The WalMart concept does not work everywhere
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Ray Cassick wrote:
The German people do not want to do morning cheers?
:laugh: Could you imagine having to do morning cheers before cutting some code. I think that would last about one day with me. Personally I don't know a single adult that would put up with being treated like a child like that.
Hey don't worry, I can handle it. I took something. I can see things no one else can see. Why are you dressed like that? - Jack Burton
Chris Austin wrote:
Could you imagine having to do morning cheers before cutting some code.
Isn't that what you do in those morning Agile stand-up-meetings? :rolleyes: Marc
Some people believe what the bible says. Literally. At least [with Wikipedia] you have the chance to correct the wiki -- Jörgen Sigvardsson
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer -
Ray Cassick wrote:
The German people do not want to do morning cheers?
:laugh: Could you imagine having to do morning cheers before cutting some code. I think that would last about one day with me. Personally I don't know a single adult that would put up with being treated like a child like that.
Hey don't worry, I can handle it. I took something. I can see things no one else can see. Why are you dressed like that? - Jack Burton
Chris Austin wrote:
Could you imagine having to do morning cheers before cutting some code.
I usually do that each morning after I get in. I stand up and cheer to all my coworkers the following, "If anybody comes near me while I figure out this mess of code, you'll be leaving work in a bag. Rah, fucken Rah." I get the most work done this way. ;P
Chris Meech I am Canadian. [heard in a local bar] When no one was looking, every single American woman between the ages of 18 and 32 went out and got a tatoo just above their rumpus. [link[^]]
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Happened to me yesterday. I have a bit of an upset tummy so I wanted to pick up some Imodium to try and make it through the day. Unfortunately Wal-mart was the closest and time was against me. Nobody was manning the registers. When I started asking for help I got attitude from the employees. After waiting 10 minutes for someone just to take my money I gave up and ran to the nearest CVS.
Hey don't worry, I can handle it. I took something. I can see things no one else can see. Why are you dressed like that? - Jack Burton
Chris Austin wrote:
pick up some Imodium
Oooohh, not a good time to be held up.
BW
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
-- Steven Wright -
Ray Cassick wrote:
The German people do not want to do morning cheers?
:laugh: Could you imagine having to do morning cheers before cutting some code. I think that would last about one day with me. Personally I don't know a single adult that would put up with being treated like a child like that.
Hey don't worry, I can handle it. I took something. I can see things no one else can see. Why are you dressed like that? - Jack Burton
Hah! They used to do this every morning at one of my former employers. They called it "agile programming".
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Richard A. Abbott wrote:
And if governments were possitively and actively promoting the eating of healthy foodstuffs, then general health would improve
The government already is doing way too much, IMO. It's not the government's responsibility. It's the consumers. And in the US (and probably elsewhere), we seem to have consumers with a very low IQ. Marc
Some people believe what the bible says. Literally. At least [with Wikipedia] you have the chance to correct the wiki -- Jörgen Sigvardsson
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmerMarc Clifton wrote:
we seem to have consumers with a very low IQ
Isn't that a premise for being able to sell a lot of products? :)
-- Painstakingly Drawn Before a Live Audience
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Richard A. Abbott wrote:
And if governments were possitively and actively promoting the eating of healthy foodstuffs, then general health would improve
The government already is doing way too much, IMO. It's not the government's responsibility. It's the consumers. And in the US (and probably elsewhere), we seem to have consumers with a very low IQ. Marc
Some people believe what the bible says. Literally. At least [with Wikipedia] you have the chance to correct the wiki -- Jörgen Sigvardsson
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmerLike I said "As we both live in democratic capitalistic countries, then the individual must be free to choose for themselves the life and lifestyle they consider relevant for them, howsoever repugnant it may be in the eyes of someone else." But, unlike you, I consider it important an part of government to advise the populus of the risks associated with the practice of consuming poor quality food. Doing so, reduces the risks of early deaths, reduces risk on non-fatal medical problems, reduces costs of healthcare, and in your country, a reduced medical insurance outlay. Anyhow, I suspect that consumers do not all have a low IQ, just some, and of those who might have an average or above average IQ, perhaps their personal/family circumstances do not permit, for whatever reason, the acquisition of higher quality foodstuffs.
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Chris Austin wrote:
Could you imagine having to do morning cheers before cutting some code.
Isn't that what you do in those morning Agile stand-up-meetings? :rolleyes: Marc
Some people believe what the bible says. Literally. At least [with Wikipedia] you have the chance to correct the wiki -- Jörgen Sigvardsson
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer:laugh: I haven’t been drug into a formal stand-up yet; our meetings are pretty loose and fun. It helps that as a team we all get along really well. Not sure how I'd feel about attending the canonical stand-up meeting. When I worked at TI we had daily production meetings at 7:30 AM to which all of the engineers were required to attend.....fricking awful.
