Is the Bitcoin bubble going to burst (soon)?
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Eddy Vluggen wrote:
You just need to transfer 3000 dollar in administration fees :)
So you are the prince from Zamunda Nigeria?
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I have been watching with interest over the last week at the continuing rise in Bitcoin and other leading digital currencies. It was only a few days ago that it had crossed the 2000 usd mark, and today has seen continued rise and is currently sitting around the $2700 and basically double where it was on a few weeks ago. Of course there is also a lot of interest in Ethereum, Litecoin and Ripple, the later I had never heard of until only a couple of days ago. I remember I had mined some Dogecoin back in 2014, and it has sat in a backed up wallet, back then it was worth 25 USD and now is apparently valued at 340 or something like that. When you start digging around and looking at various financial analysts making statements of 10K USD by the end of the year, to 1M USD in the next 5 years once the currency stabilises, which have to wonder if this is all going to end in tears. Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but when I think back to when I contemplated buying at 600usd, and then again at 1300usd...is it time to take a punt or not! Anybody here been stashing and forgot about them? Or anyone else following what's going on?
Dave Find Me On:Web|Youtube|Facebook|Twitter|LinkedIn Folding Stats: Team CodeProject
Who knows. But more interesting is the whole concept of block chains and digital transactions, not just for currency, but for any kind of contractual arrangement. At the end of the day, it'll be the lawyers, as usual, that win. ;) Marc
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Who knows. But more interesting is the whole concept of block chains and digital transactions, not just for currency, but for any kind of contractual arrangement. At the end of the day, it'll be the lawyers, as usual, that win. ;) Marc
Latest Article - Create a Dockerized Python Fiddle Web App Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802
The technology behind them is really interesting. Blockchain is relatively simple concept to grasp once I looked at a few of the explanation videos and articles when it first came on the scene. However, I'm still trying to understand the technology underpinning Ethereum which is based on "Smart Contracts" and haven't got a clue about the new kid on the block which is causing a stir "Ripple".
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Who knows. But more interesting is the whole concept of block chains and digital transactions, not just for currency, but for any kind of contractual arrangement. At the end of the day, it'll be the lawyers, as usual, that win. ;) Marc
Latest Article - Create a Dockerized Python Fiddle Web App Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802
blockchain is interesting but also the biggest problem with bitcoin. Its present size is a few gigabytes, when only a few people use bitcoins for transactions. Imagine where will that size grow if it was used daily by millions of people... infeasible! so I don't think there's any future in bitcoin, and it's just a classic bubble a friend of mine was trying to convince me into buying bitcoins last Christmas, when the price was under $1000. On what reasonable grounds did it double in size in half a year other than speculation?
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W∴ Balboos wrote:
1 - Online Extortion relies heavily on this type of currency. They'd suddenly be broke.
Because ransomware did not exist before the introduction of the BitCoin?
W∴ Balboos wrote:
2 - If they did extortion with real currency it could be traced and we could boil them in oil.
No, thanks to banks a lot of electronic fiat cannot be traced. Which reminds me, I got a donation to your name in the value of a million dollar. You just need to transfer 3000 dollar in administration fees :)
W∴ Balboos wrote:
3 - If they cashed in their bitcoin, the appearance of real money would be traceable (and taxable).
There's nothing to cash in - BC is cash*. -- *) for the given context.
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I mostly agree with you, but BC made it a whole lot safer and easier to cash in the ransom. I also saw a case where real life kidnappers wanted BC as ransom payment. It makes the job of authorities a lot harder and for the criminals a lot easier. If you think about putting safety measures to prevent someone entering your home, it won't really prevent it, but heck, it may just make the guy look somewhere easier.
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I mostly agree with you, but BC made it a whole lot safer and easier to cash in the ransom. I also saw a case where real life kidnappers wanted BC as ransom payment. It makes the job of authorities a lot harder and for the criminals a lot easier. If you think about putting safety measures to prevent someone entering your home, it won't really prevent it, but heck, it may just make the guy look somewhere easier.
To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems - Homer Simpson ---- Our heads are round so our thoughts can change direction - Francis Picabia
Fabio Franco wrote:
I also saw a case where real life kidnappers wanted BC as ransom payment. It makes the job of authorities a lot harder and for the criminals a lot easier.
The currency that is most used (globally) for illegal transactions is the American Dollar. :)
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Fabio Franco wrote:
I also saw a case where real life kidnappers wanted BC as ransom payment. It makes the job of authorities a lot harder and for the criminals a lot easier.
