Moores Law is being wasted...
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It looks like Moores Lay of computer speed is going to hold for at least a few more years. (NOTE: I just read Intel's press release at http://www.intel.com/pressroom/archive/releases/20031105tech.htm[^].) Maybe I'm crazy, but at least from my point of view it looks like we're wasting all of the performance gains from computer advancement. The current "breakthroughs" (.NET, JAVA, XML, etc) (and I use that term loosely) in the software development world are not about using new performance to create new capabilities, tools, etc, but is largely being used to "enhance" developer productivity. I realize that there is a benefit to this, but where are the "breakthrough" applications for users. Where are the novel new uses for the performance (ie. voice recognition, etc)? Since Windows 2000 (doesn't seem that long ago does it?), what real advancement has been made in the OS to take advantage of the added performance? I suspect that due to the underlying code in Windows, it isn't really possible to leverage much of the performance in a safe/reliable way...Besides, what can a keyboard driver do with a 10GHZ processor it can't do with a 120mhz processor? <rant> .NET and the advancements in JAVA have made the development of certain types of software somewhat easier, but in my opinion have not really made the end-product more powerful. Sure, ASP.NET is better than ASP, but is a let down from ISAPI and C++. I guess from a business perspective, hardware is cheap and developers are expensive, so in that sense, the power is not wasted. But give me a break, I want voice recognition, touch screens, biometrics, truly context-sensitive (me being the context) help and search, true wireless (I love my laptop, but want to get rid of the power cord.) I want it all, and at least from a performance perspective it seems within our grasps. But all I ever hear about any more is how much more productive I can be. I DON'T WANT SOFTWARE DEVELOPMENT TO BE MORE PRODUCTIVE! DAMN IT! I want to work with some cool technology (I will kill the first person who refers to .NET as cool). I want to search for "The Matrix" on the internet and have the search engine display a page with movie information, times in my area, reviews, buy tickets, reserve seats, etc. I do not want a list of more web pages. I want some math-head to enter the
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It looks like Moores Lay of computer speed is going to hold for at least a few more years. (NOTE: I just read Intel's press release at http://www.intel.com/pressroom/archive/releases/20031105tech.htm[^].) Maybe I'm crazy, but at least from my point of view it looks like we're wasting all of the performance gains from computer advancement. The current "breakthroughs" (.NET, JAVA, XML, etc) (and I use that term loosely) in the software development world are not about using new performance to create new capabilities, tools, etc, but is largely being used to "enhance" developer productivity. I realize that there is a benefit to this, but where are the "breakthrough" applications for users. Where are the novel new uses for the performance (ie. voice recognition, etc)? Since Windows 2000 (doesn't seem that long ago does it?), what real advancement has been made in the OS to take advantage of the added performance? I suspect that due to the underlying code in Windows, it isn't really possible to leverage much of the performance in a safe/reliable way...Besides, what can a keyboard driver do with a 10GHZ processor it can't do with a 120mhz processor? <rant> .NET and the advancements in JAVA have made the development of certain types of software somewhat easier, but in my opinion have not really made the end-product more powerful. Sure, ASP.NET is better than ASP, but is a let down from ISAPI and C++. I guess from a business perspective, hardware is cheap and developers are expensive, so in that sense, the power is not wasted. But give me a break, I want voice recognition, touch screens, biometrics, truly context-sensitive (me being the context) help and search, true wireless (I love my laptop, but want to get rid of the power cord.) I want it all, and at least from a performance perspective it seems within our grasps. But all I ever hear about any more is how much more productive I can be. I DON'T WANT SOFTWARE DEVELOPMENT TO BE MORE PRODUCTIVE! DAMN IT! I want to work with some cool technology (I will kill the first person who refers to .NET as cool). I want to search for "The Matrix" on the internet and have the search engine display a page with movie information, times in my area, reviews, buy tickets, reserve seats, etc. I do not want a list of more web pages. I want some math-head to enter the
You make some good points, But just because every 2 yrs the number of flip flops doubles, doesn't mean that other stuff can handle it. Memory and Bus speeds are now begin to really lag and high processor output is being throttled by this. I don't want any of that breakthrough stuff yet. Idiot proof languages mean more people can attempt to program and this is one of the reasons program developers have lost their status. Regardz Colin J Davies
*** WARNING *
This could be addictive
