Visual Studio 2022 offline
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You're not gonna like *my* thoughts, so feel free to skip this altogether. I understand what I'm about to write is a non-starter for you. My intent is not to rock the boat. And I fully realize none of this helps you in your current situation. My thinking is, if a dev machine absolutely, positively, by design, has to be air-gapped, then from the get-go, something's very wrong with the picture. I absolutely understand the need to air-gap things. But you don't develop/test against real servers with real data, you do all of that with a lab you can take down/rebuild on-demand. Externalize your connection configuration. User accounts shouldn't lead to valuable data. Work with made-up data. If that gets breached? There should be nothing of value lost. I say this with all due respect. I understand you don't necessarily have a say in this. All I'm pointing out is that things are being made unnecessarily complicated for you because someone along the chain is making bad decisions. Why does a dev box need to be kept isolated from the rest of the world? All that being said - sometimes you lose your live internet connection for reasons outside your control, and VS (2022 especially) has become awful at managing connected/disconnected states, but that's a rant for another day. If you can stick with VS2019 and it's working well for you...stick with it. My offline experience with VS2022 hasn't been a positive one.
That may work if the data is the protected IP. What happens if the algorithm is the protected IP? In this case, air-gapping the developer's platforms is the only sure way to protect the IP.
Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows. -- 6079 Smith W.
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You're not gonna like *my* thoughts, so feel free to skip this altogether. I understand what I'm about to write is a non-starter for you. My intent is not to rock the boat. And I fully realize none of this helps you in your current situation. My thinking is, if a dev machine absolutely, positively, by design, has to be air-gapped, then from the get-go, something's very wrong with the picture. I absolutely understand the need to air-gap things. But you don't develop/test against real servers with real data, you do all of that with a lab you can take down/rebuild on-demand. Externalize your connection configuration. User accounts shouldn't lead to valuable data. Work with made-up data. If that gets breached? There should be nothing of value lost. I say this with all due respect. I understand you don't necessarily have a say in this. All I'm pointing out is that things are being made unnecessarily complicated for you because someone along the chain is making bad decisions. Why does a dev box need to be kept isolated from the rest of the world? All that being said - sometimes you lose your live internet connection for reasons outside your control, and VS (2022 especially) has become awful at managing connected/disconnected states, but that's a rant for another day. If you can stick with VS2019 and it's working well for you...stick with it. My offline experience with VS2022 hasn't been a positive one.
Thanks for your experience with 2022 working offline. If we decide to migrate to the new NET, we're going to have to upgrade to 2022. Unless someone knows a way to make 2019 support .NET 7. If 2022 is that unreasonable about working offline, that becomes a con in the debate about migrating. I'll be doing some experimenting with that when I'm out in internet land. As for the rest -- given your underlying assumptions (which you can deduce, based on your post), your comments are correct in every manner, and I agree with them. But ... you knew there was a but coming :) ... in my case, those assumptions are not correct and the development environment is absolutely correct for what I work on.
Be wary of strong drink. It can make you shoot at tax collectors - and miss. Lazarus Long, "Time Enough For Love" by Robert A. Heinlein
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Thanks for your experience with 2022 working offline. If we decide to migrate to the new NET, we're going to have to upgrade to 2022. Unless someone knows a way to make 2019 support .NET 7. If 2022 is that unreasonable about working offline, that becomes a con in the debate about migrating. I'll be doing some experimenting with that when I'm out in internet land. As for the rest -- given your underlying assumptions (which you can deduce, based on your post), your comments are correct in every manner, and I agree with them. But ... you knew there was a but coming :) ... in my case, those assumptions are not correct and the development environment is absolutely correct for what I work on.
