Your opinion ob language to create a website / blog.
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Whatever language you select, you will wind up shouting "golf course words" before long.
4? :)
The less you need, the more you have. Even a blind squirrel gets a nut...occasionally. JaxCoder.com
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I have decided to get more serious with doing websites. Not mobile phones or IOT applications. I have experience with MS windows Web Forms. I have always worked in VB6, VB.Net and C#. I'd like to know your opinion on what is the "best" language to learn to do this. "Best" for me means : 1. Easy to learn. 2. Easy to use. 3. Final product is "secure". 4. Easy to integrate with MS SQLServer 5. Easy to maintain and modify is necessary. 6. Well documented with code examples, tips, hints, etc. Yes, I know this is a lot to ask, and will involve compromises on my part. I have purchased "Python for Dummies" but not yet started reading/using it. I dont want to spend a lot on time on it if there is something out there better.
Curious in NOLA
I use MVC Framework Tutorial for Beginners: What is, Architecture & Example[^] because it's intuitive and well documented. None are what you would call easy to learn. You will get many different opinions on this subject. Good luck
The less you need, the more you have. Even a blind squirrel gets a nut...occasionally. JaxCoder.com
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I have decided to get more serious with doing websites. Not mobile phones or IOT applications. I have experience with MS windows Web Forms. I have always worked in VB6, VB.Net and C#. I'd like to know your opinion on what is the "best" language to learn to do this. "Best" for me means : 1. Easy to learn. 2. Easy to use. 3. Final product is "secure". 4. Easy to integrate with MS SQLServer 5. Easy to maintain and modify is necessary. 6. Well documented with code examples, tips, hints, etc. Yes, I know this is a lot to ask, and will involve compromises on my part. I have purchased "Python for Dummies" but not yet started reading/using it. I dont want to spend a lot on time on it if there is something out there better.
Curious in NOLA
My personal current favourite "stack" for websites is: Front-end: React Redux - optional, used for state management and has a reasonably steep learning curve. Typescript Antd Making extensive use of npm(a package manager for javascript libraries) Back end (API): C# Database: SQLServer Are those front-end front technologies easy to learn? If I can learn them... They all work well together and there is also plenty of documentation on those front-end technologies.
“That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.”
― Christopher Hitchens
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4? :)
The less you need, the more you have. Even a blind squirrel gets a nut...occasionally. JaxCoder.com
Yes, 4 letter words.
Software Zen:
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I have decided to get more serious with doing websites. Not mobile phones or IOT applications. I have experience with MS windows Web Forms. I have always worked in VB6, VB.Net and C#. I'd like to know your opinion on what is the "best" language to learn to do this. "Best" for me means : 1. Easy to learn. 2. Easy to use. 3. Final product is "secure". 4. Easy to integrate with MS SQLServer 5. Easy to maintain and modify is necessary. 6. Well documented with code examples, tips, hints, etc. Yes, I know this is a lot to ask, and will involve compromises on my part. I have purchased "Python for Dummies" but not yet started reading/using it. I dont want to spend a lot on time on it if there is something out there better.
Curious in NOLA
When you say "web sites", I'm assuming some flavor of ASP.Net. Most code samples will be in C#, but that's not really a hindrance since there are plenty of online converters to go to vb.net. I would still go with c# anyway, though, because most .net jobs are C#. Whether or not your product is "secure" has no bearing on what language you're using. "Easy to maintain" is dependant on how good of a coder you are, and how thorough and appropriate your code comments are. Integration with SQL server (or any back-end for that matter) is pretty simple, regardless of the language. You can either roll your own DAL, or you can use one of the many ORMs available. The defacto ORM is Entity Framework when you're talking about ASP.Net in any of its flavors. You don't need python to do ASP.Net web sites.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013 -
I have decided to get more serious with doing websites. Not mobile phones or IOT applications. I have experience with MS windows Web Forms. I have always worked in VB6, VB.Net and C#. I'd like to know your opinion on what is the "best" language to learn to do this. "Best" for me means : 1. Easy to learn. 2. Easy to use. 3. Final product is "secure". 4. Easy to integrate with MS SQLServer 5. Easy to maintain and modify is necessary. 6. Well documented with code examples, tips, hints, etc. Yes, I know this is a lot to ask, and will involve compromises on my part. I have purchased "Python for Dummies" but not yet started reading/using it. I dont want to spend a lot on time on it if there is something out there better.