**The minion's version of "Catch :bob: "It's a real shame that people as stupid as you can work out how to use a computer. said by Christian Graus in the Soapbox
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It looks like Moores Lay of computer speed is going to hold for at least a few more years. (NOTE: I just read Intel's press release at http://www.intel.com/pressroom/archive/releases/20031105tech.htm[^].) Maybe I'm crazy, but at least from my point of view it looks like we're wasting all of the performance gains from computer advancement. The current "breakthroughs" (.NET, JAVA, XML, etc) (and I use that term loosely) in the software development world are not about using new performance to create new capabilities, tools, etc, but is largely being used to "enhance" developer productivity. I realize that there is a benefit to this, but where are the "breakthrough" applications for users. Where are the novel new uses for the performance (ie. voice recognition, etc)? Since Windows 2000 (doesn't seem that long ago does it?), what real advancement has been made in the OS to take advantage of the added performance? I suspect that due to the underlying code in Windows, it isn't really possible to leverage much of the performance in a safe/reliable way...Besides, what can a keyboard driver do with a 10GHZ processor it can't do with a 120mhz processor? <rant> .NET and the advancements in JAVA have made the development of certain types of software somewhat easier, but in my opinion have not really made the end-product more powerful. Sure, ASP.NET is better than ASP, but is a let down from ISAPI and C++. I guess from a business perspective, hardware is cheap and developers are expensive, so in that sense, the power is not wasted. But give me a break, I want voice recognition, touch screens, biometrics, truly context-sensitive (me being the context) help and search, true wireless (I love my laptop, but want to get rid of the power cord.) I want it all, and at least from a performance perspective it seems within our grasps. But all I ever hear about any more is how much more productive I can be. I DON'T WANT SOFTWARE DEVELOPMENT TO BE MORE PRODUCTIVE! DAMN IT! I want to work with some cool technology (I will kill the first person who refers to .NET as cool). I want to search for "The Matrix" on the internet and have the search engine display a page with movie information, times in my area, reviews, buy tickets, reserve seats, etc. I do not want a list of more web pages. I want some math-head to enter the
My two cents... I think most of the "breakthroughs" left to be made won't happen with these (relatively) modest gains in speed. For instance, most artificial intelligence algorithms are exponential in nature... which would require something like quantum computing or a breakthrough algorithm. Faster processors isn't going to do it. No single raindrop believes that it is responsible for the flood.
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You make some good points, But just because every 2 yrs the number of flip flops doubles, doesn't mean that other stuff can handle it. Memory and Bus speeds are now begin to really lag and high processor output is being throttled by this. I don't want any of that breakthrough stuff yet. Idiot proof languages mean more people can attempt to program and this is one of the reasons program developers have lost their status. Regardz Colin J Davies
*** WARNING *
This could be addictive
**The minion's version of "Catch :bob: "It's a real shame that people as stupid as you can work out how to use a computer. said by Christian Graus in the Soapbox
ColinDavies wrote: Memory and Bus speeds are now begin to really lag and high processor output is being throttled by this. True. ColinDavies wrote: I don't want any of that breakthrough stuff yet. I pretty much agree as far as breaktrough developer stuff goes. So far I don't really care for .NET/JAVA/winforms/etc. I am impressed with ASP.NET, though, because it does perform better than ASP and is not too much more involved. ColinDavies wrote: Idiot proof languages mean more people can attempt to program and this is one of the reasons program developers have lost their status. I agree 100%.
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My two cents... I think most of the "breakthroughs" left to be made won't happen with these (relatively) modest gains in speed. For instance, most artificial intelligence algorithms are exponential in nature... which would require something like quantum computing or a breakthrough algorithm. Faster processors isn't going to do it. No single raindrop believes that it is responsible for the flood.
I disagree. I am not convinced AI will ever be what some think is possible, but it doesn't matter to me at this point. Many of the "breaktrhoughs" I want to see can be done with the current level of performance. Probably the #1 breakthrough I would like to see is a complete redesign of search engines. This goes for business class DB searches and internet searches. Nobody really wants a list of links, they want answers. This change in search engines may require other changes in web app design, etc. But I don't care, current computer technology can tackle this problem. OK. You've drawn me out a little. The real issue I have is that I am BORED (read that BORED) with the work I am doing right now and am sick of the drivel that is coming out of the software dev business. I would, like most developers, love to work on something truly breakthrough and see no hope of achieving that at my current job and with my current responsibilities.
