Trouble Keeping Up?
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David Kentley wrote:
In what alternate universe was this ever the case?
During the early DOS days with GWBASIC, Turbo C (not C++), and MASM (or TASM) I guess.
Regards, Nish
Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
Currently working on C++/CLI in Action for Manning Publications. (*Sample chapter available online*)Boy was it easy to be a developer back then! ;)
Rocky <>< Latest Code Blog Post: SQL Server Express Warnings & Tips Latest Tech Blog Post: Scratch: fun for all ages for free!
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JamminJimE wrote:
300 baud modem in a Commodore 64
Hehehehe I remember those days.... I recall how astonishing it was to flip from 300 baud to 1200 baud and wonder about how blazingly fast it was.
Why is common sense not common? Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level where they are an expert. Sometimes it takes a lot of work to be lazy
Yeah, I remember.. While i was sitting with my little 300 baud Hes Modem, I dooled over those other guys that had laid out the big bucks for their 9,000 baud modems. Thought that would be all the speed I would ever need :)
Rocky <>< Latest Code Blog Post: SQL Server Express Warnings & Tips Latest Tech Blog Post: Scratch: fun for all ages for free!
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10.5 + 7 + 1 + .5 == 19 You've got 5 hours of learning time !!!
Christian Graus - C++ MVP 'Why don't we jump on a fad that hasn't already been widely discredited ?' - Dilbert
Christian Graus wrote:
You've got 5 hours of learning time !!!
I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess that you're single, aren't you? ;)
JamminJimE Microsoft Certified Application Developer.NET
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Pete O`Hanlon wrote:
I now tend to steer clear of bleeding edge technologies
Pete, That's a good idea. However, like I said in one of the other replies, that's the kind of questions coming up in my recent interviews! They want a Programmer/DBA/Architect expert in C#, VB.NET, ASP.NET, Classic ASP, VBScript, Oracle, SQL Server, Underwater Basket Weaving, Astronomy, etc. If you can't answer the questions, they'll find some 20something who can. My debtors don't like to hear "I'm betwen contracts." ;)
JamminJimE Microsoft Certified Application Developer.NET
JamminJimE wrote:
C#, VB.NET, ASP.NET, Classic ASP, VBScript, Oracle, SQL Server,
Why ? Maybe you need to steer clear of agencies, who look for an expert in everything, to ensure they get someone who knows the job at hand ?
Christian Graus - C++ MVP 'Why don't we jump on a fad that hasn't already been widely discredited ?' - Dilbert
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I am hooked on the Dew. I am into the Code Red Mtn Dew right now. Can't drink the green anymore. Too many stomach problems. I completely understand the need to keep learning. However, recently it seems to me to be alot like trying to take a sip from a fire hose! I have 4 new .NET 2.0 books at the house (advanced and core topics) that I can't even get the cover open on yet. Don't get me wrong, my boss is great. However, the pace of business (telecomm) seems to dictate what gets done and at what pace. Right now, this shop is 3 developers (including myself). There are something like 9 or 10 applications (all web) that we are working on and patching. All of it is in .NET 1.1. I don't have any position to dictate what version of .NET we are writing in and the other developers are experienced with 1.1 and no experience with 2.0. We won't be changing anytime soon! BTW, I didn't go to college. I was Active Duty US Military, but that's a different topic! ;)
JamminJimE Microsoft Certified Application Developer.NET
JamminJimE wrote:
BTW, I didn't go to college. I was Active Duty US Military, but that's a different topic!
I am a college drop-out, but that too is another story. ;P
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
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JamminJimE wrote:
Does anyone else feel that software development is changing so fast that you can't keep up?
Naw. Oh, sure, if i wanted to be up-to-date on every new MS "technology", i'd never sleep... but that's just madness. I don't care how amazing Biztalk is, it'll either die out in a couple of years, or someone will find a way to explain it in 100 short words. WPF may be the most amazing new technology ever created, but i doubt it. A decade ago, I was writing GUIs in DOS that had better layout engines than WinForms - if i ever really need to use some new MS GUI thing, i'm sure i'll be able to get the hang of it in an afternoon. Here's a link for you: Fire and Motion[^]
When I was an Israeli paratrooper a general stopped by to give us a little speech about strategy. In infantry battles, he told us, there is only one strategy: Fire and Motion. You move towards the enemy while firing your weapon. The firing forces him to keep his head down so he can't fire at you. [...] The companies who stumble are the ones who spend too much time reading tea leaves to figure out the future direction of Microsoft. People get worried about .NET and decide to rewrite their whole architecture for .NET because they think they have to. Microsoft is shooting at you, and it's just cover fire so that they can move forward and you can't, because this is how the game is played...
