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  3. serverless: IT terminology gets dumberer

serverless: IT terminology gets dumberer

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  • R raddevus

    Even though you thought IT terminology couldn't get any dumber, the Marketers have found a way. I stumbled upon the term, serverless app / serverless microservice and looked it up... What is Serverless Computing? Serverless Definition | Cloudflare[^]

    from the web site entry:

    The term ‘serverless’ is somewhat misleading, as there are still servers providing these backend services, but all of the server space and infrastructure concerns are handled by the vendor. Serverless means that the developers can do their work without having to worry about servers at all.

    X| X| X| X| X| That's a 5-puke rating! :laugh:

    L Offline
    L Offline
    Lost User
    wrote on last edited by
    #2

    ... well, if the developers are doing work then surely they are also servers, working for their masters. but anyway there is such a thing as serverless without servers, pretty much anything designed as a single connection point-to-point is serverless, hell walkie-talkies for instance are serverless. (just thought of walkies coz today I was "supposed to carry one" around - hah! left the damn thing on the desk and walked away to another floor to do other stuff - crap anyway, couldn't understand a word through the crackle)

    Message Signature (Click to edit ->)

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    • R raddevus

      Even though you thought IT terminology couldn't get any dumber, the Marketers have found a way. I stumbled upon the term, serverless app / serverless microservice and looked it up... What is Serverless Computing? Serverless Definition | Cloudflare[^]

      from the web site entry:

      The term ‘serverless’ is somewhat misleading, as there are still servers providing these backend services, but all of the server space and infrastructure concerns are handled by the vendor. Serverless means that the developers can do their work without having to worry about servers at all.

      X| X| X| X| X| That's a 5-puke rating! :laugh:

      R Offline
      R Offline
      RickZeeland
      wrote on last edited by
      #3

      For those wondering what Serverless is all about, here is an overview of Serverless frameworks: https://www.slant.co/topics/9842/~serverless-frameworks[^] :-\

      1 Reply Last reply
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      • L Lost User

        ... well, if the developers are doing work then surely they are also servers, working for their masters. but anyway there is such a thing as serverless without servers, pretty much anything designed as a single connection point-to-point is serverless, hell walkie-talkies for instance are serverless. (just thought of walkies coz today I was "supposed to carry one" around - hah! left the damn thing on the desk and walked away to another floor to do other stuff - crap anyway, couldn't understand a word through the crackle)

        Message Signature (Click to edit ->)

        R Offline
        R Offline
        raddevus
        wrote on last edited by
        #4

        Lopatir wrote:

        but anyway there is such a thing as serverless without servers, pretty much anything designed as a single connection point-to-point

        Right, but they couldn't make up a new term for that since they already have "peer-to-peer". They had to invent a new technology ala serverless. :rolleyes:

        R 1 Reply Last reply
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        • R raddevus

          Lopatir wrote:

          but anyway there is such a thing as serverless without servers, pretty much anything designed as a single connection point-to-point

          Right, but they couldn't make up a new term for that since they already have "peer-to-peer". They had to invent a new technology ala serverless. :rolleyes:

          R Offline
          R Offline
          Rick York
          wrote on last edited by
          #5

          In my experience, what is passed off as "new technology" is often just the same old stuff with a different name.

          "They have a consciousness, they have a life, they have a soul! Damn you! Let the rabbits wear glasses! Save our brothers! Can I get an amen?"

          J 1 Reply Last reply
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          • R Rick York

            In my experience, what is passed off as "new technology" is often just the same old stuff with a different name.

            "They have a consciousness, they have a life, they have a soul! Damn you! Let the rabbits wear glasses! Save our brothers! Can I get an amen?"

            J Offline
            J Offline
            Jon McKee
            wrote on last edited by
            #6

            Kind of like how "microservices" is really just separation of concerns?

            T 1 Reply Last reply
            0
            • R raddevus

              Even though you thought IT terminology couldn't get any dumber, the Marketers have found a way. I stumbled upon the term, serverless app / serverless microservice and looked it up... What is Serverless Computing? Serverless Definition | Cloudflare[^]

              from the web site entry:

              The term ‘serverless’ is somewhat misleading, as there are still servers providing these backend services, but all of the server space and infrastructure concerns are handled by the vendor. Serverless means that the developers can do their work without having to worry about servers at all.

              X| X| X| X| X| That's a 5-puke rating! :laugh:

              M Offline
              M Offline
              Mark_Wallace
              wrote on last edited by
              #7

              Marketing morons and salesmen are usually of the type that doesn't understand a damned thing about technology, but can talk bollocks about sport with customers till the cows come home. So you need sports analogies, to get technical points across. Try "Do you think it would be possible to have serverless tennis, you **cking moron? The ball has to come from somewhere!" Catch The penny, as it drops.

              I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!

