like Microsofts CompatTelRunner that does scan your entire hard disks even if you don't participate in CEIP. MS states that (1) it should only be running if you participate, which is a blatant lie, (2) that you can uninstall and hide the related KB update(s), which doesn't help since they wrapped up all KB updates in the cumulative updates, and hidden updates will keep getting unhidden on a regular basis, (3) that it doesn't report any data that I should be concerned about, which I don't believe because of (1) and (2). Any confidential data stored on my disks, including e.g. stuff related to my work, is effectively compromised by MS, no less.
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
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Ah, you're thinking of browsing. I'm more concerned about stuff like Microsofts CompatTelRunner that does scan your entire hard disks even if you don't participate in CEIP. MS states that (1) it should only be running if you participate, which is a blatant lie, (2) that you can uninstall and hide the related KB update(s), which doesn't help since they wrapped up all KB updates in the cumulative updates, and hidden updates will keep getting unhidden on a regular basis, (3) that it doesn't report any data that I should be concerned about, which I don't believe because of (1) and (2). Any confidential data stored on my disks, including e.g. stuff related to my work, is effectively compromised by MS, no less.
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
Stefan_Lang wrote:
Any confidential data stored on my disks, including e.g. stuff related to my work, is effectively compromised by MS, no less.
So, you're concerned they might send your Microsoft Money file to their servers? Technically, any program you install on your PC has the capability to do that. But that's fair. A couple of times I've had charges show up on my credit card that I did not do. First time I called and disputed. Gone. Second time, I did it online. No big deal. Not that it couldn't be worse but I guess I don't see it as enough of a threat to worry too much about it.
There are two kinds of people in the world: those who can extrapolate from incomplete data. There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
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I'm so fed up with more and more applications (including Windows itself) requiring internet connections and sending out tons of data with little or no control about what is sent and what it is used for. Also, more and more web sites liberally use geolocation data to artificially restrict what I can use, and how. While in some cases, there may be a legal foundation for this behaviour, I doubt that is true most of the time. It doesn't seem like anyone even cares to point that out - which to me is just another red flag, and I am well within my rights to deny that information. Anyway, I was wondering about ways to at least confound all these user data abusing techniques. There are only two things that came to my mind: using TOR, and using a VPN. I'm not sure how much either will help, but I understand that for VPN I need to choose a provider. Different providers provide different services, for a price - or, sometimes, free. And I have no idea what to look out for. So, my question to the community is, do you have recommendations for a first-time VPN user who just wants to retain a lttle more control over his personal data, even if obtained only through obscurity? I don't mind if down/upload speeds go down a bit. Also - this might be a stupid question, but I simply don't know - would it affect my choice of VPN if I were to use TOR, or does it even make sense to use TOR over a VPN? P.S. (2017-4-10): best info found so far: That One Privacy Site | VPN Section[^]
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
I'm a big fan of Nord. I've used them for over a year and am very happy with their performance. /ravi
My new year resolution: 2048 x 1536 Home | Articles | My .NET bits | Freeware ravib(at)ravib(dot)com
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Thanks for the suggestion but it doesn't seem 1.NET offers anything I don't already have. More importantly, it doesn't appear to offer any of the obfuscation I was hoping to gain by using a VPN and/or TOR. As for VPN disadvantages, I am sure there are some, but if it's the only way to achieve what I want, that may not be relevant.
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
If obfuscation is what you are after, then VPN only offer a leaky protection since it works at IP level. The domain names have to be resolved before leaving the entry point of VPN, which means your applications (browser or anything else) have to make requests to local DNS providers ... 1-NET and maybe TOR can let the other end of the "VPN" tunnel to make DNS requests for you and thus transfer you browsing history completely to the other end ...
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Thanks for the suggestion but it doesn't seem 1.NET offers anything I don't already have. More importantly, it doesn't appear to offer any of the obfuscation I was hoping to gain by using a VPN and/or TOR. As for VPN disadvantages, I am sure there are some, but if it's the only way to achieve what I want, that may not be relevant.
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
And also, 1-NET is designed to have both ends of the "VPN" tunnel under a user's control (self hosting, not using third party services), there is no third party logging involved ...
Find more in 1-NET: connects your resources anywhere[^]. Email searcher Email Aggregation Manager[^].
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I'm a big fan of Nord. I've used them for over a year and am very happy with their performance. /ravi
My new year resolution: 2048 x 1536 Home | Articles | My .NET bits | Freeware ravib(at)ravib(dot)com
Sheer coincidence that my PIA is due for renewal again Ravi: plus my thanks for the recco of Nord. hate auto renewal (your payment details on file), so had disabled that on PIA - now getting nags: 'reminder: only a few days left' - no standard option for one-off payment (re-sub, allow payment, unsub - still you get the full year usage but with nags) Time to go shopping: summary Nord vs PIA: (seems to be the 2 best from reviews) speed/feat/service: equivalent. PIA slightly cheaper (not by much) ... ... but now: Nord 2 years 72% off (even go direct without the coupons): nice timing. - realise Nord also want payment details on file - let's see how that goes back thought: hope Nord deep discounts are not signs they are going down.