Shog9 wrote:
if i ever really need to use some new MS GUI thing, i'm sure i'll be able to get the hang of it in an afternoon.
exactamundo. i basically ignore all of MS's TechOTheMonth until a requirement lands on my desk that makes ignoring it impossible. by that time, there will be a hundred tutorials available on the net.
image processing toolkits | batch image processing | blogging
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Christian Graus wrote:
You've got 5 hours of learning time !!!
I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess that you're single, aren't you? ;)
JamminJimE Microsoft Certified Application Developer.NET
Dude... I'm married, 2 kinds (6 and 10), 37 years old. I work from home, so I have no commute time. I work from 6 am to about 4 pm ( currently to 6 pm, as the kids are in holiday care ), eat breakfast and lunch at the PC, make dinner, put the kids to bed, start again by 8pm and work for another 2-4 hours. I have 6 hours of sleep in there. I go at least 15 hours work over the weekend. I learn new stuff entirely when I need to know it, otherwise, I just try to keep abreast of what *is* new, so when I need something, I know that it exists and where it is.
Christian Graus - C++ MVP 'Why don't we jump on a fad that hasn't already been widely discredited ?' - Dilbert
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Christian Graus wrote:
You've got 5 hours of learning time !!!
I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess that you're single, aren't you? ;)
JamminJimE Microsoft Certified Application Developer.NET
JamminJimE wrote:
I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess that you're single, aren't you?
just make it a family outing.... go out to a Microsoft technology expo, learn a new computer language... just you and the Mrs. and any Jr's you have.... in fact get the audio version of C# in 21 days and play it to your baby children before they are born. ;);) :laugh:
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
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JamminJimE wrote:
I miss the good ol' days when a dev environment was around a couple of years before they started changing it.
In what alternate universe was this ever the case?
Faith is a fine invention For gentlemen who see; But microscopes are prudent In an emergency! -Emily Dickinson
David Kentley wrote:
In what alternate universe was this ever the case?
You're just not old enough to remember when it was the case.
"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass..." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997
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"...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001 -
I hope that I'm not the only one otherwise I'm gonna start interviewing at the fast food chains. Does anyone else feel that software development is changing so fast that you can't keep up? I work 9 hours a day with an hour for lunch, a 45 minute commute each way. This doesn't leave much time for trying to keep up with Microsoft changing everything every couple of months! If asked, I couldn't even tell you what all the new technologies' acronyms mean! I miss the good ol' days when a dev environment was around a couple of years before they started changing it. "Would you like fries with that?"..."Would you like to large size for only 39 cents more?" Just practicing! :wtf:
JamminJimE Microsoft Certified Application Developer.NET
Yes, the world of developers (well at least on the MS platform) changes started at the release of .NET and just keep increasing at the speed new technologies are being released. Being involved in the computer industry since 1981, I have never seen anything like the changes of today except for the very early years of the personal computer. Once I learned C and started on MSDOS, it was a quiet life until Windows 3.0 hit which required a great deal of change along with firmly embrassing C++. Then things were quiet until Windows 95 hit, but then most of the technology just came along and the learning curve was slight. From that point until the release of .NET, not a lot happened. The first few years of .NET were somewhat calm, but now that it has exploded, Microsoft seems to be taking it seriously and most areas of development continue to change. Not sure if at times it is for the good ;) Anyway, I am finding it VERY hard to keep up with everything and have decided I need to focus in given areas and let the rest go by me until I have the time to deal with it. As an example, for a number of years now I have worked mostly on web applications, so I tend to dig in to advancements in that area. While I still keep an eye out about the other technologies, I focus on the technologies that will change the way I do the majority of my work. This is the first time since I began in the computer technology that I could not keep up with all areas of development.
Rocky <>< Latest Code Blog Post: SQL Server Express Warnings & Tips Latest Tech Blog Post: Scratch: fun for all ages for free!
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Dude... I'm married, 2 kinds (6 and 10), 37 years old. I work from home, so I have no commute time. I work from 6 am to about 4 pm ( currently to 6 pm, as the kids are in holiday care ), eat breakfast and lunch at the PC, make dinner, put the kids to bed, start again by 8pm and work for another 2-4 hours. I have 6 hours of sleep in there. I go at least 15 hours work over the weekend. I learn new stuff entirely when I need to know it, otherwise, I just try to keep abreast of what *is* new, so when I need something, I know that it exists and where it is.
Christian Graus - C++ MVP 'Why don't we jump on a fad that hasn't already been widely discredited ?' - Dilbert
Christian Graus wrote:
I'm married, 2 kinds (6 and 10), 37 years old
Christian, I must applaud you. I am also 37, married, and about to start a family. Your wife must be a very understanding woman. My wife would be too, but she would get tired of my working/studying all the time and start coming into my office "just to see what I'm doing" about every 15 minutes!!
