What every programmer should know about...
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Yes, we have licenses for driving. I'm not going to argue about why we shouldn't have any for programming; presumably you are aware of the differences and why driving licenses exist. Still, I don't see how your argument is in any way specific to programming. You're saying that ease of use leads to idiots using it (or at least users won't be educated about the thing they use; they don't need to be idiots for the theory to work), and therefore ease of use is bad. Jeg foreslår derfor at vi skaper et vanskelig språk i stedet; på den måten kan vi unngå mange tåpelige leserinnlegg. (I therefore suggest we create a difficult language instead; that way, we could avoid many stupid letters to the editor.)
dojohansen wrote:
Still, I don't see how your argument is in any way specific to programming. You're saying that ease of use leads to idiots using it (or at least users won't be educated about the thing they use; they don't need to be idiots for the theory to work), and therefore ease of use is bad.
I'm saying, we're not serving the non-programmers well by giving them easy-to-use languages that still offer most of the same pitfalls as the older, more difficult languages. You don't see a drunk struggling to keep his car on the road and think, "what he needs is a stabilizer for his steering wheel and larger buttons for the cruise-control feature!" We'd all be better off by giving those without the talent or desire for programming applications that provided them with sufficient flexibility to accomplish their needs without caring about efficient algorithm design, callstacks, typed variables, etc...
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Christopher Duncan wrote:
people equate programming with putting up a web page
You never miss an opportunity to take a jibe on Web development?:)
Rama Krishna Vavilala wrote:
Christopher Duncan wrote:people equate programming with putting up a web page You never miss an opportunity to take a jibe on Web development?
Most people think it is easy to be a web developer until they try to do it themselves. Then their song becomes how difficult it is to program to varying browser implementations and how standard application programming is so much easier because you only need to address a single architecture. All I have to say to people who attempt to develop web applications is "welcome to the wild side". P.S. - I wrote a client resident application to access Active Directory using an LDAP connection a few days ago as a prototype for a web service I am writing and, yes, it was easy, just not robust enough for our requirements. Web services and web based applications are the future. Get with it or get over it. When the boat leaves the dock you will either be on it or be left behind.
Simply Elegant Designs JimmyRopes Designs
Think inside the box! ProActive Secure Systems
I'm on-line therefore I am. JimmyRopes -
If I had started life as a web guy, I'm sure my perspective would be very, very different. Coming up from DOS and a brief affair with UNIX, C compiler in hand, gives you an incredible amount of power, all the way down to twiddling bits in a register if that's what it calls for. Entering the extremely constrained world of the web from this angle makes it all appear very limited in comparison. Yeah, a global TCP/IP network is pretty cool, but web development can't help but feel like you're playing with children's toys in contrast to what's truly possible. Knowing what's going on with a computer and being able to affect every aspect of it and then moving to a browser environment just feels like going backwards instead of forwards, i.e. a massive loss of power. That said, if there were no browser development and all the guys who do web dev now were working in hard core, native development, I have no doubt that the overwhelming majority of them would be fine programmers. The remainder, who get by today only because the web is sponsored by Fischer-Price, would simply drift away to another profession.
Christopher Duncan www.PracticalUSA.com Author of The Career Programmer and Unite the Tribes Got a career question? Ask the Attack Chihuahua!
modified on Friday, June 26, 2009 1:27 PM
Christopher Duncan wrote:
If I had started life as a web guy, I'm sure my perspective would be very, very different.
No that has nothing to do with it. I have been programming professionally for 36 years now and started out as an assembler language programmer on IBM mainframes (18 years experience) long before DOS was invented. I also learned UNIX and C language at Bell Telephone Laboratories (predecessor to AT&T Bell Laboratories) when UNIX was still a beta. When windows gained traction I learned C++ and became proficient with Windows programming, but realized that the internet is the future. I reinvented myself as a web developer around 10 years ago and have never looked back.
Christopher Duncan wrote:
Entering the extremely constrained world of the web from this angle makes it all appear very limited in comparison.
Although you do not have access to the client machine there are many things you can provide using web services and web applications. I don't particularly want to twiddle settings in a client's registry. I don't even care if they are using a computer or some other display surface and separate interface device. I provide web services and applications that can be presented on a wide range of architectures. The limitations are in your imagination, not the possibilities that present themselves.
Christopher Duncan wrote:
web development can't help but feel like you're playing with children's toys in contrast to what's truly possible
A limitation of your imagination.
Christopher Duncan wrote:
Knowing what's going on with a computer and being able to affect every aspect of it and then moving to a browser environment just feels like going backwards instead of forwards, i.e. a massive loss of power.
Welcome to the future. Give up the power trip and you will realize the potential of the internet.
Simply Elegant Designs JimmyRopes Designs
Think inside the box! ProActive Secure Systems
I'm on-line therefore I am. JimmyRopes