Who bought MSDN Subscription?
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Michael Sync wrote:
so, i will still need to use VS express to develop my pet projects...
Yeah. Or a text editor and GCC. If you're into the .NET stuff, you can download the SDK and do command line builds there as well. VS Express is pretty decent though.
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...the wind blows over it and it is gone, and its place remembers it no more...
:) ya. When I was using .NET 1.1, I used to use SharpDevelop.. Now, I thank to MS for releasing VS Express. :)
Thanks and Regards, Michael Sync ( Blog: http://michaelsync.net)
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Thanks... But it is sad that I don't own a company..
Thanks and Regards, Michael Sync ( Blog: http://michaelsync.net) "Please vote to let me (and others) know if this answer helped you or not. A 5 vote tells people that your question has been answered successfully and that I've pitched it at just the right level. Thanks."
Michael Sync wrote:
I don't own a company
You could own a Sole Proprietorship company - MichealSyncSoftware - tomorrow! Taxes are little more complex than personal taxes, plus you get more write-offs (assuming US citizen). Write off your personal computers, software, subscription (1/3 of $399 = $133. A rebate in effect, net cost $266), magazines, seminars, travel to seminars, etc., etc.
Gary
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Shog9 wrote:
my employer takes care of providing me the tools necessary for my job.
ya.. but they won't allow me to take the installer to install in my personal machine, right? so, i will still need to use VS express to develop my pet projects...
Thanks and Regards, Michael Sync ( Blog: http://michaelsync.net) "Please vote to let me (and others) know if this answer helped you or not. A 5 vote tells people that your question has been answered successfully and that I've pitched it at just the right level. Thanks."
When you use the disk to install VS, just copy the whole thing to your dev machine. Then, when nobody is looking, you can cut a disk to take home. My employer has no problem with me installing on my personal machine, as I do a lot of work for them on it.
My head asplode!
Calling all South African developers! Your participation in this local dev community will be mutually beneficial, to you and us.
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Ref : http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/subscriptions/bb841434.aspx Who can buy the MSDN subscription??? I mean, among the developers.. The salary range for developer in my area are between USD 1600 and 2000. (I know there are some developers who used to get around $100~$500 per month in some countries.) So, how can we buy this MSDN subscription ($1199)??
Visual Studio Professional Edition with MSDN Professional ($1,199)
Thanks and Regards, Michael Sync ( Blog: http://michaelsync.net)
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Christian Graus wrote:
the average starting wage I would say is $30-$40k.
Wow!! $40K per month.. That's amazing..
Christian Graus wrote:
We work an 8 hour day, you work 6 ?
We work 8 hrs a day too. but we don't count breakfast hour ( 30 mins),lunch (1 hr ) and cafe time ( 30 mins)... I worked 8 hrs (sometimes, more ) in Office.. After office hours, I take time to participate in this forum, try to read about C# 3.0 and etc, do blogging.. I spend so much time in front of computers every day.. but .... (I should have born in West.)
Thanks and Regards, Michael Sync ( Blog: http://michaelsync.net) "Please vote to let me (and others) know if this answer helped you or not. A 5 vote tells people that your question has been answered successfully and that I've pitched it at just the right level. Thanks."
Michael Sync wrote:
Wow!! $40K per month.. That's amazing..
Thats probably per year....that much per month is crazy, and definitely nowhere near the average.
:badger:
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When you use the disk to install VS, just copy the whole thing to your dev machine. Then, when nobody is looking, you can cut a disk to take home. My employer has no problem with me installing on my personal machine, as I do a lot of work for them on it.
My head asplode!
Calling all South African developers! Your participation in this local dev community will be mutually beneficial, to you and us.
Brady Kelly wrote:
When you use the disk to install VS, just copy the whole thing to your dev machine. Then, when nobody is looking, you can cut a disk to take home.
tsk tsk tsk...
:badger:
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Michael Sync wrote:
Wow!! $40K per month.. That's amazing..
Thats probably per year....that much per month is crazy, and definitely nowhere near the average.