              R 1 Reply Last reply
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              • R raddevus

                Even though you thought IT terminology couldn't get any dumber, the Marketers have found a way. I stumbled upon the term, serverless app / serverless microservice and looked it up... What is Serverless Computing? Serverless Definition | Cloudflare[^]

                from the web site entry:

                The term ‘serverless’ is somewhat misleading, as there are still servers providing these backend services, but all of the server space and infrastructure concerns are handled by the vendor. Serverless means that the developers can do their work without having to worry about servers at all.

                X| X| X| X| X| That's a 5-puke rating! :laugh:

                Sander RosselS Offline
                Sander RosselS Offline
                Sander Rossel
                wrote on last edited by
                #8

                It's really very cool technology though... I've written about it and I'm planning on doing a presentation at my company later this year. With serverless I can finally host my websites and databases without needing my own physical server or a system admin for that matter. In that sense the word isn't even completely wrong, as far as I'm concerned there are no servers to worry about.

                Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Continuous Integration, Delivery, and Deployment arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly

                R L 2 Replies Last reply
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                • R raddevus

                  Even though you thought IT terminology couldn't get any dumber, the Marketers have found a way. I stumbled upon the term, serverless app / serverless microservice and looked it up... What is Serverless Computing? Serverless Definition | Cloudflare[^]

                  from the web site entry:

                  The term ‘serverless’ is somewhat misleading, as there are still servers providing these backend services, but all of the server space and infrastructure concerns are handled by the vendor. Serverless means that the developers can do their work without having to worry about servers at all.

                  X| X| X| X| X| That's a 5-puke rating! :laugh:

                  M Offline
                  M Offline
                  maze3
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #9

                  The only way I am going to keep my self sane on this is separating out "Server" the hardware and server software. MS SQL Server is not a Server. You will want to run that in Windows Server, which also is not a Server, but make sure you provision and heft Server to run that on. You would run SQL Server on a desktop, but a Server would be better.

                  R 1 Reply Last reply
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                  • J Jon McKee

                    Kind of like how "microservices" is really just separation of concerns?

                    T Offline
                    T Offline
                    theokr
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #10

                    LOL. I've spent a lot of time trying to be wowed by microseconds. I've not succeeded.

                    J 1 Reply Last reply
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                    • R raddevus

                      Even though you thought IT terminology couldn't get any dumber, the Marketers have found a way. I stumbled upon the term, serverless app / serverless microservice and looked it up... What is Serverless Computing? Serverless Definition | Cloudflare[^]

                      from the web site entry:

                      The term ‘serverless’ is somewhat misleading, as there are still servers providing these backend services, but all of the server space and infrastructure concerns are handled by the vendor. Serverless means that the developers can do their work without having to worry about servers at all.

                      X| X| X| X| X| That's a 5-puke rating! :laugh:

                      M Offline
                      M Offline
                      Marc Clifton
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #11

                      raddevus wrote:

                      Serverless means that the developers can do their work without having to worry about servers at all.

                      I've never worked at a company that provided servers while I worked. Would be nice. :rolleyes:

                      Latest Article - A Concise Overview of Threads Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802

                      R 1 Reply Last reply
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                      • M Mark_Wallace

                        Marketing morons and salesmen are usually of the type that doesn't understand a damned thing about technology, but can talk bollocks about sport with customers till the cows come home. So you need sports analogies, to get technical points across. Try "Do you think it would be possible to have serverless tennis, you **cking moron? The ball has to come from somewhere!" Catch The penny, as it drops.

                        I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!

                        R Offline
                        R Offline
                        raddevus
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #12

                        Mark_Wallace wrote:

                        Try "Do you think it would be possible to have serverless tennis, you **cking moron? The ball has to come from somewhere!"

                        :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup: :laugh:

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • Sander RosselS Sander Rossel

                          It's really very cool technology though... I've written about it and I'm planning on doing a presentation at my company later this year. With serverless I can finally host my websites and databases without needing my own physical server or a system admin for that matter. In that sense the word isn't even completely wrong, as far as I'm concerned there are no servers to worry about.

                          Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Continuous Integration, Delivery, and Deployment arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly

                          R Offline
                          R Offline
                          raddevus
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #13

                          Sander Rossel wrote:

                          as far as I'm concerned there are no servers to worry about.

                          I don't worry about gravity on a regular basis. Does that mean I am gravityless? :laugh:

                          R Sander RosselS 2 Replies Last reply
                          0
                          • M maze3

                            The only way I am going to keep my self sane on this is separating out "Server" the hardware and server software. MS SQL Server is not a Server. You will want to run that in Windows Server, which also is not a Server, but make sure you provision and heft Server to run that on. You would run SQL Server on a desktop, but a Server would be better.

                            R Offline
                            R Offline
                            raddevus
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #14

                            maze3 wrote:

                            The only way I am going to keep my self sane on this is separating out "Server" the hardware and server software.

                            That's a good point. And it is interesting that the word "server" is so ambiguous. Well, so many things in IT are ambiguous really. It's why so many people have the same titles but do entirely different things at different companies.

