155 vs. millions
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155 deaths is all it took to ban ephedra[^] vs. millions of smoking related deaths, and tobacco is still legal[^] The irony of this leaves (no puns intended) me dumbfounded. So, what's your New Year's Resolution? Marc Latest AAL Article My blog Join my forum!
Just goes to show what a few billion dollars placed in the right hands can do... The tobacco industry isn't afraid of lining a few pockets to ensure it's survival. Dan Morris
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That's politics for ya! However, from personal experience, while ephedra is a very good supplement as it really works the way it's advertised, it may also give very bad side effects; * Low blood pressure - every morning is a challenge 10 seconds after getting up from bed, heading towards the bathroom.. "Hey, where did the lights go?" * Higher work pulse - running with ephedra in the system is near impossible. My max is around 175-180 bpm, at which point I have to be working really really hard. With ephedra in my body I can reach that pulse almost without breaking a sweat. * Depression - ephedra is a stimulant related to amphetamine. The effects of it leaving the body is similar to that of amphetamine leaving the body of an amphetamine user, i.e., not the best feeling in the world. Anything not going your way, feels like the biggest problem in the world. The good thing is that ephedra teaches one never to start with amphetamine. As long as the manufacturer of the ephedra herb capsules employs some quality control, then I see no problems with it. Twinlab's got the best damn ephedra supplements I've ever used - no noticable side effects at all! While other no-name brands are just horrible (where all points above apply). Tobacco users should pay more for medical treatments. Public hospitals should charge extra for treating tobacco users, even if they pay VAT for their tobacco products. Non-smokers should be prioritized in medical situations where needed. Smokers shouldn't be allowed to smoke in public areas. I may sound like a fascist here, but I'm really just being brutally honest here. I don't enjoy paying taxes for people who's misusing their benefits (IMHO, smoking is!), and I don't like breathing second hand smoke. There is nothing good with smoking. Nothing at all - it's all poison. How is me sucking smoke from a burning tyre any different from sucking the smoke from a cigarette? I bet if tyres had been invented before we found tobacco, smokers would today gather around burning tyres, enjoying the sweet flavor rubber smoke. :) Marc Clifton wrote: So, what's your New Year's Resolution? None, because I know my character is too weak to make any worthy promise. :) -- Watcha' gonna do, when Hulkamania runs wild on you!?
Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote: I don't enjoy paying taxes for people who's misusing their benefits So should government also monitor food intake? Amount of exercise? People who aren't trying to be physically fit, are more likely to become ill.
"Things are not what they seem. Nor are they any different."
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Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote: I don't enjoy paying taxes for people who's misusing their benefits So should government also monitor food intake? Amount of exercise? People who aren't trying to be physically fit, are more likely to become ill.
"Things are not what they seem. Nor are they any different."
brianwelsch wrote: So should government also monitor food intake? Amount of exercise? People who aren't trying to be physically fit, are more likely to become ill. Not monitor, no. But if a person wants treatments for back pain, and the person in question weighs 300+ lbs, then it should cost more. It all boils down to taking responsbility for your action, doesn't it? Nobody is forced to eat excessively, and nobody is forced to smoke. With a public health care system, as here in Sweden, people are almost encouraged to eat like crazy and smoke. And it's gotten to the point where the health care is just falling apart, because it's mismanaged and wasn't designed to treat people constantly hurting themselves. The past few weeks I've come to the conclusion that I'm paying way too much tax. Most of it is sucked into a big black hole a.k.a administration, never to surface again. What's left to actually treat people, just isn't enough. Administration costs and "stupid" costs must be cut back. ("Stupid" costs are due to treating people who have spent a life time on weakening their own health - and ignorance is no excuse this day and age!) I'm all for a public health care system, I really am! But I want something in return from the people who use it - effort! -- Watcha' gonna do, when Hulkamania runs wild on you!?