Hey don't worry, I can handle it. I took something. I can see things no one else can see. Why are you dressed like that? - Jack Burton
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Marc Clifton wrote:
we seem to have consumers with a very low IQ
Isn't that a premise for being able to sell a lot of products? :)
-- Painstakingly Drawn Before a Live Audience
Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote:
Isn't that a premise for being able to sell a lot of products?
Touche. It's the premise for our entire capitalistic marketing and commercialization industry. Yeah, that's a SB statement, I know. Marc
Some people believe what the bible says. Literally. At least [with Wikipedia] you have the chance to correct the wiki -- Jörgen Sigvardsson
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer -
Stuart van Weele wrote:
but many had high prices, poor quality, limited selection
And that's where local competition would weed them out. But a local guy cannot compete with a nationwide retailer, making megavolume overseas purchases and owning their own freight companies. A local retailer is too high up on the food chain. So you end up with these mega-retailers. Sure, that's competition too. But it feels more like an invasion than a choice. Marc
Some people believe what the bible says. Literally. At least [with Wikipedia] you have the chance to correct the wiki -- Jörgen Sigvardsson
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmerIt's called a free market. Wal Mart is just the most efficient at exploiting new logistics technologies. Don't worry, in a generation or two Wal Mart will be squeezed out by someone else. Then people can complain about how the changing economy is driving such a wonderful part of america out of business.
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Hah! They used to do this every morning at one of my former employers. They called it "agile programming".
Sound like a formal stand-up. I am pretty keen on a lot of the agile methods. But, the stand-up isn't one of the items I have completely bought into. I prefer to let my team choose a meeting time that works best for all of us. Usually not a lot of cheering or corporate speak; but a good amount of joking. We also keep the time down to about 45 minutes or less. Helps that it is a small team.
Hey don't worry, I can handle it. I took something. I can see things no one else can see. Why are you dressed like that? - Jack Burton
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Richard A. Abbott wrote:
you have a dislike for unions.
Yes, I do actually. It seems unions were formed originally to create and protect the worker's rights to basic things like safety, rest and bathroom breaks, the right to strike, etc. At this point, I feel like unions impose so many regulations on companies they become another mini-government that simply costs American companies money with no benefit to the company and little benefit to the worker. That's my perception, which probably doesn't line up with reality though. But when I read about unions forcing workers to strike, and if the worker shows up he's blacklisted in the union, and the union basically forces companies into bankruptcy, I look at that and ask, whose interests does a union actually serve, when the company ends up folding and workers are forced into a union and then can't have the freedom to agree or disagree with the union actions. Talk about a cult. Marc
Some people believe what the bible says. Literally. At least [with Wikipedia] you have the chance to correct the wiki -- Jörgen Sigvardsson
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmerHowever, in UK, there were big problems prior to Thatcher's premiership, but with her "reforms", the power of UK trade unions were reduced. As an example of poor UK trade unionism in the 1970's, http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=Red+Robbo+and+British+Leyland+1970%27s&btnG=Google+Search&meta=[^] It was not uncommon for wildcat strikes over something puny. Trade Unions have their place in society. And yes they should support their members in improving their lot. But not for the benefit of the union itself, only its members.
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Corinna John wrote:
almost everything was tried
Except learning from their competitors?
I think that is the biggest problem in this instance. They gave themselves no room to learn from their competitors. Their business model seems to be all about squeezing their supply chain and labor. In a strong union area they won't be able to stay out of the red. People can get mad at the unions but it is the way life is some parts of the world. You can adapt or you can get out. It looks like wally chose the latter. Personally, I'd say good riddence.
Hey don't worry, I can handle it. I took something. I can see things no one else can see. Why are you dressed like that? - Jack Burton
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Sound like a formal stand-up. I am pretty keen on a lot of the agile methods. But, the stand-up isn't one of the items I have completely bought into. I prefer to let my team choose a meeting time that works best for all of us. Usually not a lot of cheering or corporate speak; but a good amount of joking. We also keep the time down to about 45 minutes or less. Helps that it is a small team.
Hey don't worry, I can handle it. I took something. I can see things no one else can see. Why are you dressed like that? - Jack Burton
Agile methods seem like the biggest waste of money to me. Two programmers to do the job of one. If a card gets finished before the iteration is over, then you have two programmers sitting around doing nothing. And daily meetings where everyone in the team gets together are very expensive. Imagine how much money you spend just to have that meeting.
Logifusion[^] If not entertaining, write your Congressman.
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Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote:
Isn't that a premise for being able to sell a lot of products?
Touche. It's the premise for our entire capitalistic marketing and commercialization industry. Yeah, that's a SB statement, I know. Marc
Some people believe what the bible says. Literally. At least [with Wikipedia] you have the chance to correct the wiki -- Jörgen Sigvardsson
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmerMarc Clifton wrote:
Yeah, that's a SB statement, I know.
