Salary for 5+ years exp programmer
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I was looking for a job switch and when i went through a few interviews, they asked me, whats your salary expectations. Normally i try to avoid that by saying as per the market standards etc. But what is the market trend ? If you have 5+ years exp in ASP, C # etc ? Will you say my expectation is around 120k annually or does it matters which compnay it is? How much a MS guys gets with say 6 years of exp in .net and all ? I find it very rude, when "they" ask what is your current salary :wtf:, and i almost never tell them. What is that to do with the job i am applying for? Why that should be a criterea to judge what the salary i should expect ? Was wondering what you all thinks ? btw TGIF :)
i wou;d say for 120k you need to be very cutting edge and a position of nothing less than technical lead Inflating a salary is something which is normally unverifiable as christian said but its more of an ethical question. i think its better to avoid saying anything till you can and if that just won't do inflate a bit like 10% more of your current salary and then talk about market trend All the best on your job hunt, let us know what happened :-D
Omit Needless Words - Strunk, William, Jr.
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Ask for a 1 million a year, a nudist secretary and a Bugatti Veryon. Bargain down from there.
A cynic is a man who, when he smells flowers, looks around for a coffin.
-H.L. Mencken -
Jerry Hammond wrote:
I got to thinking about this and thought about how much it cost you to have your ego tickled with those big raises.
Actually, it was the biggest raise that got me in trouble. When I got a competing offer, they matched it, 30% raise. But my wife at that time hated me for it, because I then made more than her by more than a few dollars. Perhaps it cost me, but then they took a big risk. I jumped from accounting software to engineering/graphics. That was a risky move, they reduced that risk by giving me a chance.... well, and they had no other qualified applicants for the job. I came with a recommendation from one of their own engineers, so even with the risk I was a safer bet. I was working for 22,400 as an accounting programmer (one man shop), so I got a higher paying job also. It's never as simple as it looks on paper. They didn't regret it, and I have paid them back with good products. They paid me back with good raises. Quid pro quo. If I had stayed in accounting I would not have received as good of raises, nor would I ever receive the salary I do now. So we both benefited from a chance to show what I can do.
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
Jeffry J. Brickley wrote:
Actually, it was the biggest raise that got me in trouble. When I got a competing offer, they matched it, 30% raise. But my wife at that time hated me for it, because I then made more than her by more than a few dollars.
oh that guilt feeling :)
Omit Needless Words - Strunk, William, Jr.
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DeepWaters wrote:
Will you say my expectation is around 120k annually or does it matters which compnay it is?
is this in $US ???? Me thing you are shooting for the moon !!! I think a good advice is to ask for about 12% higher than you are actually making; or at least more than what you would get after a reasonable raise at your current job; so you can after that bargain with them.
Maximilien Lincourt Your Head A Splode - Strong Bad
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DeepWaters wrote:
is there a glimse of light at the end of the tunnel ?
Yes, Scientific name: Tractus Runoverus. But the common name is a "train."
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
Do you mean programmers life will always be like that ? but who choose that we programmers only ? Its time to do something about that , Deepwaters had put a great questions these companies are making millions out of our work, we do deserve more than the judgement on "how much we deserve based on how much we are getting"
Omit Needless Words - Strunk, William, Jr.
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I mean, i know its based on a lot of different stuffs, but what do you say is the best and the worst case ?
Well, (for example) I've seen job adverts where in Madrid, Spain a C# Software Developer with 5 years experience can earn €24K ($32K). In London, England a C# Software Developer with 5 years experience can earn £75K ($150K). That is a fairly wide range. You need to focus a bit better on location. Then you can say something like: In Glasgow, Scotland a software developer with 5 years experience can expect to earn £27K ($54K) to £33K ($66K)
Upcoming events: * Glasgow: Introduction to AJAX (2nd May), SQL Server 2005 - XML and XML Query Plans, Mock Objects, SQL Server Reporting Services... Never write for other people. Write for yourself, because you have a passion for it. -- Marc Clifton My website
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Do you mean programmers life will always be like that ? but who choose that we programmers only ? Its time to do something about that , Deepwaters had put a great questions these companies are making millions out of our work, we do deserve more than the judgement on "how much we deserve based on how much we are getting"
Omit Needless Words - Strunk, William, Jr.