Be wary of strong drink. It can make you shoot at tax collectors - and miss. Lazarus Long, "Time Enough For Love" by Robert A. Heinlein
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I work on an air-gapped development network. Every year or so, I go out and spend a week or so on an internet connected machine and download Visual Studio and Android Studio and all the bits and pieces required for those products and the libraries they want to download to support our projects. Copy all that onto DVDs and transfer it to the air-gap and setup some scripts to install it all. Yes, it is a colossal PITA but it's what I've got to do for my work environment. VS has been getting worse each release as Microsoft ignores their offline developers more and more. If you need all those damn NuGet packages to do the most basic development actions like unit tests, include the *&(^# things in the offline packages! ... Okay, rant over. Android Studio hasn't gotten worse, its process has been the same for years now ... run it online then bundle up the repository cache and take that offline. I'm getting ready to do the big nasty for this year, and my question deals with Visual Studio. Currently, we have 2019 (with about half the major components), on the air-gap network with all current patches applied. I'm soliciting opinions on: - how much more does 2022 want to access the internet in its normal course of operations, once you have all components for your project on the local machine? For reference, 2019 works fine with no delays trying to access the internet to do "other stuff" or look for updates or phone home. - is it worth it to upgrade to 2022? We have a suite of .NET Framework 4.7.2 WinForms applications, along with both C and C++ programs. No web and no database ... although I can see some small local DB stuff coming. This questions only applies if we stick with NET Framework. We're thinking about migrating to .NET 7 (whatever the current version is), which will force us to upgrade and render this question moot. - how easy is it to set up a local NuGet server with just those packages put out by Microsoft, and maybe a few other select sources? We are excessively paranoid about third party stuff here, so don't really use much that we can't get the source for and compile ourselves, so I'm not talking all those random open source packages that are out there. Yes, I know MS isn't qualitatively better, but my overlords are much happier if I can point to them, or some other recognized corporate purveyor of SW tools, as the source of a binary. Data is transferred the old fashioned sneaker-net way, using DVDs. Having 10s of them is not a problem, but having 100s is. Al
there is the visual studio 2022 installer that has to be installed first then there is an option from that to save the files locally [Create an offline installation - Visual Studio (Windows) | Microsoft Learn](https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/visualstudio/install/create-an-offline-installation-of-visual-studio?view=vs-2022) then u need a 25GB DVD split to make it readonly then u need to copy to a test env and test the install (meaning test all you know and want of functions and coding a dummy project) (switch off and disable task scheduled and web checking) then install in dev prod env nuget part you need to do your rnd and get the offline packs etc ([NuGet Server Local?](https://nugetserver.net/)
Caveat Emptor. "Progress doesn't come from early risers – progress is made by lazy men looking for easier ways to do things." Lazarus Long
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I can only speculate, and you don't owe me any explanation or need to elaborate. I'm sure it can all be justified. All I can say is good luck, and I hope you're well compensated for the extra hoops you're being made to jump through. :-)
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That may work if the data is the protected IP. What happens if the algorithm is the protected IP? In this case, air-gapping the developer's platforms is the only sure way to protect the IP.
Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows. -- 6079 Smith W.
The word "patent" comes to mind. But I can't imagine that, in the real world, it's all that effective at protecting said IP, but at the same time, I can't imagine that even the largest software companies today working on the most secretive stuff go completely offline. Lots of security checks, everything being monitored 24/7 in an automated fashion, sure, but completely offline? Maybe a few small labs here and there, and that's it... But then, I've never really had the exposure to that sort of thing, so who am I to speculate...
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Daniel had it in one guess.
Be wary of strong drink. It can make you shoot at tax collectors - and miss. Lazarus Long, "Time Enough For Love" by Robert A. Heinlein
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there is the visual studio 2022 installer that has to be installed first then there is an option from that to save the files locally [Create an offline installation - Visual Studio (Windows) | Microsoft Learn](https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/visualstudio/install/create-an-offline-installation-of-visual-studio?view=vs-2022) then u need a 25GB DVD split to make it readonly then u need to copy to a test env and test the install (meaning test all you know and want of functions and coding a dummy project) (switch off and disable task scheduled and web checking) then install in dev prod env nuget part you need to do your rnd and get the offline packs etc ([NuGet Server Local?](https://nugetserver.net/)
Caveat Emptor. "Progress doesn't come from early risers – progress is made by lazy men looking for easier ways to do things." Lazarus Long
I'm well aware of the process, having done it for a number of years. My questions were more along the lines of 1) how 2022 behaves offline, 2) how hard is it, based on your experience, to set up a local NuGet server, and 3) how well does 2022 play with an offline local NuGet server.