:badger:
Christian said that people from West got $100-$500 per hours. then, $18000 per month? ( ($100 x 6) x 30 = 18000 ).. he said that they work an 8-hrs a day so ($100 x 8) x 30 = 24000
Thanks and Regards, Michael Sync ( Blog: http://michaelsync.net) "Please vote to let me (and others) know if this answer helped you or not. A 5 vote tells people that your question has been answered successfully and that I've pitched it at just the right level. Thanks."
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Christian said that people from West got $100-$500 per hours. then, $18000 per month? ( ($100 x 6) x 30 = 18000 ).. he said that they work an 8-hrs a day so ($100 x 8) x 30 = 24000
Thanks and Regards, Michael Sync ( Blog: http://michaelsync.net) "Please vote to let me (and others) know if this answer helped you or not. A 5 vote tells people that your question has been answered successfully and that I've pitched it at just the right level. Thanks."
Michael Sync wrote:
he said that they work an 8-hrs a day so ($100 x 8) x 30 = 24000
Don't tell me you work Saturdays and Sundays there...
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"(I know there are some developers who used to get around $100~$500 per month in some countries.)" implied that this was as much as dev makes in *any* country. In the West, some devs make within that range per hour. Of course, that's not average, but it's possible. I don't recall Singapore being especially cheap, I'm surprised you get paid so little.
Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++ "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
Jordanian Devs make a starting salary of about 350JD which is about 500US$. In the Gulf Countries (Kingdom of Saudi Arabia, UAE, Kuwait, etc.) They make something comparative to 2000US$ - 3000US$ (depending on many factors) and they don't pay income tax. Locally, the region is experiencing an incredible boom across many sectors and inflation is becoming a serious problem because the salaries are not moving with the inflation at all. This is why there is a serious brain drain issue with the countries like Jordan, Egypt, and Lebanon (generally, better educated more technology aware) to the Gulf countries. And this is why I've decided enough is enough, as soon as I finish my Masters Degree I'm going back home to Canada. It sucks working hard and not making a living comparable to my friends and family back west. :sigh: Court case with the worm vendors pending. :^)
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook "There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance." Ali ibn Abi Talib "Animadvertistine, ubicumque stes, fumum recta in faciem ferri?"
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Christian Graus wrote:
the average starting wage I would say is $30-$40k.
Wow!! $40K per month.. That's amazing..
Christian Graus wrote:
We work an 8 hour day, you work 6 ?
We work 8 hrs a day too. but we don't count breakfast hour ( 30 mins),lunch (1 hr ) and cafe time ( 30 mins)... I worked 8 hrs (sometimes, more ) in Office.. After office hours, I take time to participate in this forum, try to read about C# 3.0 and etc, do blogging.. I spend so much time in front of computers every day.. but .... (I should have born in West.)
Thanks and Regards, Michael Sync ( Blog: http://michaelsync.net) "Please vote to let me (and others) know if this answer helped you or not. A 5 vote tells people that your question has been answered successfully and that I've pitched it at just the right level. Thanks."
OK, I see the issue. We generally measure salaries by year. $40k per year is an average starting salary
Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++ "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
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Christian said that people from West got $100-$500 per hours. then, $18000 per month? ( ($100 x 6) x 30 = 18000 ).. he said that they work an 8-hrs a day so ($100 x 8) x 30 = 24000
Thanks and Regards, Michael Sync ( Blog: http://michaelsync.net) "Please vote to let me (and others) know if this answer helped you or not. A 5 vote tells people that your question has been answered successfully and that I've pitched it at just the right level. Thanks."
Michael Sync wrote:
Christian said that people from West got $100-$500 per hours.
I said some can get inside that range. I can get > $100 an hour. There is no way I can get $500, not often and never on a long term job.
Michael Sync wrote:
he said that they work an 8-hrs a day so ($100 x 8) x 30 = 24000
We get weekends off, mostly
Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++ "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
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OK, I see the issue. We generally measure salaries by year. $40k per year is an average starting salary
Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++ "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
Christian Graus wrote:
We get weekends off, mostly
($100 x 8) x 20 = 16000? 40K / 12 = 3333.3 ?? Anyway, it's much higher..