The currency that is most used (globally) for illegal transactions is the American Dollar. :)
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Eddy Vluggen wrote:
The currency that is most used (globally) for illegal transactions is the American Dollar.
I know. It's because it's the most accepted currency worldwide too.
To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems - Homer Simpson ---- Our heads are round so our thoughts can change direction - Francis Picabia
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blockchain is interesting but also the biggest problem with bitcoin. Its present size is a few gigabytes, when only a few people use bitcoins for transactions. Imagine where will that size grow if it was used daily by millions of people... infeasible! so I don't think there's any future in bitcoin, and it's just a classic bubble a friend of mine was trying to convince me into buying bitcoins last Christmas, when the price was under $1000. On what reasonable grounds did it double in size in half a year other than speculation?
umeca74 wrote:
On what reasonable grounds did it double in size in half a year other than speculation?
Increased demand and larger acceptance-base, as reported by multiple financial institutions. Since April, the BC is a legal form of payment in Japan.
umeca74 wrote:
so I don't think there's any future in bitcoin, and it's just a classic bubble
I doubt you'd recognize a bubble if you were in one; most Americans don't have gold or bitcoins, but (tech)stocks, student-loans and their own house. I do not see the demand for housing grow, and the large tech companies are struggling to be profitable :)
umeca74 wrote:
when only a few people use bitcoins for transactions.
It is no longer "a few people". Please explain how the CURRENT situation is infeasible?
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Eddy Vluggen wrote:
The currency that is most used (globally) for illegal transactions is the American Dollar.
I know. It's because it's the most accepted currency worldwide too.
To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems - Homer Simpson ---- Our heads are round so our thoughts can change direction - Francis Picabia
Where BC is painted to be used by criminals and people who evade taxes. Again, most of that is in dollars. BC is beyond state-control, and most countries do not like that idea. Which must mean that it is the best invention since sliced bread.
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Where BC is painted to be used by criminals and people who evade taxes. Again, most of that is in dollars. BC is beyond state-control, and most countries do not like that idea. Which must mean that it is the best invention since sliced bread.
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Eddy Vluggen wrote:
Where BC is painted to be used by criminals and people who evade taxes.
Like I said, I mostly agree with you. But it does make their activities easier, but I never mentioned it's only useful to them, or that BC is mostly used by them. Like many things in life there are the upsides and downsides to it. The idea that government can't control it is actually really comforting. What I don't like about it is that it doesn't have any kind of material or service attached to it, so it floats like hell. I wouldn't keep a BC savings account for example, it's much too volatile and a big question mark. I would though use it as a small slice of my investments. It has potential, but I also fear it will eventually burst. To me it has the same value as the loan papers that caused US's real state bubble burst. It's based on something that 'may' pay.
To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems - Homer Simpson ---- Our heads are round so our thoughts can change direction - Francis Picabia
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Eddy Vluggen wrote:
Where BC is painted to be used by criminals and people who evade taxes.
Like I said, I mostly agree with you. But it does make their activities easier, but I never mentioned it's only useful to them, or that BC is mostly used by them. Like many things in life there are the upsides and downsides to it. The idea that government can't control it is actually really comforting. What I don't like about it is that it doesn't have any kind of material or service attached to it, so it floats like hell. I wouldn't keep a BC savings account for example, it's much too volatile and a big question mark. I would though use it as a small slice of my investments. It has potential, but I also fear it will eventually burst. To me it has the same value as the loan papers that caused US's real state bubble burst. It's based on something that 'may' pay.
To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems - Homer Simpson ---- Our heads are round so our thoughts can change direction - Francis Picabia
Fabio Franco wrote:
What I don't like about it is that it doesn't have any kind of material or service attached to it, so it floats like hell.
Incorrect. Its value is derived from the fact that there are limited amounts of them. Since it is a new currency, you can expect wild swings until a fair price is found.
Fabio Franco wrote:
To me it has the same value as the loan papers that caused US's real state bubble burst. It's based on something that 'may' pay.
It is not a money-generating asset, so it would only pay if you speculate in the currency. It is a store of value however, and since demand has a lot room left to grow, I'd even argue that we are a long way from a bubble. A bank is something that 'may' pay; as long as not everyone tries that simultaneous :D
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Fabio Franco wrote:
What I don't like about it is that it doesn't have any kind of material or service attached to it, so it floats like hell.
Incorrect. Its value is derived from the fact that there are limited amounts of them. Since it is a new currency, you can expect wild swings until a fair price is found.
Fabio Franco wrote:
To me it has the same value as the loan papers that caused US's real state bubble burst. It's based on something that 'may' pay.
