Code Project Project(s) Update [long but important]
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:laugh: David Stone wrote: some of the women around the office saw it and got a little upset. Everyone is so touchy nowadays. I wish the acronym PC could have remained "Personal Computer". But no, I now I have tell people that I'm an ego-challenged, politically disenfranchised, monetarily weakened, non-available single citizen of the earth involved in a heterosexual relationship. X| Marc Help! I'm an AI running around in someone's f*cked up universe simulator.
Sensitivity and ethnic diversity means celebrating difference, not hiding from it. - Christian Graus
Every line of code is a liability - Taka Muraoka
Microsoft deliberately adds arbitrary layers of complexity to make it difficult to deliver Windows features on non-Windows platforms--Microsoft's "Halloween files"Marc Clifton wrote: I'm an ego-challenged, politically disenfranchised, monetarily weakened, non-available single citizen of the earth involved in a heterosexual relationship. :laugh: Nice one Marc. :)
Hawaian shirts and shorts work too in Summer. People assume you're either a complete nut (in which case not a worthy target) or so damn good you don't need to worry about camouflage... -Anna-Jayne Metcalfe on Paintballing
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Paul Watson wrote: A few questions, but first; Great job so far Jason, you have cracked that whip and kept what to me looks like a bowl full of buttered kittens in line. Thank you. Its a lot like herding cats (for more info, see a super bowl commercial from a couple years back). Paul Watson wrote: What is the official name that the projects will be published under? Good question. Got any ideas? Paul Watson wrote: Are we working on a logo of some sorts? (the kind that can be put in an About box) If we publish under a single group entity, we need a logo. We need a cool one! Paul Watson wrote: I vote you as overall high commander of the... I mean CPP Coordinator. I think it is something we will need as people splinter off and try to start more than three projects I really can't do anything about people starting other projects outside of our 3. I do think that they will fail completely if they don't follow the methods we come up with here. How do you manage 50 developers around the world??? :~ Paul Watson wrote: Oh and finally; How the heck does Source Versioning (CVS, VSS etc.) and Defect Tracking work together? I would think defect/bug/issue tracking falls under something like PMS. Heck if I know. :) We'll let the teams decide how their respective projects work.
Jason Henderson
"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter." - Winston Churchill
Jason Henderson wrote: Are we working on a logo of some sorts? (the kind that can be put in an About box) I tried playing with Corel Draw for 10 Minutes, and drew a blank on how to draw loads of clever developers, so I tried drawing UGLY which is a LOT easier. http://website.lineone.net/~joelholdsworth/ugly.jpg[^] If anyone has any ideas for a team banner, I can draw it out if needs be.**
*¨¨`) ¸¸.·´ ¸.·*¨¨`) (¸¸.·* ¸ .·* ¸¸.·* (¸¸.~~> Joel Holdsworth.
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UGLY is just the opposite of what we want - we want something that looks nice. Would you buy a toolkit that's called "UGLY"??? I think we should have a vote on this one.
"Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God." - Jesus
"You must be the change you wish to see in the world." - Mahatma GandhiWhat if we add some letter so it is easier to find with Google? UGHLY or UUGLY or UUGLI "UUGLY graphics" gives only two hits on google. We could monitor how much it is used, just by a simple search. jhaga CodeProject House, Paul Watson wrote: ...and the roar of John Simmons own personal Nascar in the garage. Meg flitting about taking photos.Chris having an heated arguement with Colin Davies and .S.Rod. over egian values. Nish manically typing *censur*. Duncan racing around after his pet *c.* Michael Martin and Bryce loudly yelling *c.* C.G. having a fit as Roger Wright loads up *c.* . Anna waving her *c.* and Deb scoffing chocolates in the corner. ...Good heavens!
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Jason Henderson wrote: Are we working on a logo of some sorts? (the kind that can be put in an About box) I tried playing with Corel Draw for 10 Minutes, and drew a blank on how to draw loads of clever developers, so I tried drawing UGLY which is a LOT easier. http://website.lineone.net/~joelholdsworth/ugly.jpg[^] If anyone has any ideas for a team banner, I can draw it out if needs be.**
*¨¨`) ¸¸.·´ ¸.·*¨¨`) (¸¸.·* ¸ .·* ¸¸.·* (¸¸.~~> Joel Holdsworth.
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Nice!
