Oh oh.
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Vikram A Punathambekar wrote:
Hey, what is this, Internet 101?
Sorry :-O As soon as Maunder fixes the e-mail link there would probably be a reduced need for such an external account. Anyhow, given a day or two this thread will be almost out-of-site and forgotten.
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Richard A. Abbott wrote:
As soon as Maunder fixes the e-mail link
Ok I was following along fine until I got to that, what am I missing?
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China's premier worried for U.S. investments[^] "Beijing has high expectations for U.S. President Barack Obama's economic recovery strategy, but worries remain about the safety of China's assets in the United States, Premier Wen Jiabao said on Friday." What's next? China dumping US t-bills?
73Zeppelin wrote:
What's next? China dumping US t-bills?
Well, there was some wild-ass conspiracy-mongering speculation recently that part of the deal Mrs Clinton was in China to conduct involved giving the Chinese government "rights" to eminent domain in the US. Crazy, I know ... I mean, who could ever even imagine that Democrats might ever seek to compromise the sovereignty of the People of the US?
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Richard A. Abbott wrote:
India can pack a fair punch that might make Beijing think twice.
Agreed. But if we are discussing China getting into combat with the U.S., we cannot assume that she would blink at thge idea of taking on India.
Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface
Oakman wrote:
China getting into combat with the U.S.
Not sure if China would want that as they would be most likely to come off second best. And the people of California wouldn't need to wonder when the big one would strike as it might no longer exist.
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China's premier worried for U.S. investments[^] "Beijing has high expectations for U.S. President Barack Obama's economic recovery strategy, but worries remain about the safety of China's assets in the United States, Premier Wen Jiabao said on Friday." What's next? China dumping US t-bills?
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I think from all that I read China has been preparing for a non-traditional "war" where they exercise greater influence over not just economics, but also cyberspace. By controlling those 2 areas, they could become the next "world's only superpower".
fred_ wrote:
By controlling those 2 areas, they could become the next "world's only superpower".
Throw in space itself and they've got a lock. China's space program is ramping up, just as the US program goes onto hiatus (After next year, we'll be renting space on the Russian program until and unless Orion bears fruit - something Obama has already indicated he thinks should be postponed.) I strongly suspect that President Hu and Premier Wen know very well that when engaged in a rock fight, it's better to be at the top of the well than standing at the bottom.
Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface
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fred_ wrote:
By controlling those 2 areas, they could become the next "world's only superpower".
Throw in space itself and they've got a lock. China's space program is ramping up, just as the US program goes onto hiatus (After next year, we'll be renting space on the Russian program until and unless Orion bears fruit - something Obama has already indicated he thinks should be postponed.) I strongly suspect that President Hu and Premier Wen know very well that when engaged in a rock fight, it's better to be at the top of the well than standing at the bottom.
Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface
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the one at the bottom of every post, next to the reply link
Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface
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fred_ wrote:
By controlling those 2 areas, they could become the next "world's only superpower".
Throw in space itself and they've got a lock. China's space program is ramping up, just as the US program goes onto hiatus (After next year, we'll be renting space on the Russian program until and unless Orion bears fruit - something Obama has already indicated he thinks should be postponed.) I strongly suspect that President Hu and Premier Wen know very well that when engaged in a rock fight, it's better to be at the top of the well than standing at the bottom.
Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface
I recently went to talk given by Neil Degrasse Tyson. He made a very salient point that if we want to see our space program ramp up all we really need is a rumor or two of China or Russia wanting to build a military base in orbit, on the moon or, on Mars. [Edit] Hopefully somebody can direct the defense department to read at least bits of "The Moon is a Harsh Mistress".
Sovereign ingredient for a happy marriage: Pay cash or do without. Interest charges not only eat up a household budget; awareness of debt eats up domestic felicity. --Lazarus Long Avoid the crowd. Do your own thinking independently. Be the chess player, not the chess piece. --?
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I recently went to talk given by Neil Degrasse Tyson. He made a very salient point that if we want to see our space program ramp up all we really need is a rumor or two of China or Russia wanting to build a military base in orbit, on the moon or, on Mars. [Edit] Hopefully somebody can direct the defense department to read at least bits of "The Moon is a Harsh Mistress".