It is not a money-generating asset, so it would only pay if you speculate in the currency. It is a store of value however, and since demand has a lot room left to grow, I'd even argue that we are a long way from a bubble. A bank is something that 'may' pay; as long as not everyone tries that simultaneous :D
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Eddy Vluggen wrote:
Its value is derived from the fact that there are limited amounts of them.
Still, no material attached to it. Government currencies have at least some material or service attached to it (like gold, properties, etc).
Eddy Vluggen wrote:
a lot room left to grow, I'd even argue that we are a long way from a bubble.
I agree on that, but still specifically bound to speculation. I see that trend change since acceptance is growing (Japan accepts it as an official currency) and it's potential to have material attached to it grows. I may be wrong in my views, I am not a financial expert, but I wouldn't jump with my both feet on it.
Eddy Vluggen wrote:
A bank is something that 'may' pay; as long as not everyone tries that simultaneous :-D
Yep, won't challenge that :laugh:
To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems - Homer Simpson ---- Our heads are round so our thoughts can change direction - Francis Picabia
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Is the Bitcoin bubble going to burst? For sure. When? Who knows. Should you invest? How is your appetite for risk? Three reasons to fear the coming crash in bitcoins - MarketWatch[^] Five Of The Largest Asset Bubbles In History | Investopedia[^]
Peter Wasser "The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell
Now... dropping like a lead balloon!
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W∴ Balboos wrote:
1 - Online Extortion relies heavily on this type of currency. They'd suddenly be broke.
Because ransomware did not exist before the introduction of the BitCoin?
W∴ Balboos wrote:
2 - If they did extortion with real currency it could be traced and we could boil them in oil.
No, thanks to banks a lot of electronic fiat cannot be traced. Which reminds me, I got a donation to your name in the value of a million dollar. You just need to transfer 3000 dollar in administration fees :)
W∴ Balboos wrote:
3 - If they cashed in their bitcoin, the appearance of real money would be traceable (and taxable).
There's nothing to cash in - BC is cash*. -- *) for the given context.
Bastard Programmer from Hell :suss: If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^][](X-Clacks-Overhead: GNU Terry Pratchett)
Because ransomware did not exist before the introduction of the BitCoin?
Correlation is not causality.
No, thanks to banks a lot of electronic fiat cannot be traced.
Don't know much about forensics, do you?
There's nothing to cash in - BC is cash*.
"cashing in" requires, at some point, a trade of something for something ELSE. At some point, it turns into someTHING that has intrinsic value.. Chickens, bread, Gold...
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Eddy Vluggen wrote:
Its value is derived from the fact that there are limited amounts of them.
Still, no material attached to it. Government currencies have at least some material or service attached to it (like gold, properties, etc).
Eddy Vluggen wrote:
a lot room left to grow, I'd even argue that we are a long way from a bubble.
I agree on that, but still specifically bound to speculation. I see that trend change since acceptance is growing (Japan accepts it as an official currency) and it's potential to have material attached to it grows. I may be wrong in my views, I am not a financial expert, but I wouldn't jump with my both feet on it.
Eddy Vluggen wrote:
A bank is something that 'may' pay; as long as not everyone tries that simultaneous :-D
Yep, won't challenge that :laugh:
To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems - Homer Simpson ---- Our heads are round so our thoughts can change direction - Francis Picabia
Fabio Franco wrote:
Still, no material attached to it.
It is not a physical thing, but a mathematical thing. And due to the fact that they are, they're usefull as a means of exchange. And no, goverment money is not backed by gold.
Fabio Franco wrote:
I wouldn't jump with my both feet on it.
I can't even afford tipping toes in it.
Bastard Programmer from Hell :suss: If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^][](X-Clacks-Overhead: GNU Terry Pratchett)
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Because ransomware did not exist before the introduction of the BitCoin?
Correlation is not causality.
No, thanks to banks a lot of electronic fiat cannot be traced.
Don't know much about forensics, do you?
There's nothing to cash in - BC is cash*.
"cashing in" requires, at some point, a trade of something for something ELSE. At some point, it turns into someTHING that has intrinsic value.. Chickens, bread, Gold...
Member 12009066 wrote:
Correlation is not causality.
No, it ain't, but it does show that it is a rediculous claim that BC is enabling it.
Member 12009066 wrote:
Don't know much about forensics, do you?
That's a brilliant deduction, dear Watson. And there's still enough banks that provide "privacy"; that's why the caribean is such a popular destionation. Did you just choose to ignore the news?
