Aren't USB-C plugs meant to be symmetrical?
-
USB was the one port to solve all problems. The fact that there's USB-C proves it didn't.
Bastard Programmer from Hell :suss: "If you just follow the bacon Eddy, wherever it leads you, then you won't have to think about politics." -- Some Bell.
The problem isn't USB-C, but B, B SuperSpeed, Mini B, Micro B, Micro B SuperSpeed, and then C. Maybe you want to count in as well the A, Mini A, Mini AB and Micro AB. Anyone who seriously believes that C will be the very last USB connector ever is naive, to phrase it politely. Yet I'd say that for at least ten years, USB did deliver. Not only did we get rid of COM and LPT and SCSI (with umpteen different plugs) and PS/2 and DIN and 15-pin joystick port, but also several proprietary plugs that required dedicated extension cards plugged into the mainboard. We could tolerate the Mini B. But it got out of hand with the Micro B. From then on, chaos reigns.
-
When I got my first USB-C device, I did the unbelievable and looked up the spec. (Yes, I know RTFM is a swear word, and I'm donning appropriate PPE.) I was staggered at the complexity. The "major" signals, power, etc are "mirrored" (well, skew-mirrored) but some aren't. The device and chip-in-the-cable are meant to figure out between then which way is up. Maybe your extension isn't strictly "all pins 1:1", or its chip isn't playing nice. Ah, the joys of "smart" cables!
Software rusts. Simon Stephenson, ca 1994. So does this signature. me, 2012
When I got my first USB device (A Schock Flip Phone) I just returned the whole mess - I didn't want to have another device and charger when I've a dozen or so of the microUSB things that are everywhere. Further reading and I discover that the base-turds are changing over, everywhere, and all the old chargers will require adapters. So I went and bought back the Schock Flip Phone and go a ten-pack of really cheap adapater (micro USB to USB C) to sprinkle about my world. The life-changing event suffered by Chris goes a long way in explaining why it sometimes doesn't seem to work. At least the microUSB only goes in one way - depending, of course, on how angry you are.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
-
I've optimised my monitor / mouse / keyboard / zoom camera / phone charger / other phone charger / watch charger / headphone charger / zoom lamp setup so it's all neatly cabled to the back of my monitor. To do this I needed a USB-C extension cable. It mostly worked. Except for the mouse. OK: everything except the mouse. I tested the plugs, I swapped things in and out, I checked the mouse worked when plugged into the laptop directly. Nothing worked. Until I unplugged the USB-C extension cord, twisted it 180 degrees, and plugged it back in. Now it works. This makes no sense to me.
cheers Chris Maunder
My USB-C extension cable has this helpful label stuck to it:- "If there is a problem when connected with your mouse, keyboard, etc (USB 2.0 devices can only support one side), please reverse the female connector of the USB-C extension cable" USB-C connectors are symmetrical, but this also relies on the USB 3 device detecting which way round the connector is. USB 2 has no such detection, as it's connectors were never rotationally symmetrical. So I guess it's your USB 2 mouse not being able to detect the connection has been inverted.
-
Chris Maunder wrote:
Except for the mouse.
Since the computer mouse requires movement across flat surfaces the USB-C has to be twisted properly into the plug. This is the expected behavior to support the hardware interface and is a part of USB-C requirement for all computer mouse(s). Since keyboards are not moved across the surface they do not have this requirement. A lot of people don't know about this, but the standard is clearly stated in the docs: http://gutenberg.org/cache/epub/10000/pg10000.html[^] :rolleyes: Am i funny yet? :laugh:
-
My USB-C extension cable has this helpful label stuck to it:- "If there is a problem when connected with your mouse, keyboard, etc (USB 2.0 devices can only support one side), please reverse the female connector of the USB-C extension cable" USB-C connectors are symmetrical, but this also relies on the USB 3 device detecting which way round the connector is. USB 2 has no such detection, as it's connectors were never rotationally symmetrical. So I guess it's your USB 2 mouse not being able to detect the connection has been inverted.
Now that's interesting! I'm actually using the extension so I can gaffe tape my USSB-C hub to the back of my monitor. The hub has a short USB-C cable so the extension allows it to reach my mac. I was assuming the (cheap no-name brand) hub would have all the smarts to handle all the bits and pieces around USB-C to USB 2 negotiations. Live and learn.
cheers Chris Maunder
-
I've optimised my monitor / mouse / keyboard / zoom camera / phone charger / other phone charger / watch charger / headphone charger / zoom lamp setup so it's all neatly cabled to the back of my monitor. To do this I needed a USB-C extension cable. It mostly worked. Except for the mouse. OK: everything except the mouse. I tested the plugs, I swapped things in and out, I checked the mouse worked when plugged into the laptop directly. Nothing worked. Until I unplugged the USB-C extension cord, twisted it 180 degrees, and plugged it back in. Now it works. This makes no sense to me.
cheers Chris Maunder
-
I've optimised my monitor / mouse / keyboard / zoom camera / phone charger / other phone charger / watch charger / headphone charger / zoom lamp setup so it's all neatly cabled to the back of my monitor. To do this I needed a USB-C extension cable. It mostly worked. Except for the mouse. OK: everything except the mouse. I tested the plugs, I swapped things in and out, I checked the mouse worked when plugged into the laptop directly. Nothing worked. Until I unplugged the USB-C extension cord, twisted it 180 degrees, and plugged it back in. Now it works. This makes no sense to me.
cheers Chris Maunder
Broken wire
-
You have to align the quantum phase interface with the nearest zodiacal node.
