I finally got myself in trouble at work
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Why do you expect to be punished? :confused: A proper response should be to consider the pros and cons of your actions. First off, you are showing initiative to take on work not assigned to you. This is a good thing and is usually rewarded. Evidently you also have some plan associatted with this extra work, which is also good. On the negative side, did you miss any deadlines for work that has been assigned to you. During this period of 'extra effort' on your part, can anyone show that the code you produced was of any less value or had more bugs in it than normal? Unless your boss and management are doing this analysis before acting, then they are reacting emotionally and that is no good at all.
Chris Meech I am Canadian. [heard in a local bar] Nobody likes jerks. [espeir] The zen of the soapbox is hard to attain...[Jörgen Sigvardsson] I wish I could remember what it was like to only have a short term memory.[David Kentley]
Chris Meech wrote:
Why do you expect to be punished?
I don't think I should be punished, but I cannot think for others. I somehow sense that they are pretty upset with my action. As I said in another post, the ironic thing is, if I did not do the actual work, nobody can blame me even if the whole system breaks down because we did not take any action. In that case, they cannot even blame me for not raising the issue because I did two months ago and nobody got back to me.
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The management discovered that I have written code that changes the way the system works. The new code will solve a real urgent problem we are facing and I never said it has to go the way I designed and coded. We don't have any workable solution for this problem and any solution including mine involves regression testing everything. However, that is not the issue. The issue is that I have been doing the work while working on a lot of other projects assigned to me, and they don't know about it. Process, Process, Process, ... Can you predict what kind of punishment I will get? What will you do if you are my manager?
Xiangyang Liu wrote:
Process, Process, Process, ...
Hey now, processes are important! They keep process designers employed designing them. That stunt you pulled, well, who knows how many budding statisticians and wanna-be dictators it'll deprive of work?
Xiangyang Liu wrote:
Can you predict what kind of punishment I will get?
Ten months writing after-the-fact justifications for what you did. Complete with pages and pages of bogus numbers and colorful graphs and charts.
Xiangyang Liu wrote:
What will you do if you are my manager?
Nothing. But, i like it when work gets done. That's why i'm not in management.
every night, i kneel at the foot of my bed and thank the Great Overseeing Politicians for protecting my freedoms by reducing their number, as if they were deer in a state park. -- Chris Losinger, Online Poker Players?
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If it's a relatively quick change (1 day or less), then you're probably right that it's easier to simply get it implemented and get a test ready to show the fix. However, if you spend more time on an issue than a day, you start messing with your manager's time scheduling. There might be things in the pipe that you don't know about yet, that your manager is waiting to assign. So it could be understandable that while you're on-time with assigned tasks, your manager sees the time you spent on the fix as missed opportunity to get something else accomplished. Just a thought, it's tough to say what the right reaction should be from the outside.
BW
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
-- Steven Wrightbrianwelsch wrote:
However, if you spend more time on an issue than a day, you start messing with your manager's time scheduling. There might be things in the pipe that you don't know about yet, that your manager is waiting to assign. So it could be understandable that while you're on-time with assigned tasks, your manager sees the time you spent on the fix as missed opportunity to get something else accomplished.
Not just that, but the problem may already be known and assigned to someone elsewhere in the organization. Now you've messed with thier tasking.
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Well, your points are valid, but he has explicitly said he had NOT put it in the release. The issue is that he was working on something w/o all the managers knowing about it. I agree with the sane types - I'd give you a slap on the back for being proactive, aggressive, and helpful. But, I would want you to communicate what you are doing so that there is no duplication of effort. Managers NEED surprises like this. It's a good thing. The plus side - if they fire you, then they just proved what idiots they are.
Charlie Gilley Will program for food... Whoever said children were cheaper by the dozen... lied. My son's PDA is an M249 SAW. My other son commutes in an M1A2 Abrams
I agree, its very important to be open about what you're doing, this prevents a lot of serious problems that might occur, like duplicate efforts, a misunderstanding about people not doing a good job, while they actually prevent projects from going down the drain. As a development manager on two teams I don't like surprises, no matter how big they are. Its a sign that my management has gone bad and I need to improve stuff so that I can see the nasty and nice surprises coming. So you're right if you mean that surprises can help improve the management, but it's always better to prevent such things from happening in the first place. It's really a two-way street, developers need to update the management and management needs to communicate with the developers, so both parties know what to do. It reminds me of a great book "Building a software engineering culture" from Carl Wiegers. You should read it when you got the time and the money to buy the book (of course I would try and let my boss pay for it ;P). It provides great tips that help in these cases.
