HTML 5 [modified]
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Paul Watson wrote:
Some needed elements but more importantly we can get back into a regular HTML change process rather than the stagnation of the past few years.
True. I wonder though. I restate the point I made to Rohde, though on a more general scale, there are so many workarounds now that I don't know what sort of effect these late changes will affect. They are late. And like Leppie said, XHTML 2.0 is coming soon and there is a conflict of sorts that will appear. Primarily, I'm not a web developer but I do tons of it. I'm very attracted to multi-platform solutions and distributed systems. I'm hoping to see what the other guys think about this.
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook "There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance." Ali ibn Abi Talib "Animadvertistine, ubicumque stes, fumum recta in faciem ferri?"
Mustafa Ismail Mustafa wrote:
XHTML 2.0 is coming soon
Is that still a massive re-imagining of XHTML? I remember going through it when it was first mentioned and it looked like a nightmare. Yes, it had loads of "cool stuff" but it wasn't a 2.0 release, it was a whole new system. I haven't been keeping track lately but isn't the radical XHTML 2.0 plans why these other guys did HTML5? They thought XHTML 2.0 was too radical and that the web doesn't need it. Rather they said the web needs an iteration on HTML4 and to get back into regular HTML upgrades.
regards, Paul Watson Ireland & South Africa
Fernando A. Gomez F. wrote:
At least he achieved immortality for a few years.
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Mustafa Ismail Mustafa wrote:
XHTML 2.0 is coming soon
Is that still a massive re-imagining of XHTML? I remember going through it when it was first mentioned and it looked like a nightmare. Yes, it had loads of "cool stuff" but it wasn't a 2.0 release, it was a whole new system. I haven't been keeping track lately but isn't the radical XHTML 2.0 plans why these other guys did HTML5? They thought XHTML 2.0 was too radical and that the web doesn't need it. Rather they said the web needs an iteration on HTML4 and to get back into regular HTML upgrades.
regards, Paul Watson Ireland & South Africa
Fernando A. Gomez F. wrote:
At least he achieved immortality for a few years.
Here's a nice small "VS" article comparing the two new standards. It's pretty short but gives you an idea about the new features in both of 'em. X/HTML 5 Versus XHTML 2[^]
"When you have made evil the means of survival, do not expect men to remain good. Do not expect them to stay moral and lose their lives for the purpose of becoming the fodder of the immoral. Do not expect them to produce, when production is punished and looting rewarded. Do not ask, `Who is destroying the world?' You are."
-Atlas Shrugged, Ayn Rand -
Rohde wrote:
I did write three tags in standard HTML notation
There's the answer.
Rohde wrote:
audio, video, and canvas tags
Yes. That should really help bring forward the multimedia in the internet, though they are quite late if you want my opinion. There are so many workarounds now that I don't know how much of an effect those new tags will affect.
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook "There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance." Ali ibn Abi Talib "Animadvertistine, ubicumque stes, fumum recta in faciem ferri?"
You might be right on the lateness issue. None the less I like that there's a standard way of doing it. It seems more future proof that way I think. :)
"When you have made evil the means of survival, do not expect men to remain good. Do not expect them to stay moral and lose their lives for the purpose of becoming the fodder of the immoral. Do not expect them to produce, when production is punished and looting rewarded. Do not ask, `Who is destroying the world?' You are."
-Atlas Shrugged, Ayn Rand -
Mustafa Ismail Mustafa wrote:
XHTML 2.0 is coming soon
Is that still a massive re-imagining of XHTML? I remember going through it when it was first mentioned and it looked like a nightmare. Yes, it had loads of "cool stuff" but it wasn't a 2.0 release, it was a whole new system. I haven't been keeping track lately but isn't the radical XHTML 2.0 plans why these other guys did HTML5? They thought XHTML 2.0 was too radical and that the web doesn't need it. Rather they said the web needs an iteration on HTML4 and to get back into regular HTML upgrades.
regards, Paul Watson Ireland & South Africa
Fernando A. Gomez F. wrote:
At least he achieved immortality for a few years.
Paul Watson wrote:
Is that still a massive re-imagining of XHTML? I remember going through it when it was first mentioned and it looked like a nightmare. Yes, it had loads of "cool stuff" but it wasn't a 2.0 release, it was a whole new system.
You're quite right, its a complete break from previous versions. In fact its not backwards compatible. Its got tons of new stuff that is totally cool, XForms is just one revolutionary change that I think would make things MUCH simpler.
Paul Watson wrote:
I haven't been keeping track lately but isn't the radical XHTML 2.0 plans why these other guys did HTML5? They thought XHTML 2.0 was too radical and that the web doesn't need it. Rather they said the web needs an iteration on HTML4 and to get back into regular HTML upgrades.