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It looks like Moores Lay of computer speed is going to hold for at least a few more years. (NOTE: I just read Intel's press release at http://www.intel.com/pressroom/archive/releases/20031105tech.htm[^].) Maybe I'm crazy, but at least from my point of view it looks like we're wasting all of the performance gains from computer advancement. The current "breakthroughs" (.NET, JAVA, XML, etc) (and I use that term loosely) in the software development world are not about using new performance to create new capabilities, tools, etc, but is largely being used to "enhance" developer productivity. I realize that there is a benefit to this, but where are the "breakthrough" applications for users. Where are the novel new uses for the performance (ie. voice recognition, etc)? Since Windows 2000 (doesn't seem that long ago does it?), what real advancement has been made in the OS to take advantage of the added performance? I suspect that due to the underlying code in Windows, it isn't really possible to leverage much of the performance in a safe/reliable way...Besides, what can a keyboard driver do with a 10GHZ processor it can't do with a 120mhz processor? <rant> .NET and the advancements in JAVA have made the development of certain types of software somewhat easier, but in my opinion have not really made the end-product more powerful. Sure, ASP.NET is better than ASP, but is a let down from ISAPI and C++. I guess from a business perspective, hardware is cheap and developers are expensive, so in that sense, the power is not wasted. But give me a break, I want voice recognition, touch screens, biometrics, truly context-sensitive (me being the context) help and search, true wireless (I love my laptop, but want to get rid of the power cord.) I want it all, and at least from a performance perspective it seems within our grasps. But all I ever hear about any more is how much more productive I can be. I DON'T WANT SOFTWARE DEVELOPMENT TO BE MORE PRODUCTIVE! DAMN IT! I want to work with some cool technology (I will kill the first person who refers to .NET as cool). I want to search for "The Matrix" on the internet and have the search engine display a page with movie information, times in my area, reviews, buy tickets, reserve seats, etc. I do not want a list of more web pages. I want some math-head to enter the
I agree for the most part. I have been working with the .net framework in managed C++ and I despise it. I find that I waste all of my so-called "gains in productivity" trying to figure out the new ways of doing things that were nearly always far simpler in the past. However - I disagree with your comments regarding blocking direct memory access. I have been developing a variety of applications, interfaces, and drivers for the past fifteen years and the times that direct memory access was needed can be counted on one hand. Simple drivers are available to provide access to specific memory addresses and I/O ports and that's just fine with me. In fact, I prefer it that way. The sooner we are weaned from the ancient MS-DOS memory map the better. The Ten Commandments For C Programmers
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I disagree. I am not convinced AI will ever be what some think is possible, but it doesn't matter to me at this point. Many of the "breaktrhoughs" I want to see can be done with the current level of performance. Probably the #1 breakthrough I would like to see is a complete redesign of search engines. This goes for business class DB searches and internet searches. Nobody really wants a list of links, they want answers. This change in search engines may require other changes in web app design, etc. But I don't care, current computer technology can tackle this problem. OK. You've drawn me out a little. The real issue I have is that I am BORED (read that BORED) with the work I am doing right now and am sick of the drivel that is coming out of the software dev business. I would, like most developers, love to work on something truly breakthrough and see no hope of achieving that at my current job and with my current responsibilities.
Perhaps the problem, then, for you is that most stuff that people need these days is anything but breakthrough. It is mostly mundane. On the desktop, people need apps that perform business functions, and on the web, most of the novelty is still stuff that could not be done electronically before, but now can. Now the game industry, however, is definitely taking advantage of Moore's law. :) No single raindrop believes that it is responsible for the flood.
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Perhaps the problem, then, for you is that most stuff that people need these days is anything but breakthrough. It is mostly mundane. On the desktop, people need apps that perform business functions, and on the web, most of the novelty is still stuff that could not be done electronically before, but now can. Now the game industry, however, is definitely taking advantage of Moore's law. :) No single raindrop believes that it is responsible for the flood.
Perhaps you're right. I think the whole search thing is kinda breakthrough (I know, I know you want me to stop going on about the search thing.) As far as applications go, I'd like to see much more seemless integration with peoples work environment. Ie. More useable stuff, less standalone applications. You are right about the gaming industry.
