How do you cope?
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Hmm.. I didn't see that as kindness and support. What I saw was someone trying to push his beliefs onto someone who's saddened. Maybe it was his intent, but it didn't show. I think it just enforced my view of the human race: we're all just a bunch of egomaniacs, trying to convert everybody to our own belief system. (If that wasn't the case, we wouldn't be arguing so much, would we? :))
-- 100% natural. No superstitious additives.
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Actually many religions do not want converts. If you want to become Jewish the Rabbi is to turn you away at least three times. You have to be born Hindu. Christianity is the only religion I know that promotes conversion.
Islam too promotes conversion, as well as Buddhism.
-- 100% natural. No superstitious additives.
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Absolutely! I saw him last summer touring with Rufus Wainwright and Ben Lee. Amazing stuff. :)
Once you wanted revolution
Now you're the institution
How's it feel to be the man? -
Shog9 wrote:
and hope to be reunited again some day.
Shog - I've read your articles and posts over the past few years and have a good respect for your thoughts. I am not wanting to start a flame war, as I am very agnostic on the idea, but what makes you cling to the idea of an afterlife? Is it just out of comfort, or is there some sort of scientific basis? When I am depressed in times like these, I find myself wanting, hoping, for some sort of reunification in the end, but the whole idea just doesn't quite analign with my analytical thinking. And that saddens me even more. Jim RunFatBoy.net[^] - Exercise for the rest of us.
To read fascinating info and stories about people who have been clinically dead and come back to life, to tell about what they have experienced, take a look at http://near-death.com/[^]. --- Mere Christianity by C. S. Lewis is a book by a former agnostic that explains the fundamental basics of the Christian perspective in a logical, non-preachy, down-to-earth way. It is a must-read for anyone who wants to understand the basics of Christian belief and why Christians believe it.
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David Stone wrote:
Christianity isn't some pyramid scheme where you get more points in heaven for every person you sign up...
But that is exactly how I see many devout Christians behave. While I was in the Marines, I had a Corporal who worked under me and he kept preaching to me. I gave him four fair warnings about preaching religion to me personally, about how it's not acceptable to me and that he should cease. He didn't. I asked him why he persisted. He said as a Christian it was his duty to save my soul. I asked him if he believed he could fly or that Jesus would catch him if I threw him out the office window (second floor of a two story building) onto the cars in the parking lot. He then said "are you threatening me?" I said "No, but I did give you FOUR chances to stop and you didn't. So I felt compelled to provide the appropriate risk for your perceived reward." He didn't say anything to me again about religion in any form. Sharing your beliefs about how you can find strength in God and Jesus is fine. But then Steve Holle threw in an obvious penalty clause about how there is no hope otherwise, that was crossing a line that shouldn't have been crossed. And Steve *KNEW* he was crossing the line when he posted it but he went ahead and did it anyway, which shows a huge lack of sense *AND* sensitivity. Both of which I'm told repeatedly are highy valued Christian traits. And both of which are repeatedly displayed as being in short supply in those same Christians. Mike Poz -- modified at 16:40 Tuesday 27th June, 2006 forgot to debold... -- modified at 16:41 Tuesday 27th June, 2006 I really have to learn to use the preview button...
I agree with you. I've often said that I think it's really sad that Christians are some of the most judgmental people I know. For people whose religion is based on love and forgiveness, Christians are so quick to condemn and alienate rather than form relationships and show love. Heck, Jesus chose to eat with tax collectors and prostitutes rather than the priests and religious leaders of the day. I'm aware of the fact that many Christians go about spouting their beliefs to anybody who will (or, in a lot of cases, won't) listen. And I'm upset at them because they make all Christians look bad in the process. By the way, I'd like to proselytize to you for a minute. You don't need to use the preview button. You need to use CPhog[^]. It's got an in-page WYSIWYG post editor that lets you reply to posts without ever leaving the forum page. It's really cool. (Alright, I admit. I had a hand in writing it. And the WYSIWYG editor is my baby. :-D)
Once you wanted revolution
Now you're the institution
How's it feel to be the man? -
Absolutely! I saw him last summer touring with Rufus Wainwright and Ben Lee. Amazing stuff. :)
Once you wanted revolution
Now you're the institution
How's it feel to be the man? -
Islam too promotes conversion, as well as Buddhism.
-- 100% natural. No superstitious additives.
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Ah, I get your point. When you put it that way, I'd have to agree with you that Christians are probably alone promoting.
-- 100% natural. No superstitious additives.
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leckey wrote:
Yeah, but when is the last time they showed up on your doorstep to "promote?"
One reason Christianity is conversion-intensve is that, when Christianity was forming, it had to compete with other religions - so conversion was, and still is, the core of their religious propagation. With Hinduism, when it formed, there was no competition, so there's no concept of conversion. Islam has conversion too (or at least in the past they did). Large number of Hindus were converted to Islam (mostly under force) during the pre-Mughal dynasty in India. I don't think Buddhism has conversion - though I guess they do write books to help people understand it better. Regards, Nish
Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
Currently working on C++/CLI in Action for Manning Publications. Also visit the Ultimate Toolbox blog (New) -
leckey wrote:
Very well said.
Agreed - that was a good post! Regards, Nish
Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
Currently working on C++/CLI in Action for Manning Publications. Also visit the Ultimate Toolbox blog (New) -
Shog9 wrote:
and hope to be reunited again some day.
Shog - I've read your articles and posts over the past few years and have a good respect for your thoughts. I am not wanting to start a flame war, as I am very agnostic on the idea, but what makes you cling to the idea of an afterlife? Is it just out of comfort, or is there some sort of scientific basis? When I am depressed in times like these, I find myself wanting, hoping, for some sort of reunification in the end, but the whole idea just doesn't quite analign with my analytical thinking. And that saddens me even more. Jim RunFatBoy.net[^] - Exercise for the rest of us.
