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  3. Back to the Future - MS Edition

Back to the Future - MS Edition

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  • M Mike Winiberg

    What gets me about a lot of changes (especially to UI) with MS is that they never actually seem to research the effects of the changes on actual, real-world, not in the MS eco-system users, so things that make no sense get through, only to be retracted or tweaked later when real users start bitching! Like so many dev firms, its more important to have something new and shiny than to provide something actually useful. The latest Windows 11 upgrade has, for example, severely impacted my 4K laptop usability: Until now, if using in laptop mode (ie with keyboard and mouse) all file search menus were like my desktop (also 4K Win 11) with nice compact lists of files, easy to scan and select from with the mouse. Now, because my laptop CAN be folded into a tablet (which used to switch tablet mode on automatically) it is now in tablet mode permanently, so file search lists are widely spaced for better usability with touch and the option to use 'desktop' mode has been removed. So despite having 4K desktop and 4K laptop, the usability of the laptop has been reduced by the removal of a very useful and long-lived feature for no apparent reason. This is a minor thing but reflects the whole MS culture around UI. Think back to the win8 debacle, when a whole new UI was introduced but with absolutely, positively no on-screen help or prompts as to how to drive it. Turn on the machine, you are faced with maybe an icon to launch something, no indication or guides as to the touch or mouse gestures needed to interact with the machine and - if you had a keyboard attached - nothing about the UI in the F1 help either - which in any case didn't work at all if you weren't displaying the desktop rather than the (default) front touch menu. Another major UI failing is the introduction of the 'button' bars across the top of Office applications etc. Just as the world was adopting ever wider ie landscape screens, the apps for working on documents (the vast majority of which are portrait) removed large vertical spaces from the screen for their 'menus' making viewing significant portions of the thing you are working on much harder. Likewise the recent decision by MS to stop you from moving the taskbar to the side of the screen to give you more vertical working area - why? Who's work is made easier by doing that? Sorry, rant over, but this kind of stupidity really boils my piss!

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    M Offline
    Member 10652083
    wrote on last edited by
    #13

    I refuse to use any Word later than 2003, the last one before the button bar appeared. As well as taking up screen area, the bar was more difficult to use than menus because you have to scan the whole bar looking for a function.

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    • Mircea NeacsuM Mircea Neacsu

      My muscles are relaxed and I feel so good! I've just discovered that Win11 added the option to open Task Manager when you right-click on taskbar. I know there are many other ways of opening the Task Manager but my hands just have muscle memory and every time I wanted to open it, my hands would right click on the task bar just to see that the option is no longer there (by this time brain will kick in and click on Ctrl-Shift-Esc to open said Task Manager). Imagine my surprise this morning when hands again went to right click and eyes noticed the old/new option. Not sure when this happened but sure was a nice surprise. Soon Win11 will look just like Win10 but with rounded corners.

      Mircea

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      Member 9167057
      wrote on last edited by
      #14

      Now they just need to make the taskbar side-dockable again.

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      • Mircea NeacsuM Mircea Neacsu

        My muscles are relaxed and I feel so good! I've just discovered that Win11 added the option to open Task Manager when you right-click on taskbar. I know there are many other ways of opening the Task Manager but my hands just have muscle memory and every time I wanted to open it, my hands would right click on the task bar just to see that the option is no longer there (by this time brain will kick in and click on Ctrl-Shift-Esc to open said Task Manager). Imagine my surprise this morning when hands again went to right click and eyes noticed the old/new option. Not sure when this happened but sure was a nice surprise. Soon Win11 will look just like Win10 but with rounded corners.

        Mircea

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        Martin ISDN
        wrote on last edited by
        #15

        i skipped windows vista and windows 7 and went directly to windows 8.1, because in windows explorer there was no "up directory" button people trying to explain to me that i am stupid and that breadcrumbs are a better way to navigate the file system just made my decision firm to stay on windows xp. i am infinitely more grateful if someone declares that my opinion doesn't matter at all, than telling me that they switched to a better solution for me, that i would love to use cheers

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        • D Daniel Pfeffer

          And where were you in the time of CP/M? ... And where was I in the time of OS/360? ... :)

          Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows. -- 6079 Smith W.