Sovereign ingredient for a happy marriage: Pay cash or do without. Interest charges not only eat up a household budget; awareness of debt eats up domestic felicity. --Lazarus Long Avoid the crowd. Do your own thinking independently. Be the chess player, not the chess piece. --?
Chris Austin wrote:
if we want to see our space program ramp up all we really need is a rumor or two of China or Russia wanting to build a military base in orbit, on the moon or, on Mars
That's all it took to convert Ike into a space nut.
Chris Austin wrote:
Hopefully somebody can direct the defense department to read at least bits of "The Moon is a Harsh Mistress"
:thumbsup::thumbsup: But I'm not sure that Obama would consider that more important than convening a conference on "Violence in the Home," or would take Mitch O'connel away from his focus on outlawing abortion.
Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface
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73Zeppelin wrote:
I do not doubt economic warfare
I think that's already been going on. (As I am sure, do you.) But I think they've made the same mistake so much of the world has of assuming that the American financial engine was all powerful. They have, as you indicate, been attempting to gain a stranglehold on the US by buying up all its debt. And it certainly has worked for at least the last 12 years. neither Clinton nor Bush have told their bankers, "no," re: anything that was important. Marx said that the capitalist will "sell us the rope we hang him with," but I doubt he ever conceived of a situation where the capitalist would send him the money to buy the farm to grow the hemp to make the rope, in return for shoes that don't fit, food that is poisoned, and cheap goods made by slaves. However, this recession/depression that we are going through has shown both sides that China is (again, as you said) extremely vulnerable to the US. Although everyone assures me that tariffs are terrible idea, the effective tariffs that the US population has erected against China by simply refusing to buy their goods, have set her up for a peasant revolution - ironic when you think that they are, nominally at least, a communist country. It may or may not come to a shooting war but I note that we are now guarding our spy ships with a destroyer. What happens if that turns into a carrier group? What happens if the US goes after Pakistan which is probably more of China's ally that they have ever been the US's? What happens if the US gets sucked into the Mexican civil war? I have tried to understand what someeone like Larry Summers might be thinking when he signs off on these massive expenditres the US government is making. The only thing I can come up with is that he believes that we will inflate the money supply by so much that our debt will shrink to a fraction of what it presently is, in terms of buying power.
73Zeppelin wrote:
Hell of a thing to be dependent on other countries for energy and their willingness to buy government debt
Once upon a time it was rubber. Isn't there some axiom or other that deals with the idea that nations will always expand their use of easily obtained natural resources until they aren't?
Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface
Oakman wrote:
What happens if the US goes after Pakistan which is probably more of China's ally that they have ever been the US's? What happens if the US gets sucked into the Mexican civil war?
Here is an even more radical scenario - China takes sides in an American civil war, supporting the side fighting to reinstitute true free market capitalism (China's motivation being that a free market society in the US actually helps them maintain the status quo in their own country, whereas a socialistic US destabalizes the international economic engine)
Chaining ourselves to the moral high ground does not make us good guys. Aside from making us easy targets, it merely makes us idiotic prisoners of our own self loathing.
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Oakman wrote:
What happens if the US goes after Pakistan which is probably more of China's ally that they have ever been the US's? What happens if the US gets sucked into the Mexican civil war?
Here is an even more radical scenario - China takes sides in an American civil war, supporting the side fighting to reinstitute true free market capitalism (China's motivation being that a free market society in the US actually helps them maintain the status quo in their own country, whereas a socialistic US destabalizes the international economic engine)
Chaining ourselves to the moral high ground does not make us good guys. Aside from making us easy targets, it merely makes us idiotic prisoners of our own self loathing.
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China's premier worried for U.S. investments[^] "Beijing has high expectations for U.S. President Barack Obama's economic recovery strategy, but worries remain about the safety of China's assets in the United States, Premier Wen Jiabao said on Friday." What's next? China dumping US t-bills?
73Zeppelin wrote:
China's premier worried for U.S. investments
Wouldn't you be? :doh:
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