I don't know if one spurred the other. It sounds normal though. Some developers shouldn't be given a choice :rolleyes: Too many choice can make developers confused, causing them to spiral into an infinite loop, eventually burning out their synapses. Seriously though, I think its good that they're coming out with a standard way of doing things (even though its late) but I'm slightly worried as to what would happen to the future of the web. This makes for a good read: Clickety[^] and the ever present wikipedia entry: Clickety 2[^]
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook "There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance." Ali ibn Abi Talib "Animadvertistine, ubicumque stes, fumum recta in faciem ferri?"
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Here's a nice small "VS" article comparing the two new standards. It's pretty short but gives you an idea about the new features in both of 'em. X/HTML 5 Versus XHTML 2[^]
"When you have made evil the means of survival, do not expect men to remain good. Do not expect them to stay moral and lose their lives for the purpose of becoming the fodder of the immoral. Do not expect them to produce, when production is punished and looting rewarded. Do not ask, `Who is destroying the world?' You are."
-Atlas Shrugged, Ayn RandDamn, not what I was hoping for. Sounds like many more years of conflict. Which do you think is the right path, HTML5 or XHTML 2?
regards, Paul Watson Ireland & South Africa
Fernando A. Gomez F. wrote:
At least he achieved immortality for a few years.
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Damn, not what I was hoping for. Sounds like many more years of conflict. Which do you think is the right path, HTML5 or XHTML 2?
regards, Paul Watson Ireland & South Africa
Fernando A. Gomez F. wrote:
At least he achieved immortality for a few years.
The purist in me says XHTML 2, but the pragmatist says HTML 5. But honestly I'd be glad just one of them becomes THE standard. I'm so not looking forward to years of battle between these two competing standards.
"When you have made evil the means of survival, do not expect men to remain good. Do not expect them to stay moral and lose their lives for the purpose of becoming the fodder of the immoral. Do not expect them to produce, when production is punished and looting rewarded. Do not ask, `Who is destroying the world?' You are."
-Atlas Shrugged, Ayn Rand -
The purist in me says XHTML 2, but the pragmatist says HTML 5. But honestly I'd be glad just one of them becomes THE standard. I'm so not looking forward to years of battle between these two competing standards.
"When you have made evil the means of survival, do not expect men to remain good. Do not expect them to stay moral and lose their lives for the purpose of becoming the fodder of the immoral. Do not expect them to produce, when production is punished and looting rewarded. Do not ask, `Who is destroying the world?' You are."
-Atlas Shrugged, Ayn RandRohde wrote:
But honestly I'd be glad just one of them becomes THE standard. I'm so not looking forward to years of battle between these two competing standards.
My point exactly. I wish some "visionary" would actually think of how they could merge the best of both.
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook "There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance." Ali ibn Abi Talib "Animadvertistine, ubicumque stes, fumum recta in faciem ferri?"
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Damn, not what I was hoping for. Sounds like many more years of conflict. Which do you think is the right path, HTML5 or XHTML 2?
regards, Paul Watson Ireland & South Africa
Fernando A. Gomez F. wrote:
At least he achieved immortality for a few years.
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You might be right on the lateness issue. None the less I like that there's a standard way of doing it. It seems more future proof that way I think. :)
"When you have made evil the means of survival, do not expect men to remain good. Do not expect them to stay moral and lose their lives for the purpose of becoming the fodder of the immoral. Do not expect them to produce, when production is punished and looting rewarded. Do not ask, `Who is destroying the world?' You are."
-Atlas Shrugged, Ayn RandOh totally. Conformance to a standard (whatever the standard may be) is a wonderful thing. It instantly means that things become transportable. Look at Posix and XML.
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook "There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance." Ali ibn Abi Talib "Animadvertistine, ubicumque stes, fumum recta in faciem ferri?"
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Paul Watson wrote:
Which do you think is the right path, HTML5 or XHTML 2?
HXTML 2.5 ;P
xacc.ide - now with IronScheme support
IronScheme - 1.0 alpha 1 out nowI'm rooting for LeppieML
regards, Paul Watson Ireland & South Africa
Fernando A. Gomez F. wrote:
At least he achieved immortality for a few years.
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I'm rooting for LeppieML
regards, Paul Watson Ireland & South Africa
Fernando A. Gomez F. wrote:
At least he achieved immortality for a few years.
Or CPML even :)
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook "There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance." Ali ibn Abi Talib "Animadvertistine, ubicumque stes, fumum recta in faciem ferri?"
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I'm rooting for LeppieML
regards, Paul Watson Ireland & South Africa
Fernando A. Gomez F. wrote:
At least he achieved immortality for a few years.
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I'm rooting for LeppieML
regards, Paul Watson Ireland & South Africa
Fernando A. Gomez F. wrote:
At least he achieved immortality for a few years.
