Manufacturers using Tamper Proof Screws on equipment I Bought and Own
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Hi, We all know those screws with no Star, Slot, Philips op Posidrive self tapping screws. Star(Torque) and Hex Drives with a pip in the centre to stop me inserting a standard tool to undo the screw. The question is 'Why' manufacturers go to this length. I am talkin about small domestic appliances, for instance Irons and Toasters. It has been mentioned that they try to protect a patent inside. Well, if I was after discovering an important patent, I would go to the Patents Office, and request the Patent Documentation. Moreover, if I indeed wanted to look inside to see how it works, a hacksaw and an angle grinder would in most if not all cases give me access to the innards. Another reason that has been mentioned is 'Consumer Safety' That comes into play were voltages seriously higher than 240/380 Volt come into play. Historically, a Colour CRT had a voltage applied in the range of around 40kV. Never seen tamper proof screws used in these scenario's. Another app is the Power Supply in a Microwave Oven, which uses a Voltage Multiplier Stack to generate voltages between 4 and 16 kV. Never found any security screws there either. A Further reason stated was: 'No User Serviceable Parts Inside', in other words, This is Our Area, Don't Go There. That is the most annoying one. I do not rent the appliance, I Bought it, and I own it. It is for me to do with as I wish, modify it as I wish, and accepting that as soon as I open or modify it, that I am out on my own, and that factory guarantees are null and void. All in all, I do not accept that I should be locked out of an appliance I have bought, by tamperproof screws. Running a Laundrette for 20 years, Irons fail, mostly because of a temperature over run, and the thermal fuse failing. A Steam Generator Iron? All works on 220/240 Volt. Nothing of extreme danger there. Fit a New Thermal Fuse and the item will work again. By fitting tamper proof screws, the manufacturer makes such repair difficult, if not impossible. We get on average a Year out of an Iron by repairing. On average each Iron needs 3 repairs in it's one year life, before it is written off and dismantled for spares. Tamperproof Screws work against the motto of 'Repair, Re-Use, Re-Cycle' -
Bram van Kampen
I think this whole topic is not valid in light if reality... The reality? Yes, it's yours to do with what you want - but then you sue after you hurt yourself or burn down your apartment building...(then your neighbors sue you - then all of you sue the iron company) So, you cannot look at this topic without taking into account the liability people like you, yes you, create for honest companies... Two idiots in NJ (some time ago) picked up a running lawnmower and used it to cut hedges...they failed and got hurt...They won in court.... That's why all the 'stupid' restrictions...Now grow up and understand the world your infantile demands have created....
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Hi, We all know those screws with no Star, Slot, Philips op Posidrive self tapping screws. Star(Torque) and Hex Drives with a pip in the centre to stop me inserting a standard tool to undo the screw. The question is 'Why' manufacturers go to this length. I am talkin about small domestic appliances, for instance Irons and Toasters. It has been mentioned that they try to protect a patent inside. Well, if I was after discovering an important patent, I would go to the Patents Office, and request the Patent Documentation. Moreover, if I indeed wanted to look inside to see how it works, a hacksaw and an angle grinder would in most if not all cases give me access to the innards. Another reason that has been mentioned is 'Consumer Safety' That comes into play were voltages seriously higher than 240/380 Volt come into play. Historically, a Colour CRT had a voltage applied in the range of around 40kV. Never seen tamper proof screws used in these scenario's. Another app is the Power Supply in a Microwave Oven, which uses a Voltage Multiplier Stack to generate voltages between 4 and 16 kV. Never found any security screws there either. A Further reason stated was: 'No User Serviceable Parts Inside', in other words, This is Our Area, Don't Go There. That is the most annoying one. I do not rent the appliance, I Bought it, and I own it. It is for me to do with as I wish, modify it as I wish, and accepting that as soon as I open or modify it, that I am out on my own, and that factory guarantees are null and void. All in all, I do not accept that I should be locked out of an appliance I have bought, by tamperproof screws. Running a Laundrette for 20 years, Irons fail, mostly because of a temperature over run, and the thermal fuse failing. A Steam Generator Iron? All works on 220/240 Volt. Nothing of extreme danger there. Fit a New Thermal Fuse and the item will work again. By fitting tamper proof screws, the manufacturer makes such repair difficult, if not impossible. We get on average a Year out of an Iron by repairing. On average each Iron needs 3 repairs in it's one year life, before it is written off and dismantled for spares. Tamperproof Screws work against the motto of 'Repair, Re-Use, Re-Cycle' -
Bram van Kampen
Also, despite the stickers or screws that warn warranty void if opened, that is not true. Legally, they have to prove that your opening and modifying the device caused it to fail. If I replace the battery in my phone and the screen goes out, then the screen is covered because obviously the two are unrelated. As far as the star screw with the stub in the middle, a drill bit can take care of that. Actually, a screw extractor can take care of any security screw, just have the right sized one on hand to replace it.