                            1 Reply Last reply
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                            • M Marc Clifton

                              raddevus wrote:

                              Serverless means that the developers can do their work without having to worry about servers at all.

                              I've never worked at a company that provided servers while I worked. Would be nice. :rolleyes:

                              Latest Article - A Concise Overview of Threads Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802

                              R Offline
                              R Offline
                              raddevus
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #15

                              Marc Clifton wrote:

                              I've never worked at a company that provided servers while I worked. Would be nice. :rolleyes:

                              A very good point. Have to hope for the hardware and then if you get it you have to beg for admin rights. :laugh:

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                              • R raddevus

                                Sander Rossel wrote:

                                as far as I'm concerned there are no servers to worry about.

                                I don't worry about gravity on a regular basis. Does that mean I am gravityless? :laugh:

                                R Offline
                                R Offline
                                rtischer8277
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #16

                                "as far as I am concerned there are no servers to worry about" and therein lies the problem. This thread explicitly lays the blame for the misinformation the 'serverless' term conveys at the feet of marketing. That much is a no-brainer. The real problem, as I see it, is the falsehood the quote conveys. There is plenty of reason to be wary of servers, server farms and data centers in general: lack of real data security, ownership and privacy, not to mention lack of inherent scalability. Let's see what happens when IoT blows up internet usage by a factor or 10 to 100 or more. I'm sure hierarchical providers will come up with stop-gap measures, but you can be assured they won't be real serverless solutions. For a real serverless archecture see www.hiveware.com.

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                0
                                • Sander RosselS Sander Rossel

                                  It's really very cool technology though... I've written about it and I'm planning on doing a presentation at my company later this year. With serverless I can finally host my websites and databases without needing my own physical server or a system admin for that matter. In that sense the word isn't even completely wrong, as far as I'm concerned there are no servers to worry about.

                                  Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Continuous Integration, Delivery, and Deployment arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly

                                  L Offline
                                  L Offline
                                  Lance Milleson
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #17

                                  But isn't your computer the server, then?

                                  Sander RosselS 1 Reply Last reply
                                  0
                                  • L Lance Milleson

                                    But isn't your computer the server, then?

                                    Sander RosselS Offline
                                    Sander RosselS Offline
                                    Sander Rossel
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #18

                                    No, the server is somewhere in some data center out of my control. My computer is only used for development.

                                    Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Continuous Integration, Delivery, and Deployment arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    0
                                    • R raddevus

                                      Sander Rossel wrote:

                                      as far as I'm concerned there are no servers to worry about.

                                      I don't worry about gravity on a regular basis. Does that mean I am gravityless? :laugh:

                                      Sander RosselS Offline
                                      Sander RosselS Offline
                                      Sander Rossel
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #19

                                      Only in space ;)

                                      Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Continuous Integration, Delivery, and Deployment arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly

                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      0
                                      • R raddevus

                                        Even though you thought IT terminology couldn't get any dumber, the Marketers have found a way. I stumbled upon the term, serverless app / serverless microservice and looked it up... What is Serverless Computing? Serverless Definition | Cloudflare[^]

                                        from the web site entry:

                                        The term ‘serverless’ is somewhat misleading, as there are still servers providing these backend services, but all of the server space and infrastructure concerns are handled by the vendor. Serverless means that the developers can do their work without having to worry about servers at all.

                                        X| X| X| X| X| That's a 5-puke rating! :laugh:

                                        R Offline
                                        R Offline
                                        Ryan Peden
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #20

                                        I used to be annoyed by the term 'serverless' until I stopped thinking of it as a description of the underlying technology, and started thinking of it as a description of the billing model. I don't have to care if it's running on a server, or a potato, or a kitten, as long as I'm always billed the same amount for the normalized amount of computing resources I've consumed. Overall, instead of 'serverless', I prefer Functions as as Service (FaaS). That gives a decent idea of what to expect, and gives a relatively easy way to compare it against IaaS (like EC2 and other bits of AWS) and PaaS (Like Azure App Service and Google App Engine).

                                        R 1 Reply Last reply
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                                        • R Ryan Peden

                                          I used to be annoyed by the term 'serverless' until I stopped thinking of it as a description of the underlying technology, and started thinking of it as a description of the billing model. I don't have to care if it's running on a server, or a potato, or a kitten, as long as I'm always billed the same amount for the normalized amount of computing resources I've consumed. Overall, instead of 'serverless', I prefer Functions as as Service (FaaS). That gives a decent idea of what to expect, and gives a relatively easy way to compare it against IaaS (like EC2 and other bits of AWS) and PaaS (Like Azure App Service and Google App Engine).

                                          R Offline
                                          R Offline
                                          raddevus
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #21

                                          Ryan Peden wrote:

                                          I prefer Functions as as Service (FaaS).

                                          I agree with you and I think your naming is much better. The whole issue was that I came across this serverless term and thought, "Hmm...is this a PWA (Progressive Web App) of some sort? Something just running on client?" Words are important! :rolleyes:

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