WM
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Xiangyang Liu wrote:
Process, Process, Process, ...
Hey now, processes are important! They keep process designers employed designing them. That stunt you pulled, well, who knows how many budding statisticians and wanna-be dictators it'll deprive of work?
Xiangyang Liu wrote:
Can you predict what kind of punishment I will get?
Ten months writing after-the-fact justifications for what you did. Complete with pages and pages of bogus numbers and colorful graphs and charts.
Xiangyang Liu wrote:
What will you do if you are my manager?
Nothing. But, i like it when work gets done. That's why i'm not in management.
every night, i kneel at the foot of my bed and thank the Great Overseeing Politicians for protecting my freedoms by reducing their number, as if they were deer in a state park. -- Chris Losinger, Online Poker Players?
Shog9 wrote:
Ten months writing after-the-fact justifications for what you did. Complete with pages and pages of bogus numbers and colorful graphs and charts.
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: While I was "in power" in my own team for a short period, I did punish a developer by demanding her do documentation work only. But it was not because she did more work, it was because the work she did were totally crap, she had no talent in programming at all. But she talked to the management and my decision was over-turned.
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brianwelsch wrote:
However, if you spend more time on an issue than a day, you start messing with your manager's time scheduling. There might be things in the pipe that you don't know about yet, that your manager is waiting to assign. So it could be understandable that while you're on-time with assigned tasks, your manager sees the time you spent on the fix as missed opportunity to get something else accomplished.
Not just that, but the problem may already be known and assigned to someone elsewhere in the organization. Now you've messed with thier tasking.
dan neely wrote:
Not just that, but the problem may already be known and assigned to someone elsewhere in the organization. Now you've messed with thier tasking.
I realize there could be many situations that would turn my action into a really bad thing, but they don't apply in this case. I raised the issue with the management two months ago, they did not get back to me nor did they assign someone else working on it. If they did, I would not present my solution to them: only me and the man up stairs would know it ever existed. P.S. Yes, they "discovered" my work because I told them.
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Paul Watson wrote:
Xiangyang. You're fired
Well, it probably won't be that bad this time. The thing is, I can't imagine myself changing the way I work. It has been great in the past and nobody seems to mind that I deliver things much faster and with high quality (but done them in a politically incorrect way). No matter what happens, my life could be harder from now on, they will be watching me closely.
Xiangyang Liu wrote:
I can't imagine myself changing the way I work.
You need to find a company that thinks like you then. Being a programmer isn't just about code. It is about the company too and how it works. Different companies have different styles. Your manager might have good reason not to want programmers doing their own thing. If you disagree with the policy then you should discuss it with him, not just ignore it.
regards, Paul Watson Ireland FeedHenry needs you
eh, stop bugging me about it, give it a couple of days, see what happens.
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Xiangyang Liu wrote:
I can't imagine myself changing the way I work.
You need to find a company that thinks like you then. Being a programmer isn't just about code. It is about the company too and how it works. Different companies have different styles. Your manager might have good reason not to want programmers doing their own thing. If you disagree with the policy then you should discuss it with him, not just ignore it.
regards, Paul Watson Ireland FeedHenry needs you
eh, stop bugging me about it, give it a couple of days, see what happens.
Paul Watson wrote:
You need to find a company that thinks like you then.
I thought the current place works for me very well, until now.
Paul Watson wrote:
If you disagree with the policy then you should discuss it with him, not just ignore it.
There is no hope I will win any such argument, none. The reason for ignoring somethings selectively is to keep my mental health.
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The management discovered that I have written code that changes the way the system works. The new code will solve a real urgent problem we are facing and I never said it has to go the way I designed and coded. We don't have any workable solution for this problem and any solution including mine involves regression testing everything. However, that is not the issue. The issue is that I have been doing the work while working on a lot of other projects assigned to me, and they don't know about it. Process, Process, Process, ... Can you predict what kind of punishment I will get? What will you do if you are my manager?