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brianwelsch wrote: So should government also monitor food intake? Amount of exercise? People who aren't trying to be physically fit, are more likely to become ill. Not monitor, no. But if a person wants treatments for back pain, and the person in question weighs 300+ lbs, then it should cost more. It all boils down to taking responsbility for your action, doesn't it? Nobody is forced to eat excessively, and nobody is forced to smoke. With a public health care system, as here in Sweden, people are almost encouraged to eat like crazy and smoke. And it's gotten to the point where the health care is just falling apart, because it's mismanaged and wasn't designed to treat people constantly hurting themselves. The past few weeks I've come to the conclusion that I'm paying way too much tax. Most of it is sucked into a big black hole a.k.a administration, never to surface again. What's left to actually treat people, just isn't enough. Administration costs and "stupid" costs must be cut back. ("Stupid" costs are due to treating people who have spent a life time on weakening their own health - and ignorance is no excuse this day and age!) I'm all for a public health care system, I really am! But I want something in return from the people who use it - effort! -- Watcha' gonna do, when Hulkamania runs wild on you!?
Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote: It all boils down to taking responsbility for your action, doesn't it? Absolutely! As long as it fair in that regard I really don't have a problem with penalties for smoking, obesity, etc. However, once we start trying to filter through which conditions are self-made, and which are unavoidable, or perhaps caused by mental illness, we get into alot of rules which can be broken, and more chance for the system to fall apart. I'd like to see things move towards individual health insurance, where I can customize a plan with whichever insurance company I choose, and they can adjust my premiums based on overall health. If for whatever reason I cannot afford coverage I can apply for assistance from the government with this for x years.
"Things are not what they seem. Nor are they any different."
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155 deaths is all it took to ban ephedra[^] vs. millions of smoking related deaths, and tobacco is still legal[^] The irony of this leaves (no puns intended) me dumbfounded. So, what's your New Year's Resolution? Marc Latest AAL Article My blog Join my forum!
It is mind boggling. In the course of researching yesterday's question I found no evidence supporting this ban. It seems to be along the same lines as the other interesting post from yesterday about subverting science to support a politically approved agenda. As the lecture Crichton delivered at Cal Tech states, consensus isn't science - it's religion. I'm resolving to give up making resolutions. Years ago I resolved to put more things off, and to date it's the only one I've successfully kept. It's been so successful, in fact, that I've never since got around to making more resolutions, so I think the time has come for this year's committment. "Another day done - All targets met; all systems fully operational; all customers satisfied; all staff keen and well motivated; all pigs fed and ready to fly" - Jennie A.
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I think all drugs should be legal, but your odds of survival should be printed plainly on the packaging. Marc Clifton wrote: New Year's Resolution? Oddly, to quit smoking. I quit for a few weeks this fall, then started up again occasionally. I'm smoking much,much less than before, but smoking is smoking.
"Things are not what they seem. Nor are they any different."
brianwelsch wrote: I think all drugs should be legal, but your odds of survival should be printed plainly on the packaging. That was GENIUS! Man, we need that on all sorts of products. Like for fragrances and clothes, they need to print: "Odds of getting laid: XX%". On TVs: "Odds of finding something good to watch." I can't think of anymore now.... damn, it was going good there for a while. EDIT: Oops, forogot tot mention my New Year's Resolution, which is to lose weight and build up some muscle. I really let myself go this year, and I need to get in better shape so I can compete against others in my Tae Kwan Do class.
Who am I? Currently: A Programming Student trying to survive school with plan to go on to Univeristy of Advancing Technology to study game design. Main career interest include: Multimedia and game programming. Working on an outside project: A game for the GamePark32 (GP32) portable gaming console. My website: www.GP32US.com
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Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote: I don't enjoy paying taxes for people who's misusing their benefits So should government also monitor food intake? Amount of exercise? People who aren't trying to be physically fit, are more likely to become ill.
"Things are not what they seem. Nor are they any different."
Yes. Fat people should be taxed by the pound, and pay extra for treatment for bad knees, heart problems, back injuries, and airline seats. We need an excise tax on fast food, too, to help offset the huge burden placed on the health care system by people who, from poor dietary habits to plain laziness, allow themselves to become obese. The truly obese should be fined for consuming ice cream in public places, as it is offensive to all right thinking people of normal proportions, and sets a terrible example for impressionable children. And they should all be required to wear a beeper that sounds whenever they back up, for the protection of those stuck behind them in bank and supermarket checkout lines. "Another day done - All targets met; all systems fully operational; all customers satisfied; all staff keen and well motivated; all pigs fed and ready to fly" - Jennie A.