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It looks like Moores Lay of computer speed is going to hold for at least a few more years. (NOTE: I just read Intel's press release at http://www.intel.com/pressroom/archive/releases/20031105tech.htm[^].) Maybe I'm crazy, but at least from my point of view it looks like we're wasting all of the performance gains from computer advancement. The current "breakthroughs" (.NET, JAVA, XML, etc) (and I use that term loosely) in the software development world are not about using new performance to create new capabilities, tools, etc, but is largely being used to "enhance" developer productivity. I realize that there is a benefit to this, but where are the "breakthrough" applications for users. Where are the novel new uses for the performance (ie. voice recognition, etc)? Since Windows 2000 (doesn't seem that long ago does it?), what real advancement has been made in the OS to take advantage of the added performance? I suspect that due to the underlying code in Windows, it isn't really possible to leverage much of the performance in a safe/reliable way...Besides, what can a keyboard driver do with a 10GHZ processor it can't do with a 120mhz processor? <rant> .NET and the advancements in JAVA have made the development of certain types of software somewhat easier, but in my opinion have not really made the end-product more powerful. Sure, ASP.NET is better than ASP, but is a let down from ISAPI and C++. I guess from a business perspective, hardware is cheap and developers are expensive, so in that sense, the power is not wasted. But give me a break, I want voice recognition, touch screens, biometrics, truly context-sensitive (me being the context) help and search, true wireless (I love my laptop, but want to get rid of the power cord.) I want it all, and at least from a performance perspective it seems within our grasps. But all I ever hear about any more is how much more productive I can be. I DON'T WANT SOFTWARE DEVELOPMENT TO BE MORE PRODUCTIVE! DAMN IT! I want to work with some cool technology (I will kill the first person who refers to .NET as cool). I want to search for "The Matrix" on the internet and have the search engine display a page with movie information, times in my area, reviews, buy tickets, reserve seats, etc. I do not want a list of more web pages. I want some math-head to enter the
Matt Gullett wrote: I do not want a list of more web pages. I want some math-head to enter the same search criteria and get a web page with information on a matrix, algorithms, tools, etc. I've been saying this for some time, but the response I get is "Google is good enough, isn't it?". :doh: It's very obvious that we are not reaching anywhere near the full potential that the info available on the 'net allows us. Search engines are still in their infancy. Matt Gullett wrote: Why did MS have to build a new language/framework when what is really needed is an excellent C++ library/framework. Why, Why, Why???? Matt Gullett wrote: (I will kill the first person who refers to .NET as cool) .NET is :cool:. ;P (Sorry, couldn't resist.) Much of what I like in .NET, though, really could be done in an unmanaged language platform, and I'd be glad to see it that way. Some of what I like about .NET is: delegates security unified platform full easy-access type info (aka reflection) the BCL!!! language independence no-nightmare versioning attributes ...and the list goes on. While this could be done in a good C++ library, it could be done much better in a new language platform or in a re-design of C++. I see .NET as a breakthrough - a breakthrough in the underlying design of programming languages. This fundamental change does, believe it or not, make a difference in the reliability and maintainability of the end product. I haven't seen another platform that has all of the combined qualities that I see in .NET. I hope to soon see one, but until that time, I'll go with .NET.
**"Peace is not merely a distant goal that we seek, but a means by which we arrive at that goal." -- Martin Luther King Jr.
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Matt Gullett wrote: I do not want a list of more web pages. I want some math-head to enter the same search criteria and get a web page with information on a matrix, algorithms, tools, etc. I've been saying this for some time, but the response I get is "Google is good enough, isn't it?". :doh: It's very obvious that we are not reaching anywhere near the full potential that the info available on the 'net allows us. Search engines are still in their infancy. Matt Gullett wrote: Why did MS have to build a new language/framework when what is really needed is an excellent C++ library/framework. Why, Why, Why???? Matt Gullett wrote: (I will kill the first person who refers to .NET as cool) .NET is :cool:. ;P (Sorry, couldn't resist.) Much of what I like in .NET, though, really could be done in an unmanaged language platform, and I'd be glad to see it that way. Some of what I like about .NET is: delegates security unified platform full easy-access type info (aka reflection) the BCL!!! language independence no-nightmare versioning attributes ...and the list goes on. While this could be done in a good C++ library, it could be done much better in a new language platform or in a re-design of C++. I see .NET as a breakthrough - a breakthrough in the underlying design of programming languages. This fundamental change does, believe it or not, make a difference in the reliability and maintainability of the end product. I haven't seen another platform that has all of the combined qualities that I see in .NET. I hope to soon see one, but until that time, I'll go with .NET.