Nothing succeeds like a budgie without teeth.
-
I've optimised my monitor / mouse / keyboard / zoom camera / phone charger / other phone charger / watch charger / headphone charger / zoom lamp setup so it's all neatly cabled to the back of my monitor. To do this I needed a USB-C extension cable. It mostly worked. Except for the mouse. OK: everything except the mouse. I tested the plugs, I swapped things in and out, I checked the mouse worked when plugged into the laptop directly. Nothing worked. Until I unplugged the USB-C extension cord, twisted it 180 degrees, and plugged it back in. Now it works. This makes no sense to me.
cheers Chris Maunder
It makes sense if it was dirty... which meant you overloaded the bandwidth but it worked with everything, EXCEPT THE MOUSE.
-
You have to align the quantum phase interface with the nearest zodiacal node.
Nothing succeeds like a budgie without teeth.
You forgot to tangled the Quantum Capacitors and cool the Delithium Crystals. "I canna' change the laws of physics." -- Montgomery "Scotty" Scott
-
Ah you youngsters. I never had such problems with RS-232.
"If we don't change direction, we'll end up where we're going"
As someone who deals with RS232, still, on a very normal basis, don't you remember the null-modem pin swaps? I still carry several DB9 null-modem adapters around with me in my backpack for testing. There is even a meme about it... something along the lines of "don't panic! swap pins 2 and 3 and carry on!" or something. So yes, even rs232 can be "backwards" (unfortunately).
-
As someone who deals with RS232, still, on a very normal basis, don't you remember the null-modem pin swaps? I still carry several DB9 null-modem adapters around with me in my backpack for testing. There is even a meme about it... something along the lines of "don't panic! swap pins 2 and 3 and carry on!" or something. So yes, even rs232 can be "backwards" (unfortunately).
Yeah, I think we had seven different ways of making null modem cables... That was including those on a full 25-pin RS232-plug with all the signals. On the 9-pin connectors, there were not that many alternatives. My experience with them is primarily as a college lecturer: If you ask our students who were CS students in the first half of the 1990, they still remember one single group project: That of implementing a (simplified) Kermit protocol between two PCs, after soldering up a null modem cable. This was their first encounter with multi-process (and even multi-machine) software debugging: It gave them the greatest frustrations of their study years, but also their greatest learning experience.
-
Ah you youngsters. I never had such problems with RS-232.
"If we don't change direction, we'll end up where we're going"
-
I've optimised my monitor / mouse / keyboard / zoom camera / phone charger / other phone charger / watch charger / headphone charger / zoom lamp setup so it's all neatly cabled to the back of my monitor. To do this I needed a USB-C extension cable. It mostly worked. Except for the mouse. OK: everything except the mouse. I tested the plugs, I swapped things in and out, I checked the mouse worked when plugged into the laptop directly. Nothing worked. Until I unplugged the USB-C extension cord, twisted it 180 degrees, and plugged it back in. Now it works. This makes no sense to me.
cheers Chris Maunder
did you try a different cable? If different cable works: then cable might not be properly wired up. If different cable has same issue when flipping: the mouse might not be wired to handle the data and power on the flipped pins. USB-a only has 4 pins. USB-c has 24, 12 doubled. The mouse likely switched from handle micro usb to C, so to save time and a penny cut the need to fully wire up all the pins
-
I've optimised my monitor / mouse / keyboard / zoom camera / phone charger / other phone charger / watch charger / headphone charger / zoom lamp setup so it's all neatly cabled to the back of my monitor. To do this I needed a USB-C extension cable. It mostly worked. Except for the mouse. OK: everything except the mouse. I tested the plugs, I swapped things in and out, I checked the mouse worked when plugged into the laptop directly. Nothing worked. Until I unplugged the USB-C extension cord, twisted it 180 degrees, and plugged it back in. Now it works. This makes no sense to me.
cheers Chris Maunder
it's a safe passage so they can once again reintroduce a new plug
-
did you try a different cable? If different cable works: then cable might not be properly wired up. If different cable has same issue when flipping: the mouse might not be wired to handle the data and power on the flipped pins. USB-a only has 4 pins. USB-c has 24, 12 doubled. The mouse likely switched from handle micro usb to C, so to save time and a penny cut the need to fully wire up all the pins
I flipped it. It worked. I moved on :)
cheers Chris Maunder