Windows 11 + Linux + .NET question
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I recently spotted a Linux icon in the Windows Explorer. That's right, I remembered, I installed the Linux something for Windows. Then I also remembered, sometimes.. in the past? future? I know not... Linux GUI / X-Windows app support should come to the... err... WLS? (Windows Linux Subsystem? Did I get the name right?). And then perhaps I could try Avalonia for Linux from the comfort of my Windows Desktop. Which brings me to my question... is any of this is already available to general public? (I don't feel like risking my desktop into the Windows Insider Program, I got only one desktop) Bonus question: is there that many normal non IT user using Linux out there? I am thinking to port (when it is complete) my take over the world app... But that might be a pointless endeavor! :laugh:
A new .NET Serializer All in one Menu-Ribbon Bar Taking over the world since 1371!
I believe this is now available, check this page: [Run Linux GUI apps with WSL | Microsoft Docs](https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/wsl/tutorials/gui-apps). I recently installed Windows 11 (like a month ago) and my build is 22000.376. For the graphical WSL to work you need to have Windows 11 with build 22000 or higher. I have installed WSL on my Windows 10 in the past so I know for a fact that you do not have to be a Windows Insider to use the features (even when they are in the preview). Windows Insiders just have access to a higher build available a while sooner.
The shit I complain about It's like there ain't a cloud in the sky and it's raining out - Eminem ~! Firewall !~
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I believe this is now available, check this page: [Run Linux GUI apps with WSL | Microsoft Docs](https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/wsl/tutorials/gui-apps). I recently installed Windows 11 (like a month ago) and my build is 22000.376. For the graphical WSL to work you need to have Windows 11 with build 22000 or higher. I have installed WSL on my Windows 10 in the past so I know for a fact that you do not have to be a Windows Insider to use the features (even when they are in the preview). Windows Insiders just have access to a higher build available a while sooner.
The shit I complain about It's like there ain't a cloud in the sky and it's raining out - Eminem ~! Firewall !~
Thanks matey, gotta have a look. This is exciting news! :)
A new .NET Serializer All in one Menu-Ribbon Bar Taking over the world since 1371!
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I believe this is now available, check this page: [Run Linux GUI apps with WSL | Microsoft Docs](https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/wsl/tutorials/gui-apps). I recently installed Windows 11 (like a month ago) and my build is 22000.376. For the graphical WSL to work you need to have Windows 11 with build 22000 or higher. I have installed WSL on my Windows 10 in the past so I know for a fact that you do not have to be a Windows Insider to use the features (even when they are in the preview). Windows Insiders just have access to a higher build available a while sooner.
The shit I complain about It's like there ain't a cloud in the sky and it's raining out - Eminem ~! Firewall !~
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I recently spotted a Linux icon in the Windows Explorer. That's right, I remembered, I installed the Linux something for Windows. Then I also remembered, sometimes.. in the past? future? I know not... Linux GUI / X-Windows app support should come to the... err... WLS? (Windows Linux Subsystem? Did I get the name right?). And then perhaps I could try Avalonia for Linux from the comfort of my Windows Desktop. Which brings me to my question... is any of this is already available to general public? (I don't feel like risking my desktop into the Windows Insider Program, I got only one desktop) Bonus question: is there that many normal non IT user using Linux out there? I am thinking to port (when it is complete) my take over the world app... But that might be a pointless endeavor! :laugh:
A new .NET Serializer All in one Menu-Ribbon Bar Taking over the world since 1371!
Super Lloyd wrote:
Bonus question: is there that many normal non IT user using Linux out there?