Curious in NOLA
What you list are typically "plug ins" that can be found on any decent hosting site. A static web site, assuming you had your subject matter prepared, would take a few hours to set up; same day. Add a cart, another hour. Add a picture gallery: a function of how well you had your pix organized in the first place. Etc. It's not a language question; it's a component question. ("component-based architecture")
It was only in wine that he laid down no limit for himself, but he did not allow himself to be confused by it. ― Confucian Analects: Rules of Confucius about his food
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I have decided to get more serious with doing websites. Not mobile phones or IOT applications. I have experience with MS windows Web Forms. I have always worked in VB6, VB.Net and C#. I'd like to know your opinion on what is the "best" language to learn to do this. "Best" for me means : 1. Easy to learn. 2. Easy to use. 3. Final product is "secure". 4. Easy to integrate with MS SQLServer 5. Easy to maintain and modify is necessary. 6. Well documented with code examples, tips, hints, etc. Yes, I know this is a lot to ask, and will involve compromises on my part. I have purchased "Python for Dummies" but not yet started reading/using it. I dont want to spend a lot on time on it if there is something out there better.
Curious in NOLA
Slow Eddie wrote:
I have experience with MS windows Web Forms. I have always worked in VB6, VB.Net and C#.
Ditto.
Slow Eddie wrote:
I'd like to know your opinion on what is the "best" language to learn to do this
There's two languages there; one for the server, one for the client. Server side may be familiar. Server side, I'd recommend Apache with Mono.
Bastard Programmer from Hell :suss: "If you just follow the bacon Eddy, wherever it leads you, then you won't have to think about politics." -- Some Bell.
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I have decided to get more serious with doing websites. Not mobile phones or IOT applications. I have experience with MS windows Web Forms. I have always worked in VB6, VB.Net and C#. I'd like to know your opinion on what is the "best" language to learn to do this. "Best" for me means : 1. Easy to learn. 2. Easy to use. 3. Final product is "secure". 4. Easy to integrate with MS SQLServer 5. Easy to maintain and modify is necessary. 6. Well documented with code examples, tips, hints, etc. Yes, I know this is a lot to ask, and will involve compromises on my part. I have purchased "Python for Dummies" but not yet started reading/using it. I dont want to spend a lot on time on it if there is something out there better.
Curious in NOLA
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I have decided to get more serious with doing websites. Not mobile phones or IOT applications. I have experience with MS windows Web Forms. I have always worked in VB6, VB.Net and C#. I'd like to know your opinion on what is the "best" language to learn to do this. "Best" for me means : 1. Easy to learn. 2. Easy to use. 3. Final product is "secure". 4. Easy to integrate with MS SQLServer 5. Easy to maintain and modify is necessary. 6. Well documented with code examples, tips, hints, etc. Yes, I know this is a lot to ask, and will involve compromises on my part. I have purchased "Python for Dummies" but not yet started reading/using it. I dont want to spend a lot on time on it if there is something out there better.
Curious in NOLA
If you're used to WinForms maybe try Blazor I've never used it before, but in theory it gives you access to stateful applications and .NET goodness on the client side.
Real programmers use butterflies
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I have decided to get more serious with doing websites. Not mobile phones or IOT applications. I have experience with MS windows Web Forms. I have always worked in VB6, VB.Net and C#. I'd like to know your opinion on what is the "best" language to learn to do this. "Best" for me means : 1. Easy to learn. 2. Easy to use. 3. Final product is "secure". 4. Easy to integrate with MS SQLServer 5. Easy to maintain and modify is necessary. 6. Well documented with code examples, tips, hints, etc. Yes, I know this is a lot to ask, and will involve compromises on my part. I have purchased "Python for Dummies" but not yet started reading/using it. I dont want to spend a lot on time on it if there is something out there better.
Curious in NOLA
Ask Chris @chris-maunder what he's finally worked this site into.
The Science of King David's Court | Object Oriented Programming with C++
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I have decided to get more serious with doing websites. Not mobile phones or IOT applications. I have experience with MS windows Web Forms. I have always worked in VB6, VB.Net and C#. I'd like to know your opinion on what is the "best" language to learn to do this. "Best" for me means : 1. Easy to learn. 2. Easy to use. 3. Final product is "secure". 4. Easy to integrate with MS SQLServer 5. Easy to maintain and modify is necessary. 6. Well documented with code examples, tips, hints, etc. Yes, I know this is a lot to ask, and will involve compromises on my part. I have purchased "Python for Dummies" but not yet started reading/using it. I dont want to spend a lot on time on it if there is something out there better.