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Hi, We all know those screws with no Star, Slot, Philips op Posidrive self tapping screws. Star(Torque) and Hex Drives with a pip in the centre to stop me inserting a standard tool to undo the screw. The question is 'Why' manufacturers go to this length. I am talkin about small domestic appliances, for instance Irons and Toasters. It has been mentioned that they try to protect a patent inside. Well, if I was after discovering an important patent, I would go to the Patents Office, and request the Patent Documentation. Moreover, if I indeed wanted to look inside to see how it works, a hacksaw and an angle grinder would in most if not all cases give me access to the innards. Another reason that has been mentioned is 'Consumer Safety' That comes into play were voltages seriously higher than 240/380 Volt come into play. Historically, a Colour CRT had a voltage applied in the range of around 40kV. Never seen tamper proof screws used in these scenario's. Another app is the Power Supply in a Microwave Oven, which uses a Voltage Multiplier Stack to generate voltages between 4 and 16 kV. Never found any security screws there either. A Further reason stated was: 'No User Serviceable Parts Inside', in other words, This is Our Area, Don't Go There. That is the most annoying one. I do not rent the appliance, I Bought it, and I own it. It is for me to do with as I wish, modify it as I wish, and accepting that as soon as I open or modify it, that I am out on my own, and that factory guarantees are null and void. All in all, I do not accept that I should be locked out of an appliance I have bought, by tamperproof screws. Running a Laundrette for 20 years, Irons fail, mostly because of a temperature over run, and the thermal fuse failing. A Steam Generator Iron? All works on 220/240 Volt. Nothing of extreme danger there. Fit a New Thermal Fuse and the item will work again. By fitting tamper proof screws, the manufacturer makes such repair difficult, if not impossible. We get on average a Year out of an Iron by repairing. On average each Iron needs 3 repairs in it's one year life, before it is written off and dismantled for spares. Tamperproof Screws work against the motto of 'Repair, Re-Use, Re-Cycle' -
Bram van Kampen
My refrigerator started freezing. the guy showed me the PLASTIC part. He says they break every 6-8 yrs to encourage you buying a new one. They used to be metal. My Pontiac Aztec has had EVERY window motor kit replaced. The driver side window, 3 times. The mechanic showed me the PLASTIC wheel that used to be aluminum. He said he has seen the old ones last for 20yrs. The new ones get about 4-6 (so just after they come off lease). And the cheap ones you get to replace them cost LESS than the LABOR to install them. There are 2 things going on. First is planned obsolescence, and the second is non-user servicable. Find the tools, and fix them. Like you are doing. KitchenAid has a great standing blender. Well, the CONSUMER one is basically the same as the commercial, but again, one of the main gears is now made of plastic instead of metal. It breaks. The original design was all metal and have been handed down from grand parents. That is now the Commercial version. It is clearly not accidental. So, I wonder what your feeling would be about buying a TRACTOR from John Deere, only to find out that software can shut you out of performing repairs? [Why American Farmers Are Hacking Their Tractors With Ukrainian Firmware - Motherboard](https://motherboard.vice.com/en\_us/article/why-american-farmers-are-hacking-their-tractors-with-ukrainian-firmware)
