So try some of these...
-
Thanks for sharing the nice thoughts Nagy. What I want to establish here is that comparing Palestinians and Zionists is not correct even though they adopt the same tactics to oppose each other. The Palestinians are indigenous natives of the land while the Zionists were brought in ships from various other countries. One is a legitimate resistance movement and the other is an illegal occupier. The fight is not centered around religion as many believe, the fight is about rights. Btw, I don't know who downvoted you and why. I have compensated it with a +5.
I certainly didn't downvote him. Again with the Palestinians. Who are these mysterious people of whom you speak? Did they spring up overnight in the early 60's? No. Were there already jews in the area? Yes. Legitimnate resistence movement. How risible. All they know how to do is keep themsleves in articial refugee camps and lob missiles at innocent people or attempt to terrorise in the hope that will, somehow, get Israel to give them what they want. Since what they (and, presumably you, want, is to destroy Israel and exterminate the Jews, how much chance do you think there is of you getting it? Rights my arse: be honest for a change.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair. nils illegitimus carborundum me, me, me
-
Do you think you might not just be doing a touch of hair splitting here? We know we can't agree (cos I'm right and you're wrong :-)) so why not call it a day and go on our merry way? I'm pretty sure we can keep coming back at each other with a pithy response but to what end? We're no closer now than... well, ever, actually. Have a nice day.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair. nils illegitimus carborundum me, me, me
Sure Mark. I have no problem. I know you won't agree with me (because I'm right and you're wrong) :) Just explain to me once how you believe that it is their homeland when you know very well that people don't go to their homeland in ships, they're rather born there, isn't it?
-
I certainly didn't downvote him. Again with the Palestinians. Who are these mysterious people of whom you speak? Did they spring up overnight in the early 60's? No. Were there already jews in the area? Yes. Legitimnate resistence movement. How risible. All they know how to do is keep themsleves in articial refugee camps and lob missiles at innocent people or attempt to terrorise in the hope that will, somehow, get Israel to give them what they want. Since what they (and, presumably you, want, is to destroy Israel and exterminate the Jews, how much chance do you think there is of you getting it? Rights my arse: be honest for a change.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair. nils illegitimus carborundum me, me, me
mark merrens wrote:
Were there already jews in the area? Yes.
Yes, there were. And they are native Jews. I never questioned their right to live in Palestine. They have full rights to continue to live in their homeland. I have problem only with the Zionists who were imported from other countries. In the words of Helen Thomas "get the hell out of Palestine".
mark merrens wrote:
All they know how to do is keep themsleves in articial refugee camps
How many artificial refugee camps have you visited so far?
mark merrens wrote:
lob missiles at innocent people
So, what is Israel doing in Gaza? Do you atleast know that Israel killed more than 1500 civilians in 22 days during the Gaza carnage? Don't they look like human beings to you?
mark merrens wrote:
Since what they (and, presumably you, want, is to destroy Israel and exterminate the Jews
Did I ever talk to exterminating the Jews? In reality I am in full support of the native Jews. (I am myself named after a Jewish Prophet). It's just a typical cry of anti-semitism whenever Israel is criticised. Anti-Zionism is NOT anti-semitism. Please grow up.
mark merrens wrote:
Rights my arse
May be for you, not for the Palestinians.
-
Sure Mark. I have no problem. I know you won't agree with me (because I'm right and you're wrong) :) Just explain to me once how you believe that it is their homeland when you know very well that people don't go to their homeland in ships, they're rather born there, isn't it?
Shameel wrote:
Just explain to me once how you believe that it is their homeland when you know very well that people don't go to their homeland in ships, they're rather born there, isn't it?
Nope: your homeland is where you make it. I wasn't born where I lived for a long time but it became my homeland. The bottom line is it doesn't matter ho wmuch we go back and forth it's not up to us. I'd happily live in peace with Islam. Sadly, I suspect the reverse is not ture.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair. nils illegitimus carborundum me, me, me
-
mark merrens wrote:
Were there already jews in the area? Yes.