Jason Henderson
"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter." - Winston Churchill
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Chris Austin wrote: am fond of the title "high commander" as well. It reminds me of Third Rock From The Sun. We must do the salute, and I reckon Nish would make a good intergalactic radio. Now we just need to find a Sally. :-D
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaChris Losinger wrote: i hate needles so much i can't even imagine allowing one near The Little Programmer
Then we were thinking along the same lines. :) 3rd Rock is still my favorite show. Is Chirs M “The Big Giant Head” aka Stone Phillips? Hey don't worry, I can handle it. I took something. I can see things no one else can see. Why are you dressed like that? - Jack Burton
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Then we were thinking along the same lines. :) 3rd Rock is still my favorite show. Is Chirs M “The Big Giant Head” aka Stone Phillips? Hey don't worry, I can handle it. I took something. I can see things no one else can see. Why are you dressed like that? - Jack Burton
Chris Austin wrote: Is Chirs M “The Big Giant Head” aka Stone Phillips? :: Incoming message from The Big Giant Head :> Paul, you tell him and I will take away your icon and all Earth visitation privileges, including the women! :: Message ends Errr, no, Chris is not The Big Giant Head... :~
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaChris Losinger wrote: i hate needles so much i can't even imagine allowing one near The Little Programmer
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Jason Henderson wrote: Are we working on a logo of some sorts? (the kind that can be put in an About box) I tried playing with Corel Draw for 10 Minutes, and drew a blank on how to draw loads of clever developers, so I tried drawing UGLY which is a LOT easier. http://website.lineone.net/~joelholdsworth/ugly.jpg[^] If anyone has any ideas for a team banner, I can draw it out if needs be.**
*¨¨`) ¸¸.·´ ¸.·*¨¨`) (¸¸.·* ¸ .·* ¸¸.·* (¸¸.~~> Joel Holdsworth.
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Joel Holdsworth wrote: _http://website.lineone.net/~joelholdsworth/ugly.jpg\[^\]_ Nice cog! Good one.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaChris Losinger wrote: i hate needles so much i can't even imagine allowing one near The Little Programmer
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Paul Watson wrote: Oh and finally; How the heck does Source Versioning (CVS, VSS etc.) and Defect Tracking work together? If you have a Source Control/Versioning and a Defect Tracker that work together, bugs can be attached to different versions of sourcecode and so on... You might see it as 2 different projects, and it might as well be that, but is you make it one project, you can make the "2 parts" work together (integrated). The other thing is that there is something to do for everyone to do on that project, all the way from you web-dudes, and to native C++ on the server. And yes, the project is my idea :-O - Anders Money talks, but all mine ever says is "Goodbye!"
Anders Molin wrote: bugs can be attached to different versions of sourcecode and so on... Hey! Cool idea that, I like it. Anders Molin wrote: And yes, the project is my idea Don't be embarrassed, it is a good idea. What I think we should do though is build PMS and DTS (defect tracking system) and they work together. I said PMS was not a source system, but it certainly would be better if there was a source system out there that worked well with it. The defects/bugs/issues would then be tracked inside PMS while DTS handles the actual versioning of code etc. So yeah, good idea Anders, now we just need more votes on our ideas. *Paul hires a pron star to visit each CPians house, fluffing for votes* :rolleyes:
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaChris Losinger wrote: i hate needles so much i can't even imagine allowing one near The Little Programmer
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What if we add some letter so it is easier to find with Google? UGHLY or UUGLY or UUGLI "UUGLY graphics" gives only two hits on google. We could monitor how much it is used, just by a simple search. jhaga CodeProject House, Paul Watson wrote: ...and the roar of John Simmons own personal Nascar in the garage. Meg flitting about taking photos.Chris having an heated arguement with Colin Davies and .S.Rod. over egian values. Nish manically typing *censur*. Duncan racing around after his pet *c.* Michael Martin and Bryce loudly yelling *c.* C.G. having a fit as Roger Wright loads up *c.* . Anna waving her *c.* and Deb scoffing chocolates in the corner. ...Good heavens!
But that doesn't have the same effect as UGLY. BTW, what's up with your sig? I mean, what does *c.* represent? I saw that post...and there was nothing bad with the words that Paul used.
Hawaian shirts and shorts work too in Summer. People assume you're either a complete nut (in which case not a worthy target) or so damn good you don't need to worry about camouflage... -Anna-Jayne Metcalfe on Paintballing
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But that doesn't have the same effect as UGLY. BTW, what's up with your sig? I mean, what does *c.* represent? I saw that post...and there was nothing bad with the words that Paul used.