Don't worry about it, let the truth be known!
-- When you see the robot, drink!
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Agile methods seem like the biggest waste of money to me. Two programmers to do the job of one. If a card gets finished before the iteration is over, then you have two programmers sitting around doing nothing. And daily meetings where everyone in the team gets together are very expensive. Imagine how much money you spend just to have that meeting.
Logifusion[^] If not entertaining, write your Congressman.
Dustin Metzgar wrote:
Two programmers to do the job of one.
That is Extreme Programming, which is one of several agile methods.
Dustin Metzgar wrote:
And daily meetings where everyone in the team gets together are very expensive. Imagine how much money you spend just to have that meeting.
I guess that depends on the meeting.... I recently started a status update, mostly where we are, what road blocks we have so that some of the newer specialists can rotate around and help fix the holes. I try to keep it short, but by NOT having the meeting in weeks past we have had some programmers fight a wall for two or three weeks at a time, getting no where for something I or one of the others already solved months or years back.
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
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It's called a free market. Wal Mart is just the most efficient at exploiting new logistics technologies. Don't worry, in a generation or two Wal Mart will be squeezed out by someone else. Then people can complain about how the changing economy is driving such a wonderful part of america out of business.
Stuart van Weele wrote:
It's called a free market.
A free market is one model, and possibly a good one, but to say "It's called a free market" with the tacit implication that it's the best one, that I disagree with. Sure, in today's free market, WalMart is just taking advantage of that model. I personally do not feel a free market is an appropriate model when working with disparate global economies. A free market works when the forces engaged in free market activities are all on a fairly level economic playing field. But today's global economy is anything but that. Marc
Some people believe what the bible says. Literally. At least [with Wikipedia] you have the chance to correct the wiki -- Jörgen Sigvardsson
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer -
Ray Cassick wrote:
The German people do not want to do morning cheers?
:laugh: Could you imagine having to do morning cheers before cutting some code. I think that would last about one day with me. Personally I don't know a single adult that would put up with being treated like a child like that.
Hey don't worry, I can handle it. I took something. I can see things no one else can see. Why are you dressed like that? - Jack Burton
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Stuart van Weele wrote:
It's called a free market.
A free market is one model, and possibly a good one, but to say "It's called a free market" with the tacit implication that it's the best one, that I disagree with. Sure, in today's free market, WalMart is just taking advantage of that model. I personally do not feel a free market is an appropriate model when working with disparate global economies. A free market works when the forces engaged in free market activities are all on a fairly level economic playing field. But today's global economy is anything but that. Marc
Some people believe what the bible says. Literally. At least [with Wikipedia] you have the chance to correct the wiki -- Jörgen Sigvardsson
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmerAnd you propose???? The free market model isn't perfect, but everything else has been worse.
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And you propose???? The free market model isn't perfect, but everything else has been worse.
Stuart van Weele wrote:
And you propose????
Short answer: I don't have one yet. Long answer (somewhat rantish): :rolleyes: Why is pointing out that something isn't working right always followed up with a "and you propose" response? WTF is with that (not directed at you in particular)? My only opinion on the matter is that, after seeing how a free market economy works as a global market takes over, and after doing some thinking on the issue (granted that I'm not an economist), I've come to a certain conclusion. That doesn't mean that I have figured out a better solution at this point. But I think it is perfectly valid to say "hey, I don't think this is working" and let the experts figure out the right answer. Not that I have faith in the experts, but that's different issue. Marc
Some people believe what the bible says. Literally. At least [with Wikipedia] you have the chance to correct the wiki -- Jörgen Sigvardsson
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer -
Dustin Metzgar wrote:
Two programmers to do the job of one.
That is Extreme Programming, which is one of several agile methods.
Dustin Metzgar wrote:
And daily meetings where everyone in the team gets together are very expensive. Imagine how much money you spend just to have that meeting.
I guess that depends on the meeting.... I recently started a status update, mostly where we are, what road blocks we have so that some of the newer specialists can rotate around and help fix the holes. I try to keep it short, but by NOT having the meeting in weeks past we have had some programmers fight a wall for two or three weeks at a time, getting no where for something I or one of the others already solved months or years back.
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
Jeffry J. Brickley wrote:
but by NOT having the meeting in weeks past we have had some programmers fight a wall for two or three weeks at a time
Is that really the fault of not having a meeting or the fault of a couple programmers not willing to ask questions of their peers? How many useless stand up meetings do you have before you get a valuable one? Is it worth it to have 15-20 programmers standing around jabbering and clapping for an hour/half-hour instead of programming? Comparing methodologies is damn near impossible because every project is different and every team is different. Ultimately it comes down to what works for you and what you believe. No offense, but I can hear all the success stories in the world and it's still not going to convince me that agile's worth a damn.
Logifusion[^] If not entertaining, write your Congressman.