Two (separate) customers of mine recently asked me if "it works on Windows and Apple?" I said, yeah, it's a web application, it works on all platforms. And they were like "Are there others? There was this... Linux? But that's long ago, does that even still exist?" Imagine their surprise when I told them it's one of the most popular popular OS'es in the world, pretty much the entire internet runs on it and Android and MacOS are basically Linux forks :laugh: I know it's not completely true, but there wasn't really any need to get technical or nuanced :)
Best, Sander Azure DevOps Succinctly (free eBook) Azure Serverless Succinctly (free eBook) Migrating Apps to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript
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I recently spotted a Linux icon in the Windows Explorer. That's right, I remembered, I installed the Linux something for Windows. Then I also remembered, sometimes.. in the past? future? I know not... Linux GUI / X-Windows app support should come to the... err... WLS? (Windows Linux Subsystem? Did I get the name right?). And then perhaps I could try Avalonia for Linux from the comfort of my Windows Desktop. Which brings me to my question... is any of this is already available to general public? (I don't feel like risking my desktop into the Windows Insider Program, I got only one desktop) Bonus question: is there that many normal non IT user using Linux out there? I am thinking to port (when it is complete) my take over the world app... But that might be a pointless endeavor! :laugh:
A new .NET Serializer All in one Menu-Ribbon Bar Taking over the world since 1371!
Super Lloyd wrote:
Bonus question: is there that many normal non IT user using Linux out there?
Yup. Using Mono and WinForms, fullscreen, some users don't notice any difference with Windows because everything looks and responds the same. That's dedicated systems, running only one application - my Mom isn't ready for a Linux desktop :)
Bastard Programmer from Hell :suss: "If you just follow the bacon Eddy, wherever it leads you, then you won't have to think about politics." -- Some Bell.
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I recently spotted a Linux icon in the Windows Explorer. That's right, I remembered, I installed the Linux something for Windows. Then I also remembered, sometimes.. in the past? future? I know not... Linux GUI / X-Windows app support should come to the... err... WLS? (Windows Linux Subsystem? Did I get the name right?). And then perhaps I could try Avalonia for Linux from the comfort of my Windows Desktop. Which brings me to my question... is any of this is already available to general public? (I don't feel like risking my desktop into the Windows Insider Program, I got only one desktop) Bonus question: is there that many normal non IT user using Linux out there? I am thinking to port (when it is complete) my take over the world app... But that might be a pointless endeavor! :laugh:
A new .NET Serializer All in one Menu-Ribbon Bar Taking over the world since 1371!
Quote:
is there that many normal non IT user using Linux out there?
Only those in the lunatic fringes. Well, me, I am not sure I qualify as an IT type anymore. I spent most of yesterday shooting a failure that was caused by a 1/12/2022 Windows update (12/1/2022 for you right ponders).
>64 Some days the dragon wins. Suck it up.
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Super Lloyd wrote:
Bonus question: is there that many normal non IT user using Linux out there?
Two (separate) customers of mine recently asked me if "it works on Windows and Apple?" I said, yeah, it's a web application, it works on all platforms. And they were like "Are there others? There was this... Linux? But that's long ago, does that even still exist?" Imagine their surprise when I told them it's one of the most popular popular OS'es in the world, pretty much the entire internet runs on it and Android and MacOS are basically Linux forks :laugh: I know it's not completely true, but there wasn't really any need to get technical or nuanced :)
Best, Sander Azure DevOps Succinctly (free eBook) Azure Serverless Succinctly (free eBook) Migrating Apps to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript
If the question asked was "Do you see much Linux out there?", then the answer would essentially be "Very little". Linux (or *nix in general) is a great OS for a backend server, performing ongoing, regular tasks that has no contact with the actual user. If your database server was switched from Windows to Linux (or the other way around), no user would notice. If a new embedded OS, unrelated to *nix, made its way into all the network routers around the world, no user would notice. That goes for smartphones as well. If someone created a perfect clone of the Android user interface, and a library catching all Android system calls so that you could run standard apps on it, no user would know that underneath the interface was a resurrected Windows Phone. In twenty years or so - those preceding the "next year will be The Year of Linux on the Desktop" - Linux guys strongly touted the great value of a CLI as far more efficient than a GUI. Where is the CLI of Android? Go a little further back, and they touted the flexibility provided by pipelines of filters. There are traces left of it under the hood, but that is under the hood. No non-computer guy today solves his problem by hooking together a chain of filters. They do not see the great advantage of having 42 different file systems to choose from. Not even the open source nature of some *nix systems and some applications. They do not see the programmability of emacs. ... What people see might as well have been an alternate Windows desktop. Or based on the Classic Mac OS. There is nothing in the Android UI revealing it as *nix based. You do not see Linux. Even on the desktop, when Linux is to be marketed to non-computer people, it is commonly disguised: Ubuntu is just like running Windows, only better! ... The "betterness" is not obvious to the non-computer user who cannot run the applications that his friends use. Who must accept domain specific application clones by code hackers who has never worked within the domain. Who must tolerate UI conventions ignored, every application doing details its private way. That may be one way to recognize a Linux based application: Lack of respect for UI conventions and lack of true domain knowledge. Inability to run those applications that the non-computer user wants to run. Let's keep Linux / *nix to the back office. It is doing a good job there. As long as Android doesn't expose Linux specific UI "qualities", it is fair enough. If you believe that you will have a great success you the u
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Interesting... And answer to your bonus question. I used to be one of those guys. My entire school system uses Chrome OS, which is a Gentoo-Linux-based system...