Be wary of strong drink. It can make you shoot at tax collectors - and miss. Lazarus Long, "Time Enough For Love" by Robert A. Heinlein
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I'm well aware of the process, having done it for a number of years. My questions were more along the lines of 1) how 2022 behaves offline, 2) how hard is it, based on your experience, to set up a local NuGet server, and 3) how well does 2022 play with an offline local NuGet server.
Be wary of strong drink. It can make you shoot at tax collectors - and miss. Lazarus Long, "Time Enough For Love" by Robert A. Heinlein
well you do have to test it know how it behaves ...the best way is to get a heavy NuGet packaged project from say github and make it offline (via a newget server running locally) and test it for windows forms and normally back in the day projects i don't see much issues speaking from understanding.. but what works on my machine may not on yours.....i havent set up local nuget etc..
Caveat Emptor. "Progress doesn't come from early risers – progress is made by lazy men looking for easier ways to do things." Lazarus Long
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I work on an air-gapped development network. Every year or so, I go out and spend a week or so on an internet connected machine and download Visual Studio and Android Studio and all the bits and pieces required for those products and the libraries they want to download to support our projects. Copy all that onto DVDs and transfer it to the air-gap and setup some scripts to install it all. Yes, it is a colossal PITA but it's what I've got to do for my work environment. VS has been getting worse each release as Microsoft ignores their offline developers more and more. If you need all those damn NuGet packages to do the most basic development actions like unit tests, include the *&(^# things in the offline packages! ... Okay, rant over. Android Studio hasn't gotten worse, its process has been the same for years now ... run it online then bundle up the repository cache and take that offline. I'm getting ready to do the big nasty for this year, and my question deals with Visual Studio. Currently, we have 2019 (with about half the major components), on the air-gap network with all current patches applied. I'm soliciting opinions on: - how much more does 2022 want to access the internet in its normal course of operations, once you have all components for your project on the local machine? For reference, 2019 works fine with no delays trying to access the internet to do "other stuff" or look for updates or phone home. - is it worth it to upgrade to 2022? We have a suite of .NET Framework 4.7.2 WinForms applications, along with both C and C++ programs. No web and no database ... although I can see some small local DB stuff coming. This questions only applies if we stick with NET Framework. We're thinking about migrating to .NET 7 (whatever the current version is), which will force us to upgrade and render this question moot. - how easy is it to set up a local NuGet server with just those packages put out by Microsoft, and maybe a few other select sources? We are excessively paranoid about third party stuff here, so don't really use much that we can't get the source for and compile ourselves, so I'm not talking all those random open source packages that are out there. Yes, I know MS isn't qualitatively better, but my overlords are much happier if I can point to them, or some other recognized corporate purveyor of SW tools, as the source of a binary. Data is transferred the old fashioned sneaker-net way, using DVDs. Having 10s of them is not a problem, but having 100s is. Al
I'm paranoid but I see no reason not to dedicate one PC to the internet (as a proxy) and then RDP into it to see what is what. At some point, someone assumes responsibility for something.
"Before entering on an understanding, I have meditated for a long time, and have foreseen what might happen. It is not genius which reveals to me suddenly, secretly, what I have to say or to do in a circumstance unexpected by other people; it is reflection, it is meditation." - Napoleon I
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I'm paranoid but I see no reason not to dedicate one PC to the internet (as a proxy) and then RDP into it to see what is what. At some point, someone assumes responsibility for something.
"Before entering on an understanding, I have meditated for a long time, and have foreseen what might happen. It is not genius which reveals to me suddenly, secretly, what I have to say or to do in a circumstance unexpected by other people; it is reflection, it is meditation." - Napoleon I
That RDP connection violates the inviolable "air-gap" requirement. The point of responsibility is me; I assume the responsibility for what I put on the DVDs that are transferred. Deities help me if I introduce a virus that destroys anything on the internal network. At least with the air-gap, I am protected from data egress.