Sin tack the any key okay
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Sheer coincidence that my PIA is due for renewal again Ravi: plus my thanks for the recco of Nord. hate auto renewal (your payment details on file), so had disabled that on PIA - now getting nags: 'reminder: only a few days left' - no standard option for one-off payment (re-sub, allow payment, unsub - still you get the full year usage but with nags) Time to go shopping: summary Nord vs PIA: (seems to be the 2 best from reviews) speed/feat/service: equivalent. PIA slightly cheaper (not by much) ... ... but now: Nord 2 years 72% off (even go direct without the coupons): nice timing. - realise Nord also want payment details on file - let's see how that goes back thought: hope Nord deep discounts are not signs they are going down.
Sin tack the any key okay
Lopatir wrote:
realise Nord also want payment details on file
I use my PayPal account to pay them. /ravi
My new year resolution: 2048 x 1536 Home | Articles | My .NET bits | Freeware ravib(at)ravib(dot)com
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Stefan_Lang wrote:
Any confidential data stored on my disks, including e.g. stuff related to my work, is effectively compromised by MS, no less.
So, you're concerned they might send your Microsoft Money file to their servers? Technically, any program you install on your PC has the capability to do that. But that's fair. A couple of times I've had charges show up on my credit card that I did not do. First time I called and disputed. Gone. Second time, I did it online. No big deal. Not that it couldn't be worse but I guess I don't see it as enough of a threat to worry too much about it.
There are two kinds of people in the world: those who can extrapolate from incomplete data. There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
RyanDev wrote:
So, you're concerned they might send your Microsoft Money file to their servers?
Erm, no. I'm not so much concerned over data they send to their servers, but third parties hacking their servers and doing real bad stuff with it. MS might be using my data to take advantage of me, but I trust they won't do it in such a big way that it hurts me real bad - after all they've still got some reputation (and money) left to lose. But others may have less scruples. But all of this is missing the point. I was looking for advice on VPN, not to discuss privacy. I am concerned, for various reasons. VPN seems a good way to reduce the risks. I am well aware that it may not solve the issue entirely, but I rather do something than nothing at all.
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
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I'm so fed up with more and more applications (including Windows itself) requiring internet connections and sending out tons of data with little or no control about what is sent and what it is used for. Also, more and more web sites liberally use geolocation data to artificially restrict what I can use, and how. While in some cases, there may be a legal foundation for this behaviour, I doubt that is true most of the time. It doesn't seem like anyone even cares to point that out - which to me is just another red flag, and I am well within my rights to deny that information. Anyway, I was wondering about ways to at least confound all these user data abusing techniques. There are only two things that came to my mind: using TOR, and using a VPN. I'm not sure how much either will help, but I understand that for VPN I need to choose a provider. Different providers provide different services, for a price - or, sometimes, free. And I have no idea what to look out for. So, my question to the community is, do you have recommendations for a first-time VPN user who just wants to retain a lttle more control over his personal data, even if obtained only through obscurity? I don't mind if down/upload speeds go down a bit. Also - this might be a stupid question, but I simply don't know - would it affect my choice of VPN if I were to use TOR, or does it even make sense to use TOR over a VPN? P.S. (2017-4-10): best info found so far: That One Privacy Site | VPN Section[^]
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
You can setup your own on cloud, I have done this and able to VPN my way out of blocks (Even in China). I have 2 VPNs setup, one in USA (Ubuntu VM, AWS - Free!!) and another one in Singapore (Win Server VM, Azure) I have setup OpenVPN access server on both. Here is a guide I followed for setting up VPN on AWS[^] The link for setting up on windows is dead now, though I have it on my onenote, I can provide it if you need.
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And also, 1-NET is designed to have both ends of the "VPN" tunnel under a user's control (self hosting, not using third party services), there is no third party logging involved ...
Find more in 1-NET: connects your resources anywhere[^]. Email searcher Email Aggregation Manager[^].
Following your link, my impression was that 1-NETs main purpose is the connection of your devices, not so much the obscuring of your presence in the web. The direct device-to-device connections may offer the obscuring as a side-effect, but I don't see how it would help me when I (or some unwanted program service on my system) connect to anything else on the web. It surely looks interesting for the specific purpose of connecting my devices. But beyond that, I'd still need an actual VPN.
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