Software development is not like a doctor in a battlefield. If you be able to do all your assigments and get a solution to this problem with in extra time or in time, you manage very well your time at work to get the appropiate solution for this issue, you are OK, but if the others projects are dalayed becose this one, you are in troubles, big troubles. Now talking about punishment one good will be to promote you to Programmers' Supervisor. :cool:
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The management discovered that I have written code that changes the way the system works. The new code will solve a real urgent problem we are facing and I never said it has to go the way I designed and coded. We don't have any workable solution for this problem and any solution including mine involves regression testing everything. However, that is not the issue. The issue is that I have been doing the work while working on a lot of other projects assigned to me, and they don't know about it. Process, Process, Process, ... Can you predict what kind of punishment I will get? What will you do if you are my manager?
Xiangyang Liu wrote:
However, that is not the issue. The issue is that I have been doing the work while working on a lot of other projects assigned to me, and they don't know about it. Process, Process, Process, ...
That's the way it is everywhere. In order to get the real work done you have to do it on the side.
Xiangyang Liu wrote:
Can you predict what kind of punishment I will get? What will you do if you are my manager?
likely nothing will happen. If I were your manager, I'd make a "show" of punishment and then secretly reward you.
Silence is the voice of complicity. Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government. -- monty python Might I suggest that the universe was always the size of the cosmos. It is just that at one point the cosmos was the size of a marble. -- Colin Angus Mackay
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brianwelsch wrote:
However, if you spend more time on an issue than a day, you start messing with your manager's time scheduling. There might be things in the pipe that you don't know about yet, that your manager is waiting to assign. So it could be understandable that while you're on-time with assigned tasks, your manager sees the time you spent on the fix as missed opportunity to get something else accomplished.
Not just that, but the problem may already be known and assigned to someone elsewhere in the organization. Now you've messed with thier tasking.
Right, good point.
BW
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
-- Steven Wright -
The management discovered that I have written code that changes the way the system works. The new code will solve a real urgent problem we are facing and I never said it has to go the way I designed and coded. We don't have any workable solution for this problem and any solution including mine involves regression testing everything. However, that is not the issue. The issue is that I have been doing the work while working on a lot of other projects assigned to me, and they don't know about it. Process, Process, Process, ... Can you predict what kind of punishment I will get? What will you do if you are my manager?
Xiangyang Liu wrote:
Can you predict what kind of punishment I will get? What will you do if you are my manager?
I love how we blindly accept many of the tenets of slavery but nowadays call it a job or work. Punishment for stepping out of line, the idea that you are inferior, you require permission, you have a slave master, excuse me, boss/manager/supervisor, whatever. Christ, when will people start treating others like people? And yes, I know, if there wasn't a "process" chaos and anarchy would rule. Marc
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer
People who say that they will refactor their code later to make it "good" don't understand refactoring, nor the art and craft of programming. -- Josh Smith -
Xiangyang Liu wrote:
Can you predict what kind of punishment I will get? What will you do if you are my manager?
I love how we blindly accept many of the tenets of slavery but nowadays call it a job or work. Punishment for stepping out of line, the idea that you are inferior, you require permission, you have a slave master, excuse me, boss/manager/supervisor, whatever. Christ, when will people start treating others like people? And yes, I know, if there wasn't a "process" chaos and anarchy would rule. Marc
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer
People who say that they will refactor their code later to make it "good" don't understand refactoring, nor the art and craft of programming. -- Josh SmithMarc Clifton wrote:
if there wasn't a "process" chaos and anarchy would rule
And you know what will happen if anarchy rules: Things start to work by themselves? How absurd! :)
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Xiangyang Liu wrote:
Can you predict what kind of punishment I will get? What will you do if you are my manager?
I love how we blindly accept many of the tenets of slavery but nowadays call it a job or work. Punishment for stepping out of line, the idea that you are inferior, you require permission, you have a slave master, excuse me, boss/manager/supervisor, whatever. Christ, when will people start treating others like people? And yes, I know, if there wasn't a "process" chaos and anarchy would rule. Marc
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer
People who say that they will refactor their code later to make it "good" don't understand refactoring, nor the art and craft of programming. -- Josh SmithIf there wasn't a "process", we'd actually get some coding done.