AAntix wrote:
I am not wanting to start a flame war, as I am very agnostic on the idea, but what makes you cling to the idea of an afterlife? Is it just out of comfort, or is there some sort of scientific basis?
I have no scientific basis - such a thing would require the ability to run controlled tests, and that would be impractical (and likely quite unethical). I believe in a Creator who sets our lives in motion for reasons of His own, and has indicated that once this vast project has been completed, He intends to revive the souls of all who were involved in it. I believe that, although his reasons are for the most part inscrutable to us, He has indicated His love for us by providing a means of salvation apart from that which we could achieve on our own. Why do i believe these things? I could say that it is because i was taught them as a child, and have clung to them over time... but this is useless, as there are many things i learned as a child which have failed me and been discarded. Rather, i suspect that i believe in the Creator and the Resurrection for the same reasons i believe in Truth and Life - that these things which i originally accepted on faith based on those who taught them to me have become, over time, beliefs that have found their way into the way i look at the world around me. A cynic might say i believe out of habit; i concede this possibility, but do not consider it either a useful or valid stance. Rather, i believe because God has permitted me to believe. :)
AAntix wrote:
but the whole idea just doesn't quite analign with my analytical thinking. And that saddens me even more.
Analytical thinking is very useful. But it is always important to keep in mind that there are many, many times when you will not have enough data to analyze, and will ultimately end up just picking the answer that sounds best. What that is, and whether it is ultimately true or useful, depend a lot more on your state of mind than on any real skill.
---- Scripts i’ve known... CPhog 1.0.0.0 - make CP better. Forum Bookmark 0.2.5 - bookmark forum posts on
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espeir wrote:
At nighttime.
A skin joke? Regards, Nish
Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
Currently working on C++/CLI in Action for Manning Publications. Also visit the Ultimate Toolbox blog (New) -
Dude.. you're not supposed to eat ham, are you? :~
-- 100% natural. No superstitious additives.
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Oh.. :dumbfounded: where did I get that from then? :~
-- 100% natural. No superstitious additives.
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Dude.. you're not supposed to eat ham, are you? :~
-- 100% natural. No superstitious additives.
I'm not Muslim. Even though it is against the Druze religion, they don't enforce it on the seculars. :) Homer Simpson: Wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute. Lisa, honey, are saying you're never going to eat any animal again? What about bacon? Lisa Simpson: No. Homer Simpson: Ham? Lisa Simpson: No. Homer Simpson: Pork chops? Lisa Simpson: Dad! Those all come from the same animal! Homer Simpson: [Chuckles] Yeah, right Lisa. A wonderful, magical animal.
"Religion is assurance in numbers." - Bassam Abdul-Baki Web
- Blog
- RSS
- Math
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I'm not Muslim. Even though it is against the Druze religion, they don't enforce it on the seculars. :) Homer Simpson: Wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute. Lisa, honey, are saying you're never going to eat any animal again? What about bacon? Lisa Simpson: No. Homer Simpson: Ham? Lisa Simpson: No. Homer Simpson: Pork chops? Lisa Simpson: Dad! Those all come from the same animal! Homer Simpson: [Chuckles] Yeah, right Lisa. A wonderful, magical animal.
"Religion is assurance in numbers." - Bassam Abdul-Baki Web
- Blog
- RSS
- Math
:-D Yes! Pig, swine, pork! Pure magic!
-- 100% natural. No superstitious additives.
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David Stone wrote:
Christianity isn't some pyramid scheme where you get more points in heaven for every person you sign up...
But that is exactly how I see many devout Christians behave. While I was in the Marines, I had a Corporal who worked under me and he kept preaching to me. I gave him four fair warnings about preaching religion to me personally, about how it's not acceptable to me and that he should cease. He didn't. I asked him why he persisted. He said as a Christian it was his duty to save my soul. I asked him if he believed he could fly or that Jesus would catch him if I threw him out the office window (second floor of a two story building) onto the cars in the parking lot. He then said "are you threatening me?" I said "No, but I did give you FOUR chances to stop and you didn't. So I felt compelled to provide the appropriate risk for your perceived reward." He didn't say anything to me again about religion in any form. Sharing your beliefs about how you can find strength in God and Jesus is fine. But then Steve Holle threw in an obvious penalty clause about how there is no hope otherwise, that was crossing a line that shouldn't have been crossed. And Steve *KNEW* he was crossing the line when he posted it but he went ahead and did it anyway, which shows a huge lack of sense *AND* sensitivity. Both of which I'm told repeatedly are highy valued Christian traits. And both of which are repeatedly displayed as being in short supply in those same Christians. Mike Poz -- modified at 16:40 Tuesday 27th June, 2006 forgot to debold... -- modified at 16:41 Tuesday 27th June, 2006 I really have to learn to use the preview button...
Right on. :)
-- 100% natural. No superstitious additives.
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Oh.. :dumbfounded: where did I get that from then? :~
-- 100% natural. No superstitious additives.
Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote:
where did I get that from then?
May be from his name or Arabic on his home page :~ Farhan Noor Qureshi if (this == this) thow this;
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Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote:
where did I get that from then?
May be from his name or Arabic on his home page :~ Farhan Noor Qureshi if (this == this) thow this;
The name's probably it. May I ask what you perceive of me, just by looking at my name? Line noise? :-D
-- 100% natural. No superstitious additives.
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The name's probably it. May I ask what you perceive of me, just by looking at my name? Line noise? :-D
-- 100% natural. No superstitious additives.