**"Peace is not merely a distant goal that we seek, but a means by which we arrive at that goal." -- Martin Luther King Jr.
jdunlap wrote: Matt Gullett wrote: (I will kill the first person who refers to .NET as cool) BANG! You're dead. Return your library card, unplug your internet connection, cancel your credit cards and trasfer your checking/savings account balance to Africa. <evil laugh>Where, exactly, do you live?</evil laugh> I like .NET OK, but as far as I'm concerned, it's no breakthrough. It's just another link in a long chain of change. Some changes are good, some are bad, .NET is a little of both. From what I've seen, the only real change to the programming languages that means a hill-of-beans is the internal support for strings. Damn! You'd have thought someone would have throught of that about 100 years ago. How, O How? can string manipulation still be slow on a P4 2.4Ghz processor? I ask you that? Why is any of this new or a breakthrough?
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jdunlap wrote: Matt Gullett wrote: (I will kill the first person who refers to .NET as cool) BANG! You're dead. Return your library card, unplug your internet connection, cancel your credit cards and trasfer your checking/savings account balance to Africa. <evil laugh>Where, exactly, do you live?</evil laugh> I like .NET OK, but as far as I'm concerned, it's no breakthrough. It's just another link in a long chain of change. Some changes are good, some are bad, .NET is a little of both. From what I've seen, the only real change to the programming languages that means a hill-of-beans is the internal support for strings. Damn! You'd have thought someone would have throught of that about 100 years ago. How, O How? can string manipulation still be slow on a P4 2.4Ghz processor? I ask you that? Why is any of this new or a breakthrough?
Matt Gullett wrote: Where, exactly, do you live? I have his address. Mwahahaha! Marc Latest AAL Article My blog Join my forum!
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Matt Gullett wrote: Where, exactly, do you live? I have his address. Mwahahaha! Marc Latest AAL Article My blog Join my forum!
Maybe we can work something out. Damn! I just realized that there are over 40K witnesses to my diabolical plans. I guess I need to become president to kill that many people.;)
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It looks like Moores Lay of computer speed is going to hold for at least a few more years. (NOTE: I just read Intel's press release at http://www.intel.com/pressroom/archive/releases/20031105tech.htm[^].) Maybe I'm crazy, but at least from my point of view it looks like we're wasting all of the performance gains from computer advancement. The current "breakthroughs" (.NET, JAVA, XML, etc) (and I use that term loosely) in the software development world are not about using new performance to create new capabilities, tools, etc, but is largely being used to "enhance" developer productivity. I realize that there is a benefit to this, but where are the "breakthrough" applications for users. Where are the novel new uses for the performance (ie. voice recognition, etc)? Since Windows 2000 (doesn't seem that long ago does it?), what real advancement has been made in the OS to take advantage of the added performance? I suspect that due to the underlying code in Windows, it isn't really possible to leverage much of the performance in a safe/reliable way...Besides, what can a keyboard driver do with a 10GHZ processor it can't do with a 120mhz processor? <rant> .NET and the advancements in JAVA have made the development of certain types of software somewhat easier, but in my opinion have not really made the end-product more powerful. Sure, ASP.NET is better than ASP, but is a let down from ISAPI and C++. I guess from a business perspective, hardware is cheap and developers are expensive, so in that sense, the power is not wasted. But give me a break, I want voice recognition, touch screens, biometrics, truly context-sensitive (me being the context) help and search, true wireless (I love my laptop, but want to get rid of the power cord.) I want it all, and at least from a performance perspective it seems within our grasps. But all I ever hear about any more is how much more productive I can be. I DON'T WANT SOFTWARE DEVELOPMENT TO BE MORE PRODUCTIVE! DAMN IT! I want to work with some cool technology (I will kill the first person who refers to .NET as cool). I want to search for "The Matrix" on the internet and have the search engine display a page with movie information, times in my area, reviews, buy tickets, reserve seats, etc. I do not want a list of more web pages. I want some math-head to enter the
Yeah, I read that article too and had exactly the same thought. It blows my mind that I have to "interact" with my computer using an archaic keyboard from the 19th century and a pointing device that hasn't changed since it was invented in the 60's. But before I start ranting myself, let me just say this--I've thought long and hard about the same issue. The conclusion that I came to, is that if I want to work on something cool, something that really speaks to me and comes from the heart, then I pretty much have to create it myself. So, that solved the "what do I want to do" question. As to the other points you bring up, I've found, sadly, that true innovation is not something that happens very often. It's accomplished by one person, or a very small group of people. These people usually are very intelligent and break all sorts of accepted rules. Looking at the history of software development and ignoring the breakthroughs regarding hardware development, I don't think anything innovative has been done for at least the last 20 years. Real innovation is way overdue in the software industry. Unfortunately, the setting that creates innovation is being severely hampered by "The Microsoft Way", a glut of useless information that people seem to find necessary to manage rather than shitcan, and a growing myopic "solve the problem for the short-term, biggest bang for the buck" attitude, and our educational system is completely incapable of figuring out how to engendre creativity in our children and the ability to transform them into independent thinkers as adults. All of this means that, from my perspective, all those wonderful things that you wish for won't happen for a very long time. Hmmm. Did I say something about not ranting? Marc Latest AAL Article My blog Join my forum!