Curious in NOLA
Separation of front-end GUI and backend is a standard architecture for a website, so I would go for ASPnet Core Web Api ( [Tutorial: Create a web API with ASP.NET Core | Microsoft Docs](https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/aspnet/core/tutorials/first-web-api?view=aspnetcore-6.0&tabs=visual-studio ) ) connecting to SQL backend, and some version of the front-end using the Api, starting with something simpler like html5 + css + javascript/typescript as proof-of-concept, and later maybe Blazor as already suggested by HTCW. Asp.net core 5 is interesting as it offers hosting models, so that IIS is not really needed, as I would prefer to host the modules in windows service(s). It needs to be done in stages/modules I think ... BR
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I have decided to get more serious with doing websites. Not mobile phones or IOT applications. I have experience with MS windows Web Forms. I have always worked in VB6, VB.Net and C#. I'd like to know your opinion on what is the "best" language to learn to do this. "Best" for me means : 1. Easy to learn. 2. Easy to use. 3. Final product is "secure". 4. Easy to integrate with MS SQLServer 5. Easy to maintain and modify is necessary. 6. Well documented with code examples, tips, hints, etc. Yes, I know this is a lot to ask, and will involve compromises on my part. I have purchased "Python for Dummies" but not yet started reading/using it. I dont want to spend a lot on time on it if there is something out there better.
Curious in NOLA
I was in a very similar position to you. (Asp.Net with C#). After some research, for the front-end I chose Typescript (if you squint really hard it looks a bit like C#) as the base language. The as a FE framework (believe-me that you will need one unless you're a masochist), I went with Svelte. I chose Svelte over React because my stuff runs on a mobile, so download size is important. Watch I built the same app 10 times // Which JS Framework is best? - YouTube[^] for a nice overview of the main FE frameworks out there. I'm as yet undecided on a back-end. There's nothing wrong with a Microsoft back-end, unless you're paying for it. Just my $0.02.
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I have decided to get more serious with doing websites. Not mobile phones or IOT applications. I have experience with MS windows Web Forms. I have always worked in VB6, VB.Net and C#. I'd like to know your opinion on what is the "best" language to learn to do this. "Best" for me means : 1. Easy to learn. 2. Easy to use. 3. Final product is "secure". 4. Easy to integrate with MS SQLServer 5. Easy to maintain and modify is necessary. 6. Well documented with code examples, tips, hints, etc. Yes, I know this is a lot to ask, and will involve compromises on my part. I have purchased "Python for Dummies" but not yet started reading/using it. I dont want to spend a lot on time on it if there is something out there better.
Curious in NOLA
Open API standard Web API with EF Core. Front end ==> Blazor (Microsoft newest) UI ==> MudBlazor Net 6 is out tomorrow, VS2022 today in X64 Lots of buzz, lots of tutorial, lots of people working on this.
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I have decided to get more serious with doing websites. Not mobile phones or IOT applications. I have experience with MS windows Web Forms. I have always worked in VB6, VB.Net and C#. I'd like to know your opinion on what is the "best" language to learn to do this. "Best" for me means : 1. Easy to learn. 2. Easy to use. 3. Final product is "secure". 4. Easy to integrate with MS SQLServer 5. Easy to maintain and modify is necessary. 6. Well documented with code examples, tips, hints, etc. Yes, I know this is a lot to ask, and will involve compromises on my part. I have purchased "Python for Dummies" but not yet started reading/using it. I dont want to spend a lot on time on it if there is something out there better.
Curious in NOLA
SELECT TOP (1) FROM BlogPlatforms
WHERE Language = @FavoriteLanguage
ORDER BY Popularity:-\
Did you ever see history portrayed as an old man with a wise brow and pulseless heart, weighing all things in the balance of reason? Is not rather the genius of history like an eternal, imploring maiden, full of fire, with a burning heart and flaming soul, humanly warm and humanly beautiful? --Zachris Topelius
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I have decided to get more serious with doing websites. Not mobile phones or IOT applications. I have experience with MS windows Web Forms. I have always worked in VB6, VB.Net and C#. I'd like to know your opinion on what is the "best" language to learn to do this. "Best" for me means : 1. Easy to learn. 2. Easy to use. 3. Final product is "secure". 4. Easy to integrate with MS SQLServer 5. Easy to maintain and modify is necessary. 6. Well documented with code examples, tips, hints, etc. Yes, I know this is a lot to ask, and will involve compromises on my part. I have purchased "Python for Dummies" but not yet started reading/using it. I dont want to spend a lot on time on it if there is something out there better.
