Pi and me..
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Do you think about Him, like you would think of a (close) friend? How about things like praying, is that necessary or is that a way of expressing your feelings, and a way of say 'Thank You'? Once again, I don't mean to be rude in any way. Sometimes it looks like that when I read back my own sentences. I'm just missing the right words sometimes :) -- Alex Marbus www.marbus.net But then again, I could be wrong.
Do you think about Him, like you would think of a (close) friend? Yes. Sometimes I'm a bad friend and forget He's always with me, but He never fails me. How about things like praying, is that necessary or is that a way of expressing your feelings, and a way of say 'Thank You'? That's almost a trick question. :) It is necessary because it's the way He wants us to talk to Him and He makes it very clear that He wants to fellowship with us. I certainly do express my feelings through prayer, by thanking Him, worshipping Him, and asking for help to do what's right. Today, we don't have the benefit of audible communication with Him, but He tells us what we need in the Bible, and promises that true believers will live with Him forever and have complete communication directly with Him. Once again, I don't mean to be rude in any way. Sometimes it looks like that when I read back my own sentences. I'm just missing the right words sometimes. Don't worry, I do the same thing quite often. ;) John
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This one's difficult: The major difference between the two is that God exists outside of the universe.. There will be a God without the universe, but there will not be a universe without God? -- Alex Marbus www.marbus.net But then again, I could be wrong.
Yep. Why do I think so? First, because Genesis 1:1 says that it's already happened that way before. Second, we learn that the universe would fall apart without Him from Hebrews 1:3. Third, this is going to happen in the future (if I read the verses right) -- 2 Peter 3:10 says that the heavens (universe) will pass away,the elements will melt away, and the earth will be completely destroyed. Then, Revelation 21:1-3 tells us that God will create a new heaven and new earth where He will actually live with those who have believed Him during their lifetimes. I think this is just great stuff. Keep the questions coming if I haven't offended you. :-D John
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Yep. Why do I think so? First, because Genesis 1:1 says that it's already happened that way before. Second, we learn that the universe would fall apart without Him from Hebrews 1:3. Third, this is going to happen in the future (if I read the verses right) -- 2 Peter 3:10 says that the heavens (universe) will pass away,the elements will melt away, and the earth will be completely destroyed. Then, Revelation 21:1-3 tells us that God will create a new heaven and new earth where He will actually live with those who have believed Him during their lifetimes. I think this is just great stuff. Keep the questions coming if I haven't offended you. :-D John
Second, we learn that the universe would fall apart without Him from Hebrews So He is the element that keeps it all together? If I'm allowed to make a joke: he's like a kind of super-glue? :) Are jokes about Him allowed, as long as they they don't really hurt Him, or anybody who believes in Him? Third, this is going to happen in the future This is pretty scary, actually. I've read parts of the bible, but I never read it completely. If I've understood right; there are several 'chapters', describing happenings from different views. I did not know that a piece of the future is described as well. Or is it more like a prediction? Peter 3:10 sounds like a horrible chapter to me :( Do you knows these chapters by heart? I've seen some documentary on television (could be a couple of years ago), where people stated that the bible contains some future-predictions. Do you think that's true? Ofcourse, if you have a book with 1000+ pages, you can always read what you want, between the lines. Keep the questions coming if I haven't offended you. No, you certainly have not offended me. This is real interesting stuff :) It may not completely change my way of life, or my believings but it's always good to extend your knowledge-base (to use some IT-related words :)) Just curious (and to show you how little knowledge I have on this subject) : is the bible written by a single person? -- Alex Marbus www.marbus.net But then again, I could be wrong.
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Second, we learn that the universe would fall apart without Him from Hebrews So He is the element that keeps it all together? If I'm allowed to make a joke: he's like a kind of super-glue? :) Are jokes about Him allowed, as long as they they don't really hurt Him, or anybody who believes in Him? Third, this is going to happen in the future This is pretty scary, actually. I've read parts of the bible, but I never read it completely. If I've understood right; there are several 'chapters', describing happenings from different views. I did not know that a piece of the future is described as well. Or is it more like a prediction? Peter 3:10 sounds like a horrible chapter to me :( Do you knows these chapters by heart? I've seen some documentary on television (could be a couple of years ago), where people stated that the bible contains some future-predictions. Do you think that's true? Ofcourse, if you have a book with 1000+ pages, you can always read what you want, between the lines. Keep the questions coming if I haven't offended you. No, you certainly have not offended me. This is real interesting stuff :) It may not completely change my way of life, or my believings but it's always good to extend your knowledge-base (to use some IT-related words :)) Just curious (and to show you how little knowledge I have on this subject) : is the bible written by a single person? -- Alex Marbus www.marbus.net But then again, I could be wrong.