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Also I see the style attribute is not valid on any tag except font! So no more inline styles. That seems counter productive, although I am not for inline styles, they are handy for testing stuff.
xacc.ide - now with IronScheme support
IronScheme - 1.0 alpha 1 out nowIf you truly believe you need to pick a mobile phone that "says something" about your personality, don't bother. You don't have a personality. A mental illness, maybe - but not a personality. - Charlie Brooker My Photos/CP Flickr Group - ScrewTurn Wiki
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Here's the link to the differences between HTML 5 and HTML 4: Clickety[^] [edit] For the record, I got the link before I got the Code Project daily news.
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook "There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance." Ali ibn Abi Talib "Animadvertistine, ubicumque stes, fumum recta in faciem ferri?"
modified on Thursday, January 24, 2008 3:08:48 AM
I still can't believe that the best html tag ever created will be gone. The 1 letter b and i tag will be replace with with other meaning, this is ridiculous. This will create tons for breaking page, especially the forum where the user input could contains those tag. # Citation from the document # The b element now represents a span of text to be stylistically offset from the normal prose without conveying any extra importance, such as key words in a document abstract, product names in a review, or other spans of text whose typical typographic presentation is emboldened. The i element now represents a span of text in an alternate voice or mood, or otherwise offset from the normal prose, such as a taxonomic designation, a technical term, an idiomatic phrase from another language, a thought, a ship name, or some other prose whose typical typographic presentation is italicized. Usage varies widely by language.
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Also I see the style attribute is not valid on any tag except font! So no more inline styles. That seems counter productive, although I am not for inline styles, they are handy for testing stuff.
xacc.ide - now with IronScheme support
IronScheme - 1.0 alpha 1 out nowAFAIK That's going to get ugly with outlook and html email. The outlook team dropped the IE rendering engine in favor of words much less capable one (it works better in a pure exchange environment :rolleyes: X|) which has major problems with stand along style sheets.
Otherwise [Microsoft is] toast in the long term no matter how much money they've got. They would be already if the Linux community didn't have it's head so firmly up it's own command line buffer that it looks like taking 15 years to find the desktop. -- Matthew Faithfull
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How confusing is acronym? why is abbr better? One is a perfectly crumulent word describing a series of letters that make a word that stand for something else, the other is merely the forshortening of a word. They are NOT interchangable. NATO is and Acronym, not an abbreviation. I grant there are apocope and elisions, but even abbr is an abreviation, not an acronym. Why do people who do not have ENGLISH as their first language wish to bastardize it so readily?
------------------------------------ I try to appear cooler, by calling him Euler.
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Also I see the style attribute is not valid on any tag except font! So no more inline styles. That seems counter productive, although I am not for inline styles, they are handy for testing stuff.
xacc.ide - now with IronScheme support
IronScheme - 1.0 alpha 1 out nowYep, I agree. Not only testing, but are handy at times to override a given style in a class on server controls (which have changing IDs) without having to define yet another class. I get tired of thinking less is more unless the less hinders more..
Rocky <>< Blog Post: Handy utility app that is always on my machines! Tech Blog Post: Moving on up with Windows Live stuff and Plus!
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I still can't believe that the best html tag ever created will be gone. The 1 letter b and i tag will be replace with with other meaning, this is ridiculous. This will create tons for breaking page, especially the forum where the user input could contains those tag. # Citation from the document # The b element now represents a span of text to be stylistically offset from the normal prose without conveying any extra importance, such as key words in a document abstract, product names in a review, or other spans of text whose typical typographic presentation is emboldened. The i element now represents a span of text in an alternate voice or mood, or otherwise offset from the normal prose, such as a taxonomic designation, a technical term, an idiomatic phrase from another language, a thought, a ship name, or some other prose whose typical typographic presentation is italicized. Usage varies widely by language.
Yep, less typing was always better :)
Rocky <>< Blog Post: Handy utility app that is always on my machines! Tech Blog Post: Moving on up with Windows Live stuff and Plus!
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I still can't believe that the best html tag ever created will be gone. The 1 letter b and i tag will be replace with with other meaning, this is ridiculous. This will create tons for breaking page, especially the forum where the user input could contains those tag. # Citation from the document # The b element now represents a span of text to be stylistically offset from the normal prose without conveying any extra importance, such as key words in a document abstract, product names in a review, or other spans of text whose typical typographic presentation is emboldened. The i element now represents a span of text in an alternate voice or mood, or otherwise offset from the normal prose, such as a taxonomic designation, a technical term, an idiomatic phrase from another language, a thought, a ship name, or some other prose whose typical typographic presentation is italicized. Usage varies widely by language.
Jcmorin wrote:
The 1 letter b and i tag will be replace with with other meaning, this is ridiculous. This will create tons for breaking page
No, it will not. Ever heard of DOCTYPE? (badly written websites aside.. X|)
Kind regards, Pawel Krakowiak Miraculum Software[^]