Curious in NOLA
I'm not a web developer and I think the whole web is an outrageous hack. As an individual it's pretty hard to keep pace with all the crazy changes needed to make things barely work. You can tell this is true by how terrible most websites have become. But I do appreciate how important this work is, and more power to you for wanting to dive in. I can't really recommend anything you should use, other than to suggest you don't get stuck on any one framework or toolset at this point and try different ones to broaden your experience. Let that process take years, so be patient. That said, I once wrote a blog using C#, then started filling it with content. It was great for a couple of years, and then without warning Microsoft pulled the rug out from under me by changing some of the functions I was using. It was basic stuff like string handling, which they were claiming required more security, but they left the burden on me to replace them. I would have had to refactor the whole thing. I eventually moved the whole site to a Linux box and left the blog behind. Do you really want to wake up one morning to discover your website needs to be rewritten because of an overnight update you didn't ask for?! I vowed never to use Microsoft .Net for anything ever again. In general I now shy away from anything that isn't highly portable. The more you build, the more you must maintain. Eventually you'll reach your limit and either start discarding your hard work or never produce anything new. Maybe both. I lived through the tyranny of significant whitespace with Fortran in the 90s, and as long as Python remains religious about its indentation scheme, I'll never use Python either. It's not worth the aggravation I guarantee you'll experience if your application reaches any appreciable size. - Owen -
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I have decided to get more serious with doing websites. Not mobile phones or IOT applications. I have experience with MS windows Web Forms. I have always worked in VB6, VB.Net and C#. I'd like to know your opinion on what is the "best" language to learn to do this. "Best" for me means : 1. Easy to learn. 2. Easy to use. 3. Final product is "secure". 4. Easy to integrate with MS SQLServer 5. Easy to maintain and modify is necessary. 6. Well documented with code examples, tips, hints, etc. Yes, I know this is a lot to ask, and will involve compromises on my part. I have purchased "Python for Dummies" but not yet started reading/using it. I dont want to spend a lot on time on it if there is something out there better.
Curious in NOLA
Blazor | Build client web apps with C# | .NET[^] Advantage: no learning JavaScript required. JavaScript is the only reason why I haven't become a web developer. It's not a language, it's a disease. :mad:
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I'm not a web developer and I think the whole web is an outrageous hack. As an individual it's pretty hard to keep pace with all the crazy changes needed to make things barely work. You can tell this is true by how terrible most websites have become. But I do appreciate how important this work is, and more power to you for wanting to dive in. I can't really recommend anything you should use, other than to suggest you don't get stuck on any one framework or toolset at this point and try different ones to broaden your experience. Let that process take years, so be patient. That said, I once wrote a blog using C#, then started filling it with content. It was great for a couple of years, and then without warning Microsoft pulled the rug out from under me by changing some of the functions I was using. It was basic stuff like string handling, which they were claiming required more security, but they left the burden on me to replace them. I would have had to refactor the whole thing. I eventually moved the whole site to a Linux box and left the blog behind. Do you really want to wake up one morning to discover your website needs to be rewritten because of an overnight update you didn't ask for?! I vowed never to use Microsoft .Net for anything ever again. In general I now shy away from anything that isn't highly portable. The more you build, the more you must maintain. Eventually you'll reach your limit and either start discarding your hard work or never produce anything new. Maybe both. I lived through the tyranny of significant whitespace with Fortran in the 90s, and as long as Python remains religious about its indentation scheme, I'll never use Python either. It's not worth the aggravation I guarantee you'll experience if your application reaches any appreciable size. - Owen -
Happened to me several times with Microsoft tech, to name a few: early Sharepoint, Small Business Server, WebMatrix. Web development tech and capabilities change rapidly, any tech regardless if it comes from Msft, ages quickly. Something that is 3 years old is showing its age, something that is 6 years is too limited, and something that is 9 years old is in a museum. Rather than look at why not, look at the reasons why. Right now Msft tech (Blazor / Maui / Azure) is hot.