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Yeah, I read that article too and had exactly the same thought. It blows my mind that I have to "interact" with my computer using an archaic keyboard from the 19th century and a pointing device that hasn't changed since it was invented in the 60's. But before I start ranting myself, let me just say this--I've thought long and hard about the same issue. The conclusion that I came to, is that if I want to work on something cool, something that really speaks to me and comes from the heart, then I pretty much have to create it myself. So, that solved the "what do I want to do" question. As to the other points you bring up, I've found, sadly, that true innovation is not something that happens very often. It's accomplished by one person, or a very small group of people. These people usually are very intelligent and break all sorts of accepted rules. Looking at the history of software development and ignoring the breakthroughs regarding hardware development, I don't think anything innovative has been done for at least the last 20 years. Real innovation is way overdue in the software industry. Unfortunately, the setting that creates innovation is being severely hampered by "The Microsoft Way", a glut of useless information that people seem to find necessary to manage rather than shitcan, and a growing myopic "solve the problem for the short-term, biggest bang for the buck" attitude, and our educational system is completely incapable of figuring out how to engendre creativity in our children and the ability to transform them into independent thinkers as adults. All of this means that, from my perspective, all those wonderful things that you wish for won't happen for a very long time. Hmmm. Did I say something about not ranting? Marc Latest AAL Article My blog Join my forum!
Marc Clifton wrote: and a growing myopic "solve the problem for the short-term, biggest bang for the buck" attitude That may be the single biggest factor in our lack of innovation and progress. Marc Clifton wrote: and our educational system is completely incapable of figuring out how to engendre creativity in our children and the ability to transform them into independent thinkers as adults I'm afraid so. :( What else do you get when the questions of inquisitive minds are hushed, because otherwise the teacher would have to explain and guide and do some research, and the fundamental thing taught besides the basic academics is just "fit in"? Marc Clifton wrote: The conclusion that I came to, is that if I want to work on something cool, something that really speaks to me and comes from the heart, then I pretty much have to create it myself. Same goes here. For you, it comes out in the AAL, for me it's Fluid.
**"Don't judge each day by the harvest you reap, but by the seeds you plant." -- Robert Louis Stevenson
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jdunlap wrote: Matt Gullett wrote: (I will kill the first person who refers to .NET as cool) BANG! You're dead. Return your library card, unplug your internet connection, cancel your credit cards and trasfer your checking/savings account balance to Africa. <evil laugh>Where, exactly, do you live?</evil laugh> I like .NET OK, but as far as I'm concerned, it's no breakthrough. It's just another link in a long chain of change. Some changes are good, some are bad, .NET is a little of both. From what I've seen, the only real change to the programming languages that means a hill-of-beans is the internal support for strings. Damn! You'd have thought someone would have throught of that about 100 years ago. How, O How? can string manipulation still be slow on a P4 2.4Ghz processor? I ask you that? Why is any of this new or a breakthrough?
Matt Gullett wrote: BANG! You're dead. ;P ;P Matt Gullett wrote: I like .NET OK, but as far as I'm concerned, it's no breakthrough. I sort of agree, much as I like .NET. Its main breakthrough is putting those features together in one place - which does do a lot.