Hmmm... This conversation could go on for quite a while. If you would like, we can start emailing each other instead. Just a suggestion. So He is the element that keeps it all together? If I'm allowed to make a joke: he's like a kind of super-glue? :) Are jokes about Him allowed, as long as they they don't really hurt Him, or anybody who believes in Him? Well, analogies and metaphors are quite often just not good enough when it comes to God. Yes, He would be sort of like som super-super-glue (definitely no cheap glue! :)). However, glue is passive and wears out. God is active and eternal. Just a minor difference... :P As far as jokes go, I guess that's a hard one to answer. I wouldn't count your statement as a joke really. Jokes are almost always degrading to the subject in some way, but saying something humorous about God could be appropriately respectful and honoring to Him -- I just have a hard time imagining how to do that. Having fun at His expense is definitely wrong, but having fun _with_ Him is an altogether different thing (as in He is enjoying it too). This is pretty scary, actually. I've read parts of the bible, but I never read it completely. If I've understood right; there are several 'chapters', describing happenings from different views. I did not know that a piece of the future is described as well. Or is it more like a prediction? Peter 3:10 sounds like a horrible chapter to me :( You're right. The Bible can be scary. In fact it is the scariest book ever known. BUT it's also the most liberating, encouraging, and exciting book ever known. It all depends upon your relationship with God. If you determine to believe what He says about Himself and act accordingly you get all of the benefits. If you decide to ignore Him and do whatever you want... I just hope that you change your mind before you die. (NOTE: This news could easily make you want to learn about God very quickly. That is good. But as you probably know, there are a lot of false ideas out there (I probably have a couple, myself). Make sure it makes sense before you just go believing what someone says about God. The only reliable way to discover God is through what He says about Himself in the Bible.) Do you knows these chapters by heart? I've seen some documentary on television (could be a couple of years ago), where people stated that the bible contains some future-predictions. Do you think that's true? Ofcourse, if you have a book with 1000+ pages, you can always read what you want, bet
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I must correct you with the first statement : find it impossible to believe in God. I don't think non-believers find it impossible to believe in God. I think it's all about 'allowing yourself to believe', or 'give yourself the chance to believe'. I've had religious lessons on high-school and I think I missed 90% of them. That's not a good thing to do, I know, but at the age of 16 .. I thought I had better things to do. Maybe my view at today's world would have been very different if I followed those classes. I do believe in the evolution-theory, and I believe in aliens as well. But I also think perhaps there is a God, or anything similair. There is an awful lot we don't know about, or we simply refuse to see things. .. and we're already WAY off topic That's true, but who cares? It's a very interesting subject, for both believers and non-believers I think :) -- Alex Marbus www.marbus.net But then again, I could be wrong.
*grin* I don't think I made 10% of the religious instruction I had in ( a religious ) school. I doubt that I missed much. RI in schools always comes from a traditional church system, which has evolved from a power base to a system that really promotes little to do with God. I was brought up a Lutheran, and the idea that God could do anything in your life was just unheard of. Today is really no different to the early church - God can be found anywhere, because He *is* everywhere, but the people presenting the God of the Bible are not found in the systems that have the benefit of age and tradition, but those that have the benefit of doing what the Bible says and not having other traditions to distract from that. And so, it really isn't a case of giving yourself a chance to believe in an abstract, 'I decided there might be a God' sort of way. Rather one becomes a Christian by asking God and recieving evidence of His existance, direct from Him. This is what the Bible says, this is what it records for the early church and if God was able to do amazing things then, how could He possibly go into the dusty building with tall towers, men in dresses singing in Latin off key, 'proof denies faith and without faith I am nothing' business ? As for evolution and aliens, why wouldn't you believe in them ? Having not received anything from God, why would you believe in Him, and in the absence of a God, evolution seems the only viable choice, aliens an obvious next step - if some amoeba decided to grow fins and then got sick of that and started walking, why would it only happen here ? For example, I don't believe in psychics, or UFO's. I find it odd that the former make money from the simpler people in our society, and the latter apparently fly great distances to sexually abuse similar people in remote places. But my scepticism is based largely on the fact I have seen neither. If I did, it would not change my belief in God, because I met Him first, and having done so, nothing could convince me He doesn't exist any more than I could be convinced my wife doesn't. Until I do, I won't believe it, and I daresay unless you share my experience with God you will continue, in the absence of evidence to the contrary not to believe in Him either. What I meant by 'refuse to believe' is that almost everyone I tell about the ability to prove God exists tells me I am wrong ( sometimes in no uncertain terms :) ) and yet are universally unwilling to prove it. Christian The content of this post is not necessarily the opin
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The fundamental problem with the God-theory is that it doesn't actually explain anything, it just substitutes one unanswerable question with another. So to avoid unnecessarily complicating my world-view, I choose not to believe in divine beings or other supernatural entities.