I keep hearing that Chromebooks are really popular in school settings. Cost/maintainability, I guess. But shouldn't schools be preparing kids for the future? I personally don't know anyone - ANYONE - who owns a Chromebook (or, perhaps to more closely match what you're saying, the Chrome OS). Either for personal use in a business environment. So using Chromebooks in schools seems shortsighted to me.
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If the question asked was "Do you see much Linux out there?", then the answer would essentially be "Very little". Linux (or *nix in general) is a great OS for a backend server, performing ongoing, regular tasks that has no contact with the actual user. If your database server was switched from Windows to Linux (or the other way around), no user would notice. If a new embedded OS, unrelated to *nix, made its way into all the network routers around the world, no user would notice. That goes for smartphones as well. If someone created a perfect clone of the Android user interface, and a library catching all Android system calls so that you could run standard apps on it, no user would know that underneath the interface was a resurrected Windows Phone. In twenty years or so - those preceding the "next year will be The Year of Linux on the Desktop" - Linux guys strongly touted the great value of a CLI as far more efficient than a GUI. Where is the CLI of Android? Go a little further back, and they touted the flexibility provided by pipelines of filters. There are traces left of it under the hood, but that is under the hood. No non-computer guy today solves his problem by hooking together a chain of filters. They do not see the great advantage of having 42 different file systems to choose from. Not even the open source nature of some *nix systems and some applications. They do not see the programmability of emacs. ... What people see might as well have been an alternate Windows desktop. Or based on the Classic Mac OS. There is nothing in the Android UI revealing it as *nix based. You do not see Linux. Even on the desktop, when Linux is to be marketed to non-computer people, it is commonly disguised: Ubuntu is just like running Windows, only better! ... The "betterness" is not obvious to the non-computer user who cannot run the applications that his friends use. Who must accept domain specific application clones by code hackers who has never worked within the domain. Who must tolerate UI conventions ignored, every application doing details its private way. That may be one way to recognize a Linux based application: Lack of respect for UI conventions and lack of true domain knowledge. Inability to run those applications that the non-computer user wants to run. Let's keep Linux / *nix to the back office. It is doing a good job there. As long as Android doesn't expose Linux specific UI "qualities", it is fair enough. If you believe that you will have a great success you the u
Yes to all I think, but to say it doesn't exist or isn't used is just wrong (just not by regular computer users) ;)
Best, Sander Azure DevOps Succinctly (free eBook) Azure Serverless Succinctly (free eBook) Migrating Apps to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript
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I keep hearing that Chromebooks are really popular in school settings. Cost/maintainability, I guess. But shouldn't schools be preparing kids for the future? I personally don't know anyone - ANYONE - who owns a Chromebook (or, perhaps to more closely match what you're saying, the Chrome OS). Either for personal use in a business environment. So using Chromebooks in schools seems shortsighted to me.
PREACH IT!!!
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Super Lloyd wrote:
Bonus question: is there that many normal non IT user using Linux out there?