**"We must pursue peaceful ends through peaceful means." -- Martin Luther King Jr.
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Marc Clifton wrote: and a growing myopic "solve the problem for the short-term, biggest bang for the buck" attitude That may be the single biggest factor in our lack of innovation and progress. Marc Clifton wrote: and our educational system is completely incapable of figuring out how to engendre creativity in our children and the ability to transform them into independent thinkers as adults I'm afraid so. :( What else do you get when the questions of inquisitive minds are hushed, because otherwise the teacher would have to explain and guide and do some research, and the fundamental thing taught besides the basic academics is just "fit in"? Marc Clifton wrote: The conclusion that I came to, is that if I want to work on something cool, something that really speaks to me and comes from the heart, then I pretty much have to create it myself. Same goes here. For you, it comes out in the AAL, for me it's Fluid.
**"Don't judge each day by the harvest you reap, but by the seeds you plant." -- Robert Louis Stevenson
jdunlap wrote: I'm afraid so. What else do you get when the questions of inquisitive minds are hushed, because otherwise the teacher would have to explain and guide and do some research, and the fundamental thing taught besides the basic academics is just "fit in"? It's even worse than that. Teachers nowadays (and readily admit it themselves with great frustration) teach "to the test". It's the same biggest bang for the buck attitude. Instead of teaching kids real, useful, knowledge, they teach kids what they need to learn so they can pass the test. Bush's "no child left behind" is a farce, but I will readily admit that he does not have a monopoly on executive legislature that has done nothing to improve the education system. Do you realize that the way kids are taught starting from first grade through your last day of college is based on some complete idiot's idea of education from the 19th century??? I forgot his name now, but I could dig it up if I have to. Marc Latest AAL Article My blog Join my forum!
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Yeah, I read that article too and had exactly the same thought. It blows my mind that I have to "interact" with my computer using an archaic keyboard from the 19th century and a pointing device that hasn't changed since it was invented in the 60's. But before I start ranting myself, let me just say this--I've thought long and hard about the same issue. The conclusion that I came to, is that if I want to work on something cool, something that really speaks to me and comes from the heart, then I pretty much have to create it myself. So, that solved the "what do I want to do" question. As to the other points you bring up, I've found, sadly, that true innovation is not something that happens very often. It's accomplished by one person, or a very small group of people. These people usually are very intelligent and break all sorts of accepted rules. Looking at the history of software development and ignoring the breakthroughs regarding hardware development, I don't think anything innovative has been done for at least the last 20 years. Real innovation is way overdue in the software industry. Unfortunately, the setting that creates innovation is being severely hampered by "The Microsoft Way", a glut of useless information that people seem to find necessary to manage rather than shitcan, and a growing myopic "solve the problem for the short-term, biggest bang for the buck" attitude, and our educational system is completely incapable of figuring out how to engendre creativity in our children and the ability to transform them into independent thinkers as adults. All of this means that, from my perspective, all those wonderful things that you wish for won't happen for a very long time. Hmmm. Did I say something about not ranting? Marc Latest AAL Article My blog Join my forum!
Oh, aren't you the optimist.:) Marc Clifton wrote: It blows my mind that I have to "interact" with my computer This is really the heart of the problem with interacting with your computer. The computer is still just an appliance, a one-off item within your life. It is not ubiquitous. Interaction is treated much like a microwave. Marc Clifton wrote: then I pretty much have to create it myself Yep. I think my next act as ruler of nothingland is to start working on my ideas for search engines. I've been researching it and have decided that my desires are not only possible, but possible within the constraints of current technology. Marc Clifton wrote: I don't think anything innovative has been done for at least the last 20 years Agreed. Marc Clifton wrote: and our educational system is completely incapable of figuring out how to engendre creativity in our children and the ability to transform them into independent thinkers as adults. We still have an education system? I thought they were just indoctrination centers? At least till college. Marc Clifton wrote: all those wonderful things that you wish for won't happen for a very long time. Here, I disagree with you. At the very least search technology will take an upswing in the near future. There is growing demand for this change and I am one of the growing majority.