Be wary of strong drink. It can make you shoot at tax collectors - and miss. Lazarus Long, "Time Enough For Love" by Robert A. Heinlein
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I work on an air-gapped development network. Every year or so, I go out and spend a week or so on an internet connected machine and download Visual Studio and Android Studio and all the bits and pieces required for those products and the libraries they want to download to support our projects. Copy all that onto DVDs and transfer it to the air-gap and setup some scripts to install it all. Yes, it is a colossal PITA but it's what I've got to do for my work environment. VS has been getting worse each release as Microsoft ignores their offline developers more and more. If you need all those damn NuGet packages to do the most basic development actions like unit tests, include the *&(^# things in the offline packages! ... Okay, rant over. Android Studio hasn't gotten worse, its process has been the same for years now ... run it online then bundle up the repository cache and take that offline. I'm getting ready to do the big nasty for this year, and my question deals with Visual Studio. Currently, we have 2019 (with about half the major components), on the air-gap network with all current patches applied. I'm soliciting opinions on: - how much more does 2022 want to access the internet in its normal course of operations, once you have all components for your project on the local machine? For reference, 2019 works fine with no delays trying to access the internet to do "other stuff" or look for updates or phone home. - is it worth it to upgrade to 2022? We have a suite of .NET Framework 4.7.2 WinForms applications, along with both C and C++ programs. No web and no database ... although I can see some small local DB stuff coming. This questions only applies if we stick with NET Framework. We're thinking about migrating to .NET 7 (whatever the current version is), which will force us to upgrade and render this question moot. - how easy is it to set up a local NuGet server with just those packages put out by Microsoft, and maybe a few other select sources? We are excessively paranoid about third party stuff here, so don't really use much that we can't get the source for and compile ourselves, so I'm not talking all those random open source packages that are out there. Yes, I know MS isn't qualitatively better, but my overlords are much happier if I can point to them, or some other recognized corporate purveyor of SW tools, as the source of a binary. Data is transferred the old fashioned sneaker-net way, using DVDs. Having 10s of them is not a problem, but having 100s is. Al
Can't give much advice on air-gapped development, but we use the free and open-source version of Gitea as a local Git server on Windows for years now which works very well. Gitea can function as a NuGet server and also has support for Cargo, Chef, Composer, Conan, Conda, Container, Helm, Maven, npm, Pub, PyPI, RubyGems, Vagrant, etc. Github - Gitea[^]
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Can't give much advice on air-gapped development, but we use the free and open-source version of Gitea as a local Git server on Windows for years now which works very well. Gitea can function as a NuGet server and also has support for Cargo, Chef, Composer, Conan, Conda, Container, Helm, Maven, npm, Pub, PyPI, RubyGems, Vagrant, etc. Github - Gitea[^]
Very helpful, thank you! We have GitLab Enterprise running on the internal network; it can be my local NuGet server. Then all I have to do it make sure I download all the packages I need and stuff them up there.
Be wary of strong drink. It can make you shoot at tax collectors - and miss. Lazarus Long, "Time Enough For Love" by Robert A. Heinlein
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That RDP connection violates the inviolable "air-gap" requirement. The point of responsibility is me; I assume the responsibility for what I put on the DVDs that are transferred. Deities help me if I introduce a virus that destroys anything on the internal network. At least with the air-gap, I am protected from data egress.
Be wary of strong drink. It can make you shoot at tax collectors - and miss. Lazarus Long, "Time Enough For Love" by Robert A. Heinlein
Wifi and Bluetooth go over the air. RDP is a one way wire with a screen.
"Before entering on an understanding, I have meditated for a long time, and have foreseen what might happen. It is not genius which reveals to me suddenly, secretly, what I have to say or to do in a circumstance unexpected by other people; it is reflection, it is meditation." - Napoleon I
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Wifi and Bluetooth go over the air. RDP is a one way wire with a screen.
