The first thing I’d do as President is sign the Freedom of Choice Act. That’s the first thing I’d do

hairy_hats

No. It's a medical procedure so it should also require permission. If you exempt abortion then you should be able to exempt other procedures too and the principle of parental consent goes out the window.

Oakman

Ka?l wrote:

And it's a good thing.

Are you a parent?

Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface Algoraphobia: An exaggerated fear of the outside world rooted in the belief that one might spontaneously combust due to global warming.

KaRl

This is a theorical position that does not take into account what happens in the real life. If communication between the parents and the daughter is so low that the daughter is unable to talk about the pregnancy with them, then it's better to deal with it rather than creating a crisis that could be dangerous for the daughter.

When they kick at your front door How you gonna come? With your hands on your head Or on the trigger of your gun?

Fold with us! ¤ flickr

KaRl

Are you from the police?

Anyone who is not a misanthropist at 40 never loved men at any time Fold with us! ¤ flickr

Oakman

Ka?l wrote:

Are you from the police?

Nope, but I have relatives that work for the DoJ. Does that count?

Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface Algoraphobia: An exaggerated fear of the outside world rooted in the belief that one might spontaneously combust due to global warming.

Oakman

Ka?l wrote:

If communication between the parents and the daughter is so low that the daughter is unable to talk about the pregnancy with them

Oh yeah. Communication between 12 - 15 year-olds and their parents is almost always at the highest it will ever be. :rolleyes:

Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface Algoraphobia: An exaggerated fear of the outside world rooted in the belief that one might spontaneously combust due to global warming.

Oakman

Ka?l wrote:

As often, it's somebody that will never ever have to carry a child who has a firm opinion on that subject.

Or someone who has never raised a child who has a firm opinion on how best a government should regulate the relationship of parent and child?

Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface Algoraphobia: An exaggerated fear of the outside world rooted in the belief that one might spontaneously combust due to global warming.

KaRl

Are you a woman?

When they kick at your front door How you gonna come? With your hands on your head Or on the trigger of your gun?

Fold with us! ¤ flickr

Oakman

Ka?l wrote:

Are you a woman?

I'm a parent. I guess you're afraid to admit that you aren't.

Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface Algoraphobia: An exaggerated fear of the outside world rooted in the belief that one might spontaneously combust due to global warming.

Oakman

wolfbinary wrote:

What are you guys going to do about it if it passes and becomes law?

You don't understand. Most doctors oppose this law because of what could happen to them if parents discovered their child had been operated on without their consent.

Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface Algoraphobia: An exaggerated fear of the outside world rooted in the belief that one might spontaneously combust due to global warming.

KaRl

Oakman wrote:

I'm a parent.

So I guess you're not, but you have nonetheless a firm opinion of what they can do with their own body. Very contistent.

Oakman wrote:

I guess you're afraid to admit that you aren't.

If you think I care about what you believe or not, you're misguided.

Society is composed of two great classes, those that have more dinners than appetite, and those who have more appetite than dinners Fold with us! ¤ flickr

Oakman

Ka?l wrote:

So I guess you're not, but you have nonetheless a firm opinion of what they can do with their own body.

Yopu need to take remdial reading. Nowhere in this entire discussion have I said anything about what an adult woman can otr should do about aborting.

Ka?l wrote:

If you think I care about what you believe or not, you're misguided.

Oh, it's not a belief. I know you aren't. You are an opinionated kid with so little experience of the real world that you don't even know what you don't know.

Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface Algoraphobia: An exaggerated fear of the outside world rooted in the belief that one might spontaneously combust due to global warming.

Synaptrik

So, you are saying that parents don't have a right to know their young child is being operated on, let alone require consent? Why such a special case to abortion? If a child breaks their arm at school, why notify the parents and get a consent form signed? Another point, is the child aware of the rights they sign away when they have to sign forms at the hospital excusing mistakes? We had to sign one of those for my wife's hysterectomy. I support free choice. But in this case in my opinion it has to be with the parents consent and knowledge. That is just wrong.

This statement is false

KaRl

Synaptrik wrote:

Why such a special case to abortion?

You don't see the difference between breaking one's arm and becoming pregnant? If your daughter comes and say 'I broke myself a finger', that's the same than if she says 'i'm pregnant'?

Synaptrik wrote:

Another point, is the child aware of the rights they sign away when they have to sign forms at the hospital excusing mistakes?

That kind of things should not exist. Hospitals have to deal with their responsibilities, as judges have to dismiss extravagant cases.

Synaptrik wrote:

But in this case in my opinion it has to be with the parents consent and knowledge.

So it is to the parents to decide if the girl has to keep or not the embryo, to become a mother or not?

The most wasted of all days is that on which one has not laughed Fold with us! ¤ flickr

KaRl

Oakman wrote:

Nowhere in this entire discussion have I said anything about what an adult woman can otr should do about aborting.

You just signed a petition created by the "Americans United for Life" meant to block any federal law authorizing abortion. That's make you someone pro-abortion, of course...

Oakman wrote:

I know you aren't

That's for sure, you are sure to know many things.

When the pitcher falls upon the stone, woe unto the pitcher, when the stone falls upon the pitcher, woe unto the pitcher : whatever befalls, woe unto the pitcher

Fold with us! ¤ flickr

Synaptrik

Are you a woman Karl? And please, for all answer if you're a parent.

This statement is false

MrPlankton

Ka?l wrote:

As often, it's somebody that will never ever have to carry a child who has a firm opinion on that subject.

MrPlankton

Mexican boy: Viene la tormenta! Sarah Connor: What did he just say? Gas Station Attendant: He said there's a storm coming Sarah Connor: [sighs] I know.

KaRl

Synaptrik wrote:

Are you a woman Karl?

No, that's why I don't think myself compelled to impose my choice about what they can do with their bodies.

Synaptrik wrote:

And please, for all answer if you're a parent.

Why? It is none of your business.

When they kick at your front door How you gonna come? With your hands on your head Or on the trigger of your gun?

Fold with us! ¤ flickr

Synaptrik

I don't see a difference with regards to a parent's right. As a parent its still my responsibility to care for the child. Maybe the best thing would be to keep it, maybe the best thing would be to abort. I support Freedom of Choice by the way. I just don't support removing parents from the equation.

Ka?l wrote:

That kind of things should not exist. Hospitals have to deal with their responsibilities, as judges have to dismiss extravagant cases.

I don't live in shoulda woulda coulda ville.

Ka?l wrote:

So it is to the parents to decide if the girl has to keep or not the embryo, to become a mother or not?

It is the parents RESPONSIBILITY to care for their child. You are suggesting that that is special cased here. I disagree. It is up to them to discuss it and make their decision. Now in the case where the child has a legitimate reason to abort and the parents disagree allow a fast track petition to a court and let the court decide. But don't remove them altogether.

This statement is false

Synaptrik

Ka?l wrote:

No, that's why I don't think myself compelled to impose my choice about what they can do with their bodies.

I didn't suggest you do:

Further up the thread Ka?l wrote:

As often, it's somebody that will never ever have to carry a child who has a firm opinion on that subject.

You express a firm opinion on the subject.

This statement is false