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I have decided to get more serious with doing websites. Not mobile phones or IOT applications. I have experience with MS windows Web Forms. I have always worked in VB6, VB.Net and C#. I'd like to know your opinion on what is the "best" language to learn to do this. "Best" for me means : 1. Easy to learn. 2. Easy to use. 3. Final product is "secure". 4. Easy to integrate with MS SQLServer 5. Easy to maintain and modify is necessary. 6. Well documented with code examples, tips, hints, etc. Yes, I know this is a lot to ask, and will involve compromises on my part. I have purchased "Python for Dummies" but not yet started reading/using it. I dont want to spend a lot on time on it if there is something out there better.
Curious in NOLA
What about C# in Blazor? Looks like a perfect fit with that background.
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I'm not a web developer and I think the whole web is an outrageous hack. As an individual it's pretty hard to keep pace with all the crazy changes needed to make things barely work. You can tell this is true by how terrible most websites have become. But I do appreciate how important this work is, and more power to you for wanting to dive in. I can't really recommend anything you should use, other than to suggest you don't get stuck on any one framework or toolset at this point and try different ones to broaden your experience. Let that process take years, so be patient. That said, I once wrote a blog using C#, then started filling it with content. It was great for a couple of years, and then without warning Microsoft pulled the rug out from under me by changing some of the functions I was using. It was basic stuff like string handling, which they were claiming required more security, but they left the burden on me to replace them. I would have had to refactor the whole thing. I eventually moved the whole site to a Linux box and left the blog behind. Do you really want to wake up one morning to discover your website needs to be rewritten because of an overnight update you didn't ask for?! I vowed never to use Microsoft .Net for anything ever again. In general I now shy away from anything that isn't highly portable. The more you build, the more you must maintain. Eventually you'll reach your limit and either start discarding your hard work or never produce anything new. Maybe both. I lived through the tyranny of significant whitespace with Fortran in the 90s, and as long as Python remains religious about its indentation scheme, I'll never use Python either. It's not worth the aggravation I guarantee you'll experience if your application reaches any appreciable size. - Owen -
Owen Lawrence wrote:
I'm not a web developer and I think the whole web is an outrageous hack.
Sounds like you are a web developer :laugh:
“That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.”
― Christopher Hitchens
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I'm not a web developer and I think the whole web is an outrageous hack. As an individual it's pretty hard to keep pace with all the crazy changes needed to make things barely work. You can tell this is true by how terrible most websites have become. But I do appreciate how important this work is, and more power to you for wanting to dive in. I can't really recommend anything you should use, other than to suggest you don't get stuck on any one framework or toolset at this point and try different ones to broaden your experience. Let that process take years, so be patient. That said, I once wrote a blog using C#, then started filling it with content. It was great for a couple of years, and then without warning Microsoft pulled the rug out from under me by changing some of the functions I was using. It was basic stuff like string handling, which they were claiming required more security, but they left the burden on me to replace them. I would have had to refactor the whole thing. I eventually moved the whole site to a Linux box and left the blog behind. Do you really want to wake up one morning to discover your website needs to be rewritten because of an overnight update you didn't ask for?! I vowed never to use Microsoft .Net for anything ever again. In general I now shy away from anything that isn't highly portable. The more you build, the more you must maintain. Eventually you'll reach your limit and either start discarding your hard work or never produce anything new. Maybe both. I lived through the tyranny of significant whitespace with Fortran in the 90s, and as long as Python remains religious about its indentation scheme, I'll never use Python either. It's not worth the aggravation I guarantee you'll experience if your application reaches any appreciable size. - Owen -
I agree, you put that very well. There is no 'good' web development tech in my opinion - it's all a bit of a hack. None of the development tools really focus on what web pages are for - displaying information. The way MS keep changing C# and the ballooning complexity of their tools (such as ASP.NET) is why I dropped C# and .Net, though I can see that they would be useful for large-scale and very complex enterprise apps. I agree that Python has a few hideous oddities in its syntax (its use of whitespace is irritating and the propaganda that it is an object-orientated language is blasphemous). However, I am currently learning Python just so I can see what the fuss is all about, but I can't see myself using it for much except perhaps for online AI apps (though I am looking into JS as an alternative here). I quite like JS with html 5, as these are of course easily portable, and although I don't like PHP I use it for server-side tasks along with MySQL. I guess it depends on how complex a web site needs to be, but then again I think people trying to do too much with web apps may be part of the problem - I think its better to keep web apps simple and functional where possible.