Hawaian shirts and shorts work too in Summer. People assume you're either a complete nut (in which case not a worthy target) or so damn good you don't need to worry about camouflage... -Anna-Jayne Metcalfe on Paintballing
David Stone wrote: and there was nothing bad with the words that Paul used. I reckon it is because, as I am wont to blather on and on, the original did not fit in the 500 character limit of signatures. So he cut out the un-needed bits. Also "Anna waving her *c*" does sound rather nasty. :-D
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaChris Losinger wrote: i hate needles so much i can't even imagine allowing one near The Little Programmer
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But that doesn't have the same effect as UGLY. BTW, what's up with your sig? I mean, what does *c.* represent? I saw that post...and there was nothing bad with the words that Paul used.
Hawaian shirts and shorts work too in Summer. People assume you're either a complete nut (in which case not a worthy target) or so damn good you don't need to worry about camouflage... -Anna-Jayne Metcalfe on Paintballing
You are right on both topics. *c.* is only there because I had to shorten it down to fit into 500 chars. But we could do some test voting on that name, just to get some experience on how it works. jhaga CodeProject House, Paul Watson wrote: ...and the roar of John Simmons own personal Nascar in the garage. Meg flitting about taking photos.Chris having an heated arguement with Colin Davies and .S.Rod. over egian values. Nish manically typing *censur*. Duncan racing around after his pet *c.* Michael Martin and Bryce loudly yelling *c.* C.G. having a fit as Roger Wright loads up *c.* . Anna waving her *c.* and Deb scoffing chocolates in the corner. ...Good heavens!
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A few questions, but first; Great job so far Jason, you have cracked that whip and kept what to me looks like a bowl full of buttered kittens in line.
- What is the official name that the projects will be published under?
- Are we working on a logo of some sorts? (the kind that can be put in an About box)
- I vote you as overall high commander of the... I mean CPP Coordinator. I think it is something we will need as people splinter off and try to start more than three projects
Jason Henderson wrote: 3.8 Defect Tracking/Source Versioning (16) Oh and finally; How the heck does Source Versioning (CVS, VSS etc.) and Defect Tracking work together? I would think defect/bug/issue tracking falls under something like PMS.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaChris Losinger wrote: i hate needles so much i can't even imagine allowing one near The Little Programmer
Come up with a catchy slogan for this... http://www.eaglesoft.net/jasonh-xp/bob-army.jpg[^] Like these: Strength in numbers. CPP. Be all that you can be. CPP. Infinite possibilities. CPP.
Jason Henderson
"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter." - Winston Churchill
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Anders Molin wrote: bugs can be attached to different versions of sourcecode and so on... Hey! Cool idea that, I like it. Anders Molin wrote: And yes, the project is my idea Don't be embarrassed, it is a good idea. What I think we should do though is build PMS and DTS (defect tracking system) and they work together. I said PMS was not a source system, but it certainly would be better if there was a source system out there that worked well with it. The defects/bugs/issues would then be tracked inside PMS while DTS handles the actual versioning of code etc. So yeah, good idea Anders, now we just need more votes on our ideas. *Paul hires a pron star to visit each CPians house, fluffing for votes* :rolleyes:
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaChris Losinger wrote: i hate needles so much i can't even imagine allowing one near The Little Programmer
Paul Watson wrote: What I think we should do though is build PMS and DTS (defect tracking system) and they work together. PMS? Paul Watson wrote: So yeah, good idea Anders, now we just need more votes on our ideas. Thanks :cool: - Anders Money talks, but all mine ever says is "Goodbye!"
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Come up with a catchy slogan for this... http://www.eaglesoft.net/jasonh-xp/bob-army.jpg[^] Like these: Strength in numbers. CPP. Be all that you can be. CPP. Infinite possibilities. CPP.