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Oh, aren't you the optimist.:) Marc Clifton wrote: It blows my mind that I have to "interact" with my computer This is really the heart of the problem with interacting with your computer. The computer is still just an appliance, a one-off item within your life. It is not ubiquitous. Interaction is treated much like a microwave. Marc Clifton wrote: then I pretty much have to create it myself Yep. I think my next act as ruler of nothingland is to start working on my ideas for search engines. I've been researching it and have decided that my desires are not only possible, but possible within the constraints of current technology. Marc Clifton wrote: I don't think anything innovative has been done for at least the last 20 years Agreed. Marc Clifton wrote: and our educational system is completely incapable of figuring out how to engendre creativity in our children and the ability to transform them into independent thinkers as adults. We still have an education system? I thought they were just indoctrination centers? At least till college. Marc Clifton wrote: all those wonderful things that you wish for won't happen for a very long time. Here, I disagree with you. At the very least search technology will take an upswing in the near future. There is growing demand for this change and I am one of the growing majority.
Matt Gullett wrote: Yep. I think my next act as ruler of nothingland is to start working on my ideas for search engines. Keep us posted - I'm interested. And if you have need of some help, here I am - if I have enough time. Matt Gullett wrote: We still have an education system? I thought they were just indoctrination centers? At least till college. :laugh: :rolleyes: Too true. Matt Gullett wrote: Marc Clifton wrote: all those wonderful things that you wish for won't happen for a very long time. Here, I disagree with you. Hmm... he did talk about doing it yourself... ;)
**"A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step." -- Confucius
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Oh, aren't you the optimist.:) Marc Clifton wrote: It blows my mind that I have to "interact" with my computer This is really the heart of the problem with interacting with your computer. The computer is still just an appliance, a one-off item within your life. It is not ubiquitous. Interaction is treated much like a microwave. Marc Clifton wrote: then I pretty much have to create it myself Yep. I think my next act as ruler of nothingland is to start working on my ideas for search engines. I've been researching it and have decided that my desires are not only possible, but possible within the constraints of current technology. Marc Clifton wrote: I don't think anything innovative has been done for at least the last 20 years Agreed. Marc Clifton wrote: and our educational system is completely incapable of figuring out how to engendre creativity in our children and the ability to transform them into independent thinkers as adults. We still have an education system? I thought they were just indoctrination centers? At least till college. Marc Clifton wrote: all those wonderful things that you wish for won't happen for a very long time. Here, I disagree with you. At the very least search technology will take an upswing in the near future. There is growing demand for this change and I am one of the growing majority.
Matt Gullett wrote: Here, I disagree with you. At the very least search technology will take an upswing in the near future. Well, the optimist in me hopes you are right. The pessimist in me says that the real innovations and application of some cool research is going to happen somewhere else other than the good ol' USA. Not that I want to get into a discussion of global economics/politics/social-ics, but come on, people. This country has the world's largest GDP, and was a leader in innovation--flight (air and space), technology, energy, communications, transportation, medicine, etc. What the hell happened? (Don't tell me, I already know--GREED). Now all we seem to care about is entertainment. X| Matt Gullett wrote: Yep. I think my next act as ruler of nothingland is to start working on my ideas for search engines. I've been researching it and have decided that my desires are not only possible, but possible within the constraints of current technology. Good for you! As Goethe said, "Whatever you can do, or dream you can do, do it. Boldness has genius, power and magic in it. Begin now." Marc Latest AAL Article My blog Join my forum!
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jdunlap wrote: I'm afraid so. What else do you get when the questions of inquisitive minds are hushed, because otherwise the teacher would have to explain and guide and do some research, and the fundamental thing taught besides the basic academics is just "fit in"? It's even worse than that. Teachers nowadays (and readily admit it themselves with great frustration) teach "to the test". It's the same biggest bang for the buck attitude. Instead of teaching kids real, useful, knowledge, they teach kids what they need to learn so they can pass the test. Bush's "no child left behind" is a farce, but I will readily admit that he does not have a monopoly on executive legislature that has done nothing to improve the education system. Do you realize that the way kids are taught starting from first grade through your last day of college is based on some complete idiot's idea of education from the 19th century??? I forgot his name now, but I could dig it up if I have to. Marc Latest AAL Article My blog Join my forum!
Marc Clifton wrote: Instead of teaching kids real, useful, knowledge, they teach kids what they need to learn so they can pass the test. And then when they don't pass, they either make the tests easier so they can pass, or they say "the kids aren't learning enough, so that means we need to make the tests harder.", but they never see the real reason why they aren't passing to begin with. Marc Clifton wrote: I forgot his name now, but I could dig it up if I have to. No need - I already read about that a while back.
**"To know what is right and not do it is the worst cowardice." -- Confucius