The problem is that if there *is a God ( and you say His existance is a conundrum no greater or small than His absence ), then surely His existance will not be effected by your decision not to consider the possibility ? Christian The content of this post is not necessarily the opinion of my yadda yadda yadda. To understand recursion, we must first understand recursion.
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The fundamental problem with the God-theory is that it doesn't actually explain anything, it just substitutes one unanswerable question with another. So to avoid unnecessarily complicating my world-view, I choose not to believe in divine beings or other supernatural entities.
The problem is that if there *is a God ( and you say His existance is a conundrum no greater or small than His absence ), then surely His existance will not be effected by your decision not to consider the possibility ? Christian The content of this post is not necessarily the opinion of my yadda yadda yadda. To understand recursion, we must first understand recursion.
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Hmmm... This conversation could go on for quite a while. If you would like, we can start emailing each other instead. Just a suggestion. So He is the element that keeps it all together? If I'm allowed to make a joke: he's like a kind of super-glue? :) Are jokes about Him allowed, as long as they they don't really hurt Him, or anybody who believes in Him? Well, analogies and metaphors are quite often just not good enough when it comes to God. Yes, He would be sort of like som super-super-glue (definitely no cheap glue! :)). However, glue is passive and wears out. God is active and eternal. Just a minor difference... :P As far as jokes go, I guess that's a hard one to answer. I wouldn't count your statement as a joke really. Jokes are almost always degrading to the subject in some way, but saying something humorous about God could be appropriately respectful and honoring to Him -- I just have a hard time imagining how to do that. Having fun at His expense is definitely wrong, but having fun _with_ Him is an altogether different thing (as in He is enjoying it too). This is pretty scary, actually. I've read parts of the bible, but I never read it completely. If I've understood right; there are several 'chapters', describing happenings from different views. I did not know that a piece of the future is described as well. Or is it more like a prediction? Peter 3:10 sounds like a horrible chapter to me :( You're right. The Bible can be scary. In fact it is the scariest book ever known. BUT it's also the most liberating, encouraging, and exciting book ever known. It all depends upon your relationship with God. If you determine to believe what He says about Himself and act accordingly you get all of the benefits. If you decide to ignore Him and do whatever you want... I just hope that you change your mind before you die. (NOTE: This news could easily make you want to learn about God very quickly. That is good. But as you probably know, there are a lot of false ideas out there (I probably have a couple, myself). Make sure it makes sense before you just go believing what someone says about God. The only reliable way to discover God is through what He says about Himself in the Bible.) Do you knows these chapters by heart? I've seen some documentary on television (could be a couple of years ago), where people stated that the bible contains some future-predictions. Do you think that's true? Ofcourse, if you have a book with 1000+ pages, you can always read what you want, bet
33 authors, 66 book. :) Christian The content of this post is not necessarily the opinion of my yadda yadda yadda. To understand recursion, we must first understand recursion.