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Hi, We all know those screws with no Star, Slot, Philips op Posidrive self tapping screws. Star(Torque) and Hex Drives with a pip in the centre to stop me inserting a standard tool to undo the screw. The question is 'Why' manufacturers go to this length. I am talkin about small domestic appliances, for instance Irons and Toasters. It has been mentioned that they try to protect a patent inside. Well, if I was after discovering an important patent, I would go to the Patents Office, and request the Patent Documentation. Moreover, if I indeed wanted to look inside to see how it works, a hacksaw and an angle grinder would in most if not all cases give me access to the innards. Another reason that has been mentioned is 'Consumer Safety' That comes into play were voltages seriously higher than 240/380 Volt come into play. Historically, a Colour CRT had a voltage applied in the range of around 40kV. Never seen tamper proof screws used in these scenario's. Another app is the Power Supply in a Microwave Oven, which uses a Voltage Multiplier Stack to generate voltages between 4 and 16 kV. Never found any security screws there either. A Further reason stated was: 'No User Serviceable Parts Inside', in other words, This is Our Area, Don't Go There. That is the most annoying one. I do not rent the appliance, I Bought it, and I own it. It is for me to do with as I wish, modify it as I wish, and accepting that as soon as I open or modify it, that I am out on my own, and that factory guarantees are null and void. All in all, I do not accept that I should be locked out of an appliance I have bought, by tamperproof screws. Running a Laundrette for 20 years, Irons fail, mostly because of a temperature over run, and the thermal fuse failing. A Steam Generator Iron? All works on 220/240 Volt. Nothing of extreme danger there. Fit a New Thermal Fuse and the item will work again. By fitting tamper proof screws, the manufacturer makes such repair difficult, if not impossible. We get on average a Year out of an Iron by repairing. On average each Iron needs 3 repairs in it's one year life, before it is written off and dismantled for spares. Tamperproof Screws work against the motto of 'Repair, Re-Use, Re-Cycle' -
Bram van Kampen
There is a Right to Repair[^] movement in the US that is trying to stop manufacturers from preventing owners from repairing things. In the US, it's state-by-state legislation. Right now, Nebraska's legislation[^] is the one most under fire. Its amusing to see what excuses and rationalizations the corporations come up with.
I live in Oregon, and I'm an engineer.
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Not 40 kV. Had it been 40 kV, the x-ray negative of your skeleton would have been printed on the wall behind you. The limit was 25 kV, which was just low enough for the leaded glass to keep the x-ray emission from exiting the tube and nuking your progeny. BTW search a little more and you will find bits that will unlock your cryptic screws for you. Triangular, fork-like, torx with a dot, you name it.
I'm reminded of the line: "Father forgive them, they know not what they do." In your case though, you know not of what you speak. 25KV was not the limit, they used special glass in some of the later tubes, I remember personally encountering voltages of 30KV, and after I had left doing TV repair, reading of 35KV. I have no doubt that things went up from there. Stop showing your ignorance, and let things be said, there are far more knowledgeable folks out there than yourself.
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charlieg wrote:
don't buy Samsung laptops
Don't buy Samsung products period. The only Samsung product that I have owned that didn't die early is my Android phone (Galaxy S4). BluRay Player: stopped recognizing BluRay disks after 11 months Multi-Function Printer: became a $300 paperweight in less than a year after every sheet of paper would jam with no clear way to repair 26" Widescreen Monitor: rendered useless when the transformer/filter for the back-light fried. Luckily I was able to order that $1.75 part from China and there were lots of how-to fix videos on the internet. I don't think I will buy another Samsung product again.