Two (separate) customers of mine recently asked me if "it works on Windows and Apple?" I said, yeah, it's a web application, it works on all platforms. And they were like "Are there others? There was this... Linux? But that's long ago, does that even still exist?" Imagine their surprise when I told them it's one of the most popular popular OS'es in the world, pretty much the entire internet runs on it and Android and MacOS are basically Linux forks :laugh: I know it's not completely true, but there wasn't really any need to get technical or nuanced :)
Best, Sander Azure DevOps Succinctly (free eBook) Azure Serverless Succinctly (free eBook) Migrating Apps to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript
macOS is actually based on BSD Unix...
Paul Sanders http://www.alpinesoft.co.uk
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I recently spotted a Linux icon in the Windows Explorer. That's right, I remembered, I installed the Linux something for Windows. Then I also remembered, sometimes.. in the past? future? I know not... Linux GUI / X-Windows app support should come to the... err... WLS? (Windows Linux Subsystem? Did I get the name right?). And then perhaps I could try Avalonia for Linux from the comfort of my Windows Desktop. Which brings me to my question... is any of this is already available to general public? (I don't feel like risking my desktop into the Windows Insider Program, I got only one desktop) Bonus question: is there that many normal non IT user using Linux out there? I am thinking to port (when it is complete) my take over the world app... But that might be a pointless endeavor! :laugh:
A new .NET Serializer All in one Menu-Ribbon Bar Taking over the world since 1371!
WSLg is widely available to the public, as is Explorer integration using 9P. 3D acceleration in WSLg ain't available to the public. Last time I checked (which is somewhen last week), you have to run preview drivers to get this working. Whether you consider preview software "available to the public", is up to debate, of course. My personal definition includes shoving all preview stuff into the enthusiast category, with the public being defined as RTM-ready. I know I'll be porting one of my recent work to Linux, debugging in WSL.
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WSLg is widely available to the public, as is Explorer integration using 9P. 3D acceleration in WSLg ain't available to the public. Last time I checked (which is somewhen last week), you have to run preview drivers to get this working. Whether you consider preview software "available to the public", is up to debate, of course. My personal definition includes shoving all preview stuff into the enthusiast category, with the public being defined as RTM-ready. I know I'll be porting one of my recent work to Linux, debugging in WSL.
Yeah... when my home project is... complete enough, I might have a go at the Linux port! ^^
A new .NET Serializer All in one Menu-Ribbon Bar Taking over the world since 1371!
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Yeah... when my home project is... complete enough, I might have a go at the Linux port! ^^
A new .NET Serializer All in one Menu-Ribbon Bar Taking over the world since 1371!
I think, it's roughly the same for me. I surely got a nook or cranny I'd like to polish for a bit before I think about running this thing on a rented server (main raison d'etre for WSL-debugging in this particular case, rented Windows servers cost an order of magnitude or so more, than their Linux counterparts). Come to think of it, the vast majority of my code is OS-agnostic so I could, actually, start porting this thing more or less right now. Thanks for inspiring me for taking the next step in this project! :)
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I think, it's roughly the same for me. I surely got a nook or cranny I'd like to polish for a bit before I think about running this thing on a rented server (main raison d'etre for WSL-debugging in this particular case, rented Windows servers cost an order of magnitude or so more, than their Linux counterparts). Come to think of it, the vast majority of my code is OS-agnostic so I could, actually, start porting this thing more or less right now. Thanks for inspiring me for taking the next step in this project! :)
You're welcome! :) Mine is a desktop GUI... so using Desktop / OS tech.... But hey, I am curious about Avalonia! :)
A new .NET Serializer All in one Menu-Ribbon Bar Taking over the world since 1371!
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You're welcome! :) Mine is a desktop GUI... so using Desktop / OS tech.... But hey, I am curious about Avalonia! :)
A new .NET Serializer All in one Menu-Ribbon Bar Taking over the world since 1371!