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          ProfessorDan
          wrote on last edited by
          #16

          CP/M That was the OS I used at home while working on by BSCS it allowed me to program at home vs classmates going to the LAB to do homework. In those days you needed to program in ASM just to get peripherals to work. Good memories :-D

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          • D Daniel Pfeffer

            I don't know where you'd find bug-free programs. I can't imagine that there are computers in Heaven, and in Hell the programs wouldn't be bug-free. :)

            Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows. -- 6079 Smith W.

            Mircea NeacsuM Offline
            Mircea NeacsuM Offline
            Mircea Neacsu
            wrote on last edited by
            #17

            Daniel Pfeffer wrote:

            I can't imagine that there are computers in Heaven

            They sure must be! And they all answer to "Hello, Computer" :laugh:

            Mircea

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            • P ProfessorDan

              CP/M That was the OS I used at home while working on by BSCS it allowed me to program at home vs classmates going to the LAB to do homework. In those days you needed to program in ASM just to get peripherals to work. Good memories :-D

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              sasadler
              wrote on last edited by
              #18

              Those were some of the most fun days of my computer building. I built a number of interesting and useful peripheral boards for my home build CP/M based system (S100 bus). A 4K RAM board, a control board for an IBM selectric typewriter mechanism (no dot matrix printouts for me!), a Votrax based speech synthesizer board and a cassette tape backup board. I just loved the low level design and programming.

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              • Mircea NeacsuM Mircea Neacsu

                Considering that my first program ran on an IBM-7040 (in WATFOR, of course), I think I've been around for long enough to qualify for a free ticket to the land where programs have no bugs :laugh:

                Mircea

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                LucidDev
                wrote on last edited by
                #19

                IBM 1620 here, built two years before the 7040 in 1959.

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                • S sasadler

                  Those were some of the most fun days of my computer building. I built a number of interesting and useful peripheral boards for my home build CP/M based system (S100 bus). A 4K RAM board, a control board for an IBM selectric typewriter mechanism (no dot matrix printouts for me!), a Votrax based speech synthesizer board and a cassette tape backup board. I just loved the low level design and programming.

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                  ProfessorDan
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #20

                  Oh Wow, I forgot about that I bought the Vortrax chip (I think it was about $65 a lot for the mid 80's) wire wrapped a S100 Board with an ADC and an RTC and had a talking Clock as well as a talking voltmeter The system also greeted me on Powerup. You can Thank the movie 2001 and the HAL 9000 for some of the that went into that system.

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                  • P ProfessorDan

                    Oh Wow, I forgot about that I bought the Vortrax chip (I think it was about $65 a lot for the mid 80's) wire wrapped a S100 Board with an ADC and an RTC and had a talking Clock as well as a talking voltmeter The system also greeted me on Powerup. You can Thank the movie 2001 and the HAL 9000 for some of the that went into that system.

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                    sasadler
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #21

                    It was a fun project. I wrote a text to speech program so I could make it say whatever I wanted. It really brought home how funky english language spelling can be! :-)

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                    • D Daniel Pfeffer

                      That's my problem with all major version Windows upgrades. I'm all for the additional security, support for new devices and device types, etc., but why do they have to mess around with the UI? :mad: (I don't mean the way things look; I mean the keyboard shortcuts, context menus, placement of options in "Settings", etc.)

                      Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows. -- 6079 Smith W.

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                      pmauriks
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #22

                      What about if the changes were deliberate - and done to draw attention away from less annoying changes, that were more important to Microsoft's long-term strategy. Changes like gradually moving things more and more into the cloud. Like trying so hard to prevent local accounts on Windows 11. What about if giving these things back after a few weeks made people feel good about Microsoft again? Definitely becoming paranoid in my old age.

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                      • P pmauriks

                        What about if the changes were deliberate - and done to draw attention away from less annoying changes, that were more important to Microsoft's long-term strategy. Changes like gradually moving things more and more into the cloud. Like trying so hard to prevent local accounts on Windows 11. What about if giving these things back after a few weeks made people feel good about Microsoft again? Definitely becoming paranoid in my old age.

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                        Daniel Pfeffer
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #23

                        Everything you say is possible. MS presumably earns quite a bit from its "cloud" storage, and would like to increase that. I believe, however, that they reversed themselves on local accounts etc. after the outcry from their clients, which just shows good business sense; there is no need to assume benevolence or anything else on MS's part. As for your paranoia, even paranoiacs have enemies. :)

                        Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows. -- 6079 Smith W.

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