"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass..." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997
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"...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001 -
Paul Watson wrote:
You need to find a company that thinks like you then.
I thought the current place works for me very well, until now.
Paul Watson wrote:
If you disagree with the policy then you should discuss it with him, not just ignore it.
There is no hope I will win any such argument, none. The reason for ignoring somethings selectively is to keep my mental health.
Xiangyang Liu wrote:
The reason for ignoring somethings selectively is to keep my mental health.
Look for a new job. It will blow up again. Eventually it will be bad. Best to leave peacefully.
regards, Paul Watson Ireland FeedHenry needs you
eh, stop bugging me about it, give it a couple of days, see what happens.
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The management discovered that I have written code that changes the way the system works. The new code will solve a real urgent problem we are facing and I never said it has to go the way I designed and coded. We don't have any workable solution for this problem and any solution including mine involves regression testing everything. However, that is not the issue. The issue is that I have been doing the work while working on a lot of other projects assigned to me, and they don't know about it. Process, Process, Process, ... Can you predict what kind of punishment I will get? What will you do if you are my manager?
...and you said how many pages long is you resume? ;)
"When I get a little money, I buy books and if any is left, I buy food and clothes." --Erasmus
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Xiangyang Liu wrote:
Can you predict what kind of punishment I will get? What will you do if you are my manager?
I love how we blindly accept many of the tenets of slavery but nowadays call it a job or work. Punishment for stepping out of line, the idea that you are inferior, you require permission, you have a slave master, excuse me, boss/manager/supervisor, whatever. Christ, when will people start treating others like people? And yes, I know, if there wasn't a "process" chaos and anarchy would rule. Marc
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer
People who say that they will refactor their code later to make it "good" don't understand refactoring, nor the art and craft of programming. -- Josh SmithMarc Clifton wrote:
I love how we blindly accept many of the tenets of slavery but nowadays call it a job or work.
Hey! I don't accept it blindly. I accept it while drinking cheap alcohol, and singing the blues. And yes, it's 9:30PM on a Friday, and i'm still hunting bugs.
every night, i kneel at the foot of my bed and thank the Great Overseeing Politicians for protecting my freedoms by reducing their number, as if they were deer in a state park. -- Chris Losinger, Online Poker Players?
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...and you said how many pages long is you resume? ;)
"When I get a little money, I buy books and if any is left, I buy food and clothes." --Erasmus
How many pages would you like it to be? The last time I looked for a job was more than 6 years ago. Anything changed since that time? Can I still expect a sign-on bonus? :)
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The management discovered that I have written code that changes the way the system works. The new code will solve a real urgent problem we are facing and I never said it has to go the way I designed and coded. We don't have any workable solution for this problem and any solution including mine involves regression testing everything. However, that is not the issue. The issue is that I have been doing the work while working on a lot of other projects assigned to me, and they don't know about it. Process, Process, Process, ... Can you predict what kind of punishment I will get? What will you do if you are my manager?
This depends - like what happens when people have to deal with the changes you've made. This could cost a lot of extra work for them if it behaves in unexpected ways. Next time tell your boss about the change beofre you release it and make it clear your assigned tasks haven't suffered. Elaine :rose:
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Xiangyang Liu wrote:
Process, Process, Process, ...
Hey now, processes are important! They keep process designers employed designing them. That stunt you pulled, well, who knows how many budding statisticians and wanna-be dictators it'll deprive of work?
Xiangyang Liu wrote:
Can you predict what kind of punishment I will get?
Ten months writing after-the-fact justifications for what you did. Complete with pages and pages of bogus numbers and colorful graphs and charts.
Xiangyang Liu wrote:
What will you do if you are my manager?
Nothing. But, i like it when work gets done. That's why i'm not in management.
every night, i kneel at the foot of my bed and thank the Great Overseeing Politicians for protecting my freedoms by reducing their number, as if they were deer in a state park. -- Chris Losinger, Online Poker Players?
And we spend a lot of time figuring out why a system suddenly behaves differently then having to rewrite our code..