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Just goes to show what a few billion dollars placed in the right hands can do... The tobacco industry isn't afraid of lining a few pockets to ensure it's survival. Dan Morris
Dan Morris wrote: The tobacco industry isn't afraid of lining a few pockets to ensure it's survival. I think you are off base, the tobacco industry doesn't have to line pockets. As long as there is tax money to be made the government will do nothing. Gary Kirkham A working Program is one that has only unobserved bugs I thought I wanted a career, turns out I just wanted paychecks
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155 deaths is all it took to ban ephedra[^] vs. millions of smoking related deaths, and tobacco is still legal[^] The irony of this leaves (no puns intended) me dumbfounded. So, what's your New Year's Resolution? Marc Latest AAL Article My blog Join my forum!
Marc Clifton wrote: The irony of this leaves (no puns intended) me dumbfounded. Ephedra was sold as a cure, when tobacco isn't. To the list of harmful products, you could also add alcohol, cars, food, guns, women... Marc Clifton wrote: New Year's Resolution Survive to new year's eve :rolleyes:
Le temps se perd, "Si" n'existe pas Tous les remords n'y changeront rien Le temps se perd, "Si" n'existe pas Donc à présent le choix reste mien
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Yes. Fat people should be taxed by the pound, and pay extra for treatment for bad knees, heart problems, back injuries, and airline seats. We need an excise tax on fast food, too, to help offset the huge burden placed on the health care system by people who, from poor dietary habits to plain laziness, allow themselves to become obese. The truly obese should be fined for consuming ice cream in public places, as it is offensive to all right thinking people of normal proportions, and sets a terrible example for impressionable children. And they should all be required to wear a beeper that sounds whenever they back up, for the protection of those stuck behind them in bank and supermarket checkout lines. "Another day done - All targets met; all systems fully operational; all customers satisfied; all staff keen and well motivated; all pigs fed and ready to fly" - Jennie A.
Roger Wright wrote: Yes. Fat people should be taxed by the pound, and pay extra for treatment for bad knees, heart problems, back injuries, and airline seats. It seems to me that while this might have an initial benefit, I bet it would actually work against you in the long run - taxing someone extra due to weight would just force them to work longer hours or a second job to maintain their current standard of living, which would just increase their stress (which as we know makes it easier to put on weight) and reduce the time they might have available to exercise or prepare healthier meals. My own experience would bear this out - the less time I spend travelling to/from/at work, and the less stressed out I am, the better I eat and the more I'm inclined to spend time on doing active things. Roger Wright wrote: We need an excise tax on fast food That I could agree with. But given the nature of our society, there is some need for "fast" food, so providing tax breaks to companies who provide healthy and balanced "fast" foods would be good too - that way they could be sold more cheaply than the unhealthy alternatives. -- Ian Darling "The moral of the story is that with a contrived example, you can prove anything." - Joel Spolsky
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155 deaths is all it took to ban ephedra[^] vs. millions of smoking related deaths, and tobacco is still legal[^] The irony of this leaves (no puns intended) me dumbfounded. So, what's your New Year's Resolution? Marc Latest AAL Article My blog Join my forum!
Money :sigh: Elaine (non fluffy tigress) The tigress is here :-D
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Marc Clifton wrote: The irony of this leaves (no puns intended) me dumbfounded. Ephedra was sold as a cure, when tobacco isn't. To the list of harmful products, you could also add alcohol, cars, food, guns, women... Marc Clifton wrote: New Year's Resolution Survive to new year's eve :rolleyes:
Le temps se perd, "Si" n'existe pas Tous les remords n'y changeront rien Le temps se perd, "Si" n'existe pas Donc à présent le choix reste mien
KaЯl wrote: To the list of harmful products ... women I hate to break it to you Karl, but women are not products. They're slave masters. :rolleyes: -- Watcha' gonna do, when Hulkamania runs wild on you!?
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KaЯl wrote: To the list of harmful products ... women I hate to break it to you Karl, but women are not products. They're slave masters. :rolleyes: -- Watcha' gonna do, when Hulkamania runs wild on you!?
We are all products, men and women... welcome in a capitalist world! Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote: They're slave masters You know, Jörgen, you can do what you want in privacy, I won't judge :-D
Le temps se perd, "Si" n'existe pas Tous les remords n'y changeront rien Le temps se perd, "Si" n'existe pas Donc à présent le choix reste mien
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We are all products, men and women... welcome in a capitalist world! Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote: They're slave masters You know, Jörgen, you can do what you want in privacy, I won't judge :-D
Le temps se perd, "Si" n'existe pas Tous les remords n'y changeront rien Le temps se perd, "Si" n'existe pas Donc à présent le choix reste mien
KaЯl wrote: We are all products, men and women... welcome in a capitalist world! It may be a capitalist world we live in, but I'll be damned if I'm sold! KaЯl wrote: You know, Jörgen, you can do what you want in privacy, I won't judge Touché! :-D -- Watcha' gonna do, when Hulkamania runs wild on you!?