Jason Henderson
"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter." - Winston Churchill
Jason Henderson wrote: _http://www.eaglesoft.net/jasonh-xp/bob-army.jpg\[^\]_ :-D Exactly what I was thinking! Now all we need is a flag flapping in the background and stirring patriotic/indoctrinotic music. ;) The name that sprang to mind when I saw your pic is: Army Of Bob. Obviously not suitable but I laughed anyway :) p.s. I laughed so hard at the 404 page on your website. Mr T rocks! Jason Henderson wrote: Be all that you can be. CPP. Isn't that similar to the Navy/Army/Airforce/SEALS slogan? Cool but scary. I will think of some slogans, but first I am going to go crash on the office sofa. Night all.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaChris Losinger wrote: i hate needles so much i can't even imagine allowing one near The Little Programmer
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Idea submittal and voting have come to a slow crawl or stopped altogether so we'll just say its time to chose the final three projects. We could go just by the current voting result (see below), but I think its only fair that we re-evaluate what we would really like to do. Before doing so, I'd like to give you my opinion of what we should do and I know at least Paul and Marc will agree with me. I'm not going to endorse a particular project, but rather an ideal for our first stab at this. Its called... KISS (keep it simple stupid) Whatever project(s) we choose to do, it's/their scope needs to be somewhat limited (initially for release 1.0). Rome was not built in a day and CPPs are sure to fail if we try to do too much too soon. Heck, the infrastructure for large group projects isn't even in place yet. So we have a lot of thinking to do before we "dive right in." Here is how I propose we proceed: 1) Decide on 3 projects via voting (now until Tuesday) which gives us 24+ hours 2) Pick a project leader for each project (preferrably, the originator of the idea AND someone with experience writing articles and managing a herd of cattle ;)) 3) If you want to, we can pick a CPP coordinator who will look after these first 3 projects, but I doubt we'll need one. 4) Divide up into teams (I have an idea on how to do this but we'll discuss later). There may be lopsided teams. 5) Start an article for each project. NOT QUICKLY THOUGH! I'd like to see us decide on a standard layout and "features" in our project article. Its going to have to be different somehow than a standard article (I see tables :~ ). 6) Project leaders and team members will then need to define the scope and timeline for the project. A design document would be very nice. Anyone have a nice Design Doc template? 7) Here's where the fun begins. Start coding. Project leaders should be good delegators. 8) Try to stay within the scope and timeline, giving frequent updates and screen shots. If you have any different ideas, please discuss them by replying to this message. Below this message you will see a thread for PROJECT VOTING. Within that thread are 10 messages with the title of each project. Please give a vote for each message using the message voting system. The top 3 after Tuesday morning will be our beginning proje
These issues don't need to be discussed yet, but as we get closer to getting this project rolling, we're going to need to think about several other issues related to the code: 1. We need some sort of copyright license at the top of the source files. It should be pretty easy to find a good one here on CP that's really unrestrictive (i.e, just letting people know they can't sell the code). I'm all for giving all of this away for free, just like we do on CP, but I wouldn't like to see third parties selling the source code or abusing our efforts. 2. We all know that each developer has his/her own way of making objects work together. We'll need to break this project up into very modular and well-defined pieces for all of them to work together without breaking the internals of each piece. This is going to be a hard part I imagine. 3. Coding standards. I know a lot of people don't like to use any type of Hungarian notation or other standards, but it really really does make looking at other peoples' code easier. If we've got 50 developers each with their own (or lack of) standard, it's going to make modifying other parts of the project very difficult. Just thought I would share some thoughts I've had on this the last few days. I'm really excited that it seems to be taking off, and I eagerly await the start of the project :). Hopefully I will have enough spare time to be of value to it. Chris Richardson
Terrain Software -
Jason Henderson wrote: Are we working on a logo of some sorts? (the kind that can be put in an About box) I tried playing with Corel Draw for 10 Minutes, and drew a blank on how to draw loads of clever developers, so I tried drawing UGLY which is a LOT easier. http://website.lineone.net/~joelholdsworth/ugly.jpg[^] If anyone has any ideas for a team banner, I can draw it out if needs be.**
*¨¨`) ¸¸.·´ ¸.·*¨¨`) (¸¸.·* ¸ .·* ¸¸.·* (¸¸.~~> Joel Holdsworth.