if (Object.DividedByZero == true) { Universe.Implode(); } Meus ratio ex fortis machina. Simplicitatis de formae ac munus. -Foothill, 2016
Don't get me started on my Samsung dishwasher. Best money I ever spent was the maintenance plan. After 18 months of self-maintenance, I said screw it. Sears was easily past twice the original price of the dishwasher by the time they finally fixed it. Never again
Charlie Gilley <italic>Stuck in a dysfunctional matrix from which I must escape... "Where liberty dwells, there is my country." B. Franklin, 1783 “They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” BF, 1759
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You can buy "tamper proof" screw bit sets on Fleabay for peanuts - I have a few - so they don't really impact Repair, Reuse, Recycle in any significant way. They do prevent idiots getting them open while plugged in with a kitchen knife and suing the manufacturers when they hurt themselves and burn the house down. Most products these days are just that: replaceable products that are designed to be replaced relatively quickly. This is why I pay extra: my toaster for example is a Dualit instead of a Russell Hobbs because it's made of real metal, held together with real screws, and all the parts are buyable on FleaBay. If you are breaking irons every four months, you are buying domestic irons and using them industrially. I prefer the reverse: buy industrial and use domestically!
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay... AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!
Well, I know these bits, and, they could do the trick, but for the fact that it needs a 3 inch length to reach down the bottom of the 9/32" hole where the screw head is located. The ones for sale here are 1 inch long. They come with an extension which does not fit down the hole. Had the manufacturer used Standard Torq, Pozidrive or Philips Head screws, the problem would not have arisen.
Bram van Kampen
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charlieg wrote:
don't buy Samsung laptops
Don't buy Samsung products period. The only Samsung product that I have owned that didn't die early is my Android phone (Galaxy S4). BluRay Player: stopped recognizing BluRay disks after 11 months Multi-Function Printer: became a $300 paperweight in less than a year after every sheet of paper would jam with no clear way to repair 26" Widescreen Monitor: rendered useless when the transformer/filter for the back-light fried. Luckily I was able to order that $1.75 part from China and there were lots of how-to fix videos on the internet. I don't think I will buy another Samsung product again.
if (Object.DividedByZero == true) { Universe.Implode(); } Meus ratio ex fortis machina. Simplicitatis de formae ac munus. -Foothill, 2016
Well, I Agree, Don't buy Samsung Mobile Phones either. My Wife's Samsung Galaxy phone's battery stopped holding charge after 9 months from new. Batteries replaced, phone repaired, and repaired again, Never fully Fixed. Then, a Samsung phone caught fire while charging, in the house of a friend of my daughter, somewhere in Ireland. Two young people dead. My wife retired her Samsung Galaxy since.
Bram van Kampen
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Alright, I have to tell this one. 2 weeks ago my wife's hybrid car threw all kinds of error messages. The traction battery was dead and had to be replaced. That's the big one. She was near a dealer so drove it right in. They said it would be $3,200 to install a new battery pack. I said, uh, thanks, I'll fix it myself. They said ha, you can't do that. Long story short, last weekend we took the back of the car apart, extracted the battery pack, put it on the bench, isolated the dead cell. Ordered a new cell from China. Installed it, balanced the cells, reinstalled the pack, cleared the errors, tested the car, runs like new again. Total cost including shipping of the new cell $39. They have all kinds of warning about you will die a horrible electric death if you touch this. Well, I touched it.
Well, You nearly make me eat my complaint, and I hope you are still alive to read this. Say your traction battery has an action radius of say 160 miles, and, assume say a conservative gas equivalent of 20 miles per galon. The battery then stores the energy equivalent of 8 galon of gas. That constitutes a serious Molotov cocktail that you now store in your garage and drive along the road. This would be something that should be done properly, so as to protect your own, and also public safety. The first question is, are the cells you buy from china for $39 fully up to spec, or, are they rejects that 'Still Work', but may become dangerous later in their life. I would be very weary of doing something like that myself, before I appraised myself of all the facts in the matter, including how to quality test the cells. This is actually a different issue. It comes down to: 'Should the Public be allowed to Create a Potential Fire Bomb'. I am unaware of legislation in the US, but would not at all be surprised if it was allowed there. Here in the UK, such things would be strictly forbidden by law.