Vista? Touch Screen Explorer with Pen Flicks here
Quartz. wrote:
Deepwaters had put a great questions these companies are making millions out of our work, we do deserve more than the judgement on "how much we deserve based on how much we are getting"
Yes, we do... it is called raises. As someone else said, they don't ask for a pay stub, so you have the choice to inflate a little on the answer. Generally this becomes your minimum. They know you are not going to take a job for lower pay unless there is extra reasons. We did employ someone at less than his pay elsewhere, because we moved him from back east to be here with his daughter. Life would be much easier if no company took advantage of us, everyone was paid exactly what they were worth to the company and we didn't have to fend for ourselves at any time in our lives. It would be a lot better if we all won the lottery (one at a time that is). But we do have to fend for ourselves, thus the choices of changing careers, and what answer to give in questions of what you make. if I recall, I lied when I said how much I made, I was making 22,400 I told them 24,000 they gave me (not sure if I remember right) about 28,000 because 24,000 was below their pay scale. However, I was feeling that I made much less where I was at, because as an accounting programmer I was working up to 90+ hours for a salaried position. Although my position is salaried now, there is straight-time compensation for hours. So no matter how much I made, I many advantages right off. If work had not given me large raises, I probably would have looked elsewhere eventually.
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
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i wou;d say for 120k you need to be very cutting edge and a position of nothing less than technical lead Inflating a salary is something which is normally unverifiable as christian said but its more of an ethical question. i think its better to avoid saying anything till you can and if that just won't do inflate a bit like 10% more of your current salary and then talk about market trend All the best on your job hunt, let us know what happened :-D
Omit Needless Words - Strunk, William, Jr.
Vista? Touch Screen Explorer with Pen Flicks here
Quartz. wrote:
Inflating a salary is something which is normally unverifiable as christian said but its more of an ethical question.
In being on the other side of the interview table, I don't consider it an ethical question. We use it as a minimum, so you treat it as your minimum. If you won't make a move for less than 5% more than you currently make, then say your salary is 5% higher. If you won't make a move for less than 20% more because you think you are grossly under paid, then inflate it still. YOU are shouldering the risk in the inflating of the price, it's a very fine line of an answer. You don't want to say too low and risk getting a job offer at less than you will accept, especially if they "might" offer you more -- but, the other side is you don't want to say too high and rule yourself out as a candidate. This is where doing your homework comes in. Not every job is automatically going to look out for you first, them second, in fact very few will. So if you REALLY want to change jobs, find out the salary range for that area, network around, get a feel for the job situation as much as the pay range, know your expected salary, and your own minimum to move jobs.
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
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Robert Surtees wrote:
if you're currently making 120,000 I won't waste my time offering you a 60,000 job.
And if I'm currently making $35,000 you won't offer me $60,000 either - you'll continue to screw me like my current employer. That's the real reason employers ask this, to see how little they can get away with offering.
"A Journey of a Thousand Rest Stops Begins with a Single Movement"
Roger Wright wrote:
Robert Surtees wrote: if you're currently making 120,000 I won't waste my time offering you a 60,000 job. And if I'm currently making $35,000 you won't offer me $60,000 either - you'll continue to screw me like my current employer. That's the real reason employers ask this, to see how little they can get away with offering.
Yes, it is done for this reason as well. Of course, by accepting a 60,000 job for 35,000 you are screwing over all the people who would perform the job for 60,000 by letting the employer know the true cost of filling the job. You are in part responsible for driving salaries down.
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Roger Wright wrote:
Robert Surtees wrote: if you're currently making 120,000 I won't waste my time offering you a 60,000 job. And if I'm currently making $35,000 you won't offer me $60,000 either - you'll continue to screw me like my current employer. That's the real reason employers ask this, to see how little they can get away with offering.
Yes, it is done for this reason as well. Of course, by accepting a 60,000 job for 35,000 you are screwing over all the people who would perform the job for 60,000 by letting the employer know the true cost of filling the job. You are in part responsible for driving salaries down.
Robert Surtees wrote:
You are in part responsible for driving salaries down.
Horseshit.
"A Journey of a Thousand Rest Stops Begins with a Single Movement"