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Well, even if I believed in aliens that were self-conscious physical beings living somewhere other than earth... the question is incomplete. It sounds like you're assuming that these aliens are as smart or smarter than humans. (If so, which humans? ;P) Why assume that? :)
How conceited do you have to be to believe that an omnipotent force (i.e. God) created an entire universe just for humans? What will you try to convince me of next, the sun revolves around the earth? No, wait! How about the earth is flat! We are the only intelligent species in the universe! God, I hope not! :mad: The following is not directed toward anyone specific. It is not meant as ridicule of anyone's beliefs. These are my observations. What is the difference between a religion and a cult? A religion is a widely accepted cult, that's all! Look at the similarities: A leader that speaks the words of a supreme power (Pope, priests, etc.); Laws that you must follow or you will be punished (eternal damnation); Brainwashing (church every Sunday). Let me get this straight, many of you believe in God because you have felt Him. Did you hear Him? Did you feel bliss, love, etc.? Haven't you people ever heard of the placebo effect; If you are expecting something to happen your brain will manifest it. Besides, I know a few psychotic disorders that have similar symptoms. Using the Bible as a reference for facts is like using any other book (or the internet). You were told that the Bible was God's word but you have no proof. Even if there was someone alive from the days it was written are you going to believe one person? Who is to say that is was not written by a bunch of drunken mathematicians as a joke about the reason things are the way they are. I will say that I do not discount the possibility that God exist, just as I do not discount alien existence. However, I do not like it when someone believes in God because they were told to. Trust me, it does not hurt to think for yourself. Challenge what you were taught. If you're right then you have nothing to worry about.
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How conceited do you have to be to believe that an omnipotent force (i.e. God) created an entire universe just for humans? What will you try to convince me of next, the sun revolves around the earth? No, wait! How about the earth is flat! We are the only intelligent species in the universe! God, I hope not! :mad: The following is not directed toward anyone specific. It is not meant as ridicule of anyone's beliefs. These are my observations. What is the difference between a religion and a cult? A religion is a widely accepted cult, that's all! Look at the similarities: A leader that speaks the words of a supreme power (Pope, priests, etc.); Laws that you must follow or you will be punished (eternal damnation); Brainwashing (church every Sunday). Let me get this straight, many of you believe in God because you have felt Him. Did you hear Him? Did you feel bliss, love, etc.? Haven't you people ever heard of the placebo effect; If you are expecting something to happen your brain will manifest it. Besides, I know a few psychotic disorders that have similar symptoms. Using the Bible as a reference for facts is like using any other book (or the internet). You were told that the Bible was God's word but you have no proof. Even if there was someone alive from the days it was written are you going to believe one person? Who is to say that is was not written by a bunch of drunken mathematicians as a joke about the reason things are the way they are. I will say that I do not discount the possibility that God exist, just as I do not discount alien existence. However, I do not like it when someone believes in God because they were told to. Trust me, it does not hurt to think for yourself. Challenge what you were taught. If you're right then you have nothing to worry about.
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Interesting comments, especially the part about thinking for yourself. A lot of people use the "think for yourself" argument against those who believe God's Words, but those same people do little or no checking of their own assumptions that the Bible is wrong or irrelevant. (Not that this is what you're necessarily doing.) How conceited do you have to be to believe that an omnipotent force (i.e. God) created an entire universe just for humans? Someone would have to be pretty conceited to believe that. That belief also goes against everything the Bible teaches. One good verse on the subject is found in Revelation 4:11, "Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for Thou hast created all things , and for Thy pleasure they are and were created." In reference to your comparison of religion and cults, most of what you said is right. However, someone who properly believes the Bible does not take the word of a human. He is believing the words of the God who wrote them. Also, laws in general (and their punishment) are for our own good. If there were no laws, a lot more people would be hurt by the resultant anarchy or the natural consequences of their actions. I despise brainwashing as well, but convincing myself of the truth by studying surely isn't brainwashing. As for placebo effects and proof of the Bible. It is conceited (accidentally in your case, I hope) to assume that you know enough to say that someone else's conclusions are based upon emotions, ungrounded facts, or teachings that they have not researched for themselves. (I realize that you weren't talking to any one person.) I personally have done a lot of study on the validity of the Bible. It is a truly amazing and unique book. There is no possibility of a "bunch of drunken mathematicians" putting it together "as a joke about the reason things are the way they are". Why? The 66 different books were written by some 33 different authors over a period of a few thousand years. It would be rather difficult for them to collaborate with each other, but the things taught in one book by one author are also taught in other books written by different authors. Every prophecy in the Bible has either come true, or the event has not yet occurred, and none of the things taught by the Bible have been proven wrong. Together, those form strong evidence for the truth of the Bible since no person, group, or other book can validly claim that (at least according to my studies). (BTW, archeology has shown that these p