Yes, there were. And they are native Jews. I never questioned their right to live in Palestine. They have full rights to continue to live in their homeland. I have problem only with the Zionists who were imported from other countries. In the words of Helen Thomas "get the hell out of Palestine".
mark merrens wrote:
All they know how to do is keep themsleves in articial refugee camps
How many artificial refugee camps have you visited so far?
mark merrens wrote:
lob missiles at innocent people
So, what is Israel doing in Gaza? Do you atleast know that Israel killed more than 1500 civilians in 22 days during the Gaza carnage? Don't they look like human beings to you?
mark merrens wrote:
Since what they (and, presumably you, want, is to destroy Israel and exterminate the Jews
Did I ever talk to exterminating the Jews? In reality I am in full support of the native Jews. (I am myself named after a Jewish Prophet). It's just a typical cry of anti-semitism whenever Israel is criticised. Anti-Zionism is NOT anti-semitism. Please grow up.
mark merrens wrote:
Rights my arse
May be for you, not for the Palestinians.
It is quite duplicituous to pronounce that you are anti-zionist and not anti-semitic. Anyway, in reality nothing will change: the Palestinians are stuck in Gaza and the West Bank. Maybe Egypt and Jordan could relax their borders and let them migrate there - they can then procalim the Sinia as there homeland - after all, one bit of scrub looks pretty much like another. Better than where they are now I would have thought.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair. nils illegitimus carborundum me, me, me
-
mark merrens wrote:
It was never called Paletsine and all of the countries in that area are made up: none of them really existed as political entities over a hundred years ago.
But the land really existed, and the people that lived on it really existed, and the laws governing the ownership of land really existed. And legal basis of this was recognised by the British when they ran Palestine, which, under the 1922 (only 90 years ago, alas) Mandate, really existed. Israel recognised the Ottoman property rights of 19th century Zionists, as well as indigenous Jews. Thus they recognised the political entities that existed over 100 years ago.
mark merrens wrote:
enjoy unparalleled freedoms in Israel that you can't find in one single other Arab country.
Freudian slip? :-D
mark merrens wrote:
You want peace then make peace.
They don't want peace, they want their land back. Israel wants peace, so that it can keep the land it has appropriated.
Use carrots and sticks to force the little fish into the big tent - Anon
Excuse my tardy response.
ict558 wrote:
Thus they recognised the political entities that existed over 100 years ago.
of which Palestine was not one.
ict558 wrote:
Freudian slip?
:-O Looks that way!
ict558 wrote:
They don't want peace, they want their land back. Israel wants peace, so that it can keep the land it has appropriated.
Not their land so nothing to give back. Besides, you must realise that will never happen. Given that is the case make peace and move on.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair. nils illegitimus carborundum me, me, me
-
Excuse my tardy response.
ict558 wrote:
Thus they recognised the political entities that existed over 100 years ago.
of which Palestine was not one.
ict558 wrote:
Freudian slip?
:-O Looks that way!
ict558 wrote:
They don't want peace, they want their land back. Israel wants peace, so that it can keep the land it has appropriated.
Not their land so nothing to give back. Besides, you must realise that will never happen. Given that is the case make peace and move on.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair. nils illegitimus carborundum me, me, me
:zzz:
mark merrens wrote:
Excuse my tardy response.
Eh!? Whaa!? :confused: Oh! It's you. Scaring an old man like that.
mark merrens wrote:
of which Palestine was not one.
Arabs, indigenous Jews, Zionist immigrants, and others, held title to land under the Ottoman Empire. Where this land formed part of Palestine, run by the British under the 1922 Mandate, these titles were recognised. The political entities that existed over 100 years ago, whether called Palaestina, Filistine, Syria, or Orpington South, were thus recognised by all parties. Arabs, indigenous Jews, Zionist immigrants, and others, purchased title to land in Palestine, under the British. The political entity of Palestine was thus recognised by all parties. (Jews and Arabs alike held passports describing them as citizens of Palestine. Palestine postage stamps were in use. So the rest of the world also recognised Palestine as a political entity.) So, did Israel refuse to recognise the legitimacy of title to land of the indigenous Jews and Zionists? Of course not. Therefore, to that extent, Israel recognised Palestine, and the Ottoman Provinces, as a political entity.
mark merrens wrote:
Not their land so nothing to give back.
Legally, it was. But to the victor, the spoils. Israel may do as it likes.
mark merrens wrote:
Besides, you must realise that will never happen.
Willingly, no. But, never? Who knows? This show has been running since OT times.
mark merrens wrote:
Given that is the case make peace and move on.
50 years ago, before Prime Minister Wilson started the last round of 'troubles', an Irish guy explained that he hated me. Nothing personal, he assured me. I was, apparently, a good colleague to work with. It was merely because I was British.
Use carrots and sticks to force the little fish into the big tent - Anon