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These issues don't need to be discussed yet, but as we get closer to getting this project rolling, we're going to need to think about several other issues related to the code: 1. We need some sort of copyright license at the top of the source files. It should be pretty easy to find a good one here on CP that's really unrestrictive (i.e, just letting people know they can't sell the code). I'm all for giving all of this away for free, just like we do on CP, but I wouldn't like to see third parties selling the source code or abusing our efforts. 2. We all know that each developer has his/her own way of making objects work together. We'll need to break this project up into very modular and well-defined pieces for all of them to work together without breaking the internals of each piece. This is going to be a hard part I imagine. 3. Coding standards. I know a lot of people don't like to use any type of Hungarian notation or other standards, but it really really does make looking at other peoples' code easier. If we've got 50 developers each with their own (or lack of) standard, it's going to make modifying other parts of the project very difficult. Just thought I would share some thoughts I've had on this the last few days. I'm really excited that it seems to be taking off, and I eagerly await the start of the project :). Hopefully I will have enough spare time to be of value to it. Chris Richardson
Terrain SoftwareChris Richardson wrote: 1. We need some sort of copyright license at the top of the source files. It should be pretty easy to find a good one here on CP that's really unrestrictive (i.e, just letting people know they can't sell the code). I'm all for giving all of this away for free, just like we do on CP, but I wouldn't like to see third parties selling the source code or abusing our efforts. I might write one up. Whatever we do, we shouldn't do GPL, as we want people to be able to use the controls commercially. It could be as simple as this: You may freely re-use this code in your projects, as long as you follow these rules: 1. You may not re-distribute this source code for commercial gain. 2. If you re-use this code in your projects, you must include the copyright notice found at the top of this file. 3. We do not assume any liability for this code or liabilities posed by its use. ...etc... Chris Richardson wrote: 2. We all know that each developer has his/her own way of making objects work together. We'll need to break this project up into very modular and well-defined pieces for all of them to work together without breaking the internals of each piece. This is going to be a hard part I imagine. For starters: With the control libraries, that shouldn't be too hard. :rose: Have the common graphics/metrics functions in a static class. :rose: Define in an interface the basic functionality that all controls should have. With the app framework, each seperate entity would be a service, and therefore be directly and easily accessed from any other service. We should discuss the specifics before proceeding with each project. Chris Richardson wrote: 3. Coding standards. I know a lot of people don't like to use any type of Hungarian notation or other standards, but it really really does make looking at other peoples' code easier. If we've got 50 developers each with their own (or lack of) standard, it's going to make modifying other parts of the project very difficult. ABSOLUTELY. One of the worst kinds of chaos I can imagine for us would be mixed standards. It makes for a whopper headache when there is 50 different standards in one project.
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These issues don't need to be discussed yet, but as we get closer to getting this project rolling, we're going to need to think about several other issues related to the code: 1. We need some sort of copyright license at the top of the source files. It should be pretty easy to find a good one here on CP that's really unrestrictive (i.e, just letting people know they can't sell the code). I'm all for giving all of this away for free, just like we do on CP, but I wouldn't like to see third parties selling the source code or abusing our efforts. 2. We all know that each developer has his/her own way of making objects work together. We'll need to break this project up into very modular and well-defined pieces for all of them to work together without breaking the internals of each piece. This is going to be a hard part I imagine. 3. Coding standards. I know a lot of people don't like to use any type of Hungarian notation or other standards, but it really really does make looking at other peoples' code easier. If we've got 50 developers each with their own (or lack of) standard, it's going to make modifying other parts of the project very difficult. Just thought I would share some thoughts I've had on this the last few days. I'm really excited that it seems to be taking off, and I eagerly await the start of the project :). Hopefully I will have enough spare time to be of value to it. Chris Richardson
Terrain Software- We should ask Chris to provide this. 2) This will be one of the more difficult parts, but this should be decided once the project teams are formed. 3) This is also a per project setting. The project leader should lay down these tyoes of laws before starting. Chris Richardson wrote: Chris Richardson Terrain Software Cool software! I've always wanted to learn how to generate terrain. Maybe you can show me sometime. :)
Jason Henderson
"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter." - Winston Churchill
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Jason Henderson wrote: Are we working on a logo of some sorts? (the kind that can be put in an About box) I tried playing with Corel Draw for 10 Minutes, and drew a blank on how to draw loads of clever developers, so I tried drawing UGLY which is a LOT easier. http://website.lineone.net/~joelholdsworth/ugly.jpg[^] If anyone has any ideas for a team banner, I can draw it out if needs be.**
*¨¨`) ¸¸.·´ ¸.·*¨¨`) (¸¸.·* ¸ .·* ¸¸.·* (¸¸.~~> Joel Holdsworth.
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Nice! :) I'm with Paul, I think the cog makes the logo stand out. James "I despise the city and much prefer being where a traffic jam means a line-up at McDonald's" Me when telling a friend why I wouldn't want to live with him
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Nice! :) I'm with Paul, I think the cog makes the logo stand out. James "I despise the city and much prefer being where a traffic jam means a line-up at McDonald's" Me when telling a friend why I wouldn't want to live with him
![http://website.lineone.net/~joelholdsworth/ugly.jpg\[^\]_](http://website.lineone.net/~joelholdsworth/ugly.jpg%5C%5B%5E%5C%5D_){kind=link}
![http://www.eaglesoft.net/jasonh-xp/bob-army.jpg\[^\]_](http://www.eaglesoft.net/jasonh-xp/bob-army.jpg%5C%5B%5E%5C%5D_){kind=link}