Bram van Kampen
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Well, You nearly make me eat my complaint, and I hope you are still alive to read this. Say your traction battery has an action radius of say 160 miles, and, assume say a conservative gas equivalent of 20 miles per galon. The battery then stores the energy equivalent of 8 galon of gas. That constitutes a serious Molotov cocktail that you now store in your garage and drive along the road. This would be something that should be done properly, so as to protect your own, and also public safety. The first question is, are the cells you buy from china for $39 fully up to spec, or, are they rejects that 'Still Work', but may become dangerous later in their life. I would be very weary of doing something like that myself, before I appraised myself of all the facts in the matter, including how to quality test the cells. This is actually a different issue. It comes down to: 'Should the Public be allowed to Create a Potential Fire Bomb'. I am unaware of legislation in the US, but would not at all be surprised if it was allowed there. Here in the UK, such things would be strictly forbidden by law.
Bram van Kampen
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Not 40 kV. Had it been 40 kV, the x-ray negative of your skeleton would have been printed on the wall behind you. The limit was 25 kV, which was just low enough for the leaded glass to keep the x-ray emission from exiting the tube and nuking your progeny. BTW search a little more and you will find bits that will unlock your cryptic screws for you. Triangular, fork-like, torx with a dot, you name it.
No, Not to get into a Side Line argument, but I distinctly remember to have to buy a probe for UpTo 50 kV. My old one went up to 25 kV, and blew a link when used on a HT system marked 40 kV. Should not have tried it, but, at the time 'I was Young and Foolish'. I remember measuring 32 kV, indicating that the Line FlyBack transformer had a few shorted windings. Replaced same, and, the system worked again, bringing the voltage up to the specified 38.75 kV. This was in the late 1980's. I understand the issue with X-Rays, however, the manufacturers of these CRT Tubes must have found a way around the problems. I was at the time fixing TV's for friends, not designing CRT's
Bram van Kampen
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I think this whole topic is not valid in light if reality... The reality? Yes, it's yours to do with what you want - but then you sue after you hurt yourself or burn down your apartment building...(then your neighbors sue you - then all of you sue the iron company) So, you cannot look at this topic without taking into account the liability people like you, yes you, create for honest companies... Two idiots in NJ (some time ago) picked up a running lawnmower and used it to cut hedges...they failed and got hurt...They won in court.... That's why all the 'stupid' restrictions...Now grow up and understand the world your infantile demands have created....
Well,
Member 11375229 wrote:
Two idiots in NJ (some time ago) picked up a running lawnmower and used it to cut hedges...they failed and got hurt...They won in court....
Well, I assume that the defendant in the case left a running lawnmower in a public place, which would be reckless behaviour, punishable by law if an accident occurs as a result. I doubt that the manufacturer of the lawnmower was held liable in that case. There are indeed issues about public safety, which I addressed elsewhere in this discussion. Everybody, in Every Action in their life, does things which can attract liability. From walking down the pavement to crossing the road. If the state were to protect us against all of this, the only way to do that would be a universal directive for everybody to stay at home and in bed. Then we would all die from hunger and thirst. Whereas the manufacturer has a duty to provide merchandise meeting the required safety requirements, the duty to maintain these requirements passes from the seller to the buyer at the point of sale. The point is, that when I buy an Item, it is Mine, to do with as I wish. There are a number of exceptions to this in the UK, which I accept as 'Reasonable' Foremost are the 'Gas Regulations' Although I own my Gas Fired Central Heating Boiler, I am by law not allowed to interfere with it, reason being: I could blow up my neighbours house (as wel as my own) by a faulty service. This is not enforced by secret screws, but, by force of law.
Bram van Kampen
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I get 86 mpg in hybrid mode, and 163 mpg in fully automatic mode. I am still alive, but I now unsubscribing from this thread. I think you are insane. There is no point in continuing this nonsense.