Member 12009066 wrote:
"cashing in" requires, at some point, a trade of something for something ELSE. At some point, it turns into someTHING that has intrinsic value.. Chickens, bread, Gold...
BC has intrinsic value; it is a mathematical limited entity. Like gold-coins, it is merely trading your stored value against something that is usefull (for you).
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I have been watching with interest over the last week at the continuing rise in Bitcoin and other leading digital currencies. It was only a few days ago that it had crossed the 2000 usd mark, and today has seen continued rise and is currently sitting around the $2700 and basically double where it was on a few weeks ago. Of course there is also a lot of interest in Ethereum, Litecoin and Ripple, the later I had never heard of until only a couple of days ago. I remember I had mined some Dogecoin back in 2014, and it has sat in a backed up wallet, back then it was worth 25 USD and now is apparently valued at 340 or something like that. When you start digging around and looking at various financial analysts making statements of 10K USD by the end of the year, to 1M USD in the next 5 years once the currency stabilises, which have to wonder if this is all going to end in tears. Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but when I think back to when I contemplated buying at 600usd, and then again at 1300usd...is it time to take a punt or not! Anybody here been stashing and forgot about them? Or anyone else following what's going on?
Dave Find Me On:Web|Youtube|Facebook|Twitter|LinkedIn Folding Stats: Team CodeProject
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I have been watching with interest over the last week at the continuing rise in Bitcoin and other leading digital currencies. It was only a few days ago that it had crossed the 2000 usd mark, and today has seen continued rise and is currently sitting around the $2700 and basically double where it was on a few weeks ago. Of course there is also a lot of interest in Ethereum, Litecoin and Ripple, the later I had never heard of until only a couple of days ago. I remember I had mined some Dogecoin back in 2014, and it has sat in a backed up wallet, back then it was worth 25 USD and now is apparently valued at 340 or something like that. When you start digging around and looking at various financial analysts making statements of 10K USD by the end of the year, to 1M USD in the next 5 years once the currency stabilises, which have to wonder if this is all going to end in tears. Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but when I think back to when I contemplated buying at 600usd, and then again at 1300usd...is it time to take a punt or not! Anybody here been stashing and forgot about them? Or anyone else following what's going on?
Dave Find Me On:Web|Youtube|Facebook|Twitter|LinkedIn Folding Stats: Team CodeProject
Fear and Greed drive all markets. Right now, you fighting between the two... Are you missing out [greed] (yes), is it too late (maybe) [Fear of taking the loss] The problem is that WAITING is what causes the insanity to get bad enough to get in at the end, and hold through the biggest losses, and sometimes never recover. assume there is a 100% chance of 100% loss. if you are okay with that, then buy. If not, don't beat yourself up for not getting in. Look at the one person who lost theirs after buying it. Finally, know your entry, know your exit. I recently took a trade that rocketed up, I sold 75% and sat on the last 25%. I made nice profits even if 25% goes to zero. And sure enough, it has now reversed and is going to zero. I followed my plan, limited my losses, locked in my gains. Also, be sure to backup your bitcoins! MANY MANY people have lost theirs, tossed hard drives, and thumbdrives, etc. Only to realize much later.
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Fabio Franco wrote:
Still, no material attached to it.
It is not a physical thing, but a mathematical thing. And due to the fact that they are, they're usefull as a means of exchange. And no, goverment money is not backed by gold.
Fabio Franco wrote:
I wouldn't jump with my both feet on it.
I can't even afford tipping toes in it.
Bastard Programmer from Hell :suss: If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^][](X-Clacks-Overhead: GNU Terry Pratchett)
Eddy Vluggen wrote:
And no, goverment money is not backed by gold.
That's not true. Of course it's not like the old days, today a very small percentage of most governments is gold (a few still a lot), but there are other commodities.
To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems - Homer Simpson ---- Our heads are round so our thoughts can change direction - Francis Picabia
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Eddy Vluggen wrote:
And no, goverment money is not backed by gold.
That's not true. Of course it's not like the old days, today a very small percentage of most governments is gold (a few still a lot), but there are other commodities.
To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems - Homer Simpson ---- Our heads are round so our thoughts can change direction - Francis Picabia
Fabio Franco wrote:
That's not true
Go ask your central bank. There is nothing backing the modern currencies.
Fabio Franco wrote:
oday a very small percentage of most governments is gold (a few still a lot), but there are other commodities.
Owned by governments, does not make it a collateral for the outstanding paper/fiat money. Multiple modern bankrupcies have proven that.
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