"Before entering on an understanding, I have meditated for a long time, and have foreseen what might happen. It is not genius which reveals to me suddenly, secretly, what I have to say or to do in a circumstance unexpected by other people; it is reflection, it is meditation." - Napoleon I
That's being pedantic over the meaning of the phrase "air-gap". The accepted usage in computer-speak is no network connectivity of any kind, over any variety of medium, hard-wire or over-the-air. There is a conceptual physical gap surrounding the network.
Be wary of strong drink. It can make you shoot at tax collectors - and miss. Lazarus Long, "Time Enough For Love" by Robert A. Heinlein
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The word "patent" comes to mind. But I can't imagine that, in the real world, it's all that effective at protecting said IP, but at the same time, I can't imagine that even the largest software companies today working on the most secretive stuff go completely offline. Lots of security checks, everything being monitored 24/7 in an automated fashion, sure, but completely offline? Maybe a few small labs here and there, and that's it... But then, I've never really had the exposure to that sort of thing, so who am I to speculate...
I would think that in certain defence-oriented organizations, all IP is secured in an air-gapped network. Every developer would have two platforms, one connected to the Internet and the other connected to the air-gapped network.
Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows. -- 6079 Smith W.
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I work on an air-gapped development network. Every year or so, I go out and spend a week or so on an internet connected machine and download Visual Studio and Android Studio and all the bits and pieces required for those products and the libraries they want to download to support our projects. Copy all that onto DVDs and transfer it to the air-gap and setup some scripts to install it all. Yes, it is a colossal PITA but it's what I've got to do for my work environment. VS has been getting worse each release as Microsoft ignores their offline developers more and more. If you need all those damn NuGet packages to do the most basic development actions like unit tests, include the *&(^# things in the offline packages! ... Okay, rant over. Android Studio hasn't gotten worse, its process has been the same for years now ... run it online then bundle up the repository cache and take that offline. I'm getting ready to do the big nasty for this year, and my question deals with Visual Studio. Currently, we have 2019 (with about half the major components), on the air-gap network with all current patches applied. I'm soliciting opinions on: - how much more does 2022 want to access the internet in its normal course of operations, once you have all components for your project on the local machine? For reference, 2019 works fine with no delays trying to access the internet to do "other stuff" or look for updates or phone home. - is it worth it to upgrade to 2022? We have a suite of .NET Framework 4.7.2 WinForms applications, along with both C and C++ programs. No web and no database ... although I can see some small local DB stuff coming. This questions only applies if we stick with NET Framework. We're thinking about migrating to .NET 7 (whatever the current version is), which will force us to upgrade and render this question moot. - how easy is it to set up a local NuGet server with just those packages put out by Microsoft, and maybe a few other select sources? We are excessively paranoid about third party stuff here, so don't really use much that we can't get the source for and compile ourselves, so I'm not talking all those random open source packages that are out there. Yes, I know MS isn't qualitatively better, but my overlords are much happier if I can point to them, or some other recognized corporate purveyor of SW tools, as the source of a binary. Data is transferred the old fashioned sneaker-net way, using DVDs. Having 10s of them is not a problem, but having 100s is. Al
After reading all the replies, just one additional note: .Net 7 isn't LTS. Use .NET 6 or wait for .NET 8. The is assuming that LTS support is important for your environment.
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Corporate policy matches the standard for any air-gapped network: no removable writable media. The DVD sessions are closed, therefore not writable, before being used in the air-gap system.
