Start a business first on a computer using virtual programs then if it works upgrade to the real world :laugh:

I use the following process Application entry point is Sub Main. Display the splash screen with form.show Do the login useing a form.show (we use a seperate DLL for this) if the validation is successful then do the Application.Rum(mainform) Never underestimate the power of human stupidity RAH

The reason i care :P is that when you try to delete the newly created record it uses the id as its Id into the back end (Db), there is no match so i get an error every time. so 79 in the dataset is actually say 77 in the Access db (Autonumber). In an ideal world this wouldn't happen however.. BTW yes i am new (trying to self teach) but am aware that an id is just that, a record placer.