Mine is, and I'm damn grateful I don't get to sink my teeth into the thorny topic of Linux GUIs, a server-sided console project. To be honest, I've no idea how I would go about programming something GUI for Linux. I mean, I got an emergency plan should I ever get product requirements about Linux support for a GUI project at my workplace and that emergency plan would be Windows.Forms under Mono. Still, I hope https://github.com/jsuarezruiz/forms-gtk-progress/issues/31 to yield some results in the years to come. WSLg should at least provide a sensible debugging experience in this scenario, it can run Edge after all, so it may just as well run my GUI.
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I recently spotted a Linux icon in the Windows Explorer. That's right, I remembered, I installed the Linux something for Windows. Then I also remembered, sometimes.. in the past? future? I know not... Linux GUI / X-Windows app support should come to the... err... WLS? (Windows Linux Subsystem? Did I get the name right?). And then perhaps I could try Avalonia for Linux from the comfort of my Windows Desktop. Which brings me to my question... is any of this is already available to general public? (I don't feel like risking my desktop into the Windows Insider Program, I got only one desktop) Bonus question: is there that many normal non IT user using Linux out there? I am thinking to port (when it is complete) my take over the world app... But that might be a pointless endeavor! :laugh:
A new .NET Serializer All in one Menu-Ribbon Bar Taking over the world since 1371!
It's called Windows Subsystem for Linux, and yes, it's production stable and in the regular build. I recommend WSL 1. It doesn't need a hypervisor, has seamless file-system access, and you can just pick a distro you like and it works without X and without deamons. It's like running Linux natively, but much better in every way, since your drivers actually work and Windows Defender is lightyears ahead of anything in penguin land. WSL 2 adds UI and service layer support to WSL 1, but uses Hyper-V to virtualize the file-system, which is stupid on multiple levels. The worst thing about Linux is X11/Wayland, the second worst thing are the deamons. Offering both and as a trade-off to being forced to use Hyper-V is like agreeing to get slapped in the face, so you can get punched in the gut. When WSL1 is used right, you can integrate any Linux-specific toolchain on Windows. Right now I'm running Guacamole, SQLPad and code-server with SSO via tunnel over cloudflare access, all running inside WSL1 with less latency than if I was using a native Linux distro.
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I recently spotted a Linux icon in the Windows Explorer. That's right, I remembered, I installed the Linux something for Windows. Then I also remembered, sometimes.. in the past? future? I know not... Linux GUI / X-Windows app support should come to the... err... WLS? (Windows Linux Subsystem? Did I get the name right?). And then perhaps I could try Avalonia for Linux from the comfort of my Windows Desktop. Which brings me to my question... is any of this is already available to general public? (I don't feel like risking my desktop into the Windows Insider Program, I got only one desktop) Bonus question: is there that many normal non IT user using Linux out there? I am thinking to port (when it is complete) my take over the world app... But that might be a pointless endeavor! :laugh:
A new .NET Serializer All in one Menu-Ribbon Bar Taking over the world since 1371!
Super Lloyd wrote:
is there that many normal non IT user using Linux out there?
When the disk failed on my wife's underpowered vista laptop I slapped Ubuntu on it and she loved it. I was much faster and was fine for everything she needed (browsing, writing a few documents). The only problem she had was sending / receiving documents in Microsoft word format - mainly because other people were not used to importing docs in other formats. My wife is most definitely not a IT person.
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macOS is actually based on BSD Unix...
Paul Sanders http://www.alpinesoft.co.uk
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Super Lloyd wrote:
is there that many normal non IT user using Linux out there?
When the disk failed on my wife's underpowered vista laptop I slapped Ubuntu on it and she loved it. I was much faster and was fine for everything she needed (browsing, writing a few documents). The only problem she had was sending / receiving documents in Microsoft word format - mainly because other people were not used to importing docs in other formats. My wife is most definitely not a IT person.
Yeah, my wife wouldn't have a problem running Linux. Over the years I've migrated her to using cross platform tools (Firefox, Thunderbird and Libre Office). About the only thing I'll have to do is install Zoom and she'll be set. I figure when Win 10 support is done, I'll just install whatever my current favorite Linux is (currently MX Linux).