Be wary of strong drink. It can make you shoot at tax collectors - and miss. Lazarus Long, "Time Enough For Love" by Robert A. Heinlein
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I work on an air-gapped development network. Every year or so, I go out and spend a week or so on an internet connected machine and download Visual Studio and Android Studio and all the bits and pieces required for those products and the libraries they want to download to support our projects. Copy all that onto DVDs and transfer it to the air-gap and setup some scripts to install it all. Yes, it is a colossal PITA but it's what I've got to do for my work environment. VS has been getting worse each release as Microsoft ignores their offline developers more and more. If you need all those damn NuGet packages to do the most basic development actions like unit tests, include the *&(^# things in the offline packages! ... Okay, rant over. Android Studio hasn't gotten worse, its process has been the same for years now ... run it online then bundle up the repository cache and take that offline. I'm getting ready to do the big nasty for this year, and my question deals with Visual Studio. Currently, we have 2019 (with about half the major components), on the air-gap network with all current patches applied. I'm soliciting opinions on: - how much more does 2022 want to access the internet in its normal course of operations, once you have all components for your project on the local machine? For reference, 2019 works fine with no delays trying to access the internet to do "other stuff" or look for updates or phone home. - is it worth it to upgrade to 2022? We have a suite of .NET Framework 4.7.2 WinForms applications, along with both C and C++ programs. No web and no database ... although I can see some small local DB stuff coming. This questions only applies if we stick with NET Framework. We're thinking about migrating to .NET 7 (whatever the current version is), which will force us to upgrade and render this question moot. - how easy is it to set up a local NuGet server with just those packages put out by Microsoft, and maybe a few other select sources? We are excessively paranoid about third party stuff here, so don't really use much that we can't get the source for and compile ourselves, so I'm not talking all those random open source packages that are out there. Yes, I know MS isn't qualitatively better, but my overlords are much happier if I can point to them, or some other recognized corporate purveyor of SW tools, as the source of a binary. Data is transferred the old fashioned sneaker-net way, using DVDs. Having 10s of them is not a problem, but having 100s is. Al
For first part of your question, I don't have an answer like other people as I have never experienced using Visual Studio in offline mode. Regarding the Second part about setting up local Nuget Server, I would say it's moderately easy to do following the documentations, I had done it once in one of my previous organisations where we had some internal company specific nuget packages.
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I work on an air-gapped development network. Every year or so, I go out and spend a week or so on an internet connected machine and download Visual Studio and Android Studio and all the bits and pieces required for those products and the libraries they want to download to support our projects. Copy all that onto DVDs and transfer it to the air-gap and setup some scripts to install it all. Yes, it is a colossal PITA but it's what I've got to do for my work environment. VS has been getting worse each release as Microsoft ignores their offline developers more and more. If you need all those damn NuGet packages to do the most basic development actions like unit tests, include the *&(^# things in the offline packages! ... Okay, rant over. Android Studio hasn't gotten worse, its process has been the same for years now ... run it online then bundle up the repository cache and take that offline. I'm getting ready to do the big nasty for this year, and my question deals with Visual Studio. Currently, we have 2019 (with about half the major components), on the air-gap network with all current patches applied. I'm soliciting opinions on: - how much more does 2022 want to access the internet in its normal course of operations, once you have all components for your project on the local machine? For reference, 2019 works fine with no delays trying to access the internet to do "other stuff" or look for updates or phone home. - is it worth it to upgrade to 2022? We have a suite of .NET Framework 4.7.2 WinForms applications, along with both C and C++ programs. No web and no database ... although I can see some small local DB stuff coming. This questions only applies if we stick with NET Framework. We're thinking about migrating to .NET 7 (whatever the current version is), which will force us to upgrade and render this question moot. - how easy is it to set up a local NuGet server with just those packages put out by Microsoft, and maybe a few other select sources? We are excessively paranoid about third party stuff here, so don't really use much that we can't get the source for and compile ourselves, so I'm not talking all those random open source packages that are out there. Yes, I know MS isn't qualitatively better, but my overlords are much happier if I can point to them, or some other recognized corporate purveyor of SW tools, as the source of a binary. Data is transferred the old fashioned sneaker-net way, using DVDs. Having 10s of them is not a problem, but having 100s is. Al
I have both Visual Studio 2019 and 2022 installed on my development machine. For my current development efforts, which is military simulations development, I find VS 2019 with .NET Framework 4.6 works just fine. With the little I have done with Visual Studio 2022 I have yet to see any problems. But, then again I have not used it extensively. Since you appear to be working in the same technical areas that I am in terms of the needed technologies, I don't see any reason for you to upgrade to Visual Studio 2022 unless you want the latest features and want to work with .NET Core 6.x and above
Steve Naidamast Sr. Software Engineer Black Falcon Software, Inc. blackfalconsoftware@outlook.com