JamminJimE Microsoft Certified Application Developer.NET
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JamminJimE wrote:
C#, VB.NET, ASP.NET, Classic ASP, VBScript, Oracle, SQL Server,
Why ? Maybe you need to steer clear of agencies, who look for an expert in everything, to ensure they get someone who knows the job at hand ?
Christian Graus - C++ MVP 'Why don't we jump on a fad that hasn't already been widely discredited ?' - Dilbert
Believe it or not, I just interviewed for an insurance company (name witheld) that wanted that very thing. This was a direct hire. Actually, that's all I have been talking with lately. The agencies just see the fancy buzzwords on the ol' resume and submit me. It's the hiring manager or his IT groupies that are asking these questions and looking down their nose if you don't know all of the answers!
JamminJimE Microsoft Certified Application Developer.NET
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David Kentley wrote:
In what alternate universe was this ever the case?
During the early DOS days with GWBASIC, Turbo C (not C++), and MASM (or TASM) I guess.
Regards, Nish
Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
Currently working on C++/CLI in Action for Manning Publications. (*Sample chapter available online*)Uhm.... you're forgetting those behemoths called mainframes. There was also a period when DEC unvieled a new 'mini' computer every other month. There was all sorts of 'new' stuff to learn then as well. The best thing to take away from this, is that just as there was lots of new stuff in previous decades, not all of it has survived. I think the same can be said for a lot of the new technology that comes out today. There will only be little of it that will survive for a couple of decades. :)
Chris Meech I am Canadian. [heard in a local bar] I agree with you that my argument is useless. [Red Stateler] Hey, I am part of a special bread, we are called smart people [Captain See Sharp] The zen of the soapbox is hard to attain...[Jörgen Sigvardsson] I wish I could remember what it was like to only have a short term memory.[David Kentley]
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Yes, the world of developers (well at least on the MS platform) changes started at the release of .NET and just keep increasing at the speed new technologies are being released. Being involved in the computer industry since 1981, I have never seen anything like the changes of today except for the very early years of the personal computer. Once I learned C and started on MSDOS, it was a quiet life until Windows 3.0 hit which required a great deal of change along with firmly embrassing C++. Then things were quiet until Windows 95 hit, but then most of the technology just came along and the learning curve was slight. From that point until the release of .NET, not a lot happened. The first few years of .NET were somewhat calm, but now that it has exploded, Microsoft seems to be taking it seriously and most areas of development continue to change. Not sure if at times it is for the good ;) Anyway, I am finding it VERY hard to keep up with everything and have decided I need to focus in given areas and let the rest go by me until I have the time to deal with it. As an example, for a number of years now I have worked mostly on web applications, so I tend to dig in to advancements in that area. While I still keep an eye out about the other technologies, I focus on the technologies that will change the way I do the majority of my work. This is the first time since I began in the computer technology that I could not keep up with all areas of development.
Rocky <>< Latest Code Blog Post: SQL Server Express Warnings & Tips Latest Tech Blog Post: Scratch: fun for all ages for free!
Rocky, I've pretty much given up on writing Winforms as of late. There is just so much going on with ASP.NET and with it being all the buzz in the magazines (CIO Magazine, for example). With the release of the new framework (whatever iteration they are on), AJAX, Atlas, etc, I'm just struggling to keep up with that!! I am a VB programmer from 1993. I got into computers in '82 (12 years old) and wrote my first program (a game) on a Radio Shack TRS-80 CoCo. It just seems like instead of updates to the current frameworks, they come out with a new version. I have to agree with the Win'95 and '98 comment. It was pretty stable (not the OS, the industry) during that time. Just as of late, it's become a rat race.
JamminJimE Microsoft Certified Application Developer.NET
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Christian Graus wrote:
I'm married, 2 kinds (6 and 10), 37 years old
Christian, I must applaud you. I am also 37, married, and about to start a family. Your wife must be a very understanding woman. My wife would be too, but she would get tired of my working/studying all the time and start coming into my office "just to see what I'm doing" about every 15 minutes!!
JamminJimE Microsoft Certified Application Developer.NET
JamminJimE wrote:
Your wife must be a very understanding woman
*grin* she is, sometimes. She knows that the extra hours are the reason we have a nice house, and so on. I make sure we have the odd weekend away, and stuff like that. I prefer to work hard, and make my playtime count, than just be together with my wife every night, slack jawed in front of the TV ( which is what we used to do, before I started coding )
JamminJimE wrote:
"just to see what I'm doing" about every 15 minutes!!
If Donna didn't work, there is no way I'd contemplate working from home.