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We are all products, men and women... welcome in a capitalist world! Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote: They're slave masters You know, Jörgen, you can do what you want in privacy, I won't judge :-D
Le temps se perd, "Si" n'existe pas Tous les remords n'y changeront rien Le temps se perd, "Si" n'existe pas Donc à présent le choix reste mien
Hey, did any of your fellow country men educate the Italians in making good wine? For once I'm happy to say that this Italian Merlot tastes very good! Cheers! *hick* :-D (Is that Salut! in french btw?) -- Watcha' gonna do, when Hulkamania runs wild on you!?
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KaЯl wrote: We are all products, men and women... welcome in a capitalist world! It may be a capitalist world we live in, but I'll be damned if I'm sold! KaЯl wrote: You know, Jörgen, you can do what you want in privacy, I won't judge Touché! :-D -- Watcha' gonna do, when Hulkamania runs wild on you!?
Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote: It may be a capitalist world we live in, but I'll be damned if I'm sold! Come on! What's the price of your soul? :-D
Le temps se perd, "Si" n'existe pas Tous les remords n'y changeront rien Le temps se perd, "Si" n'existe pas Donc à présent le choix reste mien
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Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote: It may be a capitalist world we live in, but I'll be damned if I'm sold! Come on! What's the price of your soul? :-D
Le temps se perd, "Si" n'existe pas Tous les remords n'y changeront rien Le temps se perd, "Si" n'existe pas Donc à présent le choix reste mien
KaЯl wrote: What's the price of your soul? Well.. uhm. A case of that Pinot Noir from Bourgogne wine I drank a couple of weeks ago would be nice. :rolleyes: :-D -- Watcha' gonna do, when Hulkamania runs wild on you!?
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Hey, did any of your fellow country men educate the Italians in making good wine? For once I'm happy to say that this Italian Merlot tastes very good! Cheers! *hick* :-D (Is that Salut! in french btw?) -- Watcha' gonna do, when Hulkamania runs wild on you!?
I'm not sure, but IIRC, it's the opposite, Romans are the ones who learned to Gauls how to make wine. AFAIK, Merlot is mainly used in Bordelais (region of Bordeaux) and in Tessin, a italian-speaking part of Switzerland. I suppose that Californian and Australian producers borrowed it too. Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote: Is that Salut! in french btw?) We would rather say "Santé!", a wish of good health (it comes probably from a time when use of poison was common :-D)
Le temps se perd, "Si" n'existe pas Tous les remords n'y changeront rien Le temps se perd, "Si" n'existe pas Donc à présent le choix reste mien
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I'm not sure, but IIRC, it's the opposite, Romans are the ones who learned to Gauls how to make wine. AFAIK, Merlot is mainly used in Bordelais (region of Bordeaux) and in Tessin, a italian-speaking part of Switzerland. I suppose that Californian and Australian producers borrowed it too. Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote: Is that Salut! in french btw?) We would rather say "Santé!", a wish of good health (it comes probably from a time when use of poison was common :-D)
Le temps se perd, "Si" n'existe pas Tous les remords n'y changeront rien Le temps se perd, "Si" n'existe pas Donc à présent le choix reste mien
KaЯl wrote: I'm not sure, but IIRC, it's the opposite, Romans are the ones who learned to Gauls how to make wine. To me it seems that the apprentice became more powerful than his master. Maybe I've been unlucky when it comes to Italian wines, but it still doesn't invalidate my personal wine statistics. What else can I trust than my own taste buds? :) KaЯl wrote: We would rather say "Santé!", a wish of good health (it comes probably from a time when use of poison was common ) Well then, Santé KaЯl! I'm off to the party. Have a good one! Don't spare the wine or the women :-D -- Watcha' gonna do, when Hulkamania runs wild on you!?
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KaЯl wrote: To the list of harmful products ... women I hate to break it to you Karl, but women are not products. They're slave masters. :rolleyes: -- Watcha' gonna do, when Hulkamania runs wild on you!?
Shhhh ! :laugh: The tigress is here :-D