Christian Graus wrote:
OK, I see the issue.
Yeah. We used to measure the salaries by month. :) That's why I was thinking why you are surprised the S'pore developer's salaries. but it still less than $1000 compared to ppl from west..
Thanks and Regards, Michael Sync ( Blog: http://michaelsync.net) "Please vote to let me (and others) know if this answer helped you or not. A 5 vote tells people that your question has been answered successfully and that I've pitched it at just the right level. Thanks."
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Christian Graus wrote:
We get weekends off, mostly
($100 x 8) x 20 = 16000? 40K / 12 = 3333.3 ?? Anyway, it's much higher..
Christian Graus wrote:
OK, I see the issue.
Yeah. We used to measure the salaries by month. :) That's why I was thinking why you are surprised the S'pore developer's salaries. but it still less than $1000 compared to ppl from west..
Thanks and Regards, Michael Sync ( Blog: http://michaelsync.net) "Please vote to let me (and others) know if this answer helped you or not. A 5 vote tells people that your question has been answered successfully and that I've pitched it at just the right level. Thanks."
I have been measuring my salary in year now (+ AWS and variable bonuses). A company might be paying higher monthly salary but in the end I might be getting less per year (contract without variable bonuses). We are paying less tax compared to the west too.
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I have been measuring my salary in year now (+ AWS and variable bonuses). A company might be paying higher monthly salary but in the end I might be getting less per year (contract without variable bonuses). We are paying less tax compared to the west too.
darkelv wrote:
We are paying less tax compared to the west too.
really? How much they pay for tax?? For me, I have to pay so much tax even I'm not in West.. I have to pay the tax ( S$140 per month ) to the country that I'm staying and I have to pay the tax ( S$80 per month) to my native country.. I have to pay the double taxes to two countries.. :((
Thanks and Regards, Michael Sync ( Blog: http://michaelsync.net) "Please vote to let me (and others) know if this answer helped you or not. A 5 vote tells people that your question has been answered successfully and that I've pitched it at just the right level. Thanks."
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darkelv wrote:
We are paying less tax compared to the west too.
really? How much they pay for tax?? For me, I have to pay so much tax even I'm not in West.. I have to pay the tax ( S$140 per month ) to the country that I'm staying and I have to pay the tax ( S$80 per month) to my native country.. I have to pay the double taxes to two countries.. :((
Thanks and Regards, Michael Sync ( Blog: http://michaelsync.net) "Please vote to let me (and others) know if this answer helped you or not. A 5 vote tells people that your question has been answered successfully and that I've pitched it at just the right level. Thanks."
I am not sure about EP holder. But for Singaporean and PR, roughly 5% for first 40k, and 8% after that, and so on. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax\_bracket If you are from countries that are not in non-double-taxation list, well, that will sucks. ;p
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Christian said that people from West got $100-$500 per hours. then, $18000 per month? ( ($100 x 6) x 30 = 18000 ).. he said that they work an 8-hrs a day so ($100 x 8) x 30 = 24000
Thanks and Regards, Michael Sync ( Blog: http://michaelsync.net) "Please vote to let me (and others) know if this answer helped you or not. A 5 vote tells people that your question has been answered successfully and that I've pitched it at just the right level. Thanks."
Michael Sync wrote:
x 30
There are only 20 working days per month.
Upcoming FREE developer events: * Developer! Developer! Developer! 6 * Developer Day Scotland My website
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Christian Graus wrote:
the average starting wage I would say is $30-$40k.
Wow!! $40K per month.. That's amazing..
Christian Graus wrote:
We work an 8 hour day, you work 6 ?
We work 8 hrs a day too. but we don't count breakfast hour ( 30 mins),lunch (1 hr ) and cafe time ( 30 mins)... I worked 8 hrs (sometimes, more ) in Office.. After office hours, I take time to participate in this forum, try to read about C# 3.0 and etc, do blogging.. I spend so much time in front of computers every day.. but .... (I should have born in West.)
Thanks and Regards, Michael Sync ( Blog: http://michaelsync.net) "Please vote to let me (and others) know if this answer helped you or not. A 5 vote tells people that your question has been answered successfully and that I've pitched it at just the right level. Thanks."
Michael Sync wrote:
(I should have born in West.)
You don't have to be born here. You can move here if you get the right visa.
Upcoming FREE developer events: * Developer! Developer! Developer! 6 * Developer Day Scotland My website
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Christian Graus wrote:
No-one in the west makes $500 a month
Yeah.. What about Asia? In Myanmar, the most of senior developers got between $100-$300 (max: $500 (so hard to find the company that can that much but there are 2 or 3..)) .. In India, the most of fresh grads got between $400-$1500. $1000 - $1500 in Thai.. $1600- $2000 in S'pore.
Thanks and Regards, Michael Sync ( Blog: http://michaelsync.net) "Please vote to let me (and others) know if this answer helped you or not. A 5 vote tells people that your question has been answered successfully and that I've pitched it at just the right level. Thanks."
Well . . . if these people are working for someone (as programmers), than their employers should foot the bill. Even as a contractor, my employer has done so. It's cheaper for them than buying all the various packages and O/S I need for development. Taking full advantage of it as a user-license product, and since I work from home, as well, I've synched my home systems and laptop to contain the same tools, O/S, etc, as my prinicpal employer. That, plus the company workstation they supplied: 4 copies each of VS2003, VS2005, XP Professional - to start. Then there are items I've downloaded just to try out, such as MapPoint & its SDK, so that I could demonstrate to them the auto-formatting/standardization/correction of addresses. Although, in the countries cited, the employees are paid in spit, their employers are raking in fortunes. They could easily afford the sub's. It's just that piracy is noticably cheaper. This begs another question: Suppose piracy disappeared: would MS lower prices to the rest of us?
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
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Shog9 wrote:
my employer takes care of providing me the tools necessary for my job.
ya.. but they won't allow me to take the installer to install in my personal machine, right? so, i will still need to use VS express to develop my pet projects...
Thanks and Regards, Michael Sync ( Blog: http://michaelsync.net) "Please vote to let me (and others) know if this answer helped you or not. A 5 vote tells people that your question has been answered successfully and that I've pitched it at just the right level. Thanks."
Wrong! (or should be). A MSDN subscription is a user license. You (if you're the regestered user) can install the software on multiple machines for your use (only). Contrast this to the usual license, which is per workstation license. In particular: up to 10 installs of the O/S's (XP Pro, XP Home, Vista-Linux version, etc.), similarly for MS Office. Others applications allow for unlimited installs (basically because only developer use them and so there's no worry that it's being used to reduce sales for 'regular' users). One of the important advantages of the MSDN Subscription is that it is a user-license. I'm beginning to sound like a cheer-leader for Billy-G and his minions, but it's quite a decent deal and shows some enlightened self interest on there part: Development of Software for Windows O/S ultimately translates into sales of Windows systems. It also get the user accustomed to the strange feeling of having all of his software legal. Excuse me now, whilst I go wash my virtual mouth out with soap for speaking well of Microsoft.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
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Christian said that people from West got $100-$500 per hours. then, $18000 per month? ( ($100 x 6) x 30 = 18000 ).. he said that they work an 8-hrs a day so ($100 x 8) x 30 = 24000
Thanks and Regards, Michael Sync ( Blog: http://michaelsync.net) "Please vote to let me (and others) know if this answer helped you or not. A 5 vote tells people that your question has been answered successfully and that I've pitched it at just the right level. Thanks."
$100-500/h is the high end of the range for contractors/consultants in very specialized skills, or extremely expensive locations. Normal salaries generally range between $40k and $100k/year depending on skills and location. There're a few areas in the US where a starter house runs upwards of $1M and salaries are very high to compensate.
-- Help Stamp Out and Abolish Redundancy The preceding is courtesy of the Department of Unnecessarily Redundant Repetition Department.