Visual Studio.NET
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Hey John It only installs the J# runtime and not the J# compiler/other-stuff, but even that is sorta annoying I agree. But one good thing is that you can take advantage of some extra classes available in the J# runtime that are not available in the .NET BCL (for e.g. there is a whole zipping/unzipping library). But I am wondering if you've moved to .NET yet :-) My guess is not ;-) Nish
Now with my own blog - void Nish(char* szBlog); My MVP tips, tricks and essays web site - www.voidnish.com
Plus after installing you can go straight to Add/Remove programs and uninstall the J# stuff [worldspawn]
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John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote: Since when is f***ing J#.f***ING.NET *NECESSARY* to write C++ code??!! Who writes C++ code anymore? Marc Microsoft MVP, Visual C# MyXaml MyXaml Blog
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John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote: Since when is f***ing J#.f***ING.NET *NECESSARY* to write C++ code??!! Who writes C++ code anymore? Marc Microsoft MVP, Visual C# MyXaml MyXaml Blog
People that: a) are working in a shop where .NET isn't a factor in ANYTHING they write. b) don't want to burdon their customers with an additional 25mb runtime installation. c) don't want their code to be virtually locked in to requiring Windows (much less the latest version of Windows). ------- sig starts "...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001 "You won't like me when I'm angry..." - Dr. Bruce Banner Please review the Legal Disclaimer in my bio. ------- sig ends
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Mostly game developers i'd say marc. [worldspawn]
And people that write software for proprietary hardware systems. ------- sig starts "...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001 "You won't like me when I'm angry..." - Dr. Bruce Banner Please review the Legal Disclaimer in my bio. ------- sig ends
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Hey John It only installs the J# runtime and not the J# compiler/other-stuff, but even that is sorta annoying I agree. But one good thing is that you can take advantage of some extra classes available in the J# runtime that are not available in the .NET BCL (for e.g. there is a whole zipping/unzipping library). But I am wondering if you've moved to .NET yet :-) My guess is not ;-) Nish
Now with my own blog - void Nish(char* szBlog); My MVP tips, tricks and essays web site - www.voidnish.com
We don't need .NET - we need unmanaged C++ with MFC. I don't want all the .NET garbage that comes with VS.NET either. Wit the exception of a wdm video capture DLL, we don't even use COM. ------- sig starts "...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001 "You won't like me when I'm angry..." - Dr. Bruce Banner Please review the Legal Disclaimer in my bio. ------- sig ends
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People that: a) are working in a shop where .NET isn't a factor in ANYTHING they write. b) don't want to burdon their customers with an additional 25mb runtime installation. c) don't want their code to be virtually locked in to requiring Windows (much less the latest version of Windows). ------- sig starts "...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001 "You won't like me when I'm angry..." - Dr. Bruce Banner Please review the Legal Disclaimer in my bio. ------- sig ends
John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote: don't want their code to be virtually locked in to requiring Windows (much less the latest version of Windows). Actually .NET works on everything from Win98 and up, but of course, where you come from Win98 might be the latest version :P BTW, I use a mix of C++ and C#. Sometimes C# is faster to use, but C++ is still a way better language and way more fun to write. - Anders Money talks, but all mine ever says is "Goodbye!" ShotKeeper, my Photo Album / Organizer Application[^]
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John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote: don't want their code to be virtually locked in to requiring Windows (much less the latest version of Windows). Actually .NET works on everything from Win98 and up, but of course, where you come from Win98 might be the latest version :P BTW, I use a mix of C++ and C#. Sometimes C# is faster to use, but C++ is still a way better language and way more fun to write. - Anders Money talks, but all mine ever says is "Goodbye!" ShotKeeper, my Photo Album / Organizer Application[^]
We're still supporting Windows CE 2.12 apps... We decided in the middle of last year to stop making sure our code works on Windows 9x. Despite Microsoft's desire that we all work towards the latest and greatest crapware they puke out of Redmond, the reality is that we still have existing customers that don't want or need to use the latest OS, or sometimes, can't get the funding to upgrade. We're driven by our market, not by Microsft's roadmap. I'd love to be able to keep up, but when my job doesn't require it, I personally can't afford a yearly charge of $1500 to keep up as a developer. Even if I thought C# was a good idea, I can't afford the costs involved. ------- sig starts "...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001 "You won't like me when I'm angry..." - Dr. Bruce Banner Please review the Legal Disclaimer in my bio. ------- sig ends
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We're still supporting Windows CE 2.12 apps... We decided in the middle of last year to stop making sure our code works on Windows 9x. Despite Microsoft's desire that we all work towards the latest and greatest crapware they puke out of Redmond, the reality is that we still have existing customers that don't want or need to use the latest OS, or sometimes, can't get the funding to upgrade. We're driven by our market, not by Microsft's roadmap. I'd love to be able to keep up, but when my job doesn't require it, I personally can't afford a yearly charge of $1500 to keep up as a developer. Even if I thought C# was a good idea, I can't afford the costs involved. ------- sig starts "...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001 "You won't like me when I'm angry..." - Dr. Bruce Banner Please review the Legal Disclaimer in my bio. ------- sig ends