Well, A Keg of Gas Petrol Diesel, Conventional Fuel, will not self ignite if kept in a drum or tank. The reason is, that it needs oxygen and a spark to ignite. Your battery cells have all components in the same container to produce this energy. I am actually not insane, I am a qualified Engineer of more than 40 years standing, and I do know what I am talking about. I am also concerned about your safety, so, please do not just dismiss me as talking nonsense. There is no nonsense about what I stated. In your figures you failed to mention the base line of 'Conventional Fuel Only' You are totally missing the point! That you miss that point worries me more! The Traction battery in your car stores energy! You do not seem to be aware of that concept, and treat it as replacing A1 batteries in a toy. Stored energy can be released in a regulated way by driving the car. Gas or Diesel is also a form of stored energy. In a conventional car, energy is supplied in the form of hydrocarbons, primarily gas, which is burned in your conventional engine. In this case, the fuel from the tank, is burned with the air we all breath. In short, the fuel in the tank kan not combust by itself, there is no oxygen in the tank. Despite the movies, conventional cars rarely explode. In the case of a Battery, there is also a chemical process going. That battery holds all chemicals needed to provide the chemical reaction to release the energy in the form of an electric current to drive your car. Lithium Ion batteries depend upon very finely crushed chemicals, being perfectly mixed. In the process of charging and discharging, the lithium compounds are changed from one compound to another. If this process is less than perfect, metallic Lithium, called Lithium Dendrites are formed They are at first small, but will grow over time, and start with 'self discharge', i.e. a Dead Cell. When a cell self discharges, it generates heat, ultimately causing the cell to melt, and making more short circuits leading into a run away situation, with ultimately the entire pack exploding We have seen this behaviour with mobile phone batteries, There is no reason why propulsive car batteries using the same technology, should be free from this explosion risk. By adding batteries from an unspecified source, you put yourself and others at danger. If you are happy to live with that in the US, fine with me. Just do not bring it to Europe.
Bram van Kampen
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Well, I know these bits, and, they could do the trick, but for the fact that it needs a 3 inch length to reach down the bottom of the 9/32" hole where the screw head is located. The ones for sale here are 1 inch long. They come with an extension which does not fit down the hole. Had the manufacturer used Standard Torq, Pozidrive or Philips Head screws, the problem would not have arisen.
Bram van Kampen
That just means you bought the cheap ones! :laugh: CT0715 X/Long Reach 32PC 150MM Hollow Torx Security Tamperproof Screwdriver Bits | eBay[^]
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay... AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!
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Well, A Keg of Gas Petrol Diesel, Conventional Fuel, will not self ignite if kept in a drum or tank. The reason is, that it needs oxygen and a spark to ignite. Your battery cells have all components in the same container to produce this energy. I am actually not insane, I am a qualified Engineer of more than 40 years standing, and I do know what I am talking about. I am also concerned about your safety, so, please do not just dismiss me as talking nonsense. There is no nonsense about what I stated. In your figures you failed to mention the base line of 'Conventional Fuel Only' You are totally missing the point! That you miss that point worries me more! The Traction battery in your car stores energy! You do not seem to be aware of that concept, and treat it as replacing A1 batteries in a toy. Stored energy can be released in a regulated way by driving the car. Gas or Diesel is also a form of stored energy. In a conventional car, energy is supplied in the form of hydrocarbons, primarily gas, which is burned in your conventional engine. In this case, the fuel from the tank, is burned with the air we all breath. In short, the fuel in the tank kan not combust by itself, there is no oxygen in the tank. Despite the movies, conventional cars rarely explode. In the case of a Battery, there is also a chemical process going. That battery holds all chemicals needed to provide the chemical reaction to release the energy in the form of an electric current to drive your car. Lithium Ion batteries depend upon very finely crushed chemicals, being perfectly mixed. In the process of charging and discharging, the lithium compounds are changed from one compound to another. If this process is less than perfect, metallic Lithium, called Lithium Dendrites are formed They are at first small, but will grow over time, and start with 'self discharge', i.e. a Dead Cell. When a cell self discharges, it generates heat, ultimately causing the cell to melt, and making more short circuits leading into a run away situation, with ultimately the entire pack exploding We have seen this behaviour with mobile phone batteries, There is no reason why propulsive car batteries using the same technology, should be free from this explosion risk. By adding batteries from an unspecified source, you put yourself and others at danger. If you are happy to live with that in the US, fine with me. Just do not bring it to Europe.
Bram van Kampen
I wouldn't worry. Looking at the mechanics in the average motor repair place - they are unlikely to have done a better job. In fact - most likely you would take extra care if this was your first time to fix this - compared to people who do it every day and become desensitized to the risks. True story, friend of mine did his own electrical wiring when he built a house. The inspector confronted him and said that it was obvious that it had not been done by an electrician. My friend buckled and told the truth. How did you know, he asked? The wiring was too perfect. Real electricians are as rough as guts. Technically - you are not legally allowed to change your own light bulbs. The world has gone mad. We try way to hard to wrap each other in cotton wool.
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I'm reminded of the line: "Father forgive them, they know not what they do." In your case though, you know not of what you speak. 25KV was not the limit, they used special glass in some of the later tubes, I remember personally encountering voltages of 30KV, and after I had left doing TV repair, reading of 35KV. I have no doubt that things went up from there. Stop showing your ignorance, and let things be said, there are far more knowledgeable folks out there than yourself.
Had this been an electronics forum, I would have probably given a more serious answer than the one I just did. Beyond that, I'll gladly let you have your sense of superiority if that makes you feel better :)
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So-called "tamper-proof" screws aren't designed to keep everyone out, they're just intended to discourage the amateurs. To that end, they're probably effective enough for manufacturers to keep using them.
Well, I would agree with that. At the same time tools should be available to the Non Amateurs.
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Well, I would agree with that. At the same time tools should be available to the Non Amateurs.
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Hi, We all know those screws with no Star, Slot, Philips op Posidrive self tapping screws. Star(Torque) and Hex Drives with a pip in the centre to stop me inserting a standard tool to undo the screw. The question is 'Why' manufacturers go to this length. I am talkin about small domestic appliances, for instance Irons and Toasters. It has been mentioned that they try to protect a patent inside. Well, if I was after discovering an important patent, I would go to the Patents Office, and request the Patent Documentation. Moreover, if I indeed wanted to look inside to see how it works, a hacksaw and an angle grinder would in most if not all cases give me access to the innards. Another reason that has been mentioned is 'Consumer Safety' That comes into play were voltages seriously higher than 240/380 Volt come into play. Historically, a Colour CRT had a voltage applied in the range of around 40kV. Never seen tamper proof screws used in these scenario's. Another app is the Power Supply in a Microwave Oven, which uses a Voltage Multiplier Stack to generate voltages between 4 and 16 kV. Never found any security screws there either. A Further reason stated was: 'No User Serviceable Parts Inside', in other words, This is Our Area, Don't Go There. That is the most annoying one. I do not rent the appliance, I Bought it, and I own it. It is for me to do with as I wish, modify it as I wish, and accepting that as soon as I open or modify it, that I am out on my own, and that factory guarantees are null and void. All in all, I do not accept that I should be locked out of an appliance I have bought, by tamperproof screws. Running a Laundrette for 20 years, Irons fail, mostly because of a temperature over run, and the thermal fuse failing. A Steam Generator Iron? All works on 220/240 Volt. Nothing of extreme danger there. Fit a New Thermal Fuse and the item will work again. By fitting tamper proof screws, the manufacturer makes such repair difficult, if not impossible. We get on average a Year out of an Iron by repairing. On average each Iron needs 3 repairs in it's one year life, before it is written off and dismantled for spares. Tamperproof Screws work against the motto of 'Repair, Re-Use, Re-Cycle' -
Bram van Kampen
www.mcmaster.com and search for tamper-resistant-torx-bits they will set you free! --Bob
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www.mcmaster.com and search for tamper-resistant-torx-bits they will set you free! --Bob
Thanx Bob, There is no issue with tamper resistant torx bits, they are readily available here, and I have a suitable set. it is a three winged Philips bit, of 3 inch length. [McMaster-Carr](http://www.mcmaster.com) does not seem to stock that one either. Thanks for your reply,
Bram van Kampen