Christian Graus - C++ MVP 'Why don't we jump on a fad that hasn't already been widely discredited ?' - Dilbert
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Pete O`Hanlon wrote:
I now tend to steer clear of bleeding edge technologies
Pete, That's a good idea. However, like I said in one of the other replies, that's the kind of questions coming up in my recent interviews! They want a Programmer/DBA/Architect expert in C#, VB.NET, ASP.NET, Classic ASP, VBScript, Oracle, SQL Server, Underwater Basket Weaving, Astronomy, etc. If you can't answer the questions, they'll find some 20something who can. My debtors don't like to hear "I'm betwen contracts." ;)
JamminJimE Microsoft Certified Application Developer.NET
JamminJimE wrote:
My debtors don't like to hear "I'm betwen contracts."
So you work as a contractor? If you feel overwhelmed with the technology changes, it is probably a good time to look for a full-time job.
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Believe it or not, I just interviewed for an insurance company (name witheld) that wanted that very thing. This was a direct hire. Actually, that's all I have been talking with lately. The agencies just see the fancy buzzwords on the ol' resume and submit me. It's the hiring manager or his IT groupies that are asking these questions and looking down their nose if you don't know all of the answers!
JamminJimE Microsoft Certified Application Developer.NET
Perhaps be more assertive in the interview. If they ask if you know asp, ask them why they're still doing asp work when ASP.NET is so much better. If it's not a web dev job at all, ask why they're asking about that. If you know what they are advertising for, you can focus on presenting well for that, and throw the other stuff back at them.
Christian Graus - C++ MVP 'Why don't we jump on a fad that hasn't already been widely discredited ?' - Dilbert
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JamminJimE wrote:
My debtors don't like to hear "I'm betwen contracts."
So you work as a contractor? If you feel overwhelmed with the technology changes, it is probably a good time to look for a full-time job.
That's what I'm doing. This company doesn't expect that kind of knowledge from me, but the full time jobs I have been interviewing with want it. I am going to start raising my asking price when they want all of these technologies, I swear. "Yes, Mr. Manager, since you want a DBA, VB.NET Guru, Web Developer, AND a Software Architect, my salary needs to be between $250,000 and $275,000/yr." ROTF. That'll be the end of that interview! :laugh: When they start asking the questions, the interview is shot anyway. I know what I'm doing, but don't know every detail of every person's job on a development team!
JamminJimE Microsoft Certified Application Developer.NET
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JamminJimE wrote:
I hope that I'm not the only one otherwise I'm gonna start interviewing at the fast food chains. Does anyone else feel that software development is changing so fast that you can't keep up? I work 9 hours a day with an hour for lunch, a 45 minute commute each way. This doesn't leave much time for trying to keep up with Microsoft changing everything every couple of months! If asked, I couldn't even tell you what all the new technologies' acronyms mean! I miss the good ol' days when a dev environment was around a couple of years before they started changing it.
As most of the new stuff builds on what went before, I don't find the learning curve too hard. As long as you have good solid development practises, you'll find you can cope with almost anything Microsoft throw at you.
Michael CP Blog [^] Development Blog [^]
Yeah, well in my case, I don't know anything to start with and have to learn the solid development while working both without WPF and not and all mixed up :( Never mind, I don't know what anything means curently, so the people who can't keep up don't necessarily need to feel to bad :)
"Your typical day is full of moments where you ask for a cup of coffee and someone hands you a bag of nails." - Scott Adams
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Christian Graus wrote:
I'm married, 2 kinds (6 and 10), 37 years old
Christian, I must applaud you. I am also 37, married, and about to start a family. Your wife must be a very understanding woman. My wife would be too, but she would get tired of my working/studying all the time and start coming into my office "just to see what I'm doing" about every 15 minutes!!
JamminJimE Microsoft Certified Application Developer.NET
JamminJimE wrote:
about to start a family
oh hooooooooooo... I think we've reached the crux of the matter! I remember that time WELL in my life. I thought, "well, something's gotta give!". And it did. I had to put off hobby programming for well over FIVE YEARS! Maybe some other super-humans are capable of being a dad and still keeping up at a heavy duty dev company and also keeping up on learning and hobby programming. But those super-humans weren't ME. When you become a Dad, you're GOING to have to simplify some things. Commute time suddenly becomes the ULTIMATE priority for finding a job. You just have to let some things slide as you learn to be a good dad. If you don't let those things slide, you're letting your kid down. Don't do that. And if this is only your first kid, your next decision is "will we have another"? Once a few years have gone by and your kids are in about 4th/5th grade, well, things will slow down for you as a Dad. (I'm at that stage - it's NICE!) And you get more "me" time. I could be way off base. But BOY do i remember that time in my life :jig: It's an amazing ride. Hang on :cool: ...Steve http://shazware.com[^]