John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote: the latest and greatest crapware they puke out of Redmond You know, why dont you just move to /.? You are one of those anti-microsoft people who keeps bugging me by comming here and telling everyone that you hate microsoft. Actually, I'm ready to bet that microsoft makes better software than you do, even what you call it. - Anders Money talks, but all mine ever says is "Goodbye!" ShotKeeper, my Photo Album / Organizer Application[^]
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John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote: the latest and greatest crapware they puke out of Redmond You know, why dont you just move to /.? You are one of those anti-microsoft people who keeps bugging me by comming here and telling everyone that you hate microsoft. Actually, I'm ready to bet that microsoft makes better software than you do, even what you call it. - Anders Money talks, but all mine ever says is "Goodbye!" ShotKeeper, my Photo Album / Organizer Application[^]
As for being anti-microsoft, I've stated several times that the idea behind Windows is a great and noble one - common interface for all apps, a GUI we can live with, etc - but I think Microsoft shouldn't be controlling all the ingredients in the pie. I don't think that Microsoft should sidestep standards in an effort to kill off competitors for their apps (IE for one). I don't think Micorosft gives the industry enough time to adopt before coming out with something completely different (and usually incompatible with what came before). The plain fact of the matter is that there are other operating systems out there besides Windows. Microsoft's obvious move to destroy "cross-platform" stuff like Java is a clear indication that Microsoft is NOT concerned with making computer use better for the public at large. Microsoft's assumption that I want to be like everyone else and run all my apps via a web browser is so far off the mark that it doesn't even warrant discussion. Microsoft's assumption that users are willing to give up security for convenience has caused them to re-think at least a little of their plans. If you want to be led by the nose by Microsoft and be an early adopter every time the repackage DDE and give a shiny new name without so much as a whimper in defiance, go right ahead. I don't want to be identified on the internet. I don't want Microsoft to "help" me organize my passwords. I don't want to use IE. I don't want to code in C# until it's a job requirement. I don't want Microsoft to invade my life any more than it already has. If that makes you think I hate Microsoft, so be it. If you think I'm concerned that I bug you, well, then you haven't been paying very close attention. I read /., but only to see what's going on. I read the little blurbs, but not the "comments" made by their loyal following. If you don't, that's your choice. I also read The Register, AppleInsider, and Linux Weekly News (hoping to see a glimmer of organization in the Linux camp, but as yet I've not seen any). I wish I bugged Microsoft as much as I appear to upset you. I want choice, not "just Microsoft". (BTW, notice that I didn't do any of the cutesy little naming derivations for the qword "Microsoft".) ------- sig starts "...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001 "You won't like me when I'm angry..." - Dr. Bruce Banner Please review the Legal Disclaimer in my bio.
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As for being anti-microsoft, I've stated several times that the idea behind Windows is a great and noble one - common interface for all apps, a GUI we can live with, etc - but I think Microsoft shouldn't be controlling all the ingredients in the pie. I don't think that Microsoft should sidestep standards in an effort to kill off competitors for their apps (IE for one). I don't think Micorosft gives the industry enough time to adopt before coming out with something completely different (and usually incompatible with what came before). The plain fact of the matter is that there are other operating systems out there besides Windows. Microsoft's obvious move to destroy "cross-platform" stuff like Java is a clear indication that Microsoft is NOT concerned with making computer use better for the public at large. Microsoft's assumption that I want to be like everyone else and run all my apps via a web browser is so far off the mark that it doesn't even warrant discussion. Microsoft's assumption that users are willing to give up security for convenience has caused them to re-think at least a little of their plans. If you want to be led by the nose by Microsoft and be an early adopter every time the repackage DDE and give a shiny new name without so much as a whimper in defiance, go right ahead. I don't want to be identified on the internet. I don't want Microsoft to "help" me organize my passwords. I don't want to use IE. I don't want to code in C# until it's a job requirement. I don't want Microsoft to invade my life any more than it already has. If that makes you think I hate Microsoft, so be it. If you think I'm concerned that I bug you, well, then you haven't been paying very close attention. I read /., but only to see what's going on. I read the little blurbs, but not the "comments" made by their loyal following. If you don't, that's your choice. I also read The Register, AppleInsider, and Linux Weekly News (hoping to see a glimmer of organization in the Linux camp, but as yet I've not seen any). I wish I bugged Microsoft as much as I appear to upset you. I want choice, not "just Microsoft". (BTW, notice that I didn't do any of the cutesy little naming derivations for the qword "Microsoft".) ------- sig starts "...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001 "You won't like me when I'm angry..." - Dr. Bruce Banner Please review the Legal Disclaimer in my bio.
Hehe, you do not upset me ;) And I know you are about as conserned that you bug me, as I am about me bugging you. Come on John, this is not the first time our path cross here. :laugh: And I'm not led by the nose by MS, but neither am I afraid to try something new and to say I actually like most software from MS. But I am not the first one to adapt to new stuff, I does it when I can see a good reason to do it. - Anders Money talks, but all mine ever says is "Goodbye!" ShotKeeper, my